Long-ball football with 3-6-1 - just theoretically for now

[Experienced Defender]

3-6-1 is one of my preferred formations, though I haven't tried it with my Palace side yet. And I'm talking about the version with 2 DMs, 2 WMs and 2 AMCs. On the other hand, the long-ball style is also something I like. At some point, I'll certainly give this tactical combination a try, but before then, I'd love to hear what you think about the following idea for implementing it:

TMs

SS       APMs

DWs                           IWs

VOLs    BWMd

BPDc  CDd    DFBc

SWKd

Standard / Structured

TIs - go route one, lower tempo, play narrower (just these 3 for starters)

SWKd - long kick, distribute to TM

VOLs - get further forward (if available)

DWs - hold position, fewer risky passes

IWs - get further forward, pass it shorter, fewer risky passes

SS - max closing down, pass it shorter

TMs - max CD, hold position, move into channels

APMs - close down more

That's basically it. So, if you have any suggestions, questions or experience with this or similar system, all ideas are welcome 

[Scoham]

What’s the theory behind a lower tempo? To hold it up and wait for support? I see it more the other way, high tempo so once you get the ball up the pitch you don’t give the opposition time to get back into position.

[westy8chimp]

Whilst its theoretical... 

1) if you are playing long ball, why would you have a playmaker im advanced position? Id sooner have a deep one to launch the long ball, or none at all. 

2) - - - - - - - "--------- why have a deep role, vol, that gets forward if the transition is to play direct. May as well start with someone high up to receive the long ball, or go for a more solid dm role. The vol will, in theory, be caught in no mans land a lot

I say in theory, because in the game both roles may work well. 

3) opposite of above, i think the theory is perfect but FM reality may not be... a note of cautioun. Target man is one of my favorite type of players in both real life and in Fm... But just beware in FM the runs off of the knock downs seem a lot more reactive than proactive. So whilst an SS seems like a perfect choice...it may not play that way. What i mean by that;

IRL if a deep player is playing it long to say Andy Carrol, the midfielders or 'SS' will already run beyond Carrol... Assuming he will win the ball. In FM players dont do that much... They tend to react after the player makes a knock down. So ive moved away from theory of am or bbm or ss running beyond TM for knockdowns... To just playing two upfront so the player is in position for flick ons more quickly.

Its one to keep an eye on in games. During my WTM season it was 50/50... 

[Experienced Defender]

17 minutes ago, Scoham said:

What’s the theory behind a lower tempo? To hold it up and wait for support?

Basically yes. So that the TM has more supporting players nearby to distribute the ball once it's (hopefully) reached his head 

19 minutes ago, westy8chimp said:

if you are playing long ball, why would you have a playmaker im advanced position? Id sooner have a deep one to launch the long ball, or none at all. 

Good question, and I was also thinking about that. Actually, the only reason for using an APM is to have someone in the attacking third who can organize the play and distribute intelligent passes to teammates so that we do not have to rely exclusively on the TM's ability to head the ball to others. For example, the APM can collect the ball from TM and play a nice killer pass to SS, IW or sometimes even VOL  Furthermore, with a long-ball style you are not likely to have a lot of possession, so the use of a PM should compensate for it a little.

 

28 minutes ago, westy8chimp said:

- - - - - - - "--------- why have a deep role, vol, that gets forward if the transition is to play direct. May as well start with someone high up to receive the long ball, or go for a more solid dm role. The vol will, in theory, be caught in no mans land a lot

The VOL's role here is envisioned to be twofold. Offensively, he can provide some extra support in the attacking third and help more advanced teammates when "fighting" for loose balls. Defensively, he should act more or less like a regular DM, which should help protect our defence in the absence of any wide defenders.

 

34 minutes ago, westy8chimp said:

3) opposite of above, i think the theory is perfect but FM reality may not be... a note of cautioun. Target man is one of my favorite type of players in both real life and in Fm... But just beware in FM the runs off of the knock downs seem a lot more reactive than proactive. So whilst an SS seems like a perfect choice...it may not play that way. What i mean by that;

IRL if a deep player is playing it long to say Andy Carrol, the midfielders or 'SS' will already run beyond Carrol... Assuming he will win the ball. In FM players dont do that much... They tend to react after the player makes a knock down. So ive moved away from theory of am or bbm or ss running beyond TM for knockdowns... To just playing two upfront so the player is in position for flick ons more quickly.

Its one to keep an eye on in games. During my WTM season it was 50/50... 

Thanx for this advice, I'll keep it in mind. In theory, the way SS behaves in such situations should have to do with his anticipation... But as you said, FM and RLF still differ to an extent. So, we'll see if it's going to work 

[Experienced Defender]

@Scoham Sorry, I forgot an important part. There is actually one more reason I opted for lower tempo. Given that long balls inherently tend to be less precise than shorter ones, lower tempo gives more time to the player on the ball to "measure" his long pass before launching it far forward. 

[BJT]

Quote

Actually, the only reason for using an APM is to have someone in the attacking third who can organize the play and distribute intelligent passes to teammates so that we do not have to rely exclusively on the TM's ability to head the ball to others. For example, the APM can collect the ball from TM and play a nice killer pass to SS, IW or sometimes even VOL  Furthermore, with a long-ball style you are not likely to have a lot of possession, so the use of a PM should compensate for it a little.

I've used this line of thinking to great effect in a very direct 442. Although not as advanced as what you are suggesting position wise, I would launch it up all the way from the keeper to the target man to gain the territory on the pitch, who would then look to find my playmaker in the centre mid position to direct the play and bring my wingers into play. But he was instructed to be more stagnant in his position (hold), because I wanted him to be in a place the target man would know he would occupy and not deviate too far from it.

The AP in your system might be more inclined to roam about a bit more. I've never used an Enganche, but it might be worth giving this role a try? He'll always be in a position for the target man to find, and so would instantly be in a more attacking position to direct the play that it sounds like you are after. As long as the enganche has several options to pick out, it may be worth a try especially in a more defensive system. I'd expect he may have a bit more space to shine by launching it long from deep.