4-3-3 Half Back (Pep's Barca)

[pauly15]

Never thought I'd say this, but I think the match engine has come on in leaps and bounds this year. I'm into my fourth season with Leeds trying to recreate Pep-ball:

 

Problem areas I'm working on:

- Getting beaten over the top of the CB's. Mainly recognising quick strikers and dropping the line, and speed training. Haven't tried a "cover" role yet.

- DLP (support) giving away the ball too much. Poor attempts to switch the play with longer cross-field passes leading to turnovers. I think he's also takingtoo many poor long shots. 

- Late equalisers. If your line is super high, they go more direct and the pressing becomes less effective.

- Away from home against a quick striker you have to drop your pressing and defensive line a notch. 

- (Resolved) Excessive goals conceded from out wide. Having the inside forwards on support has helped; on attack they don't track back nearly enough.

- Good striker performance. I have been using strikers on support roles (f9, DLF, pressing forward support [my wonderkid fits the mould]) but because I have the inside forwards on support, I think the striker needs to be on an attacking role. Complete forward (a) or DLF (a) are the next things I'll try.

 

Player traits/attributes:

General: Work rate, technical ability, passing. 

CWBs: Stamina. Hug touchline, get forward as often as possible.

CBs: Pace, Simple passing to more creative players

HB: Defensive positioning, strength, tackling, simple passing

Advanced playmaker (attack): dribbling, balance, technique, acceleration, vision. 'Runs with ball through centre' PPM. I loaned Foden in the my first PL season and he was great. It's difficult to find a natural CM with these attributes.

DLP (support): Trying to improve performance in this position. I think a box-to-box midfielder may work better. 

Inside forwards (support): pace, acceleration, work rate, first touch, finishing. (Woodburn has been good)

Pressing forward (support): Mainly because I have a wonderkid who fits this mould. I've struggled to make the false 9 work well. Struggling with the forward's role in general.

Sweeper Keeper (attack): Rushing out, passing, first touch.

 

In possesion:

Focus passing:

Initially I had it on focus through the middle but I find having no set focus is improving player choices on the ball.

Offensive width:

Again, I had it on narrow, but standard appears to be working better at the moment. 

Work ball into box: 

Necessary to stop excessive long shots.

Tempo:

A maximum of standard. I lower the tempo if I'm not controlling the game. 

 

Transition:

 

Playing out:

Playing out looks much improved in this year's ME, but I've noticed that if you exactly prescribe a section to play out to (e.g. roll out to CB's, or full backs, or playmaker) that the keeper panics when it's not available (i.e. when the opposition "prevent short GK distribution", or press really high). If the option prescribed isn't available, it'll often lead to a mistake leading to a goal. So I leave it on roll out, but don't let him decide to who. 

 

Out of possession:

Defensive width:

The main area I concede is from the CWB's getting beaten and crosses coming in. Having the defensive width on narrow exaccerbates this so at the moment I have it on standard. 

Offside trap: working well.

 

Counter-intuitive stuff / controversial (imo):

Advanced player-maker attack not support. The team and the individual seem to work better if this player is getting further forward. I suppose if your Insisde Forwards are on support rather than attack this makes sense, as he has less targets to hit. I'm finding putting the inside forwards on attack is too problematic defensively in wide areas however. 

DLP (support) is the role I'm finding best in the second CM slot. I tried a roaming play-maker, which caused a lot of problems. Box-to-box midfielder seems to work well so I might investigate that further. 

Couter-attacking: I like to counter!

 

Mistakes:

Majority of mistakes are coming from my younger left centre back getting beaten over the top, and my DLP support role.

 

Training: Higher than usual attacking, technical and GK one V ones in my current calendar. 

Set pieces: Struggling to find an effective offensive routine. Currently trialling near post variations. 

Tackling: Sometimes you'll need to go hard tackling. Not having possession and dealing with counter-attacks are make or break issues for this. You'll concede clear cut chances and sometimes hard tackling is the price you have to pay to try to reduce them. 

Overlapping: I select this occasionally when the opposition are playing narrow, or with wing-backs or a diamond. 

Other:

Fitness demands are extremely high, so you'll need a decent squad and to rotate regularly.

Tried an advanced playmaker in a wide position (as it suited the player more), caused lots of problems. 

 

 

 

[ajsr1982]

Being beaten over the top is a tough one, and I'm not sure what you do to avoid it to be quite honest. Barcelona played Puyol, Pique and Mascherano in that position over the years, and what attributes did they have?

I'm not 100% sure what attributes (or lack of) causes the 'ball over the top' issue to be made worse. There is the obvious pace and acceleration of course. But I'd also think the following are important.

Agility - the ability to change direction. Given your CBs are facing forward and need to do a 180 to give chase, this feels important.

The usual combination of Concentration, Positioning and Marking should also be needed.

You already have a SK in place, so not much more you can do.

[pauly15]

Issues #1: Improving centre forward performance. 

Testing a theory: The system should have a striker on support duty. True or nay?

Spoiler

It needn't. Two factors:

- The two players don't overly suit deeper roles.

- Playing inside forwards on support and an advanced playmaker takes that space for a deeper striker to drop in to. 

I think if you're using the above combo, it makes sense to have a striker on an attacking role, who can still bring others into play. I.e. Not a poacher or an advanced forward, but a CF (a), DLF (a), or pressing forward on attack.

 

I've tried a false 9, DLF (s) and (a), and a pressing forward so far. I'm using these two players:

 

Neither are a great fit (especially Da  Graca, but I'm currently training him techinically and he'll be a superstar!) however I feel I should be getting more from them. 

The main issue seems to be... that they just don't see much of the ball! Da Graca is a physical beast and developing young player. It doesn't make any sense to play him in any kind of deeper / support role (he has 10 for passing), but sadly that's what the system calls for. Here's an example: he played 63 minutes as a pressing forward (support) in my 1-1 home draw with Man Utd (which we dominated) and received the ball 11 times.

You can see from the below he had very few touches, made very few passes, no shots, no crosses, no mistakes etc etc.

His average position:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A couple of weeks later we smashed league leaders Liverpool 1-4 away, with De Graca playing as an attacking pressing forward. Eggestien also did well the week before as a CF (a):

Passes received:

Touches:

Shots:

 

Eggestien as CF (a):

Touches:

Shots:

 

Conclusion: It's about more than Eggestien and De Graca obviously being more suited to attacking than support roles. If you play inside forwards on support and an advanced play-maker through the centre, your striker is going to have a bad time if he tries to drop into the same areas they are headed to.

[Paulinho1987]

Is it possible to have a tactic link? I would like to try it on BVB

[pauly15]

22 hours ago, Paulinho1987 said:

Is it possible to have a tactic link? I would like to try it on BVB

Sure, once I've finished tweaking it I'll provide a link.

 

One interesting thing I just discovered was that, even if you have team passing set to "extremely short", playmakers will have their passing length bumped up a notch automatically. This was leading to a lot more mistakes than this setup can handle from my DLP (s) in centre mid.

[yonko]

On October 22, 2018 at 06:55, ajsr1982 said:

Being beaten over the top is a tough one, and I'm not sure what you do to avoid it to be quite honest. Barcelona played Puyol, Pique and Mascherano in that position over the years, and what attributes did they have?

I'm not 100% sure what attributes (or lack of) causes the 'ball over the top' issue to be made worse. There is the obvious pace and acceleration of course. But I'd also think the following are important.

Agility - the ability to change direction. Given your CBs are facing forward and need to do a 180 to give chase, this feels important.

The usual combination of Concentration, Positioning and Marking should also be needed.

You already have a SK in place, so not much more you can do.

I would add Anticipation to that mix there. 

OP, you are playing with Attacking mentality and the Highest D-Line and E-Line. It's normal to get caught once in awhile. It's the risk of the tactic, as IRL. That's why coaches like Pep are brave in this approach.

It comes down to players having the right attributes, especially the defenders. 

[Sticx]

I'm using a similar setup and I think if you want to get as close to Pep's Barca then I would suggest making your Dlp a RPM with an instruction to move into channels as this is what Xavi would do. I also instruct my AP to roam because Iniesta would wander all over the pitch. The Messi role is almost impossible to replicate as he is such a unique player. Ive tried a f9, dlf, T, pf but none really capture it. Ive stuck with a dlf for now. I also use dual cwb-s because on attack they will just pump all the balls they get as crosses into the box and I like trying to get my side to pass it in most of the time. 

[kpsia518]

3 hours ago, pauly15 said:

Sure, once I've finished tweaking it I'll provide a link.

 

One interesting thing I just discovered was that, even if you have team passing set to "extremely short", playmakers will have their passing length bumped up a notch automatically. This was leading to a lot more mistakes than this setup can handle from my DLP (s) in centre mid.

there are 2 way of pep tactic.

peps in barca,IF sit narrow,WB push foward at the wing,& CM hold position,& bacame W M shape.

& pep in city,IF sit wide,IWB sit narrow,CM push forward.& bacame W M shape.
or some time pep do try left IF go wide,right IF sit narrow....& other movement,& W M shape again.

[kpsia518]

How to utilise Inverted Full Backs

https://www.thecoachingmanual.com/Content/4820819387613184

just for reference.

 

 

[Gegenklaus]

1 hour ago, kpsia518 said:

there are 2 way of pep tactic.

peps in barca,IF sit narrow,WB push foward at the wing,& CM hold position,& bacame W M shape.

& pep in city,IF sit wide,IWB sit narrow,CM push forward.& bacame W M shape.
or some time pep do try left IF go wide,right IF sit narrow....& other movement,& W M shape again.

Exactly. Pep likes to create two bands of 5 players. One band attack, the other protect (the possesion/for counters). 

[abdi1721]

Any PI's? Going to try it out with Liverpool

[kpsia518]

6 hours ago, Gegenklaus said:

Exactly. Pep likes to create two bands of 5 players. One band attack, the other protect (the possesion/for counters). 

always W M shape in build up

 

 

[pauly15]

Thanks for all your suggestions & comments! 

I agree with everything said- initially I tried to make the tactic exactly as I see it (roaming playmaker in CM, IFs on attack etc.) but I found some challenges I struggled to overcome. Mainly defending in wide areas forced some concessions to the roles of the front 3. 

There's a nice video of Thierry Henry talking through some points here: 

 

 

I'm currently trialling: 

- IFs: removed "sit narrow" instruction so they start wide then cut in late. Trying to add "get further forward" on the support role, but I'm finding it just kills you out wide defensively even though they're on support duty.

 

- Extremely Wide attacking width to try to create space.

 

- Rather than an "advanced playmaker" in CM, I'm trying a CM(a) with creative instructions. The reason for this is that the Advanced Playmaker's pressing instruction is capped at "less urgent", which is not what you want in a 4-3-3. Unfortunately it means that the CM (a) will be in front of the ball and in front of the IF (s) too often, but it's a choice between that and bad pressing. 

 

 

[kpsia518]

34 minutes ago, pauly15 said:

Thanks for all your suggestions & comments! 

I agree with everything said- initially I tried to make the tactic exactly as I see it (roaming playmaker in CM, IFs on attack etc.) but I found some challenges I struggled to overcome. Mainly defending in wide areas forced some concessions to the roles of the front 3. 

There's a nice video of Thierry Henry talking through some points here: 

 

 

I'm currently trialling: 

- IFs: removed "sit narrow" instruction so they start wide then cut in late.

 

- Extremely Wide attacking width to try to create space.

 

- Rather than an "advanced playmaker" in CM, I'm trying a CM(a) with creative instructions. The reason for this is that the Advanced Playmaker's pressing instruction is capped at "less urgent", which is not what you want in a 4-3-3. Unfortunately it means that the CM (a) will be in front of the ball and in front of the IF (s) too often, but it's a choice between that and bad pressing. 

 

 

pep tactic,should be very structured in build up

learn from this report:
https://www.thecoachingmanual.com/Content/4820819387613184


2 CM have been given freedom to roaming in this area.



But for other player,stay position.

so what role should we use in FM19,for the player to do that

[pauly15]

5 minutes ago, kpsia518 said:

pep tactic,should be very structured in build up

learn from this report:
https://www.thecoachingmanual.com/Content/4820819387613184


2 CM have been given freedom to roaming in this area.



But for other player,stay position.

so what role should we use in FM19,for the player to do that

That one is for Inverted wing-backs, but yeah if you want to try that just select "roam from position" for the CMs. The challenge is always getting it all right rather than just one aspect (i.e. positioning with the ball). The big problem is trying to get an advanced playmaker right because they're restricted from pressing aggressively. 

[kpsia518]

4 minutes ago, pauly15 said:

That one is for Inverted wing-backs, but yeah if you want to try that just select "roam from position" for the CMs. The challenge is always getting it all right rather than just one aspect (i.e. positioning with the ball). The big problem is trying to get an advanced playmaker right because they're restricted from pressing aggressively. 

i test this one for long time in FM18,not try yet in FM19
We can't do that in fm18.

 

but maybe try AP or Mezzala in fm19

[pauly15]

Hmmmm.... This is a bit ridiculous! All my goals are coming from crosses:

[Jean0987654321]

Seems to be a crossing bug coming around again. 

 

Crossing Manager 3 is back

[kpsia518]

 

[pauly15]

42 minutes ago, Jean0987654321 said:

Seems to be a crossing bug coming around again. 

 

Crossing Manager 3 is back

I guess it is reasonable for the tactic I've ended up with (CWBs and supporting inside forwards...) How are others doing with Inside forwards on attack? At the moment I find them unplayable with CWBs despite the half-back. I'm trying "defensive width" wide now to see if it helps. 

[yonko]

@pauly15

Why are you playing on Attacking mentality? What is the reason for it?

I think you should play narrower with the IFs on Support duty with Get Forward and Stay Wide PIs

Have you tried CM-S with Get Forward & Roaming PI? 

Have you considered Strikerless formation? Check out this old thread by @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! 

This is the closest I have seen anyone get to Pep's Barca on FM. I've tried it on FM17 and FM18. I even included some instructions from the FM19 Tiki-Taka preset style in my last goodbye FM18 save and it was working great. Give it a read. It will give you many ideas to try.

 

@kpsia518

That is a lovely sequence. Is that with your set up from your save? 

Regarding the inverted wingbacks, I came across a very interesting picture recently.

From Pep's playing days under Johan Cruyff. That is probably circa 1992. 

[kpsia518]

4 minutes ago, yonko said:

@pauly15

Why are you playing on Attacking mentality? What is the reason for it?

I think you should play narrower with the IFs on Support duty with Get Forward and Stay Wide PIs

Have you tried CM-S with Get Forward & Roaming PI? 

Have you considered Strikerless formation? Check out this old thread by @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! 

This is the closest I have seen anyone get to Pep's Barca on FM. I've tried it on FM17 and FM18. I even included some instructions from the FM19 Tiki-Taka preset style in my last goodbye FM18 save and it was working great. Give it a read. It will give you many ideas to try.

 

@kpsia518

That is a lovely sequence. Is that with your set up from your save? 

Regarding the inverted wingbacks, I came across a very interesting picture recently.

From Pep's playing days under Johan Cruyff. That is probably circa 1992. 

not from my save,some ppl share it

[ferrarinseb]

5 minutes ago, yonko said:

@pauly15

Why are you playing on Attacking mentality? What is the reason for it?

I think you should play narrower with the IFs on Support duty with Get Forward and Stay Wide PIs

Have you tried CM-S with Get Forward & Roaming PI? 

Have you considered Strikerless formation? Check out this old thread by @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! 

This is the closest I have seen anyone get to Pep's Barca on FM. I've tried it on FM17 and FM18. I even included some instructions from the FM19 Tiki-Taka preset style in my last goodbye FM18 save and it was working great. Give it a read. It will give you many ideas to try.

 

@kpsia518

That is a lovely sequence. Is that with your set up from your save? 

Regarding the inverted wingbacks, I came across a very interesting picture recently.

From Pep's playing days under Johan Cruyff. That is probably circa 1992. 

Have you tried to implement in this year Version? 

In that Cruyff image It can be WB's sitting narrower?

[pauly15]

36 minutes ago, yonko said:

@pauly15

Why are you playing on Attacking mentality? What is the reason for it?

I think you should play narrower with the IFs on Support duty with Get Forward and Stay Wide PIs

Have you tried CM-S with Get Forward & Roaming PI? 

Have you considered Strikerless formation? Check out this old thread by @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! 

This is the closest I have seen anyone get to Pep's Barca on FM. I've tried it on FM17 and FM18. I even included some instructions from the FM19 Tiki-Taka preset style in my last goodbye FM18 save and it was working great. Give it a read. It will give you many ideas to try.

 

@kpsia518

That is a lovely sequence. Is that with your set up from your save? 

Regarding the inverted wingbacks, I came across a very interesting picture recently.

From Pep's playing days under Johan Cruyff. That is probably circa 1992. 

Nice! Thanks:) A lot of my settings I've come to through compromise rather than design. Attacking mentality is not accurate of course. Regarding the CM (s) with forward runs & roaming, and the IF (s) with stay wider, cut inside and more forward runs... far too often you end up seeing this:

The RPM is often slightly ahead of the CM (s) and even the IF (s). I.e. Xavi is in front of Messi & Iniesta :S

I will read the post you linked to. I basically ended up where I am because the CWBs leak too many goals. Everything from there is a bit of a compromise.

[yonko]

30 minutes ago, kpsia518 said:

not from my save,some ppl share it

Can you find more details and post some info?

26 minutes ago, ferrarinseb said:

Have you tried to implement in this year Version? 

In that Cruyff image It can be WB's sitting narrower?

I haven't had too much time to play actually yet. Done a few friendly games but nothing to write about. I've been mostly studying the training module.

It's not WBs with sitting narrower PI. More like IWBs

11 minutes ago, pauly15 said:

Nice! Thanks:) A lot of my settings I've come to through compromise rather than design. Attacking mentality is not accurate of course. Regarding the CM (s) with forward runs & roaming, and the IF (s) with stay wider, cut inside and more forward runs... far too often you end up seeing this:

The RPM is often slightly ahead of the CM (s) and even the IF (s). 

I will read the post you linked to. I basically ended up where I am because the CWBs leak too many goals. Everything from there is a bit of a compromise.

What kind of Player Traits your players have? I wouldn't use RPM, especially with HB-D behind him. Stick with DLP-S.

[pauly15]

6 minutes ago, yonko said:

What kind of Player Traits your players have? I wouldn't use RPM, especially with HB-D behind him. Stick with DLP-S.

I originally had a DLP (s). Will give that another test too. 

One problematic trait for Ruben Loftus Cheek as the Iniesta (haha) is 'comes deep to get ball'. Still, I think it's more of a mentality issue. RPM has a higher mentality than CM (s) so it's inherently a bit flawed as an idea. DLP and CM (s) with the right traits might work ey

 

[pauly15]

A fairly common tactical idea in a 4-3-3 is the role of the #10 in pressing. Typically, the front 3 will cover/squeeze the four defenders, and the #10 will push in tightly on the opposing #6. At present, when you select an "advanced playmaker" their maximum pressing is capped at "less urgent", even when your tactics are set to the most aggressive pressing options available. It makes it difficult to achieve a fairly standard idea. Here's an example:

The 9 and 7 have done their jobs, the 11 is roughly in the right area, however the #10 (despite having tight marking and maximum pressing, never pushes in enough, allowing them to play out easily:

A midfielder receives the ball under no pressure. 

 

Every 4-3-3 I've played in/coached asked our #10 in midfield to push in tight on the opponent's #6 as their role in the press. If they don't, it's quite easy to play out through the free player. 

I've tried to work around this by setting my #10 to tightly mark the specific #6, however it is not always this specific in reality. What is meant by "pick up the 6" is that your #10 will simply be tight on the opponent midfielder who drops in to get the ball from their defence. 

[kpsia518]

2 hours ago, pauly15 said:

Nice! Thanks:) A lot of my settings I've come to through compromise rather than design. Attacking mentality is not accurate of course. Regarding the CM (s) with forward runs & roaming, and the IF (s) with stay wider, cut inside and more forward runs... far too often you end up seeing this:

The RPM is ahead of the CM (s) and the IF (s). 

I will read the post you linked to. I basically ended up where I am because the CWBs leak too many goals. Everything from there is a bit of a compromise.

the default tiki taka tactic set 3 playmaker in the middle.
maybe we can do the same ?
 

[Sticx]

11 hours ago, pauly15 said:

Thanks for all your suggestions & comments! 

I agree with everything said- initially I tried to make the tactic exactly as I see it (roaming playmaker in CM, IFs on attack etc.) but I found some challenges I struggled to overcome. Mainly defending in wide areas forced some concessions to the roles of the front 3. 

There's a nice video of Thierry Henry talking through some points here: 

 

 

I'm currently trialling: 

- IFs: removed "sit narrow" instruction so they start wide then cut in late. Trying to add "get further forward" on the support role, but I'm finding it just kills you out wide defensively even though they're on support duty.

 

- Extremely Wide attacking width to try to create space.

 

- Rather than an "advanced playmaker" in CM, I'm trying a CM(a) with creative instructions. The reason for this is that the Advanced Playmaker's pressing instruction is capped at "less urgent", which is not what you want in a 4-3-3. Unfortunately it means that the CM (a) will be in front of the ball and in front of the IF (s) too often, but it's a choice between that and bad pressing. 

 

 

I've noticed that if your team mentality is set to extremely urgent,like you said then your AP-a will only press less urgent. But if you set your team mentality to more urgent pressing then it doesn't cap and you can manually set more urgent to your AP. I have no idea why this is set to the way it is as it makes no sense, but it might be an option to set your team to more urgent pressing and manually change individual players.

[pauly15]

2 minutes ago, Sticx said:

I've noticed that if your team mentality is set to extremely urgent,like you said then your AP-a will only press less urgent. But if you set your team mentality to more urgent pressing then it doesn't cap and you can manually set more urgent to your AP. I have no idea why this is set to the way it is as it makes no sense, but it might be an option to set your team to more urgent pressing and manually change individual players.

Interesting! Will try that out. Thanks

[kpsia518]

15 hours ago, pauly15 said:

Interesting! Will try that out. Thanks

your tempo abit too fast maybe ?

try,

Quote

short pass + slow tempo + some time wasting.

 

 

[Sticx]

One thing I'm struggling with in this formation in my save is getting enough forward options into the box. My players tend to take long shots and I think it's because there are no passing options. I can't seem to get the right movement off the ball. The other thing I don't like is I am getting far too many crosses when I'm supposed to be working the ball into the box. Even my midfielders will take the ball and run wide with it and cross it. I really like this formation, I just can't get it to do what I want it to do.

[pauly15]

Yeah I think there's an issue with the ME in the beta. Essentially not enough through balls and too many crosses makes it hard to replicate pep-ball

[Sticx]

I have been experimenting lately by bumping the passing up to standard length while dropping the tempo down to the lowest setting. It seems to stretch the play out and create more space for everyone. I feel like with short passing selected it is taking away too many options that could be there. I want my players to select the best option available, not necessarily the shortest one.

One thing I want to try out but haven't found the right players for is to use wingers out wide with the ppm of cut inside on both wings. It might solve the problem of IF being to narrow and wingers being too wide. Basically I'm trying to implement that Thierry Henry video of him explaining how Pep didn't want him coming inside to take away space in the middle, but rather stay out wide and draw defenders out to him.

[pauly15]

21 minutes ago, Sticx said:

I have been experimenting lately by bumping the passing up to standard length while dropping the tempo down to the lowest setting. It seems to stretch the play out and create more space for everyone. I feel like with short passing selected it is taking away too many options that could be there. I want my players to select the best option available, not necessarily the shortest one.

One thing I want to try out but haven't found the right players for is to use wingers out wide with the ppm of cut inside on both wings. It might solve the problem of IF being to narrow and wingers being too wide. Basically I'm trying to implement that Thierry Henry video of him explaining how Pep didn't want him coming inside to take away space in the middle, but rather stay out wide and draw defenders out to him.

I find the passing works well, the biggest problems I have are with "looks for long passes" and traits like that- they just play risky cross field balls and give it away too often, even if they're good passers. 

[pauly15]

Have given up on the Pep for the time being, issues with through balls and crosses in the beta make it a bit hard to pull off. This is what I'm using currently

4-3-3 HB!!!.fmf

Works well on attacking mentality

[pauly15]

[Sticx]

2 hours ago, pauly15 said:

You should submit this in th bug forums. That is crazy. Crossing Manager 2019.

[pauly15]

4-3-3 HB!!!.fmf

[pauly15]

19.1 has utterly destroyed this (and the ME in general ;))

[kpsia518]

6 hours ago, pauly15 said:

19.1 has utterly destroyed this (and the ME in general ;))

Quote

http://spielverlagerung.com/2014/12/25/juego-de-posicion-under-pep-guardiola/

*Note: Here is a famous video posted by tz.de on YouTube of Guardiola training his Bayern Munich team in the art of Positional Play during the winter break of his first season with the team. He talks about the length and angling of the central midfielders in relation to each other in order to have optimal positioning to penetrate the defensive lines, specific runs/movements the players should be doing, decision making with the ball to manipulate the opponent or maintain stability, and more. 

any one can translate this ?

[kpsia518]

On 24/10/2018 at 09:05, kpsia518 said:

always W M shape in build up

 

 

 

i may try WB/CWB + IWB,use WB as IF 

[yonko]

11 hours ago, kpsia518 said:

any one can translate this ?

LOL, classic Pep video. Passion and dedication to his style of play. This is treble winning team he is educating, btw.

Makes me wish I speak German to understand.

Btw, is this Pep's version of Attacking Shadow Play training in FM19? 

[kpsia518]

7 minutes ago, yonko said:

LOL, classic Pep video. Passion and dedication to his style of play. This is treble winning team he is educating, btw.

Makes me wish I speak German to understand.

Btw, is this Pep's version of Attacking Shadow Play training in FM19? 

 

here,very detail video,2 long video :

 

 

should be structured positioning.
 

1) over load the 1st line

2) overload the middle

3) find the free man

4) specific adjuctments

 

we just know too little about positional play,many thing to learn

 

[pats]

Pep Barca is impossible to create in 19.1 ME. 

[kpsia518]

1 hour ago, pats said:

Pep Barca is impossible to create in 19.1 ME. 

i'm only success to keep 60~80% possession,but can't score.

 

 

[pauly15]

PPMs are done too often. Anyone with 'tries killer balls often' or 'looks for long passes' or whatever... does it 80% of the time they get the ball, and regardless of where on the pitch they are. Makes playing forward through the midfield with more passes impossible if you have someone with it in your 11.

[mp_87]

1 hour ago, pauly15 said:

PPMs are done too often. Anyone with 'tries killer balls often' or 'looks for long passes' or whatever... does it 80% of the time they get the ball, and regardless of where on the pitch they are. Makes playing forward through the midfield with more passes impossible if you have someone with it in your 11.

If you're playing Barca/Pep/tiki-taka/possession football you'd steer clear of any players with those PPMs?

[pauly15]

13 minutes ago, mp_87 said:

If you're playing Barca/Pep/tiki-taka/possession football you'd steer clear of any players with those PPMs?

Perhaps. I still think a more balanced approach to it is in order.

[Sticx]

2 hours ago, mp_87 said:

If you're playing Barca/Pep/tiki-taka/possession football you'd steer clear of any players with those PPMs?

Iniesta came with that PPM so I wouldn't say you want to stay away from it at all. His role is almost impossible to replicate on FM however. That trait needs very high decision making, vision, and composure to pull off, but it is nice to have when it works.