Popular Post Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 21, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) Welcome to Caixa Futebol Campus, the highly-proclaimed academy of S.L. Benfica boasting state of the art facilities and an abundance of talented young players in Football Manager 2018. The objective of this thread is to discuss youth development, with an emphasis on instilling an dynamic & adaptable style of play that progresses as the team develops. Disclaimer: the topic of Youth Development in Football Manager has been well documented over a number of years, the purpose of this thread is more application in relation to developing a tactical approach. Overview of Youth Development in Football Manager Spoiler Youth Development in Football Manager 2018 can be broken down into the following aspects. Finding and bringing in young players with high Potential Ability Youth Intakes Youth Facilities, Youth Recruitment & Junior Coaching all influence - not guarantee - the Current & Potential Ability of players in the Youth Intake (source) Head of Youth Development can influence the personality and - occasionally - attribute spread of players in the Youth Intake (source) Scouting Developing young players' Current Ability until they fulfil their Potential Ability Game time Primary factor for players over the age of 18 (source) Training & Coaching Primary factor for players below the age of 18 (source) Personality & determination Influencing distribution of Attribute improvements as a result of Current Ability increases Individual Training Team Training External to the club, national Youth Rating and - of course - luck will play a hugely influential role. Defining a Playing Style Spoiler An advantage of developing players from a young age is tactical flexibility - training attributes, traits and new positions to suit a dynamic style of play. Possession football - bread & butter for a number of years now - will still play an important part. Intense pressing High-tempo, short passing Fluid attacking movement and pace Adaptable defensive strategy Medium block to maintain control of the middle of the pitch and force opposition wide Low block to restrict space behind our defence against quick opposition attackers Adaptable possession strategy High-tempo remains constant Direct passing when we can counter-attack quickly Overall build-up adapts correspondingly Formational fluidity In order to function effectively in a variety of systems, players need to develop a high degree of collective football intelligence across the team. Anticipation Ability to predict and react to events Decisions Ability to make correct choices with and without the ball Concentration Mental focus & attention to detail Composure Steadiness of mind and ability to make decisions with and without the ball Off the Ball Ability to move into a dangerous position to receive a pass when not in possession of the ball Positioning Ability to read a situation and take the best possible position Vision Ability to see a potential opening Team Work Ability to follow tactical instructions whilst working alongside team-mates These attributes - combined with a technical skill and a certain degree of athleticism - will form the foundation of our training methodology. Class of 2018 Spoiler A primary reason for managing Benfica is the outstanding array of talented youngsters already at the club. Our inaugural match-day squad for the Supertaça Cândido de Oliveira is an early opportunity to introduce fans to a new generation of youngsters bursting with potential. The majority of the squad have come through the Caixa academy. Geronimo Rulli joins from Real Sociedad for £11m, replacing Ederson after his move to Man City Xadas, Francisco Trincão & Cesinha join for a combined £1m balancing the existing squad with some left-footed players for tactical flexibility Let's have a look at some of these players in a little more detail. Goalkeepers Joins as a ready-made first team goalkeeper. Model Professional personality perfect to tutor Mile Svilar setting up an interesting future battle for the 'Number 1' jersey. Solid core goalkeeping attributes with reasonable football intelligence and technical ability. Very good core goalkeeping attributes for his age Comfortable on the ball Concern over football intelligence, particularly anticipation, concentration and positioning Central Defenders Newly promoted club vice-captain Strong core defensive attributes Needs to improve technical ability Versatile player able to primarily at right back but also centre back Strong core defensive attributes, technical ability and football intelligence Perhaps a slightly better option at centre back given his height and perhaps even a longer-term option at halfback Well rounded modern centre back Weaknesses to iron out in Strength, Composure, Decisions and First Touch Perhaps a long-term option at half back Fullbacks La Masia graduate & one of the top players at the club Strong technical ability, solid defensive attributes, intelligent, quick and high work-capacity Very well rounded modern wingback, winger and even midfielder Extremely well-rounded player Strong technical ability, solid defensive attributes, intelligent, quick and high work-capacity Versatility to play wingback, winger or even midfielder Midfielders Talented, technical and creative midfielder. Injured at the start of the game, likely to compete for a deep midfield playmaker role when he returns. Playmaking type midfielder with strong technical ability and football intelligence particularly for his age Needs to add either defensive capability or work capacity to his game to suit most midfield roles Extremely low flair and strong teamwork so maybe suited for a 'Number 6' role Solid all-rounder suitable for either a holding midfield or runner-type role Possible option for an inverted wingback role on the right Midfield playmaker on the verge of the first team Strong technical ability, vision and flair Well rounded overall attribute profile Could potentially play as a classic 'Number 10' or even central forward Talented young playmaker Strong technical ability, vision and flair Needs to improve footballing intelligence and defensive capability Deja vu, 3 in a row. Aggressive edge to his game Reasonably well-rounded but perhaps a little behind in his development Potential option at left wingback Attackers Quick creative winger with a reasonably well-rounded attribute profile Quick, creative winger and pretty well-rounded attribute profile Reasonably good teamwork Possibility to play centrally Quick winger, with good all-round technical ability Needs to work on football intelligence, finishing, defensive capability and weaker foot Quick winger with good all-round playmaking ability Needs to work on football intelligence, finishing, and defensive capability Two-footed and able to play on either flank opens a lot of tactical versatility Quick winger with a raw, but well-rounded attribute profile Can play on either side but needs to work on weaker foot Overview Strengths: Technical ability across the team Versatility & depth Tactical flexibility: Defenders comfortable bringing the ball forward Wingbacks capable of playing as inverted wingbacks, traditional wingbacks, wingers or coming in to join the midfield Balanced & creative midfield, probably most suitable for a 3-man variant but also a diamond Quick, technical, creative and versatile attackers screaming out for a flexible 3-man attacking line Weaknesses: Lack of a natural Centre Forward to act as a focal point of the attack and link play No naturally left-sided central defenders which would help build-up play and give us the option to play a back 3 General need to improve football intelligence Scouting Team Responsible for supplementing our squad - particularly with in those problem areas of striker and left-sided centre back - will be our scouting team. Continuing the theme of being a very well run football club, Benfica boasts a strong scouting network covering Europe, North and South America. Given the emphasis on youth development, our scouts are instructed to look for young players across our entire scouting range - aka, the world - with short-term assignments covering: Portuguese U19 League South America (East) South America (West) Mexico Africa (to be divided down further later on once we have built a general knowledge of the continent) All of which searching for players under 23, 4-stars or higher in Potential Ability. Developing Current Ability Spoiler Current Ability increases are driven by a 'magic triangle' of factors within our control. Game time Personality & determination Training facilities & coaching This - to me - is essentially the Football Manager application of Sir Alex Ferguson's point on building a football club, as opposed to a football team. Game Time Years ago @SFraser - rest in peace - wrote an inspirational piece about structuring a football club to facilitate youth development. Benfica football club consists of 3 teams, competing in various competitions. First Team Primeira Liga NOS UEFA Champions League 3 smaller Cup competitions B Team Liga II Ledman U23 International Cup Under 19 Team Portugal U19 First Division UEFA Youth League The key is to ensure players are getting enough game time, at an appropriate level for their Ability. First Team Squad Largest squad at the club, containing 22-24 players Oriented primarily around Current Ability, the best players at the club competing for the first team Rulli, Cervi, Zivkovic and - likely, when he returns from injury - Krovinovic will play first team roles. Young players - Gedson Fernandes, Ruben Dias, Xadas - will be given ample opportunity to break into the team B Team 16-18 players in the squad ensuring adequate game time Primarily players still young but too old for the U-19s however not ready for the first team Lack of control over training so players requiring more attention are in the U-19s More control over tactics so a good opportunity to experiment with new ideas Alex Pinto is a great example: Too old for U-19 team, not ready for first team Attribute profile is pretty good but needs game time at Centre Back Under 19 Team 16-18 players in the squad ensuring adequate game time Majority of players are 16 to 17 years-old, which is a point when Training & Coaching has a greater influence on Current Ability development (source) In this case, the 4-1-4-1 formation allows multiple players to learn new positions which improve versatility and facilitate more opportunity in future Florentino Luis at DR Cesinha at DL Dantas at DMC Embalo at ML João Felipe at MR Duk at FC This is a wonderful opportunity to prioritise development over results Personality & Determination Personality - specifically Professionalism & Ambition - and Determination (source) improve training performance which accelerates Current Ability development. Professionalism is hidden but there are a number of personalities that indicate a high degree of professionalism. Model Citizen Model Professional, Professional Perfectionist Resolute, Spirited and fairly Professional, to a lesser extent Young players can improve their personality through Tutoring from an experienced player - ideally, with high determination and a personality indicating high professionalism. In addition to Personality & Determination players can also inherit Player Traits of their tutoring them depending on the option you select: "..I'd like you to tutor <young player> as I feel you can help improve his game" Personality, Determination & Player Traits "..I think it would be beneficial is you were to take <young player> under your wing and mentor him off the pitch" Personality and Determination only Players must meet a number of criteria in order for tutoring to take place. Tutors Must be at least 24-years old Excluding club captain Higher squad status than the Tutee Higher reputation than the Tutee Familiarity in a familiar position to the Tutee Tutees Must be 23 years old, or younger Squad status must be Rotation or lower Must have fewer than 75 first team appearances Neither Tutor or Tutee can be injured or learning a trait and both must have 6-months+ on their contracts. These criteria have two key implications: Tutoring 23 years-old players is important for two reasons: Next year, they become a potential tutor This is their final opportunity for tutoring Young players in/around the First Team need to be tutored quickly: When they hit 75 first team appearances they can no longer be tutored As their reputation increases it becomes more difficult to find potential tutors Potential tutors with top-tier personalities - Model Citizen, Model Professional, Professional, Perfectionist, etc - should be tutoring as much as possible. Older players can often be excellent tutors and are often available for low transfer fees or even free so - particularly during the first few seasons - it's useful to bring in some extra tutors to bolster your capacity to develop young players. Benfica have a few high-priority players needing tutoring quickly: Franco Cervi is 23 years-old and Fairly Determined Tutored by Jonas (Determination of 15 & Spirited) Useful traits: comes deep to get ball, plays one-twos and places shots Alex Grimaldo is first team left-back and Fairly Ambitious Tutored by Víctor Cuesta (Determination of 20 & Professional) Andrija Zivkovic is a first team attacker and Fairly Professional Tutored by Eduardo Salvio (Determination of 16 & Spirited) Gedson Fernandes is going to be competing to play right -back and Resolute Tutored by Andrés Gurrieri (Determination of 20 & Professional) Ruben Dias is going to be competing to play centre-back and Resolute Tutored by Ricardo Carvalho (Determination of 18 & Professional) Xadas will be competing for a midfield spot and is Light Hearted Tutored by Kaká (Determination of 14 & Model Professional) Useful traits: runs with ball through centre, tries killer balls, moves into channels and places shots Remaining tutors are assigned to high-potential youngsters from the U-19s. Geronimo Rulli (Determination of 15 & Model Professional) -> Mile Svilar Jardel (Determination of 16 & Professional) -> Pedro Álvaro Axel Müller (Determination of 20 & Model Citizen) -> Alex Pinto Luisão (Determination of 15 & Leader) -> Francisco Ferreira Unfortunately Leadership does not develop through tutoring André Almeida (Determination of 14 & Fairly Professional) -> Luís Pinheiro Eliseu (Determination of 15 & Fairly Determined) -> Pedro Amaral Andrea Pirlo (Determination of 12 & Professional) -> Tiago Dantas Comes deep to get the ball, tries killer balls, long range passes, dictates tempo Ljubomir Fejsa (Determination of 16 & Resolute) -> Florentino Luis Stays back at all times, marks opponents tightly and plays simple passes Andreas Samaris (Determination of 18 & Driven) -> João Felix Pizzi (Determination 14 & Fairly Professional) -> Diego Batista & later Filip Krovinovic Comes deep to get the ball, gets into opposition area, plays one-twos, switches ball to other flank Rafa (Determination 14 & Fairly Professional) -> Cesinha Haris Seferovic (Determination of 12 & Ambitious) -> Duk Raúl Jiménez (Determination of 16 & Resolute) -> João Felipe Katchana (Determination of 17 & Model Professional) -> Úmaro Embaló Training Facilities & Coaching Another primary reason for choosing Benfica is the excellent facilities & staff already in place at the club. First team coaching is the best in Portugal. ..as is the Under-19. Massive kudos to those who spend years building academies in the likes of Romania, San Marino, and Gibraltar. As usual, I play on 'easy mode'.. Training Ground Spoiler As Current Ability increases, players' Attributes improve. Team & Individual Training influence which attributes improve the most. In addition to Attributes, Team Training can also improve: Team Cohesion Match Preparation Tactical Familiarity Defensive Positioning Attacking Movement Attacking or Defensive Set Piece practice (time to do the conga!) Key decisions: Time spent on Team Cohesion and/or Match Preparation means less time spent training Attributes, and vice-versa. Team Training - factoring intensity & rest - and Individual Training - factoring intensity & additional focus - combine to give an Overall Training Workload. Higher training workload means faster progression, but also higher injury risk. First Team Training Tactical Training Focus Develops Anticipation, Composure, Concentration, Decisions, Teamwork across the team High Intensity for General Training Given Match Preparation and Rest our training time is limited during the season 2 matches per week (with one day match preparation and one day rest) means only 1 day of training 1 match per week leaves 4 days Match Preparation Tactical Familiarity during pre-season friendlies Attacking movement or defensive positioning during the season Medium Overall Workload Leaving some capacity for Individual Training Under 19 Team Training Tactical Training Focus Develops Anticipation, Composure, Concentration, Decisions, Teamwork across the team Attribute development takes a priority over match preparation for the U-19 league No match preparation Medium Intensity for General Training With a post-match rest day, this leaves 5-6 days per week of medium intensity training Medium Overall Workload Leaving some capacity for Individual Training Individual Training In individual training allows us to mitigate weaknesses and to focus on core attributes required to function effectively in a variety of systems. Football Intelligence Technical Ability Versatility Athleticism Goalkeepers typically train as Sweeper Keepers. Central Defenders develop their core defensive attributes and ball playing ability as Ball Playing Defenders. The fullback role is known as one of the most demanding in the modern game, and train as Complete Wingbacks. At this stage most Midfield players are going to be taking on the Roaming Playmaker role. In attack, we need to develop players with all-round attacking skill - and also I have lots of good attackers but few actual strikers - so I am training Attackers at Complete Forwards. Now we give this time to develop and re-evaluate accordingly. Thank you for reading! I'd also like to thank @Anaconda Vice for the Emilio Sansolini kits. Edited July 21, 2018 by Ö-zil to the Arsenal! 33 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 21, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted July 21, 2018 Adapting Tactics to the Team Spoiler Having sold the likes of Gonçalo Guedes to Paris Saint-Germain, Ederson to Manchester City, Victor Lindelof to Manchester United and Nelson Semedo to Barcelona for more than £130m in transfer fees in 2017, the start of the 2017/2018 season is the dawn of a new era for Benfica. The squad has a few key players which we will build the team around. Luisão starts as Club Captain and has made 300+ appearances for Benfica but - at 36-years old and with his legs deteriorating - he'll be used sparingly. Aggressive, brave, intelligent, strong in the air and on the ground Jardel is a excellent classic central defender. Taking over club captaincy from Luisão as the rock at the heart of our defence. Positionally intelligent and excellent reader of the game, combined with aggression, bravery and strength. Fejsa is a superb midfield destroyer. Jonas is technically excellent in front of goal, intelligent and creative and - at 33-years old - offers an interesting dynamic tactically. In typical league matches - we are favourites to win the majority of games - our go-to set up is a simple, Structured 4-2-3-1. Designed to blend youth with experience and combine a solid defensive platform with pace, movement and clinical finishing. @fmFutbolManager's superb Mentality & Team Shape Calculator gives some insight into the way the system works. Standard mentality gives me a medium defensive block and a very balanced approach overall. Higher closing down and direct passing increases the intensity. Structured team shape reduces Creative Freedom & players prioritise their individual duties & position ahead of the team mentality. In comparison with Flexible or Fluid shapes, defensive players become more defensive and attacking players become more attacking. This benefits the high number of specialist players in the squad. Jardel, Luisão, Dias and Fejsa are excellent defenders with limited technical ability Structured gives them a defensive mentality and low creative freedom to deviate Jonas is an excellent attacker but 33-years old and less suited to tracking back Structured gives Jonas a more attacking mentality encouraging him to stay forward 4-2-3-1 suits this style well. Back four and double pivot is a strong defensive platform When played correctly attacking midfield trio can oscillate between a 4-5-1 and a 4-2-4 Wingers pin back opposition fullbacks Heavy attacking presence suits direct transitions Defensive players being more defensive and attacking players being more attacking means that Duties have to be distributed carefully, to ensure the team is compact. Goalkeeper and Central Defender (Defend) have particularly defensive mentalities Central Midfield (Defend) is still defensive but - in Structured systems - Midfielders are given a slightly higher mentality than Defenders on the same duty Central Defender (Stopper) bridges this gap, defending slightly more aggressively behind the Deep-Lying Playmaker (Support) Deep-Lying Playmaker (Support) naturally holds position creating a solid double-pivot defensive block ahead of the defence Winger (Support) would naturally have a more attacking mentality than Wingback (Support) due to their position in a Structured shape Look for Overlap slightly increases the mentality of the Wingback (Support) and decreases mentality of the Winger (Support) Winger (Support) both Roam from Position creating space to overlap and adding fluidity to the attack Will ultimately become Inside Forwards but current players are well-suited to Winger roles Attacking Midfielder (Support) has a neutral mentality, dropping deep creating a 4-5-1 or presses creating a 4-4-2, links midfield and attack and Gets Further Forward to support the striker and avoid isolation Deep-lying Forward (Attack) naturally drops deeper to link play sightly helped by the addition of Roam from Position Attacking duty and structured gives an out-and-out attacking mentality as the teams primary goalscorer In bigger games - particularly in Europe - we easily add some experience and drop deeper and focus more on the counter attack. Once again, referring to the Mentality & Team Shape Calculator we can x-ray the effects a Counter mentality has on the team on the whole. Mentality becomes slightly more defensive across the team Switching wide players to Attack duty - and removing Look for Overlap as unnecessary - maintains an attacking presence on the flanks Supporting the change in Mentality we optimise the system with some additional tweaks. Dropping into a 4-4-1-1 gives us two solid banks of four and attempts to draw out opposition fullbacks Facing a quick attacker or playing Luisão with Jardel I'll drop defensive line Deeper again to mitigate their lack of pace Match Analysis Spoiler Our first challenge in the 2017/18 Champions League campaign is a home tie against Red Bull Leipzig - a intense pressing side, full of work rate and a fast attack on the break. RB Leipzig set up an an aggressive 4-4-2 - or even 4-2-4 - formation. We could perhaps have used a three-man defence - if we had trained it - to maintain an extra man advantage against the two centre forwards but decided not to rush a change. Instead we lined up in the Counter 4-4-1-1, aiming to defend deep and attack the space left behind the opposition defence quickly on the break. The two compact banks of four defend just ahead of our 18 yard box, aiming to force the opposition wide. Attacking Midfielder (Support) does a great job disrupting opposition play ahead of our double-pivot, allowing them to hold their shape. When the opposition go wide they are then swarmed by the more aggressive players on the flank. Attacking Midfielder (Support) - again - fantastic in coming all the way across to trap the opposition player. Central defenders and double pivot maintain a strong defensive position. After winning possession the counter-attack charges at the disorganised opposition defence. Cervi - man of the moment - surges forward in acres of space. Jonas - who'd stayed forward throughout the defensive phase - now occupies opposition defenders and runs into even more space in behind. Zivkovic & Salvo - at this stage - support the attack, charging towards the box. 1-0. Cervi stays wide, reaching the opposition 18-yard box drawing the central defender and then cuts back for unmarked Jonas to tap in. In the attacking phase Deep-lying Forward (Attack), regularly - as the name may suggest - drops a bit deeper in the attack. Attacking midfield trio are all now Roaming from Position and Getting Forward. Wingers have moved inside and Wingbacks are Overlapping, providing width. As well as a goalscorer, Jonas is also a superb creator and has multiple options to directly create a goalscoring opportunity. In this instance he actually takes the most difficult option, cutting inside and finding Zivkovic coming in from the left wing. 2-0. 26 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 21, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) Introduction to Possession Football Spoiler We have already discussed my long-term objective - to control games with positive, free-flowing possession football. In order to achieve this I need intelligent, technical, athletic & versatile players. As things stand, our players are far from fully developed. In this post we discuss adapting our tactics to our team at their current level of ability. Development Squad This match day squad is a selection of high-potential young players - including U-19s, B Team and First Team players - earmarked to be given opportunity in cup games and identified as the potential future of the club. We still have two gaps - left-sided Centre Back & Striker - currently filled with experienced players balancing the youth around them. Technical ability is already pretty strong, across the team. Technique, passing and first touch are great for the age group Vision and composure are pretty good across the team The clear weakness is football intelligence, particularly in midfield. Off the ball movement isn't great. Anticipation and decisions are weak Positioning, concentration, work rate and team work Team and individual training have been tailored to develop this over time, but until then it is important to make allowances in our approach. Tactical Implications High technical ability suggests we can build up play from the back and play a possession game. Switch to Attacking Movement in Match Training may help counteract poor off the ball movement. Defensive structure must allow for potential lapses in concentration and/or suspect positioning in midfield. Players do not yet have the decision making capacity to be given a high creative freedom. Implementing a Playing Style Control team mentality suits an expansive - yet balanced - style of play. In comparison to Standard, Control mentality gives us slight increases in: Base individual mentalities Defensive line and closing down Tempo and width Given that players do not yet have strong decision making capacity it is perhaps unwise to give high creative freedom associated with more Fluid team shapes but - that said - I am also not inclined to reduce creative freedom and risk becoming predictable. Flexible team shape offers a balanced level of creative freedom. All team shapes divide players by Duty into Attack, Support and Defend groups. Specific to a Flexible team shape: All players balance Team Mentality and their individual Duty. Players are sub-divided by position. Individual Mentalities in the Defence and Defensive Midfield strata are slightly lower than in the Midfield strata. DM(D) will have a lower individual mentality than a MC(D) and so on. The common concern here is that this sub-division creates a gap, reducing compactness. In the previous system we talked about a Stopper to close the gap between Central Defenders and the Central Midfielder (Defend) and Look for the Overlap to close a gap between the Wingbacks and Wingers. In this instance Exploit the Middle will increase the mentality of players with Defend duty in the Defence and Defensive midfield strata. This eliminates the gap between defence and midfield. This funnels possession through our best passers and most creative players in midfield. Combine this with Play Out of Defence, Retrain Possession, Pass Into Space and Close Down More and - voila - we have a playing style that fits our objective and the current skill level of our players. Team Structure Quote Formations are neutral; it is their application that gives them positive or negative qualities. - Jonathan Wilson Our formation is going to depend on a number of different aspects. Style of Play Playing from the back Controlling midfield Pressing Players Excellent fullbacks who could play any role Lots of wingers and technical creative midfielders Lack of strikers Opposition In Portugal the vast majority of opponents use 4-2-3-1 or 4-3-3 variants Outside of Porto and Sporting most opponents have vastly inferior squads so more likely to sit back Possession play demands a strong midfield presence. In the Grassroots Tactics thread, we discussed 3-5-2, a diamond and 4-3-3 for FC United in the Conference North, ultimately choosing 3-5-2 for it's suitability for our squad and facing many opponents playing 4-4-2. Following similar logic but this time considering we are primarily facing 4-2-3-1 or 4-3-3 variants and the quality of our wingers my start-point was a 4-3-3. Considering the need for a added defensive structure this became a 4-1-4-1. Apologies to those looking for liberos, registas or a ponta de lança - why on earth not.. - I prefer keep things simple. On the face of it, this looks conservative until you consider that playing without an Attack duty slightly increases the individual mentality of players on a Support duty in midfield or defence. Let's use @fmFutbolManager's Mentality Calculator to take another look under the hood. Individual mentalities across the squad are positive, yet balanced. Exploit the Middle is increasing individual mentalities of the Centre Defender (Defend) and Deep-Lying Playmaker (Defend) bringing them closer to the midfield. No Attack duty slightly increases the individual mentality of the entire midfield and the wingbacks. Our entire midfield has an individual mentality exactly half way between a Support and an Attack duty in a Standard mentality. An Attack duty would increase the mentality of the individual. At the expense of a slight decrease for each of the other players - in this case 6 players - in the Support unit. In this system we attack as a unit rather than rely on an individual. Remaining player instructions are very minimal. Goalkeeper distributes ball to centre backs Central Midfielders move into the channels, get forward more and run with the ball Wingers get forward more Striker moves into the channels Match Analysis Spoiler In the first season, this style of play will be introduced slowly in cup matches and - perhaps - league matches towards the end of the season. Our first run out was the Taça de Portugal Placard 3rd round against lower league SC Torreense - a perfect opportunity to experiment. Defensive Shape Perhaps our defensive structure wasn't tested as much as it could have been, but there were no signs for concern. Simple, compact 4-1-4-1 shape Defensive midfielder cover for any potential mistakes from a young midfield Probably upper medium defensive line and pressing into the opposition half Striker tracking back to disrupt opposition build-up We regularly pressed higher up and into the opposition half, retaining our shape well. Attacking Shape Over recent years the addition of new roles and improvements in the match engine mean we can create more dynamic tactics than ever before. In this system we attack in a 2-3-4-1. Inverted Wingbacks push up and in, sitting alongside the Deep-lying Playmaker. Midfield pushes forward as a unit. Wingers provide width. Deep-lying Forward drops deep to link play. The team is structured to offer our Playmaker lots of passing options. The deep-lying playmaker is the only playmaker in the side so likely to see a lot of the ball. Exploit the Middle also routes play through him. In possession he is flanked by Inverted Wingbacks and has Central Midfielders ahead of him. The opposition pressed quite well, but the Centre Backs act as a pressure valve and can easily bypass the press. The Data Analyst report also shows the advantage of a positive mentality - playing forwards and progressing the ball. Edited July 24, 2018 by Ö-zil to the Arsenal! 20 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 21, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) 2018/19 Pre-Season Spoiler One season in and the objective remains evolution rather than revolution. Success in the first season - winning the Primeria Liga and the semi-final of the Champions League - means Europe's top clubs are coming for many of our players. Manchester United bid £8.25m for last season's top goalscorer - and 34-year old - Jonas. Bayern met the £53m release clause to sign Zivkovic. Monaco came in with £21m for Salvio. Pizzi and Rafa left for West Ham for £11.25m and Burnley for £10.25m respectively in search of first team football. Meanwhile the academy players in out U-19 team won the UEFA Youth League and have earned the opportunity to progress. First Team Rúben Días played superbly last season, quickly establishing himself ahead of Luisão and developing into a strong, aggressive and intelligent defender likely to become club captain this season. Training as a Ball Playing Defender did not have the desired effect on his technical ability so added an individual focus and learning to play simple passes. Gedson Fernandes settled into the team on the right side of defence quickly and never looked back. He developed well throughout the season and is now focusing on improving Positioning and learning to play one-twos. Alex Grimaldo looks close to his potential on the left and has been excellent as a traditional wingback and in the inverted role. Xadas played a rotation role last season and the game time caused him to develop into an intelligent, creative midfielder. Having been successfully tutored he is now working on his Tackling and earning to play one-twos. Krovinovic displaced Pizzi in the team quickly after returning from injury but came very close to leaving due to a contractual dispute before being persuaded to stay. Tutoring from Pizzi developed some great traits for a dynamic midfield player. Comes deep to get the ball Plays one-twos Switches ball to opposite flank Places shots Alongside Xadas and Fejsa we have the potential for a very strong and well-rounded midfield trio. Cervi did make noises about a move but didn't quite do enough to attract the attention of the major clubs. Tutoring from Jonas developed some interesting traits for a dynamic attacking midfield role. Comes deep to get the ball Plays one-twos Gets into opposition area Places shots Finally returning from loan is Talisca - a real goalscorer. Clearly a talented but disruptive character, asked for a move to a bigger club on his first day back! Looking at our existing squad - and before delving too much into the transfer market - we clearly suit a diamond 4-4-2. Time will tell how that looks after pre-season and seeing which transfers are available. Promoted to the First Team João "Jota" Filipe recently set the real-life U-19 European Championships alight and was the star of our U-19s UEFA Youth League win. Not yet at a level to compete in the Champions League or to be relied upon in the first team but getting adequate game time will be a high priority. He's already tutored and now learning to play one-twos. Florentino Luís is a versatile player, well rounded player capable of playing in midfield or as an inverted wingback. Tutoring from Ljubomir Fejsa last season developed some useful defensive traits - which will be useful in an inexperienced team - but perhaps no through balls is a step far and likely replaced by plays one-twos once finished with the final tutoring. João Felix developed reasonably well last season but perhaps not at the same rate as some of the others. On the other hand his performance levels were excellent so it is perhaps that he needs an opportunity at a higher level. Experimenting with giving game time from the bench and in league games and continuing to tutor. Alex Pinto is a young versatile defender, comfortable on the right or centrally. Currently being tutored by Axel Müller - Model Citizen - but urgently needs to remove some traits before being relied upon at Centre Back! Francisco Trincão is promoted from the B Team as a talented left winger. Needs a bit more tutoring, and some game time. Finally - for the first team - a new face. Pedro Rodrigues returns from loan and despite being rated as less talented than some of the others seems to have a very efficient distribution of attributes for our style with intelligent play and positioning. He'll be covering for Fejsa and potentially in a half-back role. B Team Our B Team is an intermediary team between the U-19s and the First Team. Victor Bobsin is still retraining as Centre Back and would be behind Dias and Cuesta in the first team. Pedro Alvaro looks good but would be behind Jardel and Alex Pinto in the first team. Cesinha is retraining at Right Back and would be behind Gedson Fernandes and Florentino Luis. Diego Batista is also a good young midfielder and developing well but behind Krovinovic and Felix in the first team. Under-19s I am not going to talk about newgens in this post - too many random factors for this discussion. Given that training has the biggest impact on development until the age of 18 and my U-19s train harder - due to less match preparation and fewer matches - I keep my two most talented under-18s here. Dantas has developed well as an intelligent and technical midfielder as well as learning to play in Defensive Midfield, more of the same and we'll be looking at him for the first team next season. Embalo - similarly - has developed into a much more well rounded player. It'll be interesting to see how he continues to develop this season. That's about all for the Development Update. Enjoy & I'll update again shortly. Edited August 4, 2018 by Ö-zil to the Arsenal! 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-school-styla Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 cant wait. great read. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
herne79 Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 Great read. Just one minor point: 1 hour ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said: Personality - specifically Professionalism - and Determination (source) improve training performance which accelerates Current Ability development. Professionalism, Determination and Ambition all play a roughly equal part in player development. It's mentioned by Seb Wassell further into that source thread you linked . Perhaps also worth mentioning that whilst game time at a suitable level is relevant for all players, below the age of 18 training takes precedence whereas from 18 and up matches take precedence. Interested to read further updates . 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 21, 2018 Author Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) 20 minutes ago, herne79 said: Great read. Just one minor point: Professionalism, Determination and Ambition all play a roughly equal part in player development. It's mentioned by Seb Wassell further into that source thread you linked . Perhaps also worth mentioning that whilst game time at a suitable level is relevant for all players, below the age of 18 training takes precedence whereas from 18 and up matches take precedence. Interested to read further updates . Done & done. Thank you for the input Funnily enough, check out the Hints & Tips: Edited July 21, 2018 by Ö-zil to the Arsenal! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
john1 Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 Fantastic depth of analysis! Looking forward to more updates! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 Great stuff, Ozil. Nicely written and laid out (as usual!). Looking forward to seeing how you phase in possession play. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Criminal Backpass Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 This is superb. I'm really intrigued as to what you think about possession based approaches in this game. That elusive approach that appeases those of us whom want to dominate on the ball and at the same time create scoring chances. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefanopt1 Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 Amazing topic. Will follow along with a similar thing with Sporting Clube de Portugal! Gratz mate! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tajerio Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 (edited) Great lineup of youth there--but I didn't see Ze Gomes anywhere. I don't have FM18 but on 17 he was a pretty well-rounded young striker with bags of potential, and I'm sure he was on Benfica's books. Have I just missed him somehow? Edited July 21, 2018 by Tajerio Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 21, 2018 Author Share Posted July 21, 2018 7 minutes ago, Tajerio said: Great lineup of youth there--but I didn't see Ze Gomes anywhere. I don't have FM18 but on 17 he was a pretty well-rounded young striker with bags of potential, and I'm sure he was on Benfica's books. Have I just missed him somehow? You're right, Ze Gomes does look good. He's injured at the start, returning around October so I'll get him match fit in the B Team until the Christmas break and then see where I can fit him in. Might already need to start making a few sales to fit people in! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepalves7 Posted July 22, 2018 Share Posted July 22, 2018 Nice thread. There is immense talent in Portugal. Benfica, Porto and Sporting have good young players. I wanted to do the same in my club, FC Porto. Have the "Class of Diogo's". Diogo Costa (GK); Diogo Dalot (RB), Diogo Queirós and Diogo Leite (CB's). Well, and Diogo Bessa (LB), but, but not so talented. Have other players very interessed: Romário Baró, Afonso Sousa (one of the most talented), Rui Pedro (loan at Boavista in 1º season), Rui Pires (new Rúben Neves). "Olival Futebol Academy" Cheers! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abdiel_rivera10 Posted July 22, 2018 Share Posted July 22, 2018 13 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said: with short-term assignments covering: Hey O-zil, would you have to set these up over and over or can you put them as on going assignments? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 22, 2018 Author Share Posted July 22, 2018 7 hours ago, pepalves7 said: Nice thread. There is immense talent in Portugal. Benfica, Porto and Sporting have good young players. I wanted to do the same in my club, FC Porto. Have the "Class of Diogo's". Diogo Costa (GK); Diogo Dalot (RB), Diogo Queirós and Diogo Leite (CB's). Well, and Diogo Bessa (LB), but, but not so talented. Have other players very interessed: Romário Baró, Afonso Sousa (one of the most talented), Rui Pedro (loan at Boavista in 1º season), Rui Pires (new Rúben Neves). "Olival Futebol Academy" Cheers! Transfer targets Diogo Bras & Diogo Jota (superb player!) Portuguese sides have so much talent it's fantastic. 7 hours ago, Abdiel_rivera10 said: Hey O-zil, would you have to set these up over and over or can you put them as on going assignments? During the season my Director of Football is responsible for Scouting Assignments so I can focus on the football. I will manually set the Data Analyst match reports - very useful! - and tweak the General Focus of scouting to Young players. This would be different if we needed more players but our squad is very complete. As mentioned - I have my eye out for a Striker and left-sided Central Defender but I am potentially able to solve these within the existing squad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepalves7 Posted July 22, 2018 Share Posted July 22, 2018 (edited) 3 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said: Transfer targets Diogo Bras & Diogo Jota (superb player!) Portuguese sides have so much talent it's fantastic. Yes, is very good player. He in 2016/17 played in Porto, loaned by Atletico. Edited July 22, 2018 by pepalves7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
howard moon Posted July 22, 2018 Share Posted July 22, 2018 Great thread again. Your stuff is amongst the best at explaining how the game works in simple, footballing terms. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramie Posted July 23, 2018 Share Posted July 23, 2018 Great post once again. Just wondering if you change the Tactical Training Focus or do you keep it on tactical? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanDobre Posted July 23, 2018 Share Posted July 23, 2018 Sorry for posting this but can you tell me what skin do you use? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajsr1982 Posted July 23, 2018 Share Posted July 23, 2018 Nice work. Haven't learned this much from an OP in a long time! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wixxi Posted July 23, 2018 Share Posted July 23, 2018 2 hours ago, DanDobre said: Sorry for posting this but can you tell me what skin do you use? not the OP but it looks like just the 'Football Manager Dark' skin that's in the game by default, might be wrong though Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanDobre Posted July 23, 2018 Share Posted July 23, 2018 (edited) ok, thanks so I thought, but then I saw the club's estimated value and fm18 does not appear Edited July 23, 2018 by DanDobre Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean0987654321 Posted July 23, 2018 Share Posted July 23, 2018 Reminds me of what I'm trying (and succeeding :D) to do in my Athletic save. Making a DNA from the ground up in order to build a winning team playing good soccer. Well done, @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robson 07 Posted July 23, 2018 Share Posted July 23, 2018 (edited) Hello @Ö-zil to the Arsenal!. I enjoy the way you set out all your topics. You always get your points across in a very user friendly manner. I think most people accept you can't throw players into their preferred roles + duties and somehow that'll make a coherent tactic. I too buy into that. However you mention adapting the tactic to the team in post#2, plus you should be a very dominant side domestically. Added to which you have chosen standard-structured (which conceivably lends itself to my question?), so do you think you could get at least a couple more players maximising their talents in their best role/duty than you actually have? Currently only Pizzi is catered for 100% in that capacity. Could it be a simple 'no' because it won't work or a 'no' cause it's outside the DNA framework you want to impose? Just curious. Edited July 23, 2018 by Robson 07 grammar 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pass and Move Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 @Ö-zil to the Arsenal!, I generally use very similar roles for training (CF/IF for attackers, RPM for midfield), but I tend to use Libero rather than BPD for CB's as it covers more physical attributes (pace and stamina in particular) as well as dribbling, which seems useful for building out of the back. What's your rationale for BPD > Libero, assuming player is already natural at CB? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zlatanera Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 @Pass and Move If I'm not mistaken learning a new position takes up PA, so I imagine given he has no intention to use a Libero / Sweeper he just wants to maximise his players' development for their main positions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pass and Move Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 10 minutes ago, zlatanera said: @Pass and Move If I'm not mistaken learning a new position takes up PA, so I imagine given he has no intention to use a Libero / Sweeper he just wants to maximise his players' development for their main positions. If so, why train wingers with Complete Forward if they will never be played at CF? My impression was that learning a new position made the player's CA weight attributes differently, i.e. weigh certain attributes more highly than they would be otherwise -- meaning that a retrain to a more 'foreign' position would have a strong impact on CA but a like-to-like retrain (left wing to right wing) or a similar position retrain (CM to DM, CB to SW, RB to RWB, etc) would have a minimal impact. Cracked open the editor to look at this and changing a CB's sweeper rating from 1 to 15 brought his 'recommended current ability' (I have no idea what this means) up by 2 but did not change his CA. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wereldbol Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 (edited) not sure if he is still the same on the new database as i started only this benfica save when buying the game and i'm still slow managing many months later, but have a look at a kid called diego batista in the u19s because he can turn into this (and has turned into this on fm17 as well so i think his potential might be fixed at something quite decent?). i am only a goalkeeper away (currently still mile svilar) of not only fielding a complete academy first eleven throughout all of the season but also being really competitive with it. two champions league semi finals with a complete academy squad or ten academy players of the first eleven is pretty decent. wish a goalkeeper would come through. one has, but he's maxed out potentially i think at only 19 years old. i signed back renato sanches and goncalo guedes from bayern and psg because i had so much money in the bank from selling non academy players that i could easily drop 70 million on each. they are benfica academy players after all. i play a simple 442 because it allows me to develop forwards, wingers, midfielders, full backs and center backs in the u19 and B squads. Edited July 24, 2018 by wereldbol 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wereldbol Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 (edited) of course when you play as benfica you get insane regens all the time. these are my top 3 so far, a ready made future portugal midfield and a delightful poacher Edited July 24, 2018 by wereldbol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 24, 2018 Author Share Posted July 24, 2018 Introduction to Possession Football = Updated (Post 3) On 22/07/2018 at 16:07, howard moon said: Great thread again. Your stuff is amongst the best at explaining how the game works in simple, footballing terms. Thank you very much. Appreciate that feedback as simplicity is exactly what I'm going for! On 23/07/2018 at 06:50, ramie said: Great post once again. Just wondering if you change the Tactical Training Focus or do you keep it on tactical? 100% depends on the needs of the players. In this instance I would be expecting to focus on Tactical training for some time. On 23/07/2018 at 13:44, wixxi said: not the OP but it looks like just the 'Football Manager Dark' skin that's in the game by default, might be wrong though Yep, that's it 19 hours ago, Robson 07 said: Hello @Ö-zil to the Arsenal!. I enjoy the way you set out all your topics. You always get your points across in a very user friendly manner. I think most people accept you can't throw players into their preferred roles + duties and somehow that'll make a coherent tactic. I too buy into that. However you mention adapting the tactic to the team in post#2, plus you should be a very dominant side domestically. Added to which you have chosen standard-structured (which conceivably lends itself to my question?), so do you think you could get at least a couple more players maximising their talents in their best role/duty than you actually have? Currently only Pizzi is catered for 100% in that capacity. Could it be a simple 'no' because it won't work or a 'no' cause it's outside the DNA framework you want to impose? Just curious. Excellent question. The simple answer is that I do not believe the recommended duties - or many of the in-game recommendations for that matter - are valid. The player role recommendations depend on accepting the game's criteria of the attributes required for a position. Some roles are simply too broad - Central Midfielder for example, is a blank canvas. In my system, my Central Midfielder looks like this. We could remove those instructions and tell him to Hold Position and it'd be a totally different skill set. How can one set of attributes account for this? My players are rarely recommended core roles - Central Midfielder, Defensive Midfielder, Attacking Midfielder etc - instead it's always some kind of playmaker or another of the label type roles. I suspect it's to help the AI manager assign player roles based on attributes. The player role system could do with a tidy, in my opinion. I've lost track of the number of playmaker options and non-mutually exclusive roles. Case in point - apparently Pirlo isn't a great fit for the Deep-lying Playmaker (or Regista) role! 16 hours ago, Pass and Move said: @Ö-zil to the Arsenal!, I generally use very similar roles for training (CF/IF for attackers, RPM for midfield), but I tend to use Libero rather than BPD for CB's as it covers more physical attributes (pace and stamina in particular) as well as dribbling, which seems useful for building out of the back. What's your rationale for BPD > Libero, assuming player is already natural at CB? Simply hadn't thought of it 9 hours ago, wereldbol said: not sure if he is still the same on the new database as i started only this benfica save when buying the game and i'm still slow managing many months later, but have a look at a kid called diego batista in the u19s because he can turn into this (and has turned into this on fm17 as well so i think his potential might be fixed at something quite decent?). i am only a goalkeeper away (currently still mile svilar) of not only fielding a complete academy first eleven throughout all of the season but also being really competitive with it. two champions league semi finals with a complete academy squad or ten academy players of the first eleven is pretty decent. wish a goalkeeper would come through. one has, but he's maxed out potentially i think at only 19 years old. i signed back renato sanches and goncalo guedes from bayern and psg because i had so much money in the bank from selling non academy players that i could easily drop 70 million on each. they are benfica academy players after all. i play a simple 442 because it allows me to develop forwards, wingers, midfielders, full backs and center backs in the u19 and B squads. Fantastic! What's your starting team now then? Interesting to see others playing similar games. ..and, yes. I've got Batista playing in my U19s. Looks like a talented player! 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tajerio Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 I notice you've got both Retain Possession and Pass into Space on. My understanding was that Retain Possession tells players, in part, not to play through balls, while Pass into Space tells players to play those through balls. But you obviously know what you're doing--so what effect are you achieving by using the two instructions together? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 24, 2018 Author Share Posted July 24, 2018 8 minutes ago, Tajerio said: I notice you've got both Retain Possession and Pass into Space on. My understanding was that Retain Possession tells players, in part, not to play through balls, while Pass into Space tells players to play those through balls. But you obviously know what you're doing--so what effect are you achieving by using the two instructions together? Knowing what I'm doing is a strong term! The honest answer is I am not 100% sure. I am working with the same interface as anyone else, and it's not clear. The interface shows Retain Possession as a means of shortening passing without reducing tempo. I have never observed either - Retain Possession or Pass into Space - change an individual player's Passing Risk. This combination came about after adding Retain Possession to a more attacking system - after observing too many long shots - and later adding Pass into Space in an attempt to get players in behind. I've always liked what I've seen in the match engine and the majority of goals come from a through ball either direct assist or key pass. In fact, high tempo, short passing, retain possession and passing into space produced the best football I have seen in a long time in a Napoli save. Sorry I cannot give a more informed answer! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 24, 2018 Author Share Posted July 24, 2018 17 hours ago, Pass and Move said: If so, why train wingers with Complete Forward if they will never be played at CF? My impression was that learning a new position made the player's CA weight attributes differently, i.e. weigh certain attributes more highly than they would be otherwise -- meaning that a retrain to a more 'foreign' position would have a strong impact on CA but a like-to-like retrain (left wing to right wing) or a similar position retrain (CM to DM, CB to SW, RB to RWB, etc) would have a minimal impact. Cracked open the editor to look at this and changing a CB's sweeper rating from 1 to 15 brought his 'recommended current ability' (I have no idea what this means) up by 2 but did not change his CA. Excuse me, missed this one. They may never play as a Complete Forward, but they may play as a Striker - particularly as I don't have many - and this is the widest spread of attribute development whilst training to play in the Striker position. At this moment, I am just keeping potential doors open. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pass and Move Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 44 minutes ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said: Excuse me, missed this one. They may never play as a Complete Forward, but they may play as a Striker - particularly as I don't have many - and this is the widest spread of attribute development whilst training to play in the Striker position. At this moment, I am just keeping potential doors open. Sorry, meant CF as in Center Forward not the role, should've clarified. I assumed from your writing (both here and the Barca recreation) that you train attackers with the CF role regardless of whether they may play there or not, e.g. training wide forwards as CF rather than IF for the spread of attribute development. If you're lacking strikers then that's obviously another consideration Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 24, 2018 Author Share Posted July 24, 2018 20 minutes ago, Pass and Move said: Sorry, meant CF as in Center Forward not the role, should've clarified. I assumed from your writing (both here and the Barca recreation) that you train attackers with the CF role regardless of whether they may play there or not, e.g. training wide forwards as CF rather than IF for the spread of attribute development. If you're lacking strikers then that's obviously another consideration Precisely. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 (edited) On 21/07/2018 at 12:56, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said: Edited July 24, 2018 by Park Could a mod delete this post please? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! I just caught up on the possession post. Fantastic once again. I've noticed you never use the 'Play Wider' instruction in your tactics. In reference to your 2-3-4-1 shape (which looks very Pepish!), would this instruction not spread the wingers even wider, potentially giving your central players more space and your wingers more one-on-one opportunities? I'm thinking along the lines of Cruyff's/Pep's 'keep the pitch as big as possible, and play through the middle' principle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robson 07 Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 2 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said: My players are rarely recommended core roles - Central Midfielder, Defensive Midfielder, Attacking Midfielder etc - instead it's always some kind of playmaker or another of the label type roles. I suspect it's to help the AI manager assign player roles based on attributes. The player role system could do with a tidy, in my opinion. I've lost track of the number of playmaker options and non-mutually exclusive roles. Case in point - apparently Pirlo isn't a great fit for the Deep-lying Playmaker (or Regista) role! That's a good answer. The reason I asked it was because I'd just read a post last night about a retro Man Utd tactic from Class of 95 era. Everyone replying saying, no Giggs is a winger, Scholes is a playmaker and so on. Everyone had a clear idea on what type of players they were. And I thought, yep, if you were the best side domestically you try and play to your player's strengths, proactive not reactive. Maybe this applies to this Benfica team of yours, lets ask the question. Its a good point you raise that there is element of polish applied to the user interface about it, Your examples about an adapted central mid and then specifically Pirlo shine a light on what might be a little bit of window dressing by SI. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Criminal Backpass Posted July 24, 2018 Share Posted July 24, 2018 2 hours ago, Park said: @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! I just caught up on the possession post. Fantastic once again. I've noticed you never use the 'Play Wider' instruction in your tactics. In reference to your 2-3-4-1 shape (which looks very Pepish!), would this instruction not spread the wingers even wider, potentially giving your central players more space and your wingers more one-on-one opportunities? I'm thinking along the lines of Cruyff's/Pep's 'keep the pitch as big as possible, and play through the middle' principle. I'm trying to think about the same thing myself in terms of creating a good possession tactic that is effective. I used the wide men as wingers (s) with hold position and stay wide. This theoretically mimics Pep's approach in that he prefers the wide men to keep the width to (a) pull the defenders and midfielders wider to create more central space for the central creative players, and, (b) allow inverted full-backs to play inside the wingers occupying more central space, making under-lap runs instead of overlap, as well as being more central to link up with CM's. I think you've got the right idea, which is why I believe that possession tactics frustrate a lot of people on FM, because they inevitably face a lot of the same issues that real life possession teams face. Opposition teams sitting back deep and very few clear opportunities are created (in FM, very few highlights). So, my working idea is to play wider, wingers keep their position wide, inverted fb's inside them to link with cm's and make channel runs between defenders (who are stretched out by wingers prior), have one CM with some dribbling ability to roam and dribble (ala Iniesta) to draw players and create more space, and have a false nine who drops deep to pull defenders with him to draw away that deep opposition defensive block. That's the idea, in theory. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wereldbol Posted July 25, 2018 Share Posted July 25, 2018 12 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said: Fantastic! What's your starting team now then? Interesting to see others playing similar games. ..and, yes. I've got Batista playing in my U19s. Looks like a talented player! I don't want to steal the thread away from you, I'm looking forward to reading the possession posts later today when I get home from work. I play 442 and have reached two Champions League semi finals but have struggled when coming up against three in the middle sides. Those two semi final defeats and an 'early' exit in the quarter finals have all come against Arsenal who are simply too good in midfield for me to handle, even if I play Fernandes as an inverted wing back or play Carvalho or Felix as wide playmakers tucking inside. My starting line up is this, as I said, only one non-academy player in my squad: Svilar; Pinto, Dias, Alvaro, Ribeiro*; Guedes, Batista, Sanches, Filipe; Sousa*, Batista* Bench: Fernandes, Cardoso*, Carvalho, Sousa*, Félix, Gomes, Gaipo* The players with an asterisk are regens who came through our academy. I only bought Sanches, Guedes and Dias. I sold Dias to Manchester City but bought him back three seasons later for the exact same transfer price. I play the following tactic: Goalkeeper Full-back (s) Central Defender (d) Central Defender (d) Full-back (s) Wide Midfielder (a) Deep Lying Playmaker (d) Roaming Playmaker (s) Winger (s) Deep Lying Forward (s) Poacher (a) If you want to see how some of those players have turned out in 2024 in my game, feel free to ask. I can tell you that Alex Pinto has developed into one of the worlds best full-backs and is equally comfortable at central defense. Here is his profile: Have been thinking about going three at the back with Dias, Alvaro and Pinto. That way I can give Fernandes starting minutes at right wing back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 25, 2018 Author Share Posted July 25, 2018 12 hours ago, Park said: @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! I just caught up on the possession post. Fantastic once again. I've noticed you never use the 'Play Wider' instruction in your tactics. In reference to your 2-3-4-1 shape (which looks very Pepish!), would this instruction not spread the wingers even wider, potentially giving your central players more space and your wingers more one-on-one opportunities? I'm thinking along the lines of Cruyff's/Pep's 'keep the pitch as big as possible, and play through the middle' principle. It's not that I consciously don't use it. Watching matches the control mentality and designated wingers have always given us plenty of width so I have simply never seen the need. 12 hours ago, Robson 07 said: That's a good answer. The reason I asked it was because I'd just read a post last night about a retro Man Utd tactic from Class of 95 era. Everyone replying saying, no Giggs is a winger, Scholes is a playmaker and so on. Everyone had a clear idea on what type of players they were. And I thought, yep, if you were the best side domestically you try and play to your player's strengths, proactive not reactive. Maybe this applies to this Benfica team of yours, lets ask the question. Its a good point you raise that there is element of polish applied to the user interface about it, Your examples about an adapted central mid and then specifically Pirlo shine a light on what might be a little bit of window dressing by SI. Thank you. Yes, I suspect that much of it is window dressing. They could be useful for helping AI pick roles or simply for people who enjoy seeing weird and wonderful roles in their tactics. To me, there are a few with practical application - playmakers, half back, inverted wingback, mezzala etc - but many which are simply PI templates. This is certainly no official advice, just based on my experience and observation. Manchester United '99 era is a great example. Giggs is pretty much a winger whichever way you look at it. Scholes and Keane could be interpreted as Central Midfielders with PIs tailored to suit or some combination of playmaker, ball winner and/or box to box midfielder depending what game you're watching. The box to box midfielder is simply a CM(S) + roaming. Apparently there is some further difference but I could not tell you what. My personal opinion would be a box-to-box midfielder IS a Central Midfielder - doesn't apply in reverse - and I dislike the addition of roaming. Don't like the idea of midfielders popping up anywhere whilst we struggle to control the midfield. Sometimes the issue is different interpretations of the attributes required for the role, others it's different interpretations of the role itself. Take a look at a Complete Wingback in comparison to a Wingback for example. 10 hours ago, Criminal Backpass said: I'm trying to think about the same thing myself in terms of creating a good possession tactic that is effective. I used the wide men as wingers (s) with hold position and stay wide. This theoretically mimics Pep's approach in that he prefers the wide men to keep the width to (a) pull the defenders and midfielders wider to create more central space for the central creative players, and, (b) allow inverted full-backs to play inside the wingers occupying more central space, making under-lap runs instead of overlap, as well as being more central to link up with CM's. I think you've got the right idea, which is why I believe that possession tactics frustrate a lot of people on FM, because they inevitably face a lot of the same issues that real life possession teams face. Opposition teams sitting back deep and very few clear opportunities are created (in FM, very few highlights). So, my working idea is to play wider, wingers keep their position wide, inverted fb's inside them to link with cm's and make channel runs between defenders (who are stretched out by wingers prior), have one CM with some dribbling ability to roam and dribble (ala Iniesta) to draw players and create more space, and have a false nine who drops deep to pull defenders with him to draw away that deep opposition defensive block. That's the idea, in theory. That's interesting. It's a similar idea, for sure. Feel free to post your team / set up as it may be an interesting comparison. To explain a few choices - my wingers do not hold position as a) I need them forward to occupy fullbacks, b) they get into the box in the final 3rd and contribute quite a few goals. I think this is the video Henry explains Pep asked him to stay wide during buildup but was free to attack in the final 3rd. Finally I chose a Deep-Lying Forward over a False 9 simply for the addition of Hold Up the Ball to link with the midfield 4 swarming behind him. 2 hours ago, wereldbol said: I don't want to steal the thread away from you, I'm looking forward to reading the possession posts later today when I get home from work. I play 442 and have reached two Champions League semi finals but have struggled when coming up against three in the middle sides. Those two semi final defeats and an 'early' exit in the quarter finals have all come against Arsenal who are simply too good in midfield for me to handle, even if I play Fernandes as an inverted wing back or play Carvalho or Felix as wide playmakers tucking inside. My starting line up is this, as I said, only one non-academy player in my squad: Svilar; Pinto, Dias, Alvaro, Ribeiro*; Guedes, Batista, Sanches, Filipe; Sousa*, Batista* Bench: Fernandes, Cardoso*, Carvalho, Sousa*, Félix, Gomes, Gaipo* The players with an asterisk are regens who came through our academy. I only bought Sanches, Guedes and Dias. I sold Dias to Manchester City but bought him back three seasons later for the exact same transfer price. I play the following tactic: Goalkeeper Full-back (s) Central Defender (d) Central Defender (d) Full-back (s) Wide Midfielder (a) Deep Lying Playmaker (d) Roaming Playmaker (s) Winger (s) Deep Lying Forward (s) Poacher (a) If you want to see how some of those players have turned out in 2024 in my game, feel free to ask. I can tell you that Alex Pinto has developed into one of the worlds best full-backs and is equally comfortable at central defense. Here is his profile: Have been thinking about going three at the back with Dias, Alvaro and Pinto. That way I can give Fernandes starting minutes at right wing back. Don't worry at all, these threads are way more interesting as discussions and input from others is always welcome. Our sides are - interestingly - shaping quite differently. In midfield I am most excited by Dantas, Felipe, Felix, Embalo and - brought in from Braga - Xadas. By the second or third season the squad should be capable of playing just about any style and formation you want! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wereldbol Posted July 25, 2018 Share Posted July 25, 2018 Yes, I mean to type Joao Felipe, he's my winger. Dantas is probably one of the oldest players in my B team. He's not bad but I have many better options and players like Tiago and Cardoso have come through the academy to far surpass him. Also, he has a determination attribute of 4 and he refused to be tutored when he was still young. Joao Felix is probably on par with Felipe in my pecking order and has so far notched up 6 goals and 10 assists in the league and we're only in January. However, I like the pace Felipe has and he offers something different down the wing. Both are interchangeable depending on the way I want to approach the following game. Umaro Embalo is probably my biggest regret and/or disappointment. I had high hopes for him and at one time I think he had an acceleration rating of 20. But unfortunately I just couldn't get him to perform and then Chelsea came in with a £25m bid and I had to accept. He's now loaned out to Espanyol from the 31st of January of the current game year so hopefully he'll start to play some decent football. I bought Xadas as well but my preference for club grown talent meant that he found himself on the bench a lot of the time and eventually asked for a transfer. Don't forget to have a look at Joao Carvalho. He's a pretty great wide playmaker in my game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 25, 2018 Author Share Posted July 25, 2018 4 minutes ago, wereldbol said: Yes, I mean to type Joao Felipe, he's my winger. Dantas is probably one of the oldest players in my B team. He's not bad but I have many better options and players like Tiago and Cardoso have come through the academy to far surpass him. Also, he has a determination attribute of 4 and he refused to be tutored when he was still young. Joao Felix is probably on par with Felipe in my pecking order and has so far notched up 6 goals and 10 assists in the league and we're only in January. However, I like the pace Felipe has and he offers something different down the wing. Both are interchangeable depending on the way I want to approach the following game. Umaro Embalo is probably my biggest regret and/or disappointment. I had high hopes for him and at one time I think he had an acceleration rating of 20. But unfortunately I just couldn't get him to perform and then Chelsea came in with a £25m bid and I had to accept. He's now loaned out to Espanyol from the 31st of January of the current game year so hopefully he'll start to play some decent football. I bought Xadas as well but my preference for club grown talent meant that he found himself on the bench a lot of the time and eventually asked for a transfer. Don't forget to have a look at Joao Carvalho. He's a pretty great wide playmaker in my game. I'm a sucker for a two-footed wide player. I think it's so valuable to be able to beat a defender with either foot and then shoot on the inside foot or cross on the outside foot. Interesting you mention Carvalho. Carvalho, Ze Gomes and Nuno Santos are doing very well for the B Team and Horta and Rodrigues are both performing well on loan. Next season is going to be a headache. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wereldbol Posted July 25, 2018 Share Posted July 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said: I'm a sucker for a two-footed wide player. I think it's so valuable to be able to beat a defender with either foot and then shoot on the inside foot or cross on the outside foot. Interesting you mention Carvalho. Carvalho, Ze Gomes and Nuno Santos are doing very well for the B Team and Horta and Rodrigues are both performing well on loan. Next season is going to be a headache. Exactly why I decided to sell Embalo. He's very left footed, has a poor off the ball attribute of 11 and has the player preferred moves of 'runs with ball often' and 'runs with ball down the left'. He's extremely one-dimensional and whenever I gave him the nod over Felipe he preformed less. It hurt my left side. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 25, 2018 Author Share Posted July 25, 2018 23 minutes ago, wereldbol said: Exactly why I decided to sell Embalo. He's very left footed, has a poor off the ball attribute of 11 and has the player preferred moves of 'runs with ball often' and 'runs with ball down the left'. He's extremely one-dimensional and whenever I gave him the nod over Felipe he preformed less. It hurt my left side. Bare in mind he is 16 at the start of the game! Plenty of time to turn him into a more well-rounded player, but yes, left foot only does need work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anuth Posted July 25, 2018 Share Posted July 25, 2018 @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! What if my potential tutor has a good personality but less determination than tutee, you still use him ? Ex. I want to ask Toprak who is Fairly Professional with Det 11 to tutor Zakadou who is Fairly Ambitious with 12 Det. Is it a good idea? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Posted July 25, 2018 Author Share Posted July 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Anuth said: @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! What if my potential tutor has a good personality but less determination than tutee, you still use him ? Ex. I want to ask Toprak who is Fairly Professional with Det 11 to tutor Zakadou who is Fairly Ambitious with 12 Det. Is it a good idea? Meh. You're not getting much out of that tutoring, unless you're getting some advantageous traits. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westy8chimp Posted July 25, 2018 Share Posted July 25, 2018 16 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said: Knowing what I'm doing is a strong term! The honest answer is I am not 100% sure. I am working with the same interface as anyone else, and it's not clear. The interface shows Retain Possession as a means of shortening passing without reducing tempo. I have never observed either - Retain Possession or Pass into Space - change an individual player's Passing Risk. This combination came about after adding Retain Possession to a more attacking system - after observing too many long shots - and later adding Pass into Space in an attempt to get players in behind. I've always liked what I've seen in the match engine and the majority of goals come from a through ball either direct assist or key pass. In fact, high tempo, short passing, retain possession and passing into space produced the best football I have seen in a long time in a Napoli save. Sorry I cannot give a more informed answer! I enjoyed reading this response. Some of the tactical decisions I've made in my Leverkusen series simply look awful on paper... but the game, like real life, isn't played on paper. We can only guess or assume how all the calculations are made in the ME and sometimes you just try something and it works how you intended, without necessarily making theoretical sense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
herne79 Posted July 25, 2018 Share Posted July 25, 2018 On 24/07/2018 at 02:23, Pass and Move said: Cracked open the editor to look at this and changing a CB's sweeper rating from 1 to 15 brought his 'recommended current ability' (I have no idea what this means) up by 2 but did not change his CA. It means the impact on CA of training a player into a new position isn't always as big as people think. In this instance the impact on your player's CA of improving his Sweeper rating from 1 to 15 would be just 2. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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