Training in FM19

[Os]

22 hours ago, Seb Wassell said:

Because they aren't rehabilitating from injury. This becomes available when a player is in the rehab phase of injury (orange).

Sorry, still has'nt become available.

[OlivierL]

About mentoring , if i add a younger player (from u21) to the 'gk unit' . can i add him to the mentoring group ? Or do i really have to promote him to the first team ?

thanks

[Os]

1 hour ago, Olivierlandman said:

About mentoring , if i add a younger player (from u21) to the 'gk unit' . can i add him to the mentoring group ? Or do i really have to promote him to the first team ?

thanks

You can add him without promoting him.

[OlivierL]

20 minutes ago, Os said:

You can add him without promoting him.

how please ?

[herne79]

2 hours ago, Olivierlandman said:

About mentoring , if i add a younger player (from u21) to the 'gk unit' . can i add him to the mentoring group ? Or do i really have to promote him to the first team ?

thanks

Mentoring groups are made up of players in the same squad.

[SD]

@Seb Wassell Is it intended that GKs do not have their own focuses, other than passing and the physical ones, similar to what the outfield players have? It doesn't make sense that a keeper cannot work individually on something like his handling or positioning, but he can train something like corners, which is not even listed among GK's visible attributes.

[Cleon]

40 minutes ago, SD said:

@Seb Wassell Is it intended that GKs do not have their own focuses, other than passing and the physical ones, similar to what the outfield players have? It doesn't make sense that a keeper cannot work individually on something like his handling or positioning, but he can train something like corners, which is not even listed among GK's visible attributes.

Quote

Goalkeepers have no Individual > Additional Focus. Instead they have their own bespoke training sessions available in the schedule.

 

[SD]

10 minutes ago, Cleon said:

 

I see, thank you for clarifying that.

Do players care about the number of rest days in the schedule, or as long as their fatigue is kept low while happiness is kept high, you can just as well train them 3 sessions a day, 7 days a week?

[Seb Wassell]

6 minutes ago, SD said:

I see, thank you for clarifying that.

Do players care about the number of rest days in the schedule, or as long as their fatigue is kept low while happiness is kept high, you can just as well train them 3 sessions a day, 7 days a week?

Yes. Balancing fatigue/condition via rest is important, but so is the amount of time the players spend "at work".

[enigmatic]

Really don't understand the decision to have multiple entire team training sessions just for goalkeepers instead of player specific training for goalkeepers, especially since in practice everyone including the goalkeepers focuses on one specific area. Just seems unnecessarily confusing with no upside. Have one "individual training" session and individual training options for goalkeepers instead.

Set pieces is another area where it looks overcomplicated too - can players really not practice a mixture of corners and indirect free kicks and attacking and defensive setups in the same half day session? The choices in other areas are all about prioritising subtly different attribute combinations, but I can't think of any situation in which you'd decide you cared a lot about indirect free kicks but not at all about corners, and I can't imagine spending half my free slots in a week on set pieces either, even if I was Big Sam

The ability to automatically set "day before a match" training schedules rather than have your assman suggest it would be a good thing. Don't like the fact my assman defaults to suggesting condition and morale sapping physical training in the morning (although tbf, he seems to do other things in the season proper)

[Fritz13]

Has the ability to give any outfield player any of the attributes as additional training changed?

couldnt see how I could allocate quite a few - tackling, crossing, 

love the way what there are now blocks - positional sense (or something like that!!)  being one where it’s marking and positioning that is trained rather than a single attribute.

DOH - just seen Hernes  guide where tacking, crossing and dribbling are specifically mentioned as being removed .... as you were

[JavierChicharito14]

Is recovery sessions always better than rest? 

[enigmatic]

2 hours ago, JavierChicharito14 said:

Is recovery sessions always better than rest? 

Rest increases Condition faster. So you probably want both after every match

[roggiotis]

I use recovery -2 rest after match and 2 recovery -rest if a week has 2 games ,

but I don't know if thats the correct way 

[herne79]

2 hours ago, roggiotis said:

but I don't know if thats the correct way 

That's the whole point - there is no "correct" way any more*.  Do what you feel is right, learn from mistakes and adapt as you go.

*Note - I'm sure eventually the min/maxers out there will develop "optimal" strategies and if that's how some want to play the game that's fine.  But everyone plays the game how they enjoy so just play how you want to and don't worry if it's "correct" or not .

[ferrarinseb]

I agree with "There is no correct way any more". Its really hard to understand at first but after a season or 2 Its more fun. Pre Season really has a Effect and its just more than arranging Friendlies to increase match sharpness. Fixture congestion often throws plans out of window particularly more re arranged Matches.

 

[tyro]

I don't think it is hard to understand. It is actually very intuitive. However, there are just so many options that it is very overwhelming at first. You feel like wow how can I ever manage but then you realize, oh, this does that, cool.

[Seb Wassell]

11 hours ago, ferrarinseb said:

Pre Season really has a Effect and its just more than arranging Friendlies to increase match sharpness. Fixture congestion often throws plans out of window particularly more re arranged Matches.

I really cannot stress this enough. Pre-season matters.

9 hours ago, tyro said:

I don't think it is hard to understand. It is actually very intuitive. However, there are just so many options that it is very overwhelming at first. You feel like wow how can I ever manage but then you realize, oh, this does that, cool.

I'm pleased that you think this and agree with you. Of course, if anyone has any suggestions on how we can improve on this then please do lets us know in the appropriate fashion.

[yonko]

I agree that it's intuitive but overwhelming because there are so many choices what to train. 

Is it me or do players increase their match sharpness quickly in this edition? Or is it a Beta bug? I haven't seen anyone notice this yet.

It seems to me that pre-season is less about scheduling friendlies every 3 days and more about building up players' fitness and learning the tactic(s). 

I have a question though. Do the actual exercise descriptions effect the players and what they can do or it is just about what attributes are targeted and the effects it as on injuries, conditioning, etc.?

I hope it's clear what I'm asking. In other words, if two activities are targeting similar set of attributes (with the exception of one or two), does it matter which one is chosen because of the nature of the activity?

[Rashidi]

6 minutes ago, yonko said:

Is it me or do players increase their match sharpness quickly in this edition? Or is it a Beta bug? I haven't seen anyone notice this yet

Seems fine, really depends on the schedules you have set

 

6 minutes ago, yonko said:

seems to me that pre-season is less about scheduling friendlies every 3 days and more about building up players' fitness and learning the tactic(s). 

Ideally it should be about building player fitness up quickly before going on to stuff that builds cohesion and getting them ready for the season. Training and Tactics are more inter-related as they should be

6 minutes ago, yonko said:

I have a question though. Do the actual exercise descriptions effect the players and what they can do or it is just about what attributes are targeted and the effects it as on injuries, conditioning, etc.?

I would look at the colors oddly enough...that's me but everyone has their way. I know some here are triggered by the icons and want less colors lol. I am glad that a lot of the training is coming in line with reality, which is something many have asked for and some of us have even tried to do with some limited success over the years. What you are looking depends on what you are hoping to achieve. Team Cohesion, Match Sharpness, Attribute development, tactical familiarity, match preparation or all of the above. We now have to make a conscious decision. Nothing is free anymore. So it depends on how you want your club to develop.

If two activities target the same ability then yes they will both help. Each schedule has different impacts on different things, etc. condition, sharpness etc. You need to make that decision.

[yonko]

3 minutes ago, Rashidi said:

Seems fine, really depends on the schedules you have set

 

Ideally it should be about building player fitness up quickly before going on to stuff that builds cohesion and getting them ready for the season. Training and Tactics are more inter-related as they should be

I would look at the colors oddly enough...that's me but everyone has their way. I know some here are triggered by the icons and want less colors lol. I am glad that a lot of the training is coming in line with reality, which is something many have asked for and some of us have even tried to do with some limited success over the years. What you are looking depends on what you are hoping to achieve. Team Cohesion, Match Sharpness, Attribute development, tactical familiarity, match preparation or all of the above. We now have to make a conscious decision. Nothing is free anymore. So it depends on how you want your club to develop.

If two activities target the same ability then yes they will both help. Each schedule has different impacts on different things, etc. condition, sharpness etc. You need to make that decision.

Thanks for the reply. I understand all that and I welcome the change to Training in this edition. It's what I've wanted too. 

My question was if for example I select Chance Creation activity, will it affect only the attributes targeted or will it help my team create more chances in matches? I'm trying to figure out how much is training linked to what actually happens in matches. Is it all about targeting attributes and balancing out injury risk, fatigue, conditioning or do the actual activities matter/have any effect beyond that?

Btw, I'm very interested to see your approach to training. I've learned a lot from you and Cleon about training in the past, which had served me well for developing players. I'm looking forward to seeing what you guys do now.

I have some ideas on my own but I'm still testing and checking out stuff. I like how we have to put more thought into it now.

[Seb Wassell]

21 minutes ago, yonko said:

My question was if for example I select Chance Creation activity, will it affect only the attributes targeted or will it help my team create more chances in matches?

Some sessions have an impact called "upcoming match". This will impact the upcoming match in X department.

You can also see which of these are coming into play for your next match from that week's training from the 'Training > Overview' page.

[zippedd]

Training Experiment

Apparently It's not working as it should

[herne79]

2 hours ago, zippedd said:

Training Experiment

Apparently It's not working as it should

So he gives Man City a rubbish training schedule, goes on holiday for a season and they don't win the league.  Which part isn't working?

[zippedd]

13 minuti fa, herne79 ha scritto:

So he gives Man City a rubbish training schedule, goes on holiday for a season and they don't win the league.  Which part isn't working?

No ..No training at all for 3 season..that's ridiculous

 

Did you watch the video ?

[zippedd]

Hope it's going to be fix because that make the whole game broken

[3LionsFM]

Is there any way to stop your assistant manager from adjusting training schedules? It's very annoying. 

[herne79]

1 hour ago, zippedd said:

Hope it's going to be fix because that make the whole game broken

If you have evidence from your own save game (not a YouTube video) which demonstrates how "the whole game is broken", please start a thread in the Training Bugs forum stating what the issues are and upload your save game for SI to review.

On the other hand, if your only evidence of how broken the game is is a YT video where rubbish is input and (surprise) rubbish gets output, then please stop spreading nonsense.

[zippedd]

1 ora fa, herne79 ha scritto:

If you have evidence from your own save game (not a YouTube video) which demonstrates how "the whole game is broken", please start a thread in the Training Bugs forum stating what the issues are and upload your save game for SI to review.

On the other hand, if your only evidence of how broken the game is is a YT video where rubbish is input and (surprise) rubbish gets output, then please stop spreading nonsense.

For me it's fine, sorry I do not take any advantage on it. Bye

[Miravlix]

On 20/10/2018 at 16:12, Seb Wassell said:

Because they aren't rehabilitating from injury. This becomes available when a player is in the rehab phase of injury (orange).

 

Just clarifying something I noticed, it doesn't only last for the period of time they have the orange INJ on them, I have players after they lost the INJ icon that still has the Injury Rehab options.

 

No idea how long after they loss the INJ icon it last, I have 3 players in recently injuries, only one has access to Injury Rehab and none has the INJ icon.

[Horse]

3 hours ago, herne79 said:

If you have evidence from your own save game (not a YouTube video) which demonstrates how "the whole game is broken", please start a thread in the Training Bugs forum stating what the issues are and upload your save game for SI to review.

On the other hand, if your only evidence of how broken the game is is a YT video where rubbish is input and (surprise) rubbish gets output, then please stop spreading nonsense.

Isn't the issue that the youtuber simulates three seasons with absolutely no training, and still dont perform worse than, at worst, a Europa League place? That should cause some concern if your elite football players dont stagnate more than they do when all they spend their time on is just rest, charity events and teamwork sessions? City should be prime candidates for relegation, instead they retain a 5-7th position in probably the most competitive league in the world?

[Seb Wassell]

14 hours ago, zippedd said:

Training Experiment

Apparently It's not working as it should

Great to see people experimenting! With only a brief video to go on my conclusions have to be similarly brief though.

Despite not doing as poorly as expected by the narrator, without exception City did notably poorer when not training vs. training. 
Bear in mind they are still doing individual training and are playing two or three times per week, along with warm-ups etc. This will be enough to maintain some things considering they are all already top level footballers.
Development wise however those players will grind to a halt, even regress, if they continue like that.

Without seeing the save I can't comment much more than that, but it's worth noting that the Assistant reviews training periodically and makes amendments depending on settings/inputs.

[Cleon]

6 hours ago, Horse said:

Isn't the issue that the youtuber simulates three seasons with absolutely no training, and still dont perform worse than, at worst, a Europa League place? That should cause some concern if your elite football players dont stagnate more than they do when all they spend their time on is just rest, charity events and teamwork sessions? City should be prime candidates for relegation, instead they retain a 5-7th position in probably the most competitive league in the world?

It's worth noting here that he simulated the same one season three times. He didn't simulate three seasons. A Europa place for a club of City's size and with the players they have, is absolutely awful. Make no mistake about that. If he carried the save on longer he'd suffer for the reasons Seb mentions above. His players are likely regressing now already. His performances in the experiment show he regressed results wise apart from one season iirc. 

[zippedd]

2 ore fa, Cleon ha scritto:

It's worth noting here that he simulated the same one season three times. He didn't simulate three seasons. A Europa place for a club of City's size and with the players they have, is absolutely awful. Make no mistake about that. If he carried the save on longer he'd suffer for the reasons Seb mentions above. His players are likely regressing now already. His performances in the experiment show he regressed results wise apart from one season iirc. 

In my opinion if any team do not perform any trainig just for a month that should be a disaster in terms of condition injury and performance... so I'm very surprise that City could manager to get 5th position. In real life that is impossible!!!

[Taipan]

In Set Piece Training,  a certain percentage of each training type is dedicated to Outfield Player and a separate percentage to players who are marked down as Set Piece takers. 

Could you not assign all your players as Set Piece takers and then all players would get the benefit of training the set piece attribute like corners/free kicks?  

I haven't actually done this as it is totally unrealistic,  however If this is possible it does come across to me as a bit of a loop hole/exploit.

[phnompenhandy]

7 minutes ago, Taipan said:

In Set Piece Training,  a certain percentage of each training type is dedicated to Outfield Player and a separate percentage to players who are marked down as Set Piece takers. 

Could you not assign all your players as Set Piece takers and then all players would get the benefit of training the set piece attribute like corners/free kicks?  

I haven't actually done this as it is totally unrealistic,  however If this is possible it does come across to me as a bit of a loop hole/exploit.

What benefit would there be in having a squad full of corner-takers?

[Taipan]

True.....

 

 

[Scoham]

18 hours ago, zippedd said:

Training Experiment

Apparently It's not working as it should

Did the experiment use the full detail match engine? That may also make some difference.

[GoldenFM]

Hey everyone! In response to the above, I only holidayed one season remember (three times just to see if it differed much). Looking deeper into the save, the player attribute regression is quite significant. The key attributes for all the City players are declining and if I was to carry on with this 'no training' pattern then the players would be massively affected after a few seasons I reckon! 

Additionally, as Seb & Cleon said, a club like City finishing 5th/6th is pretty disastrous considering the talent they have!

My video was just a quick, fun look into it, not to be taken too seriously really as is the case with the majority of my experiments  

[phnompenhandy]

28 minutes ago, GoldenFM said:

Hey everyone!

Ah, Golden.  Just 'discovered' you and been enjoying your videos tremendously over the last couple of days. I don't have the beta and am worried about all the posts claiming FM19 is too easy, so I'm genuinely encouraged by your disastrous campaigns!!!!

[GoldenFM]

3 minutes ago, phnompenhandy said:

Ah, Golden.  Just 'discovered' you and been enjoying your videos tremendously over the last couple of days. I don't have the beta and am worried about all the posts claiming FM19 is too easy, so I'm genuinely encouraged by your disastrous campaigns!!!!

Thanks for watching! I'm actually finding it quite hard to be honest - I'm managing my beloved West Ham and I'm really struggling 

[phnompenhandy]

1 minute ago, GoldenFM said:

Thanks for watching! I'm actually finding it quite hard to be honest - I'm managing my beloved West Ham and I'm really struggling 

I'm a Llama so I'm into your Head Coach career and the Torquay save. Gonna poke about in Regen United now as my usual modus operandum is to create an amateur club in the editor, stock it with CA1 kids and join the fray at level 10 and eventually level 22 when those files are available.

[Kazza]

I keep getting complaints about my individual training assignments from the same 4/5 [layers. So I change them and still they complain. How do you find out what the best individual training is for a player, pot luck!  i have had to revert to delegation but I would like to do this aspect myself.

 

Any help appreciated, am I missing something or is this an issue

[Os]

5 hours ago, Kazza said:

I keep getting complaints about my individual training assignments from the same 4/5 [layers. So I change them and still they complain. How do you find out what the best individual training is for a player, pot luck!  i have had to revert to delegation but I would like to do this aspect myself.

 

Any help appreciated, am I missing something or is this an issue

Ignore them, most of the time it's down to a lack of professionalism

[Guest]

Has anyone actually gone further with this and started min-maxing a training schedule?

[phnompenhandy]

3 hours ago, Os said:

Ignore them, most of the time it's down to a lack of professionalism

Very much this. It's a useful clue - players with poor professionalism will never improve substantially in training whatever you do, so will not develop. You should look to shift them out in due course.

[jakem016]

Does anyone use the training intensity training option?  Would it make sense to do something like this?  It makes sense to set a high intensity for players who are well rested, but I don't know if setting an increased training schedule for well rested players will adversely affect them in the following game.  Basically I want to make sure that backup/rotation players are training harder in order to maintain their fitness but I don't want to have to manually adjust their individual training intensity level every week based on injuries or match congestion.  

[Os]

2 hours ago, jakem016 said:

Does anyone use the training intensity training option?  Would it make sense to do something like this?  It makes sense to set a high intensity for players who are well rested, but I don't know if setting an increased training schedule for well rested players will adversely affect them in the following game.  Basically I want to make sure that backup/rotation players are training harder in order to maintain their fitness but I don't want to have to manually adjust their individual training intensity level every week based on injuries or match congestion.  

Leave it on auto or you may trigger an injury crisis.

[Cleon]

10 hours ago, Os said:

Ignore them, most of the time it's down to a lack of professionalism

On  older versions you could get away with that. On FM19 is makes a difference, so don't just ignore players or long-term and even short-term, it could be quite costly in terms of development and performances.

8 hours ago, eastmd01 said:

Has anyone actually gone further with this and started min-maxing a training schedule?

Training isn't about min/maxing any longer. FM19 is more natural and organic in terms of development. There are also a lot more options and variables involved and you can tailor schedules for your own specific use and needs now. FM18 is was easy to min/max because all the info people needed to know was out there in order to do this. I'm partly to blame for this for sharing info that in hindsight, perhaps I shouldn't have. There was also only one real way to train on FM18. FM19 is a shift away from that kind of mentality and thinking. The game is now designed so there is no min/maxing because the game is set up for people to just train the sessions that makes the most sense to them for whatever they need.

4 hours ago, jakem016 said:

Does anyone use the training intensity training option?  Would it make sense to do something like this?  It makes sense to set a high intensity for players who are well rested, but I don't know if setting an increased training schedule for well rested players will adversely affect them in the following game.  Basically I want to make sure that backup/rotation players are training harder in order to maintain their fitness but I don't want to have to manually adjust their individual training intensity level every week based on injuries or match congestion.  

Why not try it and see? There's not actually a wrong way to do training as such. It's all about making the decisions you feel are correct or make the most sense doing. If it feels right go with it, if you see an increase in injuries then work out if its worth it or do you need to make further changes and so on.

[crusadertsar]

Is there a bug in the training currently? I'm two months into my season and I haven't had any of my wonderkids increasing their attributes despite giving them plenty of game time. The only arrows I'm seeing are red on other players so I'm actually having attribute decay. What am I doing wrong? I mean I have my Assistant doing the training for now. But he has similar style to my Gegenpressing tactic and I'm actually happy with what sessions he chooses. Yet my players are not really improving. It's pretty frustrating since I love developing wonderkids in this game. Should I just not play until the patch on Nov 2?