Tutoring

[borivoje213]

Anyone had any trouble with tutoring off the pitch?

About a dozen or so of my players get tutored every season.  About 7 seasons in - despite matching up youngsters with tutors of a similar personality & superior determination - 100% of the ones who've seen the tutoring period through have "gained a little" and been disappointed.  No a single one has been happy.

I find it odd considering the dramatic increases in determination, which is largely the main benefit of tutoring off the pitch and surely the measure of success.

It's only a report in the inbox at the end of the day and I don't envisage it having any negative impact, but it just seems odd.

[Snorks]

Their professionalism, ambition and motivatoin all have a bearing as well - if these are from your intake, have a look at the HoYD personality as this can influence them.

[cocoadavid]

I may be wrong, but to my observations the tutees are only delighted with the result of the tutoring if they have learned a player trait from their tutor. If you get the 'gained a little' message, it's still positive, the tutee's personality and/or determination has changed, it just means they did not learn any new player trait.

 

[westy8chimp]

2 hours ago, cocoadavid said:

I may be wrong, but to my observations the tutees are only delighted with the result of the tutoring if they have learned a player trait from their tutor. If you get the 'gained a little' message, it's still positive, the tutee's personality and/or determination has changed, it just means they did not learn any new player trait.

 

sounds sensible.

only doubt I have with that is; the player traits are only learnt (I think, certainly used to be the case) if you choose a certain option. When you are on the tutor page there are two... I forget the wording but one is something like "take him under your wing and mentor him on and off the pitch"... this one takes longer but also attempts to transfer player traits. The other is shorter and doesn't.

I've had the same response (though not as frequently) as the OP for both types of tutoring. Which would suggest it isn't simply down to the traits learned or not. (but as I say, it sounds logical and maybe the tutoring changed in FM18).

[borivoje213]

aha. I was under the impression that "improve his game" was a player trait transfer attempt only and that "mentor him off the pitch" was a determination boost only.

[westy8chimp]

54 minutes ago, borivoje213 said:

aha. I was under the impression that "improve his game" was a player trait transfer attempt only and that "mentor him off the pitch" was a determination boost only.

possible I've mixed and matched some of the text  but certainly my impression that that is why there are two options... one is a quicker way of boosting personality, hidden attrib. and determination... the other does all that and player traits but at the cost of taking longer.

So out of interest, have you been attempting the type that includes transfer of traits? If yes, then probably the message of 'gained little' is linked.

[bangkonggedek]

From my experience though both options yield similar possible outcomes.

I'd also add that whenever the tutees were reported to be delighted with the tutorship, they will have the tutor listed as their Favored Personnel in addition to picking up some Preferred Moves from the tutor.

[borivoje213]

2 hours ago, westy8chimp said:

So out of interest, have you been attempting the type that includes transfer of traits? If yes, then probably the message of 'gained little' is linked.

I currently have one person improving their game for the first time, as before I haven't had any PPMs worth transferring. perhaps it'll go differently.

but every single time I and someone tutor off the pitch it has resulted in them being disappointed or ending it early after a bust up, regardless of the improvement or matching with a similar personality. the determination attribute of the tutor has always been higher too. 100% of the time there is a determination improvement in the learner. 

but every single time they're disappointed. easily 30 or so occasions so far. im sure on previous versions I've had players be delighted with their experience when doing the same thing. that's why I'm so surprised this time around.

[borivoje213]

7 hours ago, Analog said:

Just because they were unhappy with the results doesn't mean that their personality and mentals didn't improve though.  

This is exactly what I thought.  It's just bizarre, I don't know if anyone else has it constantly happening as I do.  As I said, it wasn't this way with previous versions.

[meebee]

The impact of tutoring has decreased massively since last fm.

At least thats how i experienced it.

Personality improvements are lower, same for determination increase.

The worst part: many, many quarrels between tutors and tutees.

And i feel as if the denial of tutees has increased too.

However, i got no proof by numbers. I am just disappointed and really considered to stop careing about tutoring as the "amount of work - reward" proportion seems way out of balance.

I understand, that it had to be made less effective (as i could hire a model professional and teach a young gun that personality in one go before)

but i think the scales weight has gone too far to the other side

(i would improve tutoring,  but lower regen quality in return - because new intakes are way too overpowered now)

 

 

[meebee]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb Analog:

I've been keeping an eye on it, and I'd say it's not a massive difference, but does perhaps seem lower for determination.  But with that said, I've done nothing but play a youth save in my limited time with FM18 and I was surprised by a few personality changes, so I don't know.  When I started to think it had slowed down, sometimes personalities changed that I also thought would take a lot longer.

Yeah, but I actually like this part.  I feel like mentoring is a bit deeper than a simple squad mate relationship, so it makes sense to me that only certain personalities would have a lot of success with it.

What do you mean by denial of tutees?

 

Might be wrong vocabulary, as i am no native speaker..

Its about the tutor refusing to work with a tutoring target

[meebee]

@Analog

aye. i do go with a different tutor/tutee if i have to.

But lets say i hire a nice player who has only 11-13 determination or balanced personality.

Usually i would not hire below 15 determination or with that kind of personality if one isn't a really outstanding tool for the team. But because he is 23 (or close to), i will be able to give him one or two tutor lessons to increase his personality.

Therefore, occasionally i decide to sign an additional seasoned player with great personality, high determination, similar position and higher team status to act as tutor.

I put several millions into this, just to educate that one player (and probably a few more later on) and make him a good one instead of mediocre.

And while this worked most of the times in former fm iterations, this years version left me with utter frustration.

NOT ONCE did it work out the way it was intended to.

Yes, there have been other players than last year(s).

Yes, there was never a guarantee for it to work.

And yes, i might have become too picky.

It was still frustrating, as it does require a lot of time and patience, trying to set these things up.

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Nevermind. Only ~2 more weeks until we get our hands onto the new tutoring system. 

I really hope it will be an improvement to what i feel is lackluster at the moment.