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I'm surprised that the new Argus did better for sub-top in FM Base test than for underdog (comparing to Argus first version). I expected it would be the opposite as the new one looks for me like a more defensive formation.

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I am using FM 19.3 Ttic on FM 20 but the ME is different as atm FM 20.2.3

The MEs are FM 19.1 19.2 19.3 20.1 20,2

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Up to you how much or little you want AM to carry out.

Sometimes a tactic fails to work, the game is sent to me, I leave it to AM and tactic starts working. I therefore just check that a tactic is not working because of non tactical inputs.

I leave it all to AM apart from Shouts and OIs and it is even easier in FMT.

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12 minutes ago, Dreambuilder said:

4222 Sicilian might be good but the formation hurts my eyes.. :stop:

 

It's pretty much just a 4-4-2

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A few test results puts the order as follows (Excludes new tactics)              OVERALL     SUB TOP UNDERDOG           OVERALL SUB TOP   UNDERDOG

FM 20.2 SICILIAN 4222 P101                                                                                   1                   7                        1                         3               4             6

FM 20 SYMPATHY 4222                                                                                             2                  1                      14

FM 20.2.3  ARGUS 3322                                                                                              3                 3                      16        

FM 20 ARGUS 352                                                                                                        4                 19                      4                         1                3               2

FM 20.2.3 PREACHIN BLUES 451                                                                              5                 20                      3

FM 20 WULF 4132 (FM 19 P112)      P106                                                               12                 6                      17                         5               8                1

FM 20.2 PILGRIMAGE 41221       OXFORD                                                             16                    9                      20                        2                 1             7

BEOWULF 442 P107                                                                                                  20                    21                      13                         4              5                 3

FM 20.2 NORTHERN SOUL        P101CC                                                               15                       27                     2                           6               6              5

FM 20 SICILIAN  4222 P98                                                                                         6                       5                   15

FM 20.2.3 GOODBYE balanced P102                                                                      8                    15                      8

FM 20 NORTHERN SOUL 5-3-2      P107ECFA                                                         7                   18                        6

FM 20.1 FM 20 WULF 4141                                                                                        9                    16                        7

FM 20 BEOWULF 4411                                                                                                19                   12                    19                        7             7                  3

FM 20.2.3     PARISIENNE WALKWAYS 4231 IF     Best tested 4231                21                   22                    10                          8             2                9

FM 20 MILAN 4141                                                                                                      11                 17                      9                         9             9                  8

FM 20 SYMPATHY 442                                                                                               13                    2

FM 20 WULF 4132  P102ECCC                                                                                   10                    6

FM 20.2 WULF VOL 42220                                                                                          18                 26                       5

FM 20 SYMPATHY 4222 VOL2                                                                                   17                    11                    18

 FM20 WULF 4132 ALL CUPS                                                                                     23                       8

FM20 GOODBYE 4132                                                                                                   14                     10

FM 20.2.3 TIME 442                                                                                                      13                  14                      11

FM 20 PILGRIMAGE 41311                                                                                         11                   25                     12

FM20.2 STARGAZING 442P106ECFA                                                                        22                    4

FM 20.2.3 WULF 4132 P105ECCC                                                                             24                 13

FM 20 TEQUILA SUNRISE                                                                                                                  23

Edited by knap

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6 minutes ago, knap said:

Almost role reversals with the ARGUS Tactics. So far MR L may be more consistent.

How do you mean? Has he tested a new Argus?

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The new ARGUS 3322 has a dropped DM so should be more secure at back. FM Base test results are the opposite and in a few cases underdog results are very low. Argus 352 with MR L is good in both (new one not yet tested).

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2 minutes ago, knap said:

The new ARGUS 3322 has a dropped DM so should be more secure at back. FM Base test results are the opposite and in a few cases underdog results are very low. Argus 352 with MR L is good in both (new one not yet tested).

So you think the new Argus might go above Sicilian?

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Happy new year guys! Knap to bring out a 115points tactic tomorrow 😉

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6 hours ago, knap said:

A few test results puts the order as follows (Excludes new tactics)              OVERALL     SUB TOP UNDERDOG           OVERALL SUB TOP   UNDERDOG

FM 20.2 SICILIAN 4222 P101                                                                                   1                   7                        1                         3               4             6

FM 20 SYMPATHY 4222                                                                                             2                  1                      14

FM 20.2.3  ARGUS 3322                                                                                              3                 3                      16        

FM 20 ARGUS 352                                                                                                        4                 19                      3                         1                3               2

FM 20 WULF 4132 (FM 19 P112)      P106                                                               11                 6                      17                         5               8                1

FM 20.2 PILGRIMAGE 41221       OXFORD                                                             15                    9                      20                        2                 1             7

BEOWULF 442 P107                                                                                                  19                    20                      13                         4              5                 3

FM 20.2 NORTHERN SOUL        P101CC                                                               14                       26                     2                           6               6              5

FM 20 SICILIAN  4222 P98                                                                                         5                       5                   15

FM 20.2.3 GOODBYE balanced P102                                                                      7                    15                    7

FM 20 NORTHERN SOUL 5-3-2      P107ECFA                                                         6                    18                        5

FM 20.1 FM 20 WULF 4141                                                                                        8                   16                         6

FM 20 BEOWULF 4411                                                                                                18                   12                    19                        7             7                  3

FM 20.2.3     PARISIENNE WALKWAYS 4231 IF     Best tested 4231                20                   21                    10                          8             2                9

FM 20 MILAN 4141                                                                                                      10                 17                      8                         9             9                  8

FM 20 SYMPATHY 442                                                                                               12                    2

FM 20 WULF 4132  P102ECCC                                                                                   9                       5

FM 20.2 WULF VOL 42220                                                                                            17                 25                     4

FM 20 SYMPATHY 4222 VOL2                                                                                   16                    11                    18

 FM20 WULF 4132 ALL CUPS                                                                                     22                       8

FM20 GOODBYE 4132                                                                                                   20                     10

FM 20.2.3 TIME 442                                                                                                      13                 14                      11

FM 20 PILGRIMAGE 41311                                                                                         10                   24                     12

FM20.2 STARGAZING 442P106ECFA                                                                        21                    4

FM 20.2.3 WULF 4132 P105ECCC                                                                             23                  13

FM 20 TEQUILA SUNRISE                                                                                                                  22

Happy new year guys!

I dont understand this format why for example sicilian has 1-7-1 and then 3-4-6 or the beowulf 442 looks bad in the first column 19-20-13 but in the next looks good 4-5-3

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Happy new year.

Knap i have a idea.Why dont you make a table as you did before to show us which tactic is suitable to each  team?

I would be nice.

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There are 2 testing leagues which are slightly different, but both aim to identify good sub top and underdog tactics.

Sicilian is 1st Overall but due to being a better underdog tactic, with Sympathy best sub top.

2nd test is still catching up in terms of testing but is showing ARGUS 352 as being best overall tactic

With the 2nd test you could use Oxford at home being a good sub top tactic and Beowulf 4132 as an Away tactic.

 

 

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With ARGUS 352, is there any point using any other mentality than attacking? I mean most of the roles are set to attacking. No automatic etc.

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TIME Tactic do not use PIs if you are looking for a tactic for a Tablet (I Pad you should be able to import). Also Screenshots of Sicilian in the thread.

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I do not use Automatic for changing duty, as I only really use 1 mentality apart from a SUS.

Most likely duty changes if say using a control tactic would be WBs from, attack to support and perhaps a MC from support to defend.

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39 minutes ago, knap said:

There are 2 testing leagues which are slightly different, but both aim to identify good sub top and underdog tactics.

Sicilian is 1st Overall but due to being a better underdog tactic, with Sympathy best sub top.

2nd test is still catching up in terms of testing but is showing ARGUS 352 as being best overall tactic

With the 2nd test you could use Oxford at home being a good sub top tactic and Beowulf 4132 as an Away tactic.

 

 

Which 4132 do you recommend away ?

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1 minute ago, knap said:

I do not use Automatic for changing duty, as I only really use 1 mentality apart from a SUS.

Most likely duty changes if say using a control tactic would be WBs from, attack to support and perhaps a MC from support to defend.

Thanks. Gonna give ARGUS 352 a shot. I love that both the two Mezzalas trains long shots and finishing. Gonna be some fun bombarding sometimes!

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BEOWULF 4132 P106 for Away.

If you have a problem with balls over top try using the GOODBYE 4132,

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@knap First of all, happy new year. Are you working on a certain tactic right now? Or having a little break from creating tactics?

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13 hours ago, knap said:

The new ARGUS 3322 has a dropped DM so should be more secure at back. FM Base test results are the opposite and in a few cases underdog results are very low. Argus 352 with MR L is good in both (new one not yet tested).

Just to clarify the difference, our underdog team is 120 CA whereas Mr L's is 140 CA. 

For further clarity, our sub-top is 145 CA and Mr L's is 165 CA. 

For even further clarity, Barcelona's average CA is 168.

That'd be why underdog results appear worse on FM Base. 

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5 minutes ago, FM Base said:

Just to clarify the difference, our underdog team is 120 CA whereas Mr L's is 145 CA. 

For further clarity, our sub-top is 145 CA and Mr L's is 165 CA. 

For even further clarity, Barcelona's average CA is 168.

That'd be why underdog results appear worse on FM Base. 

I never knew this. I think an underdog team CA should be about 120 and the top team should be 160.

but then does it not depend on all other teams.... if MrL underdog is 145 and then his top team is 165, there is 20 point CA difference, and in FM Base the difference is 25 CA points so is pretty similar???

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My understanding is that the MR L Test League is a lot harder and they needed to increase CA compared to previous years.

The pts total for ARGUS 352 is about same on both leagues, which to a degree shows they are comparable.

 

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Posted (edited)

I think it's great we have 2 tactic testing leagues and both are extremely helpful when picking a tactic for your team. Many thanks and keep up the good work FM Base and MrL.
The other thing is that it's impossible to create a perfect tactic testing model (same as perfect tactic) - FM is too complicated itself, you need to make too many assumptions and the game is random to some extent. So no test can determine which tactic guarantees a 100% success in every save, but I find both tests as really important guides (even FM arena testing league can give us some hints, but that thing with reputation and underdog team performing better than sub-top in most cases makes those tests results really flawed)

Edited by wagabunda

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Happy new year, knapp is it possible for you to put up your attacking corner tactics please? I'm using Sicilian but on switch so can't download anything. Thanks in advance.

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On 31/12/2019 at 09:19, Lloydey1 said:

Is this tactic on FM Base / being tested fully? I have started using it with good results (but I am Man Utd). It suits Pogba (AP A) and Bruno Fernandes (MEZ A) but I have been tweaking the wingers to IF or IW. Any views on that?

Don't think so , nobody but me and another seem to have shown any interest in it but for me there's no altering home or away , no worrying about changing bits and bobs , simple plug'n'play .

 

Im now at the end of the 1st season using it and top the Prem , had a major wobble due to injuries and a wafer thin squad but seem back on track , will finish in Champ League places at least

 

 

one.png

two.png

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13 minutes ago, rammalc said:

Don't think so , nobody but me and another seem to have shown any interest in it but for me there's no altering home or away , no worrying about changing bits and bobs , simple plug'n'play .

 

Im now at the end of the 1st season using it and top the Prem , had a major wobble due to injuries and a wafer thin squad but seem back on track , will finish in Champ League places at least

 

 

one.png

two.png

Is this with the 451 tactic?

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3 minutes ago, Spikester said:

Is this with the 451 tactic?

it's DavyDepuydt1 tweaked version of TIME  from page 99 i think it's on , a 433 originally

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1 hour ago, Teooo :D said:

How do i know if my team is underdog or sub top? what does it depend on? @FM Base @knap

Sorry for my english and have a nice new year to everybody.



 

Underdog is a team not expected to do very well, perhaps a relegation candidate

Sub-top are your not quite top 4 teams, Everton, Wolves, etc..

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Because I test with top, the pts total in tactic name will give an idea of what is best for top club,

Top Club say 1-5 in League

Sub Top 6-11 in League

Underdog the rest

Can also use Top and Sub Top a Home Tactic Underdog Away or

Top Favourite Sub Top Evens Underdog if Underdog

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@knap what would be a good tactic for arsenal? I'm still searching for a solid tactic with forward wing players

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