Help with Sampdoria Tactic

[SammyRai]

I need some help, some major guidance, there is too much to wade through, too much vagueness, so I'm asking for some help.

I'm Sampdoria.

I want to play a varient of 442 with an Inside Forward for goals, similar to 07/08 era Man UTD.

We have a good Target Man in Zapata and a good Complete forward in Quaqiarella, so a big small partnership is viable, and should be able to combine to make space for one another and or the Insider Forward.

The team has a ready made Segundo Volante in Torreria.

The combinations are what I'm struggling with most.

This is my current, please tell me why it's terrible, coz it seems to perform awfully.

---------------------Gd-----------------------

--WBa ----CDd--------BPDco-----Fbs

------------SVa

--Wms----------------BWMd------------

------------------------------------------IFa

------------CFs---------TMa

 

Standard Ment to start games off

Structured Shape

Team Instructions: More Direct Passing - Play out of Defense - Work Ball Into Box - Play Wider - Drop Deeper - Higher Tempo

Player Instuctions : Wms - Sit Narrower

This is my basis from which I've been working from.

I though I direct style of play utilizing Zapata Target Man skills and my other 2 Forwards Movements would be good for unlocking defenses, we sit a little deeper to enable some fast counter attacking, the WMs will sit narrower to create more bods in the middle, the WB supplies some width.

What's are the basics if why this doesnt work.

What partnership is going to work with the SV when playing this quicker direct style of play.

The problems I'm seeing is, don't retain possession very well, which isn't a big deal, possession is not the point.

Too many long balls, Too many long shots, sometimes not enough support for the strikers, oddly enough. Team gets the ball up top too quick and then are isolated, though this can work for the counter direct style I want.

 

Any help appreciated

[dcaine100]

First thing that came to mind is that your tactic is unbalanced, your right side is too attacking with your WBa getting foward a lot, your SVa making frequent runs into the box and finally your WMs given the instrution "sit narrower" all this means you will be leaving masses of space down your right.

[goqs06]

15 hours ago, SammyRai said:

I want to play a varient of 442 with an Inside Forward for goals, similar to 07/08 era Man UTD.

 

[summatsupeer]

15 hours ago, SammyRai said:

Team Instructions: More Direct Passing - Play out of Defense - Work Ball Into Box - Play Wider - Drop Deeper - Higher Tempo

...

The problems I'm seeing is, don't retain possession very well, which isn't a big deal, possession is not the point.

Too many long balls, Too many long shots, sometimes not enough support for the strikers, oddly enough. Team gets the ball up top too quick and then are isolated, though this can work for the counter direct style I want.

A TM will always attract the ball more without even telling the team to play direct.

Read cleons counter guide, you don't need to give all these instructions to create a counter attack.  What you've done is made a very direct style, regardless of if there is a counter attack, you don't have a plan B if there isn't a counter attack.

[SammyRai]

I read Cleons Blog, full of awesome info - I made a new formation - it played more like I want my team to play but felt like it still had some faults - any advice would be appreciated.

 

-------------GKd--------------

----CBd----BPDc-----CBd

Wbs-------DLPd------WBs

-------BtB---------Cms------

-------SSa

--------------------TMs

Team Instructions:

Play out of Defense, Work Ball into Box, Drop Deeper

I don',t want to just throw posession away, and want options to be able to work the ball around and create chances if the counter isn't on, as stated, so with the added numbers in midfield, the team now holds onto the ball much better.

I did struggle to create chances in my last game - 0 clear cut chances - not too many counter attacks, more posession than the oppostion that had more shots than me, but they were kept largely outside the box, so working defensively.

Any obvious pointers?? Mistakes, things I can do better to suppor the strikers or create space in the final third where the counter isn't on??

Do I need somethiing other than a Target Man, the problem is with my strike force, I have an aging star that lacks a little pace, and a big man that is great at holding up the ball, so neither, overly great with the counter I suppose - no pacey wingers, by my wing backs are faily quick and the CMs tons and stamnia and good work rates.

So is it more of a personel thing, that maybe I don't have the pace to go fully for a counter attacking style??

[BadanieLuck]

Not sure if SS and a Target man are a good combination with this setup. A SS is rather centrally positioned, even though he roams around a bit, so who is going to provide the crosses for the Target Man? The WBs will be very deep in defending situations and until they got up the pitch to provide some crosses for the Target Man, the counter situation is probably already over and the opposition defence was able to reorganise. So this formation/roles may not be very effective for counter situations.

I also don't like the Target Man role. As @summatsupeer mentioned, a Target Man attracts direct balls, so in matches you will often see a ball getting crossed forward which are very difficult from the TM to control. I like the DLF(S) more. But that's just personal preference.

[westy8chimp]

On 18/03/2018 at 18:00, SammyRai said:

Structured Shape

Team Instructions: More Direct Passing - Play out of Defense - Work Ball Into Box - Play Wider - Drop Deeper - Higher Tempo

More direct and high tempo... Do not really sit alongside play out from the back and work ball into box. The first two are higher risk no nonsense fast attacks (less possession more long balls) the second two are probing slow thoughtful methods of attacking... Based on keeping the ball and waiting for a good chance

[SammyRai]

On 23/03/2018 at 00:04, BadanieLuck said:

Not sure if SS and a Target man are a good combination with this setup. A SS is rather centrally positioned, even though he roams around a bit, so who is going to provide the crosses for the Target Man? The WBs will be very deep in defending situations and until they got up the pitch to provide some crosses for the Target Man, the counter situation is probably already over and the opposition defence was able to reorganise. So this formation/roles may not be very effective for counter situations.

I also don't like the Target Man role. As @summatsupeer mentioned, a Target Man attracts direct balls, so in matches you will often see a ball getting crossed forward which are very difficult from the TM to control. I like the DLF(S) more. But that's just personal preference.

I heard somewhere SS worked well as they were better at attacking space?? I dunno - This is where my inexperience shows, coz you read threads that say when a counter is triggered, mentality is maxed, so regardless of if they played deeper, they'd bomb up the pitch?? When reading threads on counter they're all like, play deep, one maybe 2 attack duties max. Switching the WBs, to CWBs? Or adding one on attack duty??

On 23/03/2018 at 08:31, westy8chimp said:

More direct and high tempo... Do not really sit alongside play out from the back and work ball into box. The first two are higher risk no nonsense fast attacks (less possession more long balls) the second two are probing slow thoughtful methods of attacking... Based on keeping the ball and waiting for a good chance

I get what you're saying, but I don't get what you're saying. I mean, the counter is not always going to be an option/trigger. So what do I want my team to do in the meantime? Pass the ball about and work it. This is how Man Utd played under fergie.

I'll take all this advice and see how it works but it makes little sense in my brain,  But then, to be fair, I'm a mega noob. Still much to learn, thanks for the input peeps

[BadanieLuck]

vor 6 Stunden schrieb SammyRai:

I heard somewhere SS worked well as they were better at attacking space?? I dunno - This is where my inexperience shows, coz you read threads that say when a counter is triggered, mentality is maxed, so regardless of if they played deeper, they'd bomb up the pitch?? When reading threads on counter they're all like, play deep, one maybe 2 attack duties max. Switching the WBs, to CWBs? Or adding one on attack duty??

I get what you're saying, but I don't get what you're saying. I mean, the counter is not always going to be an option/trigger. So what do I want my team to do in the meantime? Pass the ball about and work it. This is how Man Utd played under fergie.

I'll take all this advice and see how it works but it makes little sense in my brain,  But then, to be fair, I'm a mega noob. Still much to learn, thanks for the input peeps

Experience comes from trying things out and watching how it unfolds in the game. So watch the games and see how the counter attacks are working for you. The thing with FM is, it takes a lot of time to get 'that' experience with it. I started with FM15, played, tried and build a lot of tactics with different teams in different leagues and still learn new things or get stretched to my limits. But overcoming this and seeing your tactics flourish will make it worth it in the end