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Well, I'm finding the level of difficulty absolutely spot on at the moment, and I'm the only one that matters, so hopefully SI don't mess it around too much :D

 

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2 hours ago, pats said:

This is Bremen (me, predicted to finish 12th) vs Wolfsburg (predicted to finish 7th) in the 7th game of my first Bundesliga season. As you can see, they had 0 shots on target, 0 shots off target, 0 blocked, 0 woodwork, 0 half chances, 0 clear cut chances and 0 long shots. They had 41% possession and 490 attempted passes in total, so it's not like I just kept the ball for the 90 minutes. They had a red card but that was in the 71st minute. Something is making teams overpowered very quickly after starting the season. Too easy?? Very much so in my opinion.

Bremen_Wolfsburg.thumb.png.2b30c7a698424bcfb1d42632ead4be6c.png

Alright so an update on this. Playing with same tactic, in the next match we faced Schalke away (who were top of the league). They absolutely smashed us but we held our nerves, scored a goal on the counter and won the game 0-1, classic Mourinho style. Really liked what I saw. Schalke didn't give us anything. Very challenging and difficult match.

I think the current difficulty issue could be about in-form teams being too powerful. Btw, I'm just trying to find out what could be causing teams to go on unbeaten runs.

Oh and they got frustrated in the end and broke my best player's (Gebre Selassie) leg which has ruled him out for 4-5 months. Beautiful! :D

Screenshot:

Schalke-Bremen.thumb.png.65313a3ba7c6a3e77f521088f568b36d.png

Edited by pats

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I agree. I've just won my 2nd champions League with apollon in the Greek League. It's 2023.....

Top class managers need to be better.

Squad building AI needs improving.

The match engine needs a massive overhaul or preferably start from scratch.

I'm using the same tactics as in 18. I'm undefeated in the league for 3 seasons now.  The match engine has the same exploits as the last 5+ years

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On 24/10/2018 at 12:23, tajj7 said:

Disagree, it's a game, it should be fun not a job

As manager of Torquay i can assure you it is a job - not a game!

Proud of my team tactical discipline after three 0-0 in a row.

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12 minutes ago, trevjim said:

I agree. I've just won my 2nd champions League with apollon in the Greek League. It's 2023.....

Top class managers need to be better.

Squad building AI needs improving.

The match engine needs a massive overhaul or preferably start from scratch.

I'm using the same tactics as in 18. I'm undefeated in the league for 3 seasons now.  The match engine has the same exploits as the last 5+ years

I think the smaller leagues has always been easier to play and win in.

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18 minutes ago, ravenation said:

I think the smaller leagues has always been easier to play and win in.

True but to win back to back champions Leagues within 5 years?

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5 hours ago, toby14 said:

First summer mate. Very unrealistic. 

Well I guess if it was the summer after the fist season and you won the league then it could happen. Especially if Chelsea had a nightmare season.

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Nah, not easy

Just played two away games as Liverpool

2-0 up early on at Watford, they came at me the whole of the 2nd half & had me sweating, exactly the same at Dortmund just. Only managed to hang on to 2-1 wins in both 

The AI deffo turn more aggressive when they need to 

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Agree, won most of my games in the first season without any bigger problems, so should be definitly more challanging. Although you have a bigger team it should be more difficult, because also greater teams have their own problems, for example: manage the stars and bring them to play together as one team and so on.. but it should be only rarly a fast selling team, not everything works without any issues, neither as a bigger team.. and the challange itself in manage a team consists of some problems or things which I should do better.. then it's worth something. But when it's too easy (for smaller or bigger teams) then it gets boring with time.

Edited by MagicTiger

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2 hours ago, trevjim said:

True but to win back to back champions Leagues within 5 years?

Ok, that is crazy with a greek team. Remember i dominated the Hungarian league and played well in Europe with Ferencvaros in FM 17 or FM18. But after 6th season i never managed to win the CL. Im onky in my 2nd season and i never manage top teams, so maybe i will not experience it. I think my results in 2nd season so far is not dominating - but with 15 new players it will be interesting to see late in season when i have new leaders and highly influential players in the squad.

But i noticed i beat a PL team in a training match and drew another one. It would not have happened in previously FMs.

Edited by ravenation

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Factors to consider when saying the game is too easy:

  • Selectable team shape is finally gone, no room for error anymore in creating tactics that clearly is ruined by wrong shape.
  • For the first time in the series lifespan pressing now actually works. Forwards on support duty chase the ball, AMs also. It's easier to set up pressing tactics - which is a very good thing - DON'T CHANGE IT!
  • The new tactic templates holds the hand of new players and tells them why a system works and why it doesn't. It makes it easier to get started for new players to the franchise - GOOD.

If anything, buying top class players is too easy in FM. As long as your reputation and wallet allows it, you can buy just about anyone. This is not a good thing.

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Oh. And here I was thinking the tactics templates made me win matches when in reallity the game is easier. I guess the devs will now "adjust" the match engine and I will be back being a cheating loser. :(

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1 minute ago, Viking said:

Oh. And here I was thinking the tactics templates made me win matches when in reallity the game is easier. I guess the devs will now "adjust" the match engine and I will be back being a cheating loser. :(

Yup. I imagine, as always, ME flaws will be worked on and "sorted" for the release, and within a month or two there'll be multiple people moaning that "crosses are totally ineffective", "no tactics work" and the classic "can't get a winning run because AI figures out my tactic within weeks"

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If AI is not able (yet) to use (and change) new preset styles then these styles are a kind of downloaded tactics. But if these style will be fully implemented for AI use then "too easy" will become "too hard"

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vor 13 Minuten schrieb GreenTriangle:

If AI is not able (yet) to use (and change) new preset styles then these styles are a kind of downloaded tactics. But if these style will be fully implemented for AI use then "too easy" will become "too hard"

This could be the main problem, as you and some other said, the AI isn't able to use the new preset tactics.. Basicly, in best case the game is fair, so it's not "too easy" and not "too hard", the midle way.. but if I must choose only beetween these two options, I would choose the "too hard" way. Of course, it could be a little depressing from time to time, but you can work on some things and try to find a way to get more succesful. But as I mentioned, if it's too easy, you'll lost the incentive to play more than a few seasons, when the game "plays itself" and you have no more challenges.

Edited by MagicTiger

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51 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Yup. I imagine, as always, ME flaws will be worked on and "sorted" for the release, and within a month or two there'll be multiple people moaning that "crosses are totally ineffective", "no tactics work" and the classic "can't get a winning run because AI figures out my tactic within weeks"

Of course - or else the FM religion fans club will have nothing to be upset about.

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I can imagine ... let's say a newly promoted team (casual human player) would meet Liverpool (AI with fully implemented gegenpressing style). Final result ? 0-5.  "Oh, but it's too hard, it's not normal, I'm sure ME is broken,  maybe I should search for come downoadable Diablo tactics"

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On 24 October 2018 at 13:23, Dagenham_Dave said:

I'm struggling a bit with a mid-table Serie A side, although we've picked up a bit of form recently. Sitting roughly where they are in real life at the moment, scorelines have been pretty realistic so far. 

Then you, sir, are not very good at this game...despite having no injuries 😂

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It has been a long established fact that the AI has access to the same tactical tools that we do. The fundamental problem is that from evaluating as many examples as I can find, said AI isn't making effective use of these tools.

Whilst I think the ME is largely impressive at representing your tactical style, can you honestly say the same about the AI?

To me the AI play with zero identity. I couldn't tell you what their style / game plan if my life depended on it.

I've seen countless FM YouTubers smash the best teams on the planet by 4 or 5 goal margins. During these games, the likes of Messi and Suarez don't do a single thing that distinguishes them from fringe players at mid table clubs. 

If I'm managing Arsenal in the first season and play Man City away, I should fear them. Their standard is what I aspire to and should take me several years to reach - That's what gives you the sense of accomplishment no other game does. 

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1 minute ago, dannysheard said:

Then you, sir, are not very good at this game

This I have never denied. Makes it a more realistic experience though, so who's the real winner here? :rolleyes:

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On 24 October 2018 at 15:33, Vinnyvagus77 said:

First of all, I'm just sharing my thoughts and opinions based on this version of FM vs the many earlier versions I've played-  and in the past using a standard SI provided tactic I was very rarely successful so had to build my own tactic (often without much success!).     

This year so far in the beta, I am using a standard provided formation and tweaked one or two instructions such as ask the GK to roll out and not to dive in....and I'm unbeaten in the league heading into January and along the way I beat Bayern Munich 5-0.   As I say, I've never experienced this kind or unbeaten run with, even with a big team before and while watching other YouTubers play the beta with the larger teams, it seems the same for them so hence I mentioned my thoughts on this post as I thought it was just me and that I must have been lucky to select a winning standard tactic.

 

I'm not having to change my tactics, adjust my training sessions. I am doing some scouting, rotating the squad and dealing with the media before clicking continue to move along and as a result...I'm on a lengthy unbeaten run.

 

Once the full game comes out I'll be moving lower down the leagues so it may be different, but I can only go by what I'm seeing with this beta save to date.

 

Brilliant game though, I think the look and feel of the game is up there. (And I'm liking the purple! :-) )

 

 

I've been playing FM for years and always done well, but the last few years have just got easier every year. I used to win maybe one in four or five Champions Leagues a few years ago; on FM18, I won 7 out of 9 seasons (across three saves). Each time I quit the save because it was ridiculously easy, and easy is boring.

There must be something that can be done to have difficulty levels.

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23 hours ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

Experienced players who are good at the game anyway using the new preset tactics which have been primarily introduced to help newer players understand the tactical system better is so far this year's biggest facepalm situation. 

The reason they are preset tactics is because they are good tactics used by good managers in real life...why would a good player not want to use good tactics? Come on Dave, you can do this.

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2 minutes ago, dannysheard said:

There must be something that can be done to have difficulty levels.

There are already difficulty levels in the game. It's called not going a big team who is favourite to win every week. :D

If you really must go a top side though, why don't you give yourself a Sunday league rep and no badges with 1's for every one of your attributes, see how easy it is then. 

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* picks one of the best squads in the world, downloads   multiple wonder tactics, inserts the corner exploit and then posts the game is too easy. Time for a nap*

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16 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

There are already difficulty levels in the game. It's called not going a big team who is favourite to win every week. :D

If you really must go a top side though, why don't you give yourself a Sunday league rep and no badges with 1's for every one of your attributes, see how easy it is then. 

I shouldn't have to arbitrarily make a game difficult for myself...that's the job of the developers.

I get that they want to make it inclusive for new players, weaker players or players that don't have the time to do the job properly, but that's the reason that FIFA has difficulty levels. Something for everyone, including the elite players/people, like me.

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2 minutes ago, dannysheard said:

that's the reason that FIFA has difficulty levels

FIFA has difficulty levels because you physically control the players. 

By the way, as tongue in cheek as it may have been, you're not an 'elite' player if you win loads with big clubs that are supposed to win loads. 

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as Dave said before, if you want it to be hard, lower your manager beginning ratings. starting with a top club and using a created manager with world class ratings and complaining its easy is kind of silly.  Its like playing fifa or another sports game  on a rookie mode and complaining . 

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5 minutes ago, Ross Ingersoll said:

as Dave said before, if you want it to be hard, lower your manager beginning ratings. starting with a top club and using a created manager with world class ratings and complaining its easy is kind of silly.  Its like playing fifa or another sports game  on a rookie mode and complaining . 

I love these forums because I get to speak to people I wouldn't normally meet (unless I was getting my exhaust fixed or having something delivered to one of my houses).

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12 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

FIFA has difficulty levels because you physically control the players. 

By the way, as tongue in cheek as it may have been, you're not an 'elite' player if you win loads with big clubs that are supposed to win loads. 

I think if a manager won 13 trophies in three years as Liverpool manager, with the fifth biggest wage spend in the league, they would be considered fairly elite.

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1 minute ago, dannysheard said:

I think if a manager won 13 trophies in three years as Liverpool manager, with the fifth biggest wage spend in the league, they would be considered fairly elite.

Clearly you're not getting enjoyment out of such a save if it's too easy. Why not set yourself more of a challenge? There's loads of ways you can. If you're just going to sit with your finger in your ears going 'la la la, it's not up to me find a challenge', then it's your loss really. 

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5 minutes ago, Ross Ingersoll said:

as Dave said before, if you want it to be hard, lower your manager beginning ratings. starting with a top club and using a created manager with world class ratings and complaining its easy is kind of silly.  Its like playing fifa or another sports game  on a rookie mode and complaining . 

I think the point being raised is that compared to managing a "big" team in FM18 vs a "big" team in FM19 (Beta), both using SI provided tactics, appears (and I say appears lightly as its still a Beta) that the game could be seen as being easier than previous versions.

 

  • FM18 played with Dortmund, using a standard tactic with a few tweaks to play out the back finished 8th and ultimately got sacked
  • FM19 (Beta) playing with Dortmund, using a tactic provided by SI (Geganpress) and a couple of tweaks asking the GK to roll out from the back and I'm unbeaten in the league, smashed Bayern 5-0, run in the cup, only lost to Barcelona in the Champions League all season - plus letting my Assistant do training so it's not that I'm making a difference due to this.

 

So for me, it's more of a comparison between the versions of FM, both with a "big" side.  So saying to go manage Lower down the league to make it harder isn't the point here - at least my point anyway.   Its a comparison between managing the bigger teams compared to previous versions is what I've noticed seems easier (at this time!!)  and I've seen the same from watching those on YouTube as well.

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I dunno about that, the previous versions have all had people winning the league with Southampton and Swansea in the first season. Some people just find the game really easy. I'd hate it if that was me. 

That said, there seems to be evidence to suggest managing the top sides looks a bit easier I still think this is down to the preset tactic set up which now suggests not just the best formations, but also the roles to play as well, which the game has never done before. 

So far I've only heard of one player using their own created vanilla tactic with a top side and breezing it.  Maybe, like how you can bypass the tutorial, SI could include an option not to see any of the presets, and force users to make their own tactic from scratch. But then people would just download one off the internet. 

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1 hour ago, dannysheard said:

Then you, sir, are not very good at this game...despite having no injuries 😂

He's likely still outperforming the AI without realizing (heavily) in some area at least. Which is one of the long-term cruxes of the matter; the perceived performance of top teams on just about any release. I personally don't consider myself an FM god either, but I could happily point fingers to releases where you could make a bullet point list of maybe 10 entries -- stick to them, never change much and you are guaranteed to be superior over AI managing those same top sides.
 

3 hours ago, Ji-Sung Park said:

Factors to consider when saying the game is too easy:

  • Selectable team shape is finally gone, no room for error anymore in creating tactics that clearly is ruined by wrong shape.

The shape had far less impact than people give it credit for. :)It's fishy picks/mixes in role and duty that did "ruin" tactics, no pick in shape. Which is also logical, given that it is and has alwys been primarily the roles and duties that govern movement as to FM. I find that observation about the presets fascinating though -- because in theory, they ought to help the AI also.... which should balance things a bit! Naturally, there's still going to be differences how and when they are being utilized between AI and human manager.

Edited by Svenc

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47 minutes ago, dannysheard said:

I shouldn't have to arbitrarily make a game difficult for myself...that's the job of the developers.

FM is a sandbox game, it's in the very definition of this genre that the user sets himself the difficulty level, rules and win conditions.

28 minutes ago, dannysheard said:

I think if a manager won 13 trophies in three years as Liverpool manager, with the fifth biggest wage spend in the league, they would be considered fairly elite.

Those metrics are just silly. There are better games out there for players looking to distinguish themselves as part of a certain percentile.

Edited by SD

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33 minutes ago, Ross Ingersoll said:

as Dave said before, if you want it to be hard, lower your manager beginning ratings. starting with a top club and using a created manager with world class ratings and complaining its easy is kind of silly.  Its like playing fifa or another sports game  on a rookie mode and complaining . 

The thing is you can win the champs lg after back to back promotions with the smallest club in europe if the game is too easy. You are merely talking about a time delay not a difficulty barometer. 

But like i said before, comparing liverpool to hartlepool is irrelevant... If danny is always liverpool then he is comparing fm18 (or previous) to fm19... If fm19 is suddenly far easier... Thats an issue. 

Ive found it comparably a lot easier using tactics and clubs i employed in fm18. 

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40 minutes ago, Ross Ingersoll said:

as Dave said before, if you want it to be hard, lower your manager beginning ratings. starting with a top club and using a created manager with world class ratings and complaining its easy is kind of silly.  Its like playing fifa or another sports game  on a rookie mode and complaining . 

Should try managing in the second Chilean division where no one will listen to me :'(

 

Dodged the relegation playoff on the final day.

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3 minutes ago, yowg8ynwa said:

Should try managing in the second Chilean division where no one will listen to me :'(

 

Dodged the relegation playoff on the final day.

or use a team  in brazil, the season is so long  by the time its over, you will have forgotten what you were complaining about at the start

Edited by Ross Ingersoll

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6 minutes ago, SD said:

FM is a sandbox game, it's in the very definition of this genre that the user sets himself the difficulty level, rules and win conditions.

Those metrics are just silly. There are better games out there for players looking to distinguish themselves as part of a certain percentile.

Is it really a sandbox game?

I like football and I like Liverpool, so I want to be able to play a football management simulation where it is at least a bit of a challenge to dominate.

 

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5 minutes ago, Ross Ingersoll said:

or use a team  in brazil, the season is so long  by the time its over, you will have forgotten what you were complaining about at the start

Unfortunately I heard that the winter transfer window is wrong in the Brazilian leagues and will need to be fixed through database.  Also, I don't even know how many competitions there are in each season.

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6 minutes ago, yowg8ynwa said:

Unfortunately I heard that the winter transfer window is wrong in the Brazilian leagues and will need to be fixed through database.  Also, I don't even know how many competitions there are in each season.

I am in the B league and I see 4, looks like around 70ish matches or so. the normal league is 38 by itself

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6 minutes ago, dannysheard said:

Is it really a sandbox game?

I like football and I like Liverpool, so I want to be able to play a football management simulation where it is at least a bit of a challenge to dominate.

 

I see where you're coming from, I was never a fan of LLM or San Marino challenges.

There are definitely ways you can make the game more challenging for yourself, but it's up to yourself to enforce those ways.

It's unreasonable to expect a game as exhaustive as FM to be bulletproof. Even multiplayer game developed specifically for the purpose of competing struggle for balance years after they were launched, and those games are far more limited in scope.

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16 minutes ago, dannysheard said:

Is it really a sandbox game?

I like football and I like Liverpool, so I want to be able to play a football management simulation where it is at least a bit of a challenge to dominate.

 

You could always try to win the league with a British squad, or an English squad at Liverpool, which would already add a layer of difficulty to the game.  You wold have to either pay premium prices for established English players, buy and develop younger ones or through your own academy.

 

3 minutes ago, Ross Ingersoll said:

I am in the B league and I see 4, looks like around 70ish matches or so. the normal league is 38 by itself

Hopefully someone in Brazil will hire me!  

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6 minutes ago, SD said:

I see where you're coming from, I was never a fan of LLM or San Marino challenges.

There are definitely ways you can make the game more challenging for yourself, but it's up to yourself to enforce those ways.

It's unreasonable to expect a game as exhaustive as FM to be bulletproof. Even multiplayer game developed specifically for the purpose of competing struggle for balance years after they were launched, and those games are far more limited in scope.

I did start adding in some 'difficulty' in FM18 (changing formation each season, selling some star players every season etc.) which I'll do again this time.

It didn't use to be this easy a few years ago, though. I guess the more features they add in, like more advanced tactics, the easier it is to overpower the AI.

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7 minutes ago, yowg8ynwa said:

You could always try to win the league with a British squad, or an English squad at Liverpool, which would already add a layer of difficulty to the game.  You wold have to either pay premium prices for established English players, buy and develop younger ones or through your own academy.

 

Hopefully someone in Brazil will hire me!  

The danger is that it loses its immersion if you add something too arbitrary to the way you play.

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6 minutes ago, dannysheard said:

I did start adding in some 'difficulty' in FM18 (changing formation each season, selling some star players every season etc.) which I'll do again this time.

It didn't use to be this easy a few years ago, though. I guess the more features they add in, like more advanced tactics, the easier it is to overpower the AI.

I've you've played Liverpool every year there might be an easier explanation - it's for the first time since 06-07 that Liverpool have a world class squad. :)

Edited by SD

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5 minutes ago, dannysheard said:

The danger is that it loses its immersion if you add something too arbitrary to the way you play.

That is true, although it does seem relatively realistic to try and achieve.

For supreme immersion, you could try to manage Athletic Bilbao in La Liga, they used to have a very strict policy of only employing players from their specific region (the Basque Country) in Spain. I think they only recently widened their approach to include Spanish players (and a Romanian who grew up in the Basque Country).

 

Edit: Changed info on Romanian player

Edited by yowg8ynwa

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4 minutes ago, SD said:

I've you've played Liverpool every year there might be an easier explanation - it's for the first time since 06-07 that Liverpool have a world class squad. :)

This is my fear. FM18 was already very easy as Liverpool and this season they'll have Alisson, who looks a beast from the quick look at the beta that I had, and VvD from the start and full-fat Salah from the start etc.

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1 hour ago, dannysheard said:

The reason they are preset tactics is because they are good tactics used by good managers in real life...why would a good player not want to use good tactics? Come on Dave, you can do this.

No. They are styles. Are not identical with real tactics.  They are "average" configurations optimized so that they are balanced .  People who have designed these styles know more about ME than 100 "gamebreaking-tactics" creatorsTheir purpose was not to create super tactics but to provide a starting point for less experienced users. More experienced users can create many other balanced configurations based on similar principles. Some real teams use tactical configurations very similar to those presented in the game as "styles". But no real team will use the same style irrespective of the opponent, the competition, the available players,  the frequency of the matches

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I find this iteration of FM easy to the point of being unrewarding and boring. There is simply no challenge. IMO its a game more than a simulation. Maybe someone made a choice; perhaps there is more money to be made with a game rather than a realistic simulation - who knows. I keep buying it though...

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