Why do so many crosses go out for corners?

[i Love United]

So many times so far in FM19, my crosses are going out for corners. Is this a bug or are there any ways around this? My full backs have about 12 for crossing so do I just need better crossers? Even with them not being great at crossing, it seems unrealistic that so many crosses just go out for corners...

Thanks, 

[rp1966]

There's a whole range of issues around that seemingly simple question. My observations are:

• Players are simply too keen to cross - when confronted by a defender they don't check back and try something else often enough, which would lead to the ball being recycled or the move breaking down in a way other than a corner.
   
• Assuming trying to cross is the right choice, they fail to beat the first man too often. The defender also doesn't clear upfield or out for a throw enough. Too often the cross just pinballs off the defender for a corner
   
• When it does beat the first man the defenders again have a problem of what they do, and again too often the ball is put out for a corner when it should be cleared upfield.

The issue around crosses and the first man are, I believe, under investigation.

I think it would useful to also take a look at defender positioning in relation to balls coming in from wide positions - too often it seems that defenders are the wrong side of the ball to safely clear; they need to be nearer the byline so that the most likely clearance/deflection direction is upfield rather than out for a corner.

Hopefully, some of these things would cut the number of corners significantly and bring things back to more realistic levels.

 

 

Edited December 17, 2018 by rp1966

[Svenc]

Slightly OT, but any ME inherent issue also tends to be highlighted/exaggerated by nonsensical tactical picks. This happens every single release so far.

F'r instance, in real football no manager/team whatsoever would "react" to an opposition parking deep and raising the walls of Jericho by going all compact itself. That's what the rigidly defensive team are already encouraging. If the attacking Team would add to this, they'd find it real hard to get any space, and always find the opposition would get a foot into stuff. Either to deflect, foul or clear. If there is an ME inherent issue here (crosses too easily blocked for a host of reasons), it would multiply.

However, that's the Kind of illogical stuff that the game still allows (for AI too), despite simulating professional management;  so SI still have to sort out what is tactical influenced/exaggerated and what isn't. That's time wasted that could be spend on fixing the core issues. Half the tactical download sections are filled with such nonsensicals… and on the AI's end...

Edited December 17, 2018 by Svenc

[sporadicsmiles]

14 minutes ago, Svenc said:

Slightly OT, but any ME inherent issue also tends to be highlighted/exaggerated by nonsensical tactical picks. This happens every single release so far.

F'r instance, in real football no manager/team whatsoever would "react" to an opposition parking deep and raising the walls of Jericho by going all compact itself. That's what the rigidly defensive team are already encouraging. If the attacking Team would add to this, they'd find it real hard to get any space, and always find the opposition would get a foot into stuff. Either to deflect, foul or clear. If there is an ME inherent issue here (crosses too easily blocked for a host of reasons), it would multiply.

However, that's the Kind of illogical stuff that the game still allows (for AI too), despite simulating professional management;  so SI still have to sort out what is tactical influenced/exaggerated and what isn't. That's time wasted that could be spend on fixing the core issues. Half the tactical download sections are filled with such nonsensicals… and on the AI's end...

It is not only nonsensical tactics that lead to an excess of crossing though, and there are a lot of blocked crosses. I think it relates back to the whole lack of offensive movement thing. My players are always eager to pass to the wings because they judge, rightly, that this is the best thing to do (because attackers are not dropping off or making runs). This means so much play is funnelled down the flanks that a lot of crosses and blocks are inevitable. 

To the OP, one think you can do is make sure you have supporting players close by, and work ball into the box. In principle, this should encourage a wide player to pass to supporting players rather than cross (as long as the player judges the pass is the better option). 

[Siven]

6 hours ago, sporadicsmiles said:

It is not only nonsensical tactics that lead to an excess of crossing though, and there are a lot of blocked crosses. I think it relates back to the whole lack of offensive movement thing. My players are always eager to pass to the wings because they judge, rightly, that this is the best thing to do (because attackers are not dropping off or making runs). This means so much play is funnelled down the flanks that a lot of crosses and blocks are inevitable. 

To the OP, one think you can do is make sure you have supporting players close by, and work ball into the box. In principle, this should encourage a wide player to pass to supporting players rather than cross (as long as the player judges the pass is the better option). 

Yeah, this is how i feel too. 

Theres just no movement from the front players, so no forward passes or through balls, so the ball end up at the full backs and most of the time you get a corner.

[Svenc]

6 hours ago, sporadicsmiles said:

It is not only nonsensical tactics that lead to an excess of crossing though, and there are a lot of blocked crosses. I think it relates back to the whole lack of offensive movement thing. My players are always eager to pass to the wings because they judge, rightly, that this is the best thing to do (because attackers are not dropping off or making runs). This means so much play is funnelled down the flanks that a lot of crosses and blocks are inevitable. 

Wasn't suggesting such mind. However things tend to be further exaggerated to comical degrees by tactical choices. On around FM13ish, there also was an issue with ME inherent supporting movement. Everybody suffered some from this, leading to additional speculative efforts from yards out. However, outright illogical tactical picks (which the game allows) would make for some outright funny matches. Talking Players reporting 30 corners plus on the occasion even, or like 40 long shots. Case in Point: Not sure what thread in the download section it was in, but a couple days ago I've also seen the argument in one of such that there "would be far too many Corners". Well, for as long as the game allows such,  (successfully) defending of some form is more likely to happen if users choke all space by making player sit right atop of each other. Because that's in more simple terms what goes on prior to a set piece, may it be a blocked cross leading to a corner or else: the defenders eventually still getting a foot in. I've more recent developed the stance that such tactical decisions needs to go, one way or the other (as AI can occasionally do it too).

Tactically the game also wouldn't be as much about avoiding simple mistakes (like a School class in Sports Basics) -- but making logically decisions shifting the odds some. What it comes down to is this: The attacking Phase of the game, including all ist movement, needs to be balanced against the defensive Phase. Every time you find an issue with the attacking phase (aforementioned movement), you may find one in the defending one. The wider the possibly scope in tactical choices, the harder it is to balance; and to get a somewhat believable/realistic match play. SI may also  focus on movement and play that actually tends to happen on an actual pitch, rather than all the bonkers ideas still allowed to be expressed in the UI. There's a counter argument to this. Which is that creativity is the spice of gaming. However, you cannot develop a "realistic" Football game if you don't focus on somewhat realistic match Play with inherently "realistic" movement. 

tldr; I have a feeling that if the corridor of choices were "narrowed down", or reduced to logical picks and play, we'd see less of this. And a more focused Long-term development. Feedback wouldn't vary quite as wildly too. As argued, things tend to repeat. The core issues, which is attacking movement, of FM19 sound eeerily similar to some past Releases (even though they differ in their specifics).

[hoqc]

15 小时前, rp1966说:

There's a whole range of issues around that seemingly simple question. My observations are:

• Players are simply too keen to cross - when confronted by a defender they don't check back and try something else often enough, which would lead to the ball being recycled or the move breaking down in a way other than a corner.
   
• Assuming trying to cross is the right choice, they fail to beat the first man too often. The defender also doesn't clear upfield or out for a throw enough. Too often the cross just pinballs off the defender for a corner
   
• When it does beat the first man the defenders again have a problem of what they do, and again too often the ball is put out for a corner when it should be cleared upfield.

The issue around crosses and the first man are, I believe, under investigation.

I think it would useful to also take a look at defender positioning in relation to balls coming in from wide positions - too often it seems that defenders are the wrong side of the ball to safely clear; they need to be nearer the byline so that the most likely clearance/deflection direction is upfield rather than out for a corner.

Hopefully, some of these things would cut the number of corners significantly and bring things back to more realistic levels.

 

 

That is so true.

I also find that players will automatically try crossing whenever they dribble near the edge of the box (from two franks), which results in many early crosses, even from advance playmakers or inside forwards or even central players whom you cannot control how often they cross.

The lack of central plays is the reason why balls are distributed to fullbacks. But I guess SI might "over-fix" the issue from last pitch about players not doing anything when they reach the byline, by forcing them to cross once (or even before) they get to there. Right now not only cross less often is not an option, overlap fullbacks will also hit early crosses all the time.

[upthetoon]

in real life, I see about 4 - 5 crosses per game that gets blocked and goes out for corners..

not sure what others think about this though.

right now my team alone average like 30 crosses per game that goes out for corners

[LukasZ_VCF]

It's because they freeze too much...and wait until opponent defender gets in the way, same with long shoots... its annoying... they have clear space and wait until they dont have it anymore...and often after that they have really dangerous counter attack...

[szp]

I created a topic in Bugs Forum about blocked crosses. In my opinion 19.2 ME have improved this issue a little bit, but still the amount of blocked crosses is unacceptable. 

[LukasZ_VCF]

The thing is even if u have players like I use because I want to play fast offensive football - Rodrigo 17 acc, 17 pace,   Guedes something like that too, Origi 18 pace, Soler 16 I think, and  they are much faster than defenders and reach the end of the pitch and they just stand there waiting for defender to reach them and than they try to cross ... same with long shoots, can dribble players run fast and they slow down or stop and than shoot straight on opponents player...

[hoqc]

一小时前, LukasZ_VCF说:

The thing is even if u have players like I use because I want to play fast offensive football - Rodrigo 17 acc, 17 pace,   Guedes something like that too, Origi 18 pace, Soler 16 I think, and  they are much faster than defenders and reach the end of the pitch and they just stand there waiting for defender to reach them and than they try to cross ... same with long shoots, can dribble players run fast and they slow down or stop and than shoot straight on opponents player...

I think the problem of players reaching bylines and waiting was fixed in 19.2. But now u got players no longer dribble to the bylines. They just hit early crosses no matter what instructions u give them.

[Jezzabythesea]

Well, Ive just started playing FM20 (after sticking with FM14 for the last 6 years lol) and it's still a huge problem! Nearly every cross is blocked, no matter how good the winger is! The most enfuriating thing is, they get to the byline and then wait for the defender to get in position before kicking it against them???? I mean, wtf is that all about? If it were just poor programming, but indicated that your attackers pace attribute wasn't high enough to pass the defender, or their crossing attribute was too low, I would get it. But even with good wingers, against very poor defenders (as in friendlies), this happens maybe 9 out of 10 times?? That must be deliberate because the game is just a set of program instructions. The question is why? It means that teams don't need good wingers, they're pretty much redundant, what you need is players with very high corner attribute and players with good heading/jumping. If it's a bug, it needs sorting, because it is very irritating, especially if you play a system with wingers (like me! :D).

Edited October 27, 2020 by Jezzabythesea
typos

[Prej]

1 hour ago, Jezzabythesea said:

Nearly every cross is blocked, no matter how good the winger is! The most enfuriating thing is, they get to the byline and then wait for the defender to get in position before kicking it against them???? I mean, wtf is that all about?

 

Yeah, that's been an issue since November 2019.

Oh, wait...

[Vali184]

This is how how they 'balanced' the ME. If the wingers complete more crosses, there would be more goals scored and matches would end 12-7 or 8-4.

[Rashidi]

If you are seeing too many attempted crosses go out for corners it usually is a sign that something needs to be looked at.

When you use a role like a wingback on an attack duty, you could find that he is more aggressive at trying to get past a player and sometimes this could leave him short of options. When that happens he could end up playing for the corner or his crosses could be blocked

I created a crossing happy 442 on twitch with the use of a wb and a wm combination, it worked brilliantly because each time someone closed down the wb he had the wm to pass to, they closed him down the wb would move into a better position, receive the pass and ping one for my target man. Here the combination of roles and duties play a part. It was an obscene 442 that just pinged crosses into the box for my TM to lap them up.

Then you have width, if your team is playing on wide widths then the focus is to get the ball down the flanks and because everyone in the community seems to have a proclivity to play on high tempo, there isn't time for attacks to build up. The wingback or full back or winger is left isolated and then the only option is try and beat the player or it ends up as a blocked cross.

If you want wingers to cross the ball then you need to think about attacking width, support and tempo to get those crosses in. Generally if you are struggling to complete your crosses, its normally a tactical problem.

[GianniM]

2 hours ago, rossenori said:

I averaged +70 crosses a game in FM19 with a lot of longshots against those teams. no cut backs, no hold up play, no recycling, no patience. IWB is a "workaround" if you just want fewer crosses but you'll be sacrificing width. 

 

4 hours ago, Rashidi said:

everyone in the community seems to have a proclivity to play on high tempo, there isn't time for attacks to build up.

 

Not saying there isn't an issue with crosses going into defenders as stated above but there are logical tactical workarounds to not be affected by it too much. 

[GianniM]

1 hour ago, rossenori said:

how would you workaround it?

As Rashidi said, lower the tempo. If as you're saying your rep increases and teams park the bus against you, it's going to be more difficult to find openings. So lower the tempo, work ball into box and be more expressive can help, if you pair it with the right roles and duties that create movement and support. Don't overrush things. Crosses work when attackers can run at them, not so much when everyone is packed in the box already before the cross.