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Iran v Spain - Wed 20th June (1900 BST, 1800 GMT, 2100 MSK, 2000 CEST, 2230 TEH)

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Spain didn't look good at the back, especially in the second half. Iran managed to create 3-4 good chances. 

Draw would have been the fairest result based on chances created imo. 

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Imagine qualifying for the knockouts by the 'fair play' tiebreaker.

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29 minutes ago, GunmaN1905 said:

Taglia retired.

Weird, because I remeber you saying about how referees are doing a worse job because of it and make too many unnecessary reviews and that it should be implemented in a better way. And I actually agreed with you for once.

That's someone else. Referees are as bad as I can remember - I say that a lot. But it's not because of VAR, and I never blame VAR for that, it is just because they suck.

Dont think I've said anything about unnecessary reviews either. It's not perfect and needs improvement obviously, but I like how it worked in Serie A. And I like how it's going at the World Cup. The unnecessary reviews are just because refs aren't experienced with it, so you'll get these idiot refs reviewing everything, like in that Tottenham FA Cup replay.

What I did say is that there needs to be more transparency over what isn't reviewed, and why. Particularly those silent checks in Serie A - that needs to be more open

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1 minute ago, git2thachoppa said:

Yeah, abandon the game plan that's given Iran their best ever results in a 4-year period in their entire history so they can get destroyed by Spain 3-0.

Queiroz you would have done better if you managed the team during the game instead of posting on here!

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Iran are similar to Morocco, maybe slightly better. There is no end product. Put up a good fight though.

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IT WASN'T VAR YOU MELTS

Jesus. Linesman thinking "I probs deserve some credit, yeah?"

Edited by ginnybob

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2 minutes ago, Sid1984 said:

Iran are similar to Morocco, maybe slightly better. There is no end product. Put up a good fight though.

This attack will all reach peak age in Qatar, plus it'll probably be a slightly familiar location. It's exciting to imagine what'll happen then, with an easier draw hopefully.

Edited by git2thachoppa

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6 minutes ago, git2thachoppa said:

Yeah, abandon the game plan that's given Iran their best ever results in a 4-year period in their entire history so they can get destroyed by Spain 3-0.

Not gung ho, but at least take their game to their opponent.

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Brazilian TV loved the Iranian female fans.

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The highlight of the WC so far is Roy Keane resisting the temptation to smash up the ITV studio.

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Just now, georginho_juventusygr said:

Not gung ho, but at least take their game to their opponent.

Iran adopted the right strategy, they only conceded once, with a bit of luck they could have not conceded at all, and maybe score once too.

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2 minutes ago, grff said:

The highlight of the WC so far is Roy Keane resisting the temptation to smash up the ITV studio.

I watched ITV stream the other day and he was visibly annoyed by Bilić because Slaven touched him every time he was trying to make a point.

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1 minute ago, grff said:

The highlight of the WC so far is Roy Keane resisting the temptation to smash up the ITV studio.

He was getting seriously pissed off with Bilic the other day when he kept touching him on the shoulder and chest whenever he made a point. Was brilliant viewing. 

Did make me laugh to see them separated for tonight's game by Ian Wright. 

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1 minute ago, PMLF said:

Iran adopted the right strategy, they only conceded once, with a bit of luck they could have not conceded at all, and maybe score once too.

You have to admit when they took the shackles off they looked so much better, sure if they played like that the entire game maybe they would have gotten beaten 3-0, or maybe they would have got a goal or 2, they certainly had chances once they started to play.

No need to be so negative from the very start, sure be defensive but having every player withing 20 yards of your goal from 10 minutes on wards is ridiculous. 

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6 minutes ago, georginho_juventusygr said:

Not gung ho, but at least take their game to their opponent.

That's what they do. In the first half they give the favourites possession in ineffective areas, so that they gradually commit everyone forward, then they break. In the second half, as the attackers feel like it's only a matter of time, that's when more attacks come.

It's all playing percentages. If a ball is knocked forward but they don't have the advantage, they reset. It means fewer chances but (as we still saw), they're huge 2 or 3 chances.

And they're up against one of the World Cup favourites. A team who only just kept their 2nd clean sheet and got their 2nd ever win in only their 4th World Cup in about 70 years.

If it had been an Iranian manager, they might not have even qualified and they'd just play like Saudi Arabia. Instead they went up against the might of Spain and 2014 Argentina and lost 1-0, with a disallowed goal and a missed stonewall penalty call. Iran. IRAN did this.

 

Edited by git2thachoppa

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1 minute ago, daylight said:

You have to admit when they took the shackles off they looked so much better, sure if they played like that the entire game maybe they would have gotten beaten 3-0, or maybe they would have got a goal or 2, they certainly had chances once they started to play.

No need to be so negative from the very start, sure be defensive but having every player withing 20 yards of your goal from 10 minutes on wards is ridiculous. 

They looked better but they had nothing to lose at that point. It would have been different if the score was still 0-0.

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Just now, PMLF said:

They looked better but they had nothing to lose at that point. It would have been different if the score was still 0-0.

It looked like they could play, we'll never know now.

Maybe they could have even caught Spain off guard and got an early goal, like I said though, we'll never know.
Will be glad to see them gone though and not only for those bloody noise makers from the supporters, I thought 2010 was the last time I muted a TV for football.

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4 minutes ago, enigmatic said:

People say Iran were dull, but I could watch this for hours...

 

A Brazilian player did this in the Women's U20 World Cup in 2008:

 

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Roy keane should always be one of the 3 pundits, he is absolute tv gold. When he was talking about kicking 3 players over the line to score if you had to or something to that effect it was brilliant especially the reaction when he said it :D

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49 minutes ago, daylight said:

kissing the ball and praying for a great throw and that's the answer he got, it's official guys, there is no God.

Or there is a god and he just hates Iran.

48 minutes ago, G-Man11 said:

I think the weaker teams have simply got a lot more organised in the last 20 years. They may not have much more talent than before but they are better conditioned, coached and capable of playing solid defensive football.

Doesn't help that nobody seems to have managed to score early yet in this tournament against a defensive minnow.

The reason I loved tournaments like 94 though is that you had unfancied teams playing really good football and going far in the tournament. Hagi and Stoichkov are two of my all time favourite players because of USA 94. This tournament is full of boring, functional teams with no sense of showmanship like those Romanian and Bulgarian sides that fascinated me as a 14 year old.

The teams of a similar level now like Denmark, Sweden, Uruguay etc are just so turgid and dull to watch. 

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9 minutes ago, Weezer said:

The reason I loved tournaments like 94 though is that you had unfancied teams playing really good football and going far in the tournament. Hagi and Stoichkov are two of my all time favourite players because of USA 94. This tournament is full of boring, functional teams with no sense of showmanship like those Romanian and Bulgarian sides that fascinated me as a 14 year old.

The teams of a similar level now like Denmark, Sweden, Uruguay etc are just so turgid and dull to watch. 

The thing is, if those Romanian and Bulgarian sides were playing today, they would also be turgid or else wouldn't qualify at all.

I grew up watching Portugal outplay everyone with Fernando Couto, Paulo Sousa, Rui Costa, João Pinto and Figo and end up losing all the time to a late penalty or corner kick after hitting the post 3 times. Lost to USA and South Korea in '02 with all that talent. Couldn't even qualify in '98. Would be even worse today. Football evolved, weaker teams are now well drilled and learned how to defend and counter (nobody likes to lose), so the stronger teams need to be more wary as well. There is less space for showmanship in the teams, and less space for pure flamboyant players.

If you liked Hagi, I suggest you watch Colombian Juan Quintero closely, and afterwards ponder why his career isn't going anywhere. Had he been born 30 years earlier he would now be remembered as a Colombian god.

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if you call playing 10 men in your own third of the pitch for 90 minutes an "evolving of football" then i hope they fold the sport now and let us remember the good times.

its nothing but a miserable mindset looking to spoil the game

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8 minutes ago, bestbrother said:

its nothing but a miserable mindset looking to spoil the game

Spoil the game?

Entertainment is a subjective term.

To me, this game was far more entertaining than it would be if Spain won 5-0.

Yeah, I would prefer a close game with 5+ goals, but unfortunately that can't happen every game.

But I'll always take a close game over some battering that was predicted tonight.

If Iran had 3-4 players that are worth 50mil€ each, I'm sure they would try and play offensively.

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8 minutes ago, bestbrother said:

if you call playing 10 men in your own third of the pitch for 90 minutes an "evolving of football" then i hope they fold the sport now and let us remember the good times.

its nothing but a miserable mindset looking to spoil the game

From one side you have a team with players from Real Madrid, Barcelona, Utd and City. From the other side, players from Persepolis, Al Sadd and Esteghlal. This was not a match between two teams from the same league like we usually watch every week. Play with "showmanship" like the "good times" and get thumped 6-1. No one likes to get thumped.

Same story with Iceland, '04 Greece and all the "weaker" teams that are somewhat successful, that's the only way they can be competitive against better players. Get used to it, or don't.

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11 minutes ago, GunmaN1905 said:

Spoil the game?

Entertainment is a subjective term.

To me, this game was far more entertaining than it would be if Spain won 5-0.

Yeah, I would prefer a close game with 5+ goals, but unfortunately that can't happen every game.

But I'll always take a close game over some battering that was predicted tonight.

If Iran had 3-4 players that are worth 50mil€ each, I'm sure they would try and play offensively.

anyone can sit 10 in. if this was how domestic football played out... there would be an outcry.

its a world cup... have a go... they lost by being negative... who knows what would happen if they put spain on the backfoot more.

peru had a little pop, they lost but i remember them more than i will iran arabia egypt etc

it is subjective but so far the football has been dross because teams are coming here to stop football not play football.

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Agree. I'm a purist though. 

I just don't get why some teams are so defeatist. No one says Iran has to match Spain but there's no excuse for parking the bus instead of playing on the counter when you see how easily Spain were threatened. It's pathetic.

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As I wrote during the game nations like Iceland, Iran and such are lucky to qualify once in every 3-4 World Cups.

They don't want to waste that chance by playing offensively against Spain, that would certainly end in a loss by 3-4 goals.

There wouldn't be an outcry if domestic football was played that way because those teams would certainly get relegated.

In group stage, there's only 3 games and you can go through by defending well and scoring some fluke goals.

Hell, even mighty Spain from 2010 was stopping football and it was incredibly dull to watch.

8 goals in 7 games. They would score the one and park a reverse bus. As in defending by not risking possession at all.
You can talk about number of passes and passing accuracy all you want, but as soon as they went up they would show no initiative to actually score by risking anything.
They wouldn't even take many risks while it was 0-0.

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Just now, GunmaN1905 said:

As I wrote during the game nations like Iceland, Iran and such are lucky to qualify once in every 3-4 World Cups.

They don't want to waste that chance by playing offensively against Spain, that would certainly end in a loss by 3-4 goals.

There wouldn't be an outcry if domestic football was played that way because those teams would certainly get relegated.

In group stage, there's only 3 games and you can go through by defending well and scoring some fluke goals.

Hell, even mighty Spain from 2010 was stopping football and it was incredibly dull to watch.

8 goals in 7 games. They would score the one and park a reverse bus. As in defending by not risking possession at all.
You can talk about number of passes and passing accuracy all you want, but as soon as they went up they would show no initiative to actually score by risking anything.
They wouldn't even take many risks while it was 0-0.

Spain weren't the issue. It was that that everyone was so scared of them that they ended up constantly playing against parked buses.

Same as peak Barcelona, they had some boring games but usually it was because of how defensive teams went against them. Anyone who came at them got torn to shreds. 

This Spain side isn't at that level though, there's no need to be so cautious.

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6 minutes ago, GunmaN1905 said:

As I wrote during the game nations like Iceland, Iran and such are lucky to qualify once in every 3-4 World Cups.

They don't want to waste that chance by playing offensively against Spain, that would certainly end in a loss by 3-4 goals.

There wouldn't be an outcry if domestic football was played that way because those teams would certainly get relegated.

In group stage, there's only 3 games and you can go through by defending well and scoring some fluke goals.

Hell, even mighty Spain from 2010 was stopping football and it was incredibly dull to watch.

8 goals in 7 games. They would score the one and park a reverse bus. As in defending by not risking possession at all.
You can talk about number of passes and passing accuracy all you want, but as soon as they went up they would show no initiative to actually score by risking anything.
They wouldn't even take many risks while it was 0-0.

iran will go home having sat on their hands for 270 minutes. having won a game on an OG and then lauding a couple 1-0 defeats.

maybe thats their mindset if being happy to turn up... but there is a history of smaller nations having a little dig at it and doing well.

to me its a waste of 4 years. get here have a little dig and chances are you will catch someone out... take a lumping if you have to.

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1 hour ago, FaceCrusher said:

The thing is, if those Romanian and Bulgarian sides were playing today, they would also be turgid or else wouldn't qualify at all.

I grew up watching Portugal outplay everyone with Fernando Couto, Paulo Sousa, Rui Costa, João Pinto and Figo and end up losing all the time to a late penalty or corner kick after hitting the post 3 times. Lost to USA and South Korea in '02 with all that talent. Couldn't even qualify in '98. Would be even worse today. Football evolved, weaker teams are now well drilled and learned how to defend and counter (nobody likes to lose), so the stronger teams need to be more wary as well. There is less space for showmanship in the teams, and less space for pure flamboyant players.

If you liked Hagi, I suggest you watch Colombian Juan Quintero closely, and afterwards ponder why his career isn't going anywhere. Had he been born 30 years earlier he would now be remembered as a Colombian god.

I only know Quintero from FM but I can guess he probably just isn't that good if his career isn't going anywhere. Hagi was genuine world class, he would be if he played today also.

I didn't mean showmanship as in flair or flamboyant players. Those Romanian and Bulgarian sides I used as examples (could also cite Euro 96 Czech Republic or France 98 Croatia) were functional sides with just a few top class players. The point is they played to win, they weren't all out attack but they didn't hide behind the bus either.

Greece ruined major tournaments. Since they won with their horrible brand of football everybody thinks they can do it :D 

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2 minutes ago, Weezer said:

Greece ruined major tournaments. Since they won with their horrible brand of football everybody thinks they can do it :D 

Don't talk about it like that. In 2004 mythical Greek warriors led by Prussian commander Rehhagel conquered Iberian peninsula and the rest of Europe with well-known Falanga tactic.
One of the greatest accomplishments in history of modern warfare.

Quote

 just a few top class players.

And where are those top-class players in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Australia, Iceland, Tunisia, Panama?
Those are the teams that parked the bus.

I don't see a single offensive player that could play in any EPL side contending for top half finish.

Egypt, Costa Rica, Korea were also disappointing in offensive department, but they simply don't have the quality.
One man teams can't do much on this level.

Team that disappointed the most in terms of gameplan was Denmark, even though they won.
But I'm pretty sure tomorrow's game will show that Peru is a quality team.

Uruguay just plays  like that and it was expected.

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Guys...

I know it's a vocal minority complaining and some of it's been covered, and granted some people aren't going to have read the whole thread. So I'm not gonna go into detail (unless you want me to) about Iran's tactics and approach, so just a few 'short' things instead without trying to seem curt or illogical:

1) Let's remember that this was Iran v Spain. Iran are underdogs in every match, up against Real and Juve players, but here they were 20/1 to win. In fact some people were 'predicting' (guessing) Iran were going to lose 5-0, 9-0, so it's clear what we thought would happen if Iran just went out and "gave it a go".

This was an Asian team with 1 win and 1 clean sheet in only 3 World Cups (50 years) before this week going against one of the tournament favourites.

2) Iran were trying to win, believe it or not, despite seemingly parking the bus and playing for 0-0. Not just because it's hard to win if you leak goals and have your Persian League-based defence and keeper exposed, but the way they play is mostly psychology and percentages. If YOU think Iran were playing for 0-0 and happy to defend for 90 minutes, so do the opposition. So they 'dominate', yet only have about 2 chances, then concede to everyone's (but Iran's) surprise.

Even today, alas it was offside, while Costa's was flukey. Iran's chances are always sudden and big ones they "should've scored", and they get them every match.

3) Iran don't have the infrastructure, preparation or players other big nations do (nations that many complainers are gonna be from). While us English just have to moan about what style the kids in the multi-million training centres play and whether one should join Chelsea and City or go abroad to Dortmund or Porto to learn, Iran is a team under a crippling ultra-conservative-religious government who have friendlies constantly cancelled and even got refused boots a week before the World Cup.

But Carlos Queiroz has been the most influential manager (and successful post-Revolution) in Iran's history. Simply because he's a hugely experienced and successful coach, and he's changed things off and on the pitch, dragging Iran into the 21st Century. As a result, Iran have had an unprecedented 4 years, qualifying for two World Cups in a row (this time unbeaten with 9 clean sheets in 9), getting a first ever finals clean sheet, first win, upsetting the odds and nearly getting something against two behemoths of world football (with one more Goliath to go).

But it's still just one step. You want a team to suddenly have great, experienced players learning from great, experienced players and playing lovely football, beating Serie A and La Liga title winners. That's not happening without a lot of building and time. And some ****ing boots!

Edited by git2thachoppa

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10 hours ago, grff said:

The highlight of the WC so far is Roy Keane resisting the temptation to smash up the ITV studio.

Love how he managed to be scornful of Southgate injuring himself accidently, doing something normal, running. He hates everyone and everything. 

Bet he's gutted with himself he actually smiled when Wright said "why's he in the woods?"

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I loved this match, I thought it was great.

I enjoy a well disciplined defence and a game plan. Iran had that but when Spain scored Iran came out and actually caused a threat and nearly got a point, it's not like they had nothing about them after the Spain goal.

I liked the defence right on top of the keeper too, no space in behind. It's up to big teams to break this kind of thing down, it's not up to Iran to play into Spain's hands. When Iran did come out and play they got at Spain too.

I was up off my seat with that Iran equaliser, it was offside but gutted, would have been a huge moment. Even that late header, should have done better. Enthralling game.

Iran can give Portugal a game here, Ronaldo aside they haven't overly impressed

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I'm actually looking forward to Iran Vs Portugal really, should be quite fun

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12 hours ago, Marc Albrighton said:

Roy keane should always be one of the 3 pundits, he is absolute tv gold. When he was talking about kicking 3 players over the line to score if you had to or something to that effect it was brilliant especially the reaction when he said it :D

13 hours ago, craigcwwe said:

He was getting seriously pissed off with Bilic the other day when he kept touching him on the shoulder and chest whenever he made a point. Was brilliant viewing. 

Did make me laugh to see them separated for tonight's game by Ian Wright. 

3 hours ago, Shortie said:

Love how he managed to be scornful of Southgate injuring himself accidently, doing something normal, running. He hates everyone and everything. 

Bet he's gutted with himself he actually smiled when Wright said "why's he in the woods?"

I like this article on Keane's punditry: "On ITV, Keane often comes across as an actor trying to play a character called Roy Keane"

https://www.balls.ie/football/tv-review-roy-keane-punditry-391319 

Pairing him with Wrighty's pub-after-several-pints style analysis might teach you even less about the game than Mark Lawrenson, but its a lot funnier.

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Israelis Cheering Iran, Hope to Rekindle Ties With Native Land: https://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2018/06/21/world/middleeast/21reuters-soccer-worldcup-israel-iran.html

Quote

Israelis Cheering Iran, Hope to Rekindle Ties With Native Land

By Reuters

June 21, 2018

JERUSALEM — Iran's national team received surprise support in their World Cup fixture against Spain: a group of Israelis of Iranian origin gathered to cheer on the team.

About 20 supporters mainly comprising the Hasid family and some of their friends gathered on Wednesday in an upscale Jerusalem neighborhood and cheered for a team that most Israelis consider a representative of their arch-enemy.

Israel has long been locked in a shadow war with Iran, which supports Islamist militants in the Gaza Strip and Lebanon and whose nuclear program is widely believed to have been targeted by Israel's intelligence services.

But Tzion Hasid, 84, a prominent member of Israel's Iranian community and a Jerusalem building contractor, who came to Israel from Isfahan in 1966 with other family members, said that despite the political enmity between the two Middle Eastern powers, Israelis of Iranian origin felt great affection for their former compatriots.

"I came from Iran to the land of Israel, the land of our dreams, but not even for one moment in over 60 years have we forgotten our (old) country," Hasid said.

"We still have feelings of respect for all Iranians ... We want peace with them and we hope that even next year, our (Israel's) leaders and theirs will meet and make peace for the benefit of both our people."

Israelis of Iranian origin number between 350,000-400,000. Many emigrated in the 1920s, 1950s and 60s and some came after the Islamic Revolution of 1979, said Pierre Lavi, 53, a Jerusalem author and publisher.

Regardless of Iran's underdog status in the match, and even after they went 1-0 down to Diego Costa's 54th minute goal which sealed the win, the group continued with repeated chants of "Iran, Iran".

The clapping and singing by the gathering of the older generation who were born in Iran and came to Israel in the 1960s was backed up, although not as vehemently, by younger generations who were born in Israel.

Lavi, who was brought to Israel as a four-month-old baby by his parents, admitted quietly that he was a supporter of Spain. "Just don't tell the others," he whispered.

"The football is a way to remember what they miss about Iran but I don't think they are really fans of the Iranian team, perhaps some are, but not all of them," Lavi said.

(Writing by Ori Lewis; Editing by Alison Williams)

Interesting article.:thup:

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4 hours ago, PMLF said:

Israelis Cheering Iran, Hope to Rekindle Ties With Native Land: https://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2018/06/21/world/middleeast/21reuters-soccer-worldcup-israel-iran.html

Interesting article.:thup:

The big question (and I think Iranians secretly want to see happen) is what if/when Israel qualify and go up against a country that doesn't recognise them, and that first country is Iran?

If Iran aren't forced to pull out, it defeats the 'government's' anti-Israel agenda and opens Pandora's Box. Now they have to 'recognise' them and all previous pull-outs have been for nothing.

If they do pull out, it's nice to think it could be the final straw that leads the football-mad country to another revolution and the end of another religion's rule.

Edited by git2thachoppa

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On 21/06/2018 at 00:10, GunmaN1905 said:

Don't talk about it like that. In 2004 mythical Greek warriors led by Prussian commander Rehhagel conquered Iberian peninsula and the rest of Europe with well-known Falanga tactic.
One of the greatest accomplishments in history of modern warfare.

And where are those top-class players in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Australia, Iceland, Tunisia, Panama?
Those are the teams that parked the bus.

I don't see a single offensive player that could play in any EPL side contending for top half finish.

Egypt, Costa Rica, Korea were also disappointing in offensive department, but they simply don't have the quality.
One man teams can't do much on this level.

Team that disappointed the most in terms of gameplan was Denmark, even though they won.
But I'm pretty sure tomorrow's game will show that Peru is a quality team.

Uruguay just plays  like that and it was expected.

Sigurdsson, Finbogason, Leckie, Mooy all good enough for top tier clubs finishing in respectable positions, other than Mooy who is easily capable of playing for a side like Everton or even Arsenal. Very good footballer. 

Generally your argument is right though. I just don't think Australia and Iceland are fair examples of your argument. 

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Ehm, we saw what happened yesterday when Iceland had to attack.

Forgot about Sigurdsson, haven't seen much of others to convince me, but still, you're probably right, I don't watch that many mid-table EPL games.

 

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4 minutes ago, GunmaN1905 said:

Ehm, we saw what happened yesterday when Iceland had to attack.

Forgot about Sigurdsson, haven't seen much of others to convince me, but still, you're probably right, I don't watch that many mid-table EPL games.

 

Mooy bossed the United midfield twice this season. Been impressive for Australia too. Especially against France. He must love playing Pogba :D

Finnbogason and Leckie play for Augsburg and Hertha in the Bundesliga. 

Edited by JDownie

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18 minutes ago, Weezer said:

 

Costa has done that for donkeys years, he's a massive troll who'll do anything to wind up the opposition defenders and provoke a reaction. Scummy? Yes. Legitimate tactic that's probably more common than you think? yes.

He once pissed off a CB so much over several games this happened:

 

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10 minutes ago, G-Man11 said:

Costa has done that for donkeys years, he's a massive troll who'll do anything to wind up the opposition defenders and provoke a reaction. Scummy? Yes. Legitimate tactic that's probably more common than you think? yes.

He once pissed off a CB so much over several games this happened:

 

Materazzi was doing it all game to Zidane hence the headbutt :D

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51 minutes ago, JDownie said:

Materazzi was doing it all game to Zidane hence the headbutt :D

Zidane is the worst c**t of them all.

14 reds, all of them due to dirty tackles and punching people.

1 hour ago, G-Man11 said:

Costa has done that for donkeys years

If only he played in early 00s Serie A. :D

Season ending injury within 5 games guaranteed.

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