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Pompey_Dan

A 4-3-1-2 inspired by Marco Giampaolo

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Great read. :thup: Very well written.

I read that ESDF article a little while back and found the full backs staying back to build possession intriguing, as it's the opposite of how most teams go about it these days.

Good luck for your season.

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Great ideas! 

Good luck with your save, and I am looking for more.

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40 minutes ago, Southern Buddie said:

This has the potential to be the best thread I've read this  version.

There's stiff competition, but I'll be following with interest. 4312 was my favourite formation in FM17 but I've struggled to get it working as well this year. Even though the new roles (mezzala, carrilero) should - in theory - make it easier.

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Good luck with the tactic and really great thread. I can't wait for more.

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I'm looking forward to this thread. I really like the idea of wing backs of defend duty, I should try that myself as an 4312 enthusiast. Can I ask you what is the reasoning behind the DLP having move into channels PI?

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Having just read the following articles I was eager to try and get this translated into fm19 and stumbled across this thread which was a touch. 

 

I've just taken over Sampdoria after they were relegated and thought it'd be nice to get them back on track by going back to what's working for them irl. 

 

I highly doubt I'll be able to get it working as I don't have Scooby what I'm doing. (Serial plug and play downloader) but this has defo given me a good base to work from. 

First thing that did spring to mind though was using carrileros instead of Mezzalas although seeing your example using the Mez above Im not to sure now. 

 

Anyway the aforementioned articles that led me here.. 

 

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://totalfootballanalysis.com/head-coach-analysis/marco-giampaolo-sampdoria-tactical-analysis/amp&ved=2ahUKEwiO28yGl5ThAhWLXRUIHYfpAM0QFjAEegQIBBAB&usg=AOvVaw3ITHrTQvZ-gjsauUm2ypx6&ampcf=1&cshid=1553208083331

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://totalfootballanalysis.com/head-coach-analysis/tactical-and-recruitment-analysis-long-read-the-sampdoria-model/amp&ved=2ahUKEwiO28yGl5ThAhWLXRUIHYfpAM0QFjAFegQIBRAB&usg=AOvVaw3EQ0Lcs_oG2htcbMrfrIbM&ampcf=1&cshid=1553208083331

 

Oh and a good old Tifo video.. 

 

 

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One nice thing about this is that a simple change of roles on the fullbacks can increase the aggression of the tactic when you need a goal. You really only need about 5 positions as well, so squad building and covering for injuries becomes easier.

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Posted (edited)

 

 

What I've got together so far.

1987225817_Screenshot2019-03-23at00_36_12.thumb.png.1cf3a678e7ee57ad8329fbab198bd370.png

The only player instructions I've got are

  • DLP - Direct passing, It was Torreira's job to play penetrating passes forward.
  • Wingbacks - Sit Narrow as I want to keep it nice and solid line at the back
  • AM - Take more risks, Moves into channels, He's the man I'm relying on for my creativity on the most part so im hoping he'll get into spaces and play the front men in
  • ST - Got them both to close down more

 

The only two competitive games I've played so far 

The goal I conceded was a pen so im not to worried about that

175005739_Screenshot2019-03-23at00_49_00.thumb.png.5ef07db5b6c3fd301f5ec295911aaba6.png

Not the worst result all things considered.

1383746459_Screenshot2019-03-23at00_49_09.thumb.png.7f1ddcccbd5374994f5e309d0d75615b.png

 

As you can see in both games though the strikers are pretty much nonexistent 

im fairly happy with it so far. Hopefully someone far more knowledgeable than me will be able to improve it though.

4-3-1-2 Narrow - Custom .fmf

Edited by Sinbad7104
More info

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@Sinbad7104 how have you progressed with your tactic? I've used the same resources you posted (I previously read the ones @Pompey_Dan shared so they probably influenced me too) and came up with this:

547085079_Screenshot2019-03-29at00_35_40.thumb.png.f348fab9457e57cae76c2b38256e9363.png

DR / DL - Sit Narrower

AMC - Take More Risks / Close Down More

STCR - Close Down More

STCL - Close Down More

Unsurprisingly, outside of the shape there are similarities between our tactics. I have Quagliarella on Attack as I want to get a 20-goal season out of him and support strikers have very low mentalities I'd worry he'd be too much of a provider. I also haven't touched defensive / attacking shape as I figured its a naturally narrow formation anyway - just telling the wing backs to tuck in should leave us very compact. 

I've only played 2 games so far - a 3-1 win at home against Benevento in the cup and them completely controlled a 0-0 draw against Lazio at the Olimpico. Given they played a 343 with 3 strikers I was pleased we were able to play through / around their press (I do key highlights and there weren't many). 

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I haven't actually continued with it as it was stressing me out a bit. I can feel myself boring of my current save though so I'll probably carry on again soon. 

Be good to see how you get on though. 

 

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My imitation appears to be slightly too accurate...in real life after 28 games Sampdoria are 9th, in-game after 11 games we're 10th.

Going off the Serie A website, these are the only stats I can accurately compare (their "assist" appears to be "chances created" but I don't how they're calculated compared to FM)

Goals: real life - 5th, game - 5th

Shots on target: real life - 9th, game - 10th

Cross completed: real life - 19th, game - 18th

I can't find possession but FM calculates it different to the likes of Opta - anyway I'm averaging 61%. I haven't gotten Quagliarella's production like real-life, but then again his 11-game run started match day 10, I've just completed match day 11 so plenty of time and he is my top scorer so far (1 pen, 1 fk, 4 open play)

 

 

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9 minutes ago, zlatanera said:

My imitation appears to be slightly too accurate...in real life after 28 games Sampdoria are 9th, in-game after 11 games we're 10th.

Going off the Serie A website, these are the only stats I can accurately compare (their "assist" appears to be "chances created" but I don't how they're calculated compared to FM)

Goals: real life - 5th, game - 5th

Shots on target: real life - 9th, game - 10th

Cross completed: real life - 19th, game - 18th

I can't find possession but FM calculates it different to the likes of Opta - anyway I'm averaging 61%. I haven't gotten Quagliarella's production like real-life, but then again his 11-game run started match day 10, I've just completed match day 11 so plenty of time and he is my top scorer so far (1 pen, 1 fk, 4 open play)

 

 

Brilliant. 

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Posted (edited)
On 30/03/2019 at 00:56, zlatanera said:

My imitation appears to be slightly too accurate...in real life after 28 games Sampdoria are 9th, in-game after 11 games we're 10th.

Going off the Serie A website, these are the only stats I can accurately compare (their "assist" appears to be "chances created" but I don't how they're calculated compared to FM)

Goals: real life - 5th, game - 5th

Shots on target: real life - 9th, game - 10th

Cross completed: real life - 19th, game - 18th

I can't find possession but FM calculates it different to the likes of Opta - anyway I'm averaging 61%. I haven't gotten Quagliarella's production like real-life, but then again his 11-game run started match day 10, I've just completed match day 11 so plenty of time and he is my top scorer so far (1 pen, 1 fk, 4 open play)

 

 

So I lost my appetite for this save, but I pushed myself to play 29 games and compare myself with real life Samp.

Points: real life - 45 (7th, level with 8th and 9th, game - 48 (7th, level with 6th). incidentally both in real life and my game Torino are level on points with Sampdoria: irl Samp lead, in-game Torino lead.

I could definitely win more by having more aggressive WBs and more conservative CMs given there is perceived to be a slight boost to the effectiveness of crosses vs. passes in-game compared to real life, but that's not the point so lets look at some more stats (not all of Serie A's stats are directly comparable, in particular they weirdly show the average amount of time spent in possession per game rather than a %. Sampdoria average around 28 minutes).

Goals: real life - 5th (50), game - 4th (44)

Shots on target: real life - 8th (159), game - 9th (174)

Cross completed: real life - 19th (136), game - 19th (119)

Conceded: real life - 8th best (38), game - 5th best (29)

We have the best pass completion ratio, (80%) and most passes completed (over 3,000 more than Napoli in 2nd).

Despite no instruction, we're 19th for dribbles too which further shows our pass-first way of playing. 

We occasionally get some beautiful goals where the DLP and two CDs have deep possession before it finds its way to a MEZ, then the AM and either a striker or a wing back to cross for the other striker to finish. 

Other than a 4-0 hammering by Inter in the cup we've only lost by 1 goal margins.

 

I'm calling this a success! 

Edited by zlatanera

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Why choose wingbacks on automatic and not support? Do they not revert to support when the mentality is set to balanced?

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3 hours ago, nick1408 said:

Why choose wingbacks on automatic and not support? Do they not revert to support when the mentality is set to balanced?

Yes, their mentality is the same. But the difference is in the hard-selected PIs.

WB-Su: Run Wide WIth Ball, Get Further Forward

WB-Au: Run Wide With Ball

The reason most people have been using WB-De in this replication attempt is because there's no way Giampaolo has "Get Further Forward" on his full backs. But they still do provide situational width, so I think Run Wide With Ball is appropriate, combined with Sit Narrower when out of possession. WB-De is just too defensive, WB-Su has an unwanted PI therefore WB-Au on Balanced is the most appropriate choice for me.

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1 hour ago, zlatanera said:

WB-De is just too defensive, WB-Su has an unwanted PI therefore WB-Au on Balanced is the most appropriate choice for me.

That's some pretty smart analysis right there :thup:

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1 hour ago, warlock said:

That's some pretty smart analysis right there :thup:

I normally overlook Automatic roles, as I tend to play on Balanced where they are all basically Support, or quite extreme Attacking or higher using a bunch of specialist roles. WB-Au is the only one that has different instructions from the Support role. 

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