knap Posted July 10, 2018 Author Share Posted July 10, 2018 Run out of Space in OP. Should be this table Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KelevraOne Posted July 11, 2018 Share Posted July 11, 2018 in tactic 352 is it possible to change the role of the 2 CM-A to AP-S / A ? Would the tactics lose much effectiveness ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveyisatard Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 13 hours ago, KelevraOne said: in tactic 352 is it possible to change the role of the 2 CM-A to AP-S / A ? Would the tactics lose much effectiveness ? Change it, test it, post results. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshLCFC Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 On 10/07/2018 at 22:57, knap said: Run out of Space in OP. Should be this table For which tactic? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 12, 2018 Author Share Posted July 12, 2018 England box, although did not work that well last night. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eflakbogdanbeyi Posted July 12, 2018 Share Posted July 12, 2018 On 07.07.2018 at 16:47, knap said: Belgium type 343 Volante !FM18.3.4DARKSIDEKOFMOON343volnapMUP103.fmf What do you think this tactic with one striker and 2 IFs? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 12, 2018 Author Share Posted July 12, 2018 Overview of Tactic List from testing TOTAL SUB TOP UNDERDOG ARGUS FM 18.2.2 P102 P385 P206 P179 PILGRIMAGE FM 18.3.3 LPOOL P104 P380 P226 P154 WOF FM 18.3.3 P101 Flexible P381 P213 P168 WOF FM 18.3.3 LPOOL P100 ALL CUPS P365 P196 P169 PILGRIMAGE Fluid LPOOL P101 P367 P201 P166 PILGRIMAGE FM 18.2 P105 P357 P218 P139 ARGUS VOL 4 FM18.3.3 Structured P101 ALL CUPS P363 P220 P143 BLUE MATTER FM 18.3.3 P105 P356 P207 P149 GOODBYE FM 18.3 VOL 7 Very Fluid P349 P208 P141 GOODBYE 3421 P324 P205 P119 MIDSOMER 442 P103 (FLAT TEST) P349 P199 P150 MIDSOMER 442 VOL MEZ P342 P196 P146 MIDSOMER 343 VOL MEZ P337 P195 P142 WOF 2323 FM 18 P104 P335 P187 P148 BLUE MATTER FM 18.3 VOL 4 P102 352 P335 P206 P129 ASH 343 19,3.3 LPOOLP99 Highly Structured P333 P205 P128 ARGUS 3430 P331 P192 P139 VOLANTE BWM FM 18.3 P101 P326 P191 P135 MM 442 VOLANTE P103 P323 P187 P136 WOF 3412 P325 P198 P127 WOF 2233 P102HS FM 18.2 P311 P194 P117 BLUE MATTER VOL 4 P100 4123 FM 18.2.1 P310 P179 -P131 MMVOLANTEANCHOR 442 P302 P165 P127 ARGUS 352 18.2,2 P101 P306 P169 P137 BLUE MATTER 433 18.3 P295 P158 P137 BLUE MATTER VOL 4 4213 VOLANTE 18.3 P289 P184 P105 PILGRIMAGE 3511 18.2.2 P102 P297 P181 P116 PILGRIMAGE 451 MUP101 18.3.3 P293 P169 P124 MIDSOMER WIDE DIAMOND 18.3 P287 P175 P112 RAMBLE ON ASYMMETRIC18,3 P100 P287 P169 P118 RAW SIENNA 4231 18,2,2 P272 P147 P125 As soon as you add IFs to the mix the tactic efficiency will drop, so you need a better team and work harder to get results. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dinmor Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Hi knap, love your tactics. Do you have any recommendations for PPMs for the 3-4-3 and the 3-5-2? I, like some others, are also interested on your take of a SUS version of the 3-4-3 or 3-5-2. Kind regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 13, 2018 Author Share Posted July 13, 2018 Movement and passing PPMs. The marmite is the tries to beat offside. SUS is vey simple dropping to a lower mentality ( contain for full SUS) and changing WBs to more defensive. The TC adjusts the TIs which is why it is easy to try different mentalities. However going defensive can allow pressure so sometimes if you have upper hand it is not always a good idea using a SUS.It all depends on how much you want to game manage. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumaca09 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Knap I want to use one of your narrow 4-3-3 tactics with Man City. Would you use this one or Bluematter ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 13, 2018 Author Share Posted July 13, 2018 These are untested atm so can't compare with BM 433. I just won PL with MC with PILGRIMAGE 4231 sub top P151so BM 433 should work although best results would be with PILGRIMAGE 343. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumaca09 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Thank you Knap Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 14, 2018 Author Share Posted July 14, 2018 The Dark Side 433 works well with MC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumaca09 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 1 hour ago, knap said: The Dark Side 433 works well with MC Good work Knap Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fumaca09 Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 17 hours ago, knap said: These are untested atm so can't compare with BM 433. I just won PL with MC with PILGRIMAGE 4231 sub top P151so BM 433 should work although best results would be with PILGRIMAGE 343. Which position did you play KDB in the 4-2-3-1 ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 14, 2018 Author Share Posted July 14, 2018 Usually right MC with the ENG BOX both Silva and KDB can play AMC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilmalm Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 Hi @knap, not sure if this is the right place to ask. But. I will go on a long term save with one of your tactics, either one of the 3421´s or the 4123 with IF. Wich one would you recommend? Thanks in advance Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 15, 2018 Author Share Posted July 15, 2018 It depends on the type of player positions you prefer. The 3421 or England Box are for if you prefer AMCs but in general 3 at back is the better defensive set up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilmalm Posted July 15, 2018 Share Posted July 15, 2018 25 minutes ago, knap said: It depends on the type of player positions you prefer. The 3421 or England Box are for if you prefer AMCs but in general 3 at back is the better defensive set up. I do prefer winger/IF instead of 2 AMC´s. The same goes with the 4123., two winger/IFs instead of 3 at the top. Looking for a tactic that i can use from lower leagues, and bulding a squad/academy around and use on my way up Thanks! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFanatikz Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 Hi knap (or any other forum member that has reasonable suggestions) I have a quick inquiry as to which one of your many brilliant tactics to use. I have recently taken over the Barcelona job on my current save as it is a step up and a tough challenge as they require instant success yet i have no budget to work with and an ageing squad. I want to use a 4-4-2 formation as this is my all time favourite and i just don't like the current modern formations. Which one of your 4-4-2 formations would you recommend for an attacking, possession based game which the board is adamant i play? I would like to use and attacking home formation and a slightly less attacking away and for big games if possible. Thanks for all the great work you do! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 16, 2018 Author Share Posted July 16, 2018 In past FMs winning tactics tended to have high possession. However this year it is mostly the opposite. 442 Route 66 should work with Barca MIDSOMER P103 442 would be an attacking 442 but may lack possession. However, this can also be used on counter which would increase possession. I would therefore try this tactic and change mentality to increase possession if needed. This would also give you an away tactic. I played this game the other day and even with the AI Barca does not have possession. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFanatikz Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 39 minutes ago, knap said: In past FMs winning tactics tended to have high possession. However this year it is mostly the opposite. 442 Route 66 should work with Barca MIDSOMER P103 442 would be an attacking 442 but may lack possession. However, this can also be used on counter which would increase possession. I would therefore try this tactic and change mentality to increase possession if needed. This would also give you an away tactic. I played this game the other day and even with the AI Barca does not have possession. Thanks for your input, it's much appreciated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 16, 2018 Author Share Posted July 16, 2018 I decided to change to the updated MU squad and test the 442. Basically same result Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
huseyinbayram19 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 " !FM18.3.4DARKSIDEKOFMOON343napMUP106.fmf " Is there a player filter for this tactic? you would be better off if you prefer the player in which positions to get efficiency from the players. Great tactic, by the way. Fenerbahçe and first-time champion and I have reached the finals in UEFA European League. I use translate because I do not have English. @knap Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 19, 2018 Author Share Posted July 19, 2018 I use attribute masking and Scout Reports rather than Player Filters. Different types of players bring their own uniqueness to a position and can change a game rather than just relying on a specific type of player. With injuries and smaller squads in LL you need to be able make do rather than have total efficiency, even if this could be defined Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruudvanwarren Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 Hey Knap...I find your "ALL CUPS" tactics really stable and reliable away from home...could their be a dark side of the moon all cups tactic created at all? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 19, 2018 Author Share Posted July 19, 2018 pietroaps has been working on a 4231 tactic with wingers based on MIDSOMER. I have just tweaked this and there is now a p100 ALL CUPS version and a P101version. May be interesting to put to the test which is better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruudvanwarren Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 11 minutes ago, knap said: pietroaps has been working on a 4231 tactic with wingers based on MIDSOMER. I have just tweaked this and there is now a p100 ALL CUPS version and a P101version. May be interesting to put to the test which is better. Currently using Pligrimage 108pts all cups away. Would gladly put one of them to a test. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smogfart Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 31 minutes ago, knap said: pietroaps has been working on a 4231 tactic with wingers based on MIDSOMER. I have just tweaked this and there is now a p100 ALL CUPS version and a P101version. May be interesting to put to the test which is better. Would love to see this, been trying to tweak your 4231 to use wingers instead of IF’s Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 19, 2018 Author Share Posted July 19, 2018 Works well with top sides. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smogfart Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 On 19/07/2018 at 20:04, knap said: pietroaps has been working on a 4231 tactic with wingers based on MIDSOMER. I have just tweaked this and there is now a p100 ALL CUPS version and a P101version. May be interesting to put to the test which is better. Any news on these tactics? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 21, 2018 Author Share Posted July 21, 2018 Not sure if Pietroaps has finished testing. The versions I did are I've finished testing - either an ALL CUPS version or P101. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnysarg Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 I’m currently using Argus is that still your top tactic or is one of these better ?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 21, 2018 Author Share Posted July 21, 2018 Testing has stopped so these tactics have not been tested. ARGUS for under dog and PILGRIMAGE for sub would be difficult to beat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pietroaps Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 Hi all. I have discussed privately my modest changes on knap's tactics with the author himself over the last few weeks. I consider the tactics his, and have been very wary of publishing anything. I commend him for the quality and dedication of his work. My concept in FM has been to try to push forward the 4231 model, with the concept that you can adapt pretty much every player/position into the tactic, including lateral attacking midfielders. However, you all know 1 striker formations have been very challenging this year. To me, the central attacking midfielder is not intended to be a "number 10" (in my opinion, as of 2018 that role does not translate too well onto the pitch against cultured defensive midfielders), or to serve an offensive organizer, but rather use the position to retain defensive midfielders in defensive movement and create overlaps with the other ofensive positions, to create but also to finish. The 4231 shape is therefore easily ("fluidly") volatile, and I have applied the name CHIMERA to these tactics, as they mimic, at times, shapes of 442/4222, 433/451, and even 23131. You can check the previous iterations on mrL tactics forum searching for "chimera". They were based mostly on knap's WOF principles - paused, intelligent, offensive play probing through the middle with overlaps. The football played is quite beautiful to watch and the results of the tactics were interesting as a whole, as they qualified among the best 4231s (~55), even though with competitive limitations. Midsomer 442 is somewhat an anomaly. Outside of 3 striker formations, and along with its "cousin" VOLMEZ, it is clearly the best tactic to come out this year. It is very offensive on the perimeter, and the two F9 (support), along with a stable centre midfield, create a functional network along the pitch and a sea of potential finishers. Furthermore, with closer lines and the slightly higher defensive line, its so compact that the defensive disadvantage is lost. If you like to play 2 striker, stop here :). Midsomer Chimera is simply: 1. pushing ahead the wingmen to wingers: I was reluctant at first as you lose defensive positioning and they cannot close inside, but they offer the verticality and the crossing; in my opinion, one of the problems with IFs AND the CAM position on the same tactic is that they become redundant and dysfunctional, particularly in narrow formations (that's why 451 formations work better in that aspect); with the wingers on narrow, they are not that outside (inside game) but flow into vertical outside channels, and frequently come inside to finish (more if the PPM/preferred foot says so). 2. 1 F9 and 1 CAM on attack: this setup is worse defensively, as they fall on the same space, but offensively they work very well. The result is a very offensively effective formation, that can be brutally overwhelming if you are the same level / better squad. By definition, it can be exposed easily if you are not. You can see on my Milan save (average PA 167, two formations on full rotation game in, game out) - that's when i suggested this might be an ok tactic. In response to knap (I'm very happy he decided to try it), I actually started some tests, but I would like others to try it, if possible, as I lack time. I always feel knap could improve these. You can find attached the first test I did, with MU on holiday (I know it's a bogus method, but it is what it is) and the first games of my Arsenal save (not significant, as I'm sure I will encounter problems as I play away to the big 6). Please feel free to comment. Midsomer Chimera.fmf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pietroaps Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 (Included CA/PA so you know it's really poor flawed Arsenal - I like them, though...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pietroaps Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 Knap, if you feel this deserves its own thread I can migrate this info there (I was just replying). Thank you all for your time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 21, 2018 Author Share Posted July 21, 2018 I would start a new thread with your information. Actually your original tactic did better than in your test. I will post my results in your thread once opened Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pietroaps Posted July 21, 2018 Share Posted July 21, 2018 I will take care of it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Novem9 Posted July 22, 2018 Share Posted July 22, 2018 Has anyone played 4231? (which with 2 DLP's) How it works in subtop? Who scores goles? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fribbe Posted July 22, 2018 Share Posted July 22, 2018 1 hour ago, Novem9 said: Has anyone played 4231? (which with 2 DLP's) How it works in subtop? Who scores goles? It's been good so far for me at Lyon. Most goals come from the striker, the inside forward and the AMC. Most assists from winger and inside forward. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Novem9 Posted July 22, 2018 Share Posted July 22, 2018 1 час назад, Fribbe сказал: It's been good so far for me at Lyon. Most goals come from the striker, the inside forward and the AMC. Most assists from winger and inside forward. Do you check left foot for inside and right foot for winger or this no matter there? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fribbe Posted July 25, 2018 Share Posted July 25, 2018 Using the 4-2-3-1 with Lyon. Finished 2nd in the league but won the EL, Coupe de France and Coupe de la Ligue. Doing a french player only save, so here's my transfer history. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corei Posted July 25, 2018 Share Posted July 25, 2018 Any news with 451 formation? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 25, 2018 Author Share Posted July 25, 2018 Pilgrimage or ARGUS. I am not working on a DARK SIDE 451. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DenzelSeyssens Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 Would the 352 work if you drop the DLP to a DLP in a DM pos? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
knap Posted July 31, 2018 Author Share Posted July 31, 2018 It changes the structure of the tactic so may or may not work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DenzelSeyssens Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 Will give it a go, ill let you know Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DenzelSeyssens Posted July 31, 2018 Share Posted July 31, 2018 DARK SIDE OF MOON 352 TEST 1 Knocked out of CL first knockout stage Won PL, Europe SC, FA cup and Carabao cup. DARK SIDE OF MOON 352 TEST 2 with deeper DLP Won PL, Europe SC, FA cup and Carabao cup and CL. Very happy with the result. Thanks for the tactic my man! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie09 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 This tactic is working wonders for my Academy save Thanks Knap Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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