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Argus White Europe 343 if Knap FM 18

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Did a test at AC Milan (holiday) and it looked really promising. Will upload results in the evening when I come back from work. And just to mention two things for the test and the tactic:

1. Given the fact it's a holiday test, a human player should perform much better with the tactic and more squad management and

2. The one sole reason I decided to test the tactc (and maybe use it later) is it's not the 3-4-3 typical for this year's edition. The 3 strikers formations are unrealistic and feel like a cheat (especially when paired with a 3 man defense). This one is a real 3-4-3 and I love the way it uses IF's.
Thanks for the tactic and I'll give you feedback at the end of the day.

Edited by buffon13

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Any player stat screen shots? What player is most creative? 

Edited by Djels

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1 hour ago, Djels said:

Any player stat screen shots? What player is most creative? 

The left IF (Calhanoglu in my test) has the most assists, but he's not scoring too much. The right one (Suso) scores a lot and assists, but not as much as the left. The Striker (Higuain) also creates a lot of chances, the mezzala and BBM as well do create quite a few chances. Will upload screens tonight.

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Hi,

   I do have an amazing team but first match with this tactic was unbelievable the best result I've ever had in a season that I can remember. I was using the other argus tactic and its working well for me, won quite a few trophies with it including the world cup with France but I think this new Argus tactic looks to have topped that giving this result.

Mark Hewitt_  Inbox.png

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I am hoping MR L will run a Top team test next year, as would be interesting to see if 343 IF could out perform a 343.

May depend on squad but this is the MU Test.

2090209403_Screenshot(431).thumb.png.6e575791304c104d3d052e48f3e865c0.png.

 

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! NOTE ! - This is a holiday test. With a proper human management of the squad the tactic can and should perform better. I've chosen the "Use current team selection whenever possible" option in the holiday window, which means that the players chosen have played every possible game no matter the fatigue! Many of them were unhappy through the course of the season because they lacked first team football, which left the dressing room atmosphere at Average during most of the season. Again - with proper management this shouldn't be a problem.

So 58 games overall, 48 wins, 7 draws, 3 losses and 142:40 goal difference. 

ALL CUPS WON! Knap, this has to be your masterpiece :'-)

If anyone wants any other information, I'll gladly screenshot and show you guys. 

A.C. Milan_  Competitions.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures-2.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures-3.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures-4.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures-5.png

A.C. Milan_ Players Players.png

Serie A TIM_ Overview Stages.png

 

Edited by buffon13

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7 hours ago, buffon13 said:

! NOTE ! - This is a holiday test. With a proper human management of the squad the tactic can and should perform better. I've chosen the "Use current team selection whenever possible" option in the holiday window, which means that the players chosen have played every possible game no matter the fatigue! Many of them were unhappy through the course of the season because they lacked first team football, which left the dressing room atmosphere at Average during most of the season. Again - with proper management this shouldn't be a problem.

So 58 games overall, 48 wins, 7 draws, 3 losses and 142:40 goal difference. 

ALL CUPS WON! Knap, this has to be your masterpiece :'-)

If anyone wants any other information, I'll gladly screenshot and show you guys. 

A.C. Milan_  Competitions.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures-2.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures-3.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures-4.png

A.C. Milan_  Senior Fixtures-5.png

A.C. Milan_ Players Players.png

Serie A TIM_ Overview Stages.png

 

what training you do mate?

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3 hours ago, fmste said:

what training you do mate?

I left the training to Match tactics + Balanced, throughout the entire test. I wonder what Knap has to say about training?

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They do, especially more aggressive players. Kessie in my save received many cards. I can't screenshot it now, but Milan received 120 yellows, whereas the second worst team had 103. Reds were not as much though - 9 for the whole season (one red card in every 6.44 games), which is bearable. We were not even the worst team in terms of reds in the league.

My two lost games in the league for the season were due to red cards. Maybe if I managed those games (I remind that this is a Holiday save) I could've made the right changes and the right subs to deal with the situation. So it's not that big of a deal.

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On assumption that you warn and fine players for reds, you can manage these during game by reducing hard tackle for player after a yellow or sub the player. Testing shows a benefit for hard tackle (win ball back as early as possible) and not a worthwhile reduction in cards. Also players have hidden dirtiness attribute. There are a few no hard tackle tactics I think BLUE MATTER and MIDSOMER.

With a player sent off I often switch to a SUS tactic even early in a game and that will usually get a result.

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5 hours ago, knap said:

On assumption that you warn and fine players for reds, you can manage these during game by reducing hard tackle for player after a yellow or sub the player. Testing shows a benefit for hard tackle (win ball back as early as possible) and not a worthwhile reduction in cards. Also players have hidden dirtiness attribute. There are a few no hard tackle tactics I think BLUE MATTER and MIDSOMER.

With a player sent off I often switch to a SUS tactic even early in a game and that will usually get a result.

the tactic has hard tackling for the whole team, but i reduce the tackling level (for the player) direct after the yellow card in match. 

What is a SUS tactic? - I mean what is a good SUS tactic for this formation ?

Edited by havanaclue

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Just the player but you can game manage. If 3-0 up but many cards then you could reduce tackling for whole team. I never bother as if there is a red then I just use a SUS tactic, and often a player can get 2 yellows in 2 mins, so y0u don't have time to pause game.

This is a good formation for a SUS.

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30 minutes ago, knap said:

Just the player but you can game manage. If 3-0 up but many cards then you could reduce tackling for whole team. I never bother as if there is a red then I just use a SUS tactic, and often a player can get 2 yellows in 2 mins, so y0u don't have time to pause game.

This is a good formation for a SUS.

SUS meaning changing to contain and switching the WBs from attack to defence or would you drop them back into a 5 defence line ? Thankyou by the way for the advice .

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You can do either. A 5 man defence may be useful if the AI use 3 strikers. If they use 4231 then the ARGUS 451 SUS may be a good option so the DM can mark their AM.

Using SUS tactics is very much dependent upon what is happening during that specific match.

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Injuries due to the high intensity of the tactic is - well to say the least, a pain in the arse. I have training on low so the workload is light, individual training in the roles/positions that I want the players in. I am playing FMT so can't really improve the medical staff that much (existing guy has 17 in Physio). Sitting 2nd after 20 games, solid but not running away with league at all - very realistic actually in that aspect. :)

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I don't worry too much about injuries as allows natural rotation. BLUE MATTER is lower intensity.

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Knap, let me ask you something.

I'm gonna start a save with Leeds, which 3 tactics would you recommend me while i'm in the Championship and 3 for when i eventually reach the PL?
Thanks!

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I tend to use a formations that uses the best players in right positions(not roles)

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21 hours ago, knap said:

I tend to use a formations that uses the best players in right positions(not roles)

Any recommendations for a team like that /Leeds/Fulham/Villa) once it reaches the Prem?

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Overview of Tactic List from testing                                  TOTAL                       SUB TOP    UNDERDOG

ARGUS FM 18.2.2       P102                                                    P385                          P206        P179  

PILGRIMAGE FM 18.3.3 LPOOL P104                                  P380                            P226       P154

WOF FM 18.3.3  P101  Flexible                                              P381                           P213          P168

WOF FM 18.3.3 LPOOL P100 ALL CUPS                                P365                          P196          P169

PILGRIMAGE Fluid  LPOOL P101                                           P367                          P201           P166

PILGRIMAGE FM 18.2 P105                                                   P357                          P218           P139

ARGUS VOL 4 FM18.3.3  Structured  P101 ALL CUPS       P363                          P220           P143

BLUE MATTER    FM 18.3.3 P105                                         P356                           P207           P149

GOODBYE FM 18.3 VOL 7 Very Fluid                                  P349                           P208          P141

GOODBYE 3421                                                                     P324                          P205         P119

MIDSOMER 442 P103 (FLAT TEST)                                      P349                          P199         P150

MIDSOMER 442 VOL MEZ                                                    P342                          P196         P146 

MIDSOMER 343 VOL MEZ                                                    P337                          P195        P142

WOF 2323    FM 18   P104                                                    P335                          P187         P148

BLUE MATTER FM 18.3 VOL 4 P102     352                       P335                           P206         P129

ASH 343 19,3.3 LPOOLP99 Highly Structured                 P333                           P205       P128

ARGUS 3430                                                                          P331                          P192         P139

VOLANTE BWM FM 18.3 P101                                           P326                            P191         P135

MM  442 VOLANTE P103                                                    P323                            P187        P136

WOF 3412                                                                            P325                             P198         P127

WOF 2233 P102HS         FM 18.2                                      P311                             P194         P117

BLUE MATTER VOL 4 P100 4123 FM 18.2.1                  P310                             P179         -P131

MMVOLANTEANCHOR            442                                   P302                            P165           P127

ARGUS 352 18.2,2 P101                                                   P306                            P169            P137

BLUE MATTER 433 18.3                                                    P295                             P158           P137

BLUE MATTER VOL 4 4213 VOLANTE 18.3                     P289                            P184            P105

PILGRIMAGE 3511 18.2.2 P102                                       P297                            P181            P116

PILGRIMAGE 451 MUP101 18.3.3                                    P293                           P169          P124

MIDSOMER WIDE DIAMOND   18.3                                P287                            P175            P112

RAMBLE ON ASYMMETRIC18,3 P100                             P287                           P169            P118     

RAW SIENNA 4231 18,2,2                                                 P272                           P147             P125 

 

Most of the newer tactics have not been tested, but in general 3 fwds are better than 2 and 2 better than 1.

Newly promoted to PL would look to best underdog tactics, but with all testing, even over 180 games, will be subject to a margin of error,  The underdog test is with a team with CA 120 and sub CA 145

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Also there is no reason not to mix tactics for home away or difficult games. For very difficult games could also consider using a SUS tactic. Also many use MIDSOMER on Counter, so different mentalities can be used if it improves results.

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23 hours ago, knap said:

Also there is no reason not to mix tactics for home away or difficult games. For very difficult games could also consider using a SUS tactic. Also many use MIDSOMER on Counter, so different mentalities can be used if it improves results.

Many thanks.

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Is there any chance you can screenshot player instructions cause I am on touch hope someone can really wanna try this tactic 

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According to the FM Brotherhood https://fmbrotherhood.com/the-best-fm18-tactics-tested-football-manager-tactics/, they list one of your tactics as being really good, the “Another Knaps` Target Man FM Tactic”  (3-2-2-1-2). When I download it seems to be a tactic from FM17, this to be exact - FM17.3.1GOODBYEKnap3412ARSENALP100TMP100. Does that still work because I couldn't find it anywhere in the forum for FM18

My Boro save is struggling in the Premiership, hard to get good players and every game is a struggle to watch I'm afraid.

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Have you tried ARGUS 343?

FM 16 and FM 17 tactics can still work but usually update them

 

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11 minutes ago, knap said:

Have you tried ARGUS 343?

FM 16 and FM 17 tactics can still work but usually update them

 

I'm going to try ARGUS 343 from start again :)

 

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I started with Athletic. As the player pool is very limited, I only have one real striker: Aduriz. Therefore I tend to choose a tactic with one striker eventhough Knap claims 3 fw tactics are best.  I initially used Dark side of the moon 4-2-3-1 as the personels suits most. The season started well. But after conceding 3 goals in consecutive games I switched to this tactic following Las Palmas game, thinking that 3 defenders can keep the defense tight but no. I cant defend! My defenders are too slow and they give so many space to oppenent fws and the opponent find so many 1-on-1 opportunity. Which tactic do you suggest to use for better defense?

 

20180827000018_1.thumb.jpg.df14dd93105159b5e5d45abbe6673603.jpg

Edited by ilker136

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Just watching Chelsea with a front 3 of Hazard Morate and Pedro,

With positions you can use aml st amr.

If not a 343 could try a 442 like Volant Anchor, MIDSOMER P103 on counter or a strikerless tactic.

Somebody has won the PL with Burnley using ASH 343 which is a bit more defensive being highly Structured.. Also last years MIDSOMER 442 is Highly structured and set on counter.

Edited by knap

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With that type of formation, I would either go to a flat back 4 to protect wings or go 3411 using a AM. If late in game and winning I would go SUS if not I would probably use AM. and keep attacking. Also depends who is on bench for subs.

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I have to say that I absolutely love this tactic. I tested it out properly with Man Utd, playing the game as I would a proper one and we absolutely smashed it. I then decided to try and tweak the tactic and set up a new game where I would go on holiday, we ended up scoring 136 goals in the league with it, although admittedly it was slightly more leaky at the back than the original and more prone to losing in away games.

I've started a proper game, this time as West Ham United and I plan to use the original tactic in away games and my tweaked tactic in home games. My first match in the league was against Manchester City and I actually went with the original in the first half considering how good Man City are and we went into half time at 1-1, so I took the risk and switched up to my tweaked tactic and we obliterated them 5 - 1! This is the tweaked tactic...

Untitled.thumb.png.cbf7b985f9aa01369cd561fedf78ee4d.png

I tried it with the wing backs further forward like in the original, but it leaks goals doing that, so it's much better defensively like this.

Edited by mikenevo

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Home and Away tactics (Hard Easy games) is a good idea, and also changing during a game if not going as planned.

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Finally finished my season, won the Premier League with 1 game to go, 132 goals score, 55 against. To be honest though, if this was any other season we probably would finish second because the other teams all did pretty bad, Chelsea 2nd with 80 points and Man Utd 3rd with 78 points.

Carabao cup we lost in 4th round to Spurs

FA Cup we lost in semi final to Man Utd :(

I bought a striker called Patrick Cutrone who was an absolute beast!

E3E1EFA50020087B1F6BCCCF0BD840F80A5A1F2070F3A98B5A792989402DD8C463CBD37C155C5CE9

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2 hours ago, mikenevo said:

Finally finished my season, won the Premier League with 1 game to go, 132 goals score, 55 against. To be honest though, if this was any other season we probably would finish second because the other teams all did pretty bad, Chelsea 2nd with 80 points and Man Utd 3rd with 78 points.

Carabao cup we lost in 4th round to Spurs

FA Cup we lost in semi final to Man Utd 

I bought a striker called Patrick Cutrone who was an absolute beast!

E3E1EFA50020087B1F6BCCCF0BD840F80A5A1F2070F3A98B5A792989402DD8C463CBD37C155C5CE9

Hi, what tactic do you use when you are away? do you use any OI?
Edited by matias82

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