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Maradonna in racist behaviour allegations

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Not susprised given its him but still not on. Ironic that the only racism so far at Russia 2018 is from Maradonna,

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Didnt another South American player do something like this?

Not at the World Cup, but im sure on a tour of China or something.

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1 minute ago, bestbrother said:

Didnt another South American player do something like this?

Not at the World Cup, but im sure on a tour of China or something.

image.thumb.png.63299ef112fedead010de3d964eb05db.png

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I think given his past behaviour that he's probably just a bloody idiot rather than being racist. Most his brain cells probably destroyed by booze and drugs. 

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1 minute ago, Neil Brock said:

I think given his past behaviour that he's probably just a bloody idiot rather than being racist. Most his brain cells probably destroyed by booze and drugs. 

Well it's not from heading the ball

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17 minutes ago, bestbrother said:

Didnt another South American player do something like this?

Not at the World Cup, but im sure on a tour of China or something.

Kenedy did it.

Also Santos players did it when Santos played the Club World Cup last time.

This kind of gesture isn't generally regarded as racist in South America.

Maradona is an idiot but I doubt it he had any bad intentions with that gesture.

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46 minutes ago, Neil Brock said:

I think given his past behaviour that he's probably just a bloody idiot rather than being racist. Most his brain cells probably destroyed by booze and drugs. 

Pretty much this, the guy really is an idiot.

If he wasn't very good at 'kick ball chase ball', he would be known as 'That idiot that lives down the road'.

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Just now, daylight said:

Pretty much this, the guy really is an idiot.

If he wasn't very good at 'kick ball chase ball', he would be known as 'That idiot that lives down the road'.

You forgot "punch ball"

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51 minuti fa, Neil Brock ha scritto:

I think given his past behaviour that he's probably just a bloody idiot rather than being racist. Most his brain cells probably destroyed by booze and drugs. 

And probably by his friendship with Maduro.

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3 minutes ago, Ratio said:

And probably by his friendship with Maduro.

Yes, he is super rich and yet he supports all socialist regimes, the same ones that ruined the lives of millions of people.

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Just now, PMLF said:

Yes, he is super rich and yet he supports all socialist regimes, the same ones that ruined the lives of millions of people.

You really gonna bring that into this?

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2 minutes ago, Heartwork said:

You really gonna bring that into this?

I wasn't the first one to mention it, I am just agreeing with the other comment!

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2 hours ago, GunmaN1905 said:

Forget the cigar.

154f1524-8375-488a-8354-dadefb597b8f.gif

Thought the same thing when I was watching. 

He should get the help he clearly needs. 

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Yea I often show my mutual appreciation for people by drawing on blackface and making asian faces when it's someone who doesn't look like me.

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3 hours ago, PMLF said:

Yes, he is super rich and yet he supports all socialist regimes, the same ones that ruined the lives of millions of people.

Man does something racist. Let’s use this opportunity to moan about socialism! 

Was this done through racism or him being an idiot? I think (and hope) its the second.

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9 hours ago, Divinity said:

People writing off racism as 'just being an idiot'. :applause:

Did he do something racist? - Yes absolutely.

Do I think he considers what he did racist and did it in such a way to purposely offend those he did it towards? - Probably not.

Does doing the above mean he's an idiot? - Yes. 

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15 minutes ago, Neil Brock said:

Did he do something racist? - Yes absolutely.

Do I think he considers what he did racist and did it in such a way to purposely offend those he did it towards? - Probably not.

Does doing the above mean he's an idiot? - Yes. 

No, doing racist acts makes you a racist. It also makes you an idiot.

There doesn't need to be purposeful offence - the vast majority of racism is not.

Don't change it to sound lesser than it is. As I said, you wouldn't dress up in blackface to demonstrate solidarity with black people.

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That kind of gesture usually isn't regarded as racist in South America, I doubt he thought he was doing anything wrong. Not that he would care anyway.

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**** off guys, it's Maradona and he can do what he wants.

And I am Asian.

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1 ora fa, PMLF ha scritto:

That kind of gesture usually isn't regarded as racist in South America, I doubt he thought he was doing anything wrong.

Unfortunately it doesn't matter anymore...

Anything that the current "outrage culture" deems as offensive IS offensive regardless of the circumstances.  Cultural absolutism at its finest...

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15 minutes ago, RBKalle said:

Unfortunately it doesn't matter anymore...

Anything that the current "outrage culture" deems as offensive IS offensive regardless of the circumstances.  Cultural absolutism at its finest...

Outrage culture? He did something racist. Whether he thought it was as racist as it was is up for debate, but it doesn’t make it any less racist. 

I completely understand that things in different cultures are more/less offensive (for example in Boston, a certain type of shop is called a packie - which sounds very similar to a very offensive word for people from the subcontinent. Plus the word c**t is less offensive in the UK than in the US although it is still offensive), but gestures such as this need to be stamped out.

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Can you do something racist without being a racist yourself? It's complicated but imho you probably can. It's not exactly something to be proud of, not knowing a gesture is racist through either your own stupidity or ignorance but still, doesn't necessarily make him a racist.

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What is up with South America though?

Everything is not "seen as racist" over there or is a friendly term :rolleyes:

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1 minute ago, Icondacarver said:

What is up with South America though?

Everything is not "seen as racist" over there or is a friendly term :rolleyes:

Shouldn't judge a continent of people by actions of a minority.

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Just now, SteveUK said:

Shouldn't judge a continent of people by actions of a minority.

If they are a minority, then that means the excuse is bull and it is not seen as a term of endearment. Also not judging the action but rather the fact that certain things are meant to be positive on that continent

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It's down to ignorance and lack of education rather than maliciousness though I found when in South America.

Maybe a bit of tribalism too, they don't really like each other either but on a one to one basis some of the most friendly people I've ever met were on my South American travels.

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10 minutes ago, Weezer said:

Can you do something racist without being a racist yourself? It's complicated but imho you probably can. It's not exactly something to be proud of, not knowing a gesture is racist through either your own stupidity or ignorance but still, doesn't necessarily make him a racist.

Did he do something racist? Yes. Is he a racist? I don’t know. Is he a massive idiot regardless? Yes. Having lived and worked abroad, I can fully understand that what is seen in one country as normal can be offensive in another, but surely making this kind of gesture can’t be seen positively?

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15 minuti fa, mark1985 ha scritto:

Outrage culture? He did something racist. Whether he thought it was as racist as it was is up for debate, but it doesn’t make it any less racist.  

I completely understand that things in different cultures are more/less offensive (for example in Boston, a certain type of shop is called a packie - which sounds very similar to a very offensive word for people from the subcontinent. Plus the word c**t is less offensive in the UK than in the US although it is still offensive), but gestures such as this need to be stamped out.

Those two sentences are almost mutually exclusive.

Cultural context isn't something we can ignore. Some stuff is offensive in one place and completely harmless in another due to cultural, social and historical differences. Just because American and British cultures are guilt-ridden due to their less than immaculate past (and not-so-past), it doesn't mean the whole world must be judged with their rules.

"Your" racism is not the same as "their" racism, because countries and continents have different history and cultures. "Asian eyes" have been a common gesture in many places without it being seen as anything but harmless fun, in a "how'd I look like if I were Chinese?" way. It becomes racist only if you add a lot of subtext to it. But in countries with minimal Asian presence, how can it be offensive?

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Having spent a lot of time in China in the last 3 years I don't think any of them would be offended by the 'slitty-eyed' thing. It's not something I'd do myself but the ones that are more culturally aware would just laugh it off imho.

*Obviously I don't speak for all Chinese people! But the ones I have dealt with are fairly high status or more culturally aware (my girlfriend works in a very expensive international school in Shanghai) than the average mainlander and they'd take the pee out of themselves for it too tbf

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They`re making a big deal out of it because it`s been done by Maradona. If it was Vasilyi, an average Spartak Moscow fan, doing it, nobody would`ve given a crap about it.

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1 minute ago, RBKalle said:

Those two sentences are almost mutually exclusive.

Cultural context isn't something we can ignore. Some stuff is offensive in one place and completely harmless in another due to cultural, social and historical differences. Just because American and British cultures are guilt-ridden due to their less than immaculate past (and not-so-past), it doesn't mean the whole world must be judged with their rules.

"Your" racism is not the same as "their" racism, because countries and continents have different history and cultures. "Asian eyes" have been a common gesture in many places without it being seen as anything but harmless fun, in a "how'd I look like if I were Chinese?" way. It becomes racist only if you add a lot of subtext to it. But in countries with minimal Asian presence, how can it be offensive?

So by that logic, places with a minimal black population should be allowed to use the n word and other racial slurs towards black people? Same with south Asian or subcontinent populations. Only a few generations ago, all this stuff was completely normal in the UK as well but luckily it’s reducing (or at least being called out). Despite each country having different forms of racism (different offensive words towards different groups) it’s all wrong. And also by your logic, if I say or do something offensive to you and you tell me it’s offensive, can I just disregard your opinion because I was having a bit of harmless fun?

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20 minutes ago, Icondacarver said:

What is up with South America though?

Everything is not "seen as racist" over there or is a friendly term :rolleyes:

Places that aren't racist by and large are basically in North America, Western Europe and Australasia. 

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3 minutes ago, Weezer said:

Having spent a lot of time in China in the last 3 years I don't think any of them would be offended by the 'slitty-eyed' thing. It's not something I'd do myself but the ones that are more culturally aware would just laugh it off imho.

*Obviously I don't speak for all Chinese people! But the ones I have dealt with are fairly high status or more culturally aware (my girlfriend works in a very expensive international school in Shanghai) than the average mainlander and they'd take the pee out of themselves for it too tbf

Is this 100% an assumption or have you tried it to see their reaction? Or did you simply ask your high status culturally aware friends?

My girlfriend is Chinese and I am sat with her whole family for fathers day, I just told them about the Maradona thing....let us just say it was universal that they thought he was an idiot and they would be annoyed if present when he did. What this proves is the offensiveness is dependant on the receivers. 

Maradona is an idiot and yes certain actions are not seen as racist in parts of the world. That I fully agree, but this act of always trying to assume or decide what the receiving party would find offensive is garbage. Only the individual can tell how they would feel and unless you entered their mind you can't say with any certainty.

People seem to always think that others should/would laugh stuff off but never ask why with all the safe banter in the world some people always go for the culturally risky & potentially offensive stuff. 

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10 minutes ago, Crispypaul said:

Places that aren't racist by and large are basically in North America, Western Europe and Australasia. 

Tbh, I was not calling them racist but they seem to have a knack of claiming that some of the racist behaviours have a different meaning to them. Other known racial hotspots at least seem to acknowledge their racism, Russian fans do not claim bananas on the pitch are a sign of endearment or the player lacks calcium. :D

Edited by Icondacarver

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Even if Maradona didn't think it was racist,I'm not sure how you would think that it was an appropriate thing to do? Surely you wouldn't think anyone could interpret that as 'oh he loves East Asia!' 

That said, I would be inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt if he says he'll make sure to be more culturally sensitive in future or sth, it's possible he thought it was bantery rather than insulting. 

I initially thought as an international celebrity he'd be more aware anyway but then Griezmann did what he did last season so who knows.

Edit: for the avoidance of doubt the 'term of endearment' comment from me was a reference to the Suarez excuse, I'm not claiming it's true @Icondacarver

Edited by The_jagster

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