LCFCEaves31 Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Hello Need help once again with this game. Every time I feel like I am getting somewhere I lose one game (usually to Dortmund or Bayern) then go on an awful run. Teams I play have one or two shots on target, they go in. My Centre Backs and Goalkeeper who are solid for 2/3's of the season all of sudden let in easy goals, let centre forwards turn them at ease and make no effort to tackle. My strikers, who are red hot suddenly can't score an open goal... Sick of it, happens every season. I ride through it most years and eventually end up finishing 3rd or 4th etc. but I obviously cant keep doing it every season, otherwise I will never win anything! Beating big teams... can't do it. And the winning streaks then the losing streaks... can' handle it anymore, must be something I am doing wrong. Anyway, here are the tactics. (I am on FM17) I've added my best player... for some reason... (Also the very last game against Bochum... we lost, but it doesn't show on here because I did what people call 'Rage Quit'... felt as though the game is against me or coded to do this, because it happens every season! I know it's not and it's something I am doing or not doing, but in the emotion of going through the same thing AGAIN... I quit. And one last thing that I probably should ask... anyone else experience this? Is it normal? Do you have a method in making sure 1 defeat doesn't lead to 6-7 on the bounce? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCFCEaves31 Posted January 7, 2018 Author Share Posted January 7, 2018 Now losing to lower league opposition in the cup. I am giving up now. The last two FM's have felt the same, to just purely frustrate you as a player. Nothing I do or try gets me out of this bad run, as soon as morale takes one little knock, it makes your whole team play like turd... The same patterns emerge every season, it's boring and not enjoyable anymore. I don't believe there is anything fundamentally wrong with my tactic, I watch the games and some of the goals we concede... not sure how you stop them when they are blasting them from 30 yards... yet my players who were scoring loads (see form above) now can't hit a barn door! To all the hardcore FM'ers who repeatedly do well, I take my hat off to you, but this is too difficult for the majority I feel. I am probably wrong and just frustrated, but it's time to retire! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdixon Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 I wouldn't be so hard on yourself, you have had a great run of form. 3-0 away to Dortmund to me would just be a bad day at the office, the 2-1 vs Milan, it's only the first leg and you have the away goal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCFCEaves31 Posted January 7, 2018 Author Share Posted January 7, 2018 12 hours ago, bdixon said: I wouldn't be so hard on yourself, you have had a great run of form. 3-0 away to Dortmund to me would just be a bad day at the office, the 2-1 vs Milan, it's only the first leg and you have the away goal. That's fine and I get it, but progressively we have been brining in better players each year, but still can't get any closer to them. Then it sets off this losing streak that happens every season, lose one, lose loads. I gave up just after this, but the only game I've won in the last 5 was because I kept quitting and playing it again and again with different set-ups. None worked so went back to tried and trusted and we won 1-0?! I don't get it... after that back to losing against crap teams again, which earlier on in the season we were blowing out of the water with ease. The players and the tactic just all of a sudden becomes a huge disconnect, like we've forgotten how to play. It happens every season, not long after the winter break. Anyway... is the tactic solid? If so, I know at least that is ok and it is something else that I am consistently getting wrong... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCFCEaves31 Posted January 8, 2018 Author Share Posted January 8, 2018 Well if anything sums up my time with Football manager at the moment, it's this Lures you into thinking you are doing well, then just repeatedly kicks you in nuts (that's the best way I can describe how I am feeling I'm afraid!) Made a few tweaks after reading some things on here, mostly regarding 4231 and went 3-0 up within 21 minutes. But then of course, without the opposition looking threatening at all, they score 3 to bring it level. Their first was crap marking from a cross (as per usual on this game, way too many crossed assists, not sure if it is any better on FM18, but its overpowered). Two were just hoofs over the top... I should have dropped us on control to play a slightly deeper line, I usually do on control or attack but for some reason forgot... So I hold my hands up, mistake on my part. We then score another well worked goal, but of course, this is football manager, so lets lure you in and kick you in the nuts again... lets make one of your centre backs (both were great first part of the season, kept lots of clean sheets) inexplicably shove their player in the penalty area and give away a penalty... when it goes against you, god does it go against you. It happens I know, but things like this just make me feel down and that I will never get this game enough to be able to enjoy it. If I can't stop these stupid streaks from happening, which cause the drop in morale and leads on to mistakes and a somewhat clueless approach to the games suddenly, I don't know if it is worth carrying on... eat, sleep, repeat... I am tempted to play the game again, with same tactics as below, but drop the defensive line to see if we concede same silly goals again, although it feels like cheating! One final point... can you have success with a BWM on (d) in front of a back line in a 4231... I have used it, thought it was working well in the beginning, but I see him being a lot more aggressive in closing down (obviously) which against a team who play 2 upfront, it can then create issues through the middle. Would a CM (d) be a much more sensible option do you think? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
herne79 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 30 minutes ago, LCFCEaves31 said: lets make one of your centre backs (both were great first part of the season, kept lots of clean sheets) inexplicably shove their player in the penalty area and give away a penalty. Inexplicably? You don't think any of your chosen Team Instructions might contribute at all? How about the player involved? Competitive? Aggressive? Pressurised? Take a deep breath, count to ten. These things are within your control but your frustration is clouding your judgement. In terms of your system, what are you doing as you've now posted two different ones? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCFCEaves31 Posted January 8, 2018 Author Share Posted January 8, 2018 36 minutes ago, herne79 said: Inexplicably? You don't think any of your chosen Team Instructions might contribute at all? How about the player involved? Competitive? Aggressive? Pressurised? Take a deep breath, count to ten. These things are within your control but your frustration is clouding your judgement. In terms of your system, what are you doing as you've now posted two different ones? I will try and reply without rambling Your first point... I started using tighter marking & get stuck in at the beginning of the season. Too many goals were being conceded last season via two methods. The first, goals coming down the centre, my centre backs were following the attacker around, turning like JCB's, not showing them onto their weaker foots like I asked, and doing nothing about the immanent threat of a shot on target. They were just letting them waltz through straight down the middle and rifle one into the back of the net. At times I wasn't too bothered about amending much as we were scoring a lot, but in the second half of that season it started to go (like this season). Secondly, goals from crosses... I know I am over-exaggerating here, but it felt like every cross ended up with my goalkeeper having to make a world class save or the opposition scored... marking was pants, reactions of the attacked far superior to my defenders. My centre backs at the time were a wonder kid new gen before Real Madrid took him off my hands, and a 31 year old John Stones, still a very good John Stones. So rightly or wrongly, I thought those two instructions would help, and it certainly seemed that way for the first part of the season. (This is my basic interpretation of trying to analyse what is happening, reading other threads however makes me fell like an idiot as they see things I just don't!! Especially if you read and try digest a Cleon thread for example. Bloke seems to be god like, just see's everything and why it is happening and how to quickly do something about it) Anyway... Your second part of the question, was the aforementioned John Stones. Not sure what you mean by Competitive or Pressurised? In what sense? His Aggression stat is '10', and has the trait 'Does not dive into tackles'. Morale was 'Good' before the game started, couldn't tell you what it was during. The incident came from the oppositions free kick in a wide area, ball pumped into the box which is when he fouled the player. Third point - Yes, I am an emotional person and am becoming very frustrated as I cannot seem to stop the inevitable. I love this game, I love football, so I want it to work, maybe too badly! This has been my best save in a long time, taking Cambridge from league 2 to Prem, but really struggled when we got there, so in the end left and took Wolfsburg job. They were 14th season before, but we finished 3 seasons 2nd, 2nd & 5th... 5th being the season it fell apart not long after winter break. It feels like it is happening again. My system, is as below now. I had been using Standard Mentality until the sudden dip/loss of form. I just felt as though it was taking too long to get forward when there was space to exploit and not taking many risks, it was allowing the opposition to get back into shape ( that's how I interpreted it anyway!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OLLMEISTER1 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 I would recommend assigning the DLP to a defend duty along side the BWM also on defend. You have good roles and set up so its just little tweaks here & there. Why do you need the DLP to support? you have 4 players ahead of him!!! Let the 4 ahead do their things with support from the full backs. Keep the two CM's on BWM & DLP but both on defend for more stability and to protect against counter attacks. You are not a million miles away. I play a very similar formation but with the striker on poacher & both full backs on support, occasional changing to WBS if needed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCFCEaves31 Posted January 9, 2018 Author Share Posted January 9, 2018 4 hours ago, OLLMEISTER1 said: I would recommend assigning the DLP to a defend duty along side the BWM also on defend. You have good roles and set up so its just little tweaks here & there. Why do you need the DLP to support? you have 4 players ahead of him!!! Let the 4 ahead do their things with support from the full backs. Keep the two CM's on BWM & DLP but both on defend for more stability and to protect against counter attacks. You are not a million miles away. I play a very similar formation but with the striker on poacher & both full backs on support, occasional changing to WBS if needed. Thanks for that I’ve felt I’m not million miles away tactics wise. I will do the tweak you suggested on cm’s. I like my fb or wb on attack if I’ve got an inside forward, makes sense to me but I’ve noticed a lot of people have both on support, the winger on the other side all with support role but fb behind on attack ... surely they’ll just run into each other ... Im having the persistent trouble of massive dip in form... you can imagine as a lesser club than Dortmund and Bayern, chances are you’ll lose. One defeat to them in the second half of the season and even though morale doesn’t look terroble the performances fall off a cliff... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OLLMEISTER1 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 Let me know how you find the CM changes. Should make you more solid when play is recycled/loss of possession and not so open on the counter. I always like to play my DL & DR on support duties either with full back or wing back role. Rarely will I give a DL & DR an attack instruction. Can leave you very open on the flanks if countered. I feel on support they are never too far away from where I want them to be positionally. My AML & AMR are on attack duties which is why I use the DL & DR on support only. Suicide if you use the whole flank on attack. Dips in form happen to everybody, its part of football and always will be. How interactive are you with players? Player chats, team meetings etc can help when dips occur. Calm, passionate talks can work wonders and seriously boost morale. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCFCEaves31 Posted January 10, 2018 Author Share Posted January 10, 2018 On 09/01/2018 at 14:48, OLLMEISTER1 said: Let me know how you find the CM changes. Should make you more solid when play is recycled/loss of possession and not so open on the counter. I always like to play my DL & DR on support duties either with full back or wing back role. Rarely will I give a DL & DR an attack instruction. Can leave you very open on the flanks if countered. I feel on support they are never too far away from where I want them to be positionally. My AML & AMR are on attack duties which is why I use the DL & DR on support only. Suicide if you use the whole flank on attack. Dips in form happen to everybody, its part of football and always will be. How interactive are you with players? Player chats, team meetings etc can help when dips occur. Calm, passionate talks can work wonders and seriously boost morale. Ok thanks will let you know. With regards to player interaction I praise them if their form is good and have called team meetings in the past, had a good reaction, but not managed to back it up with a win. Just feels so streaky this game but maybe it’s because tactics aren’t right. Anyway I’ve been struck down with flu so it might be a while before I get to it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LCFCEaves31 Posted January 21, 2018 Author Share Posted January 21, 2018 On 1/9/2018 at 14:48, OLLMEISTER1 said: Let me know how you find the CM changes. Should make you more solid when play is recycled/loss of possession and not so open on the counter. I always like to play my DL & DR on support duties either with full back or wing back role. Rarely will I give a DL & DR an attack instruction. Can leave you very open on the flanks if countered. I feel on support they are never too far away from where I want them to be positionally. My AML & AMR are on attack duties which is why I use the DL & DR on support only. Suicide if you use the whole flank on attack. Dips in form happen to everybody, its part of football and always will be. How interactive are you with players? Player chats, team meetings etc can help when dips occur. Calm, passionate talks can work wonders and seriously boost morale. Just wanted to come on and say thank you... the small tweaks you advised with roles, and reading a bit more online, I seem to have found more success than previously... well more consistently anyway. We even beat Bayern Munich... which never happens! We didn't win the league, gave ourselves too much to do at the half way point, but we did win the German Cup... never won a trophy on FM17, so must be heading in the right direction! EDIT: Posted the wrong screenshot of my tactic... oops, I posted the old one again. Essentially it is still 4231, but both centre mids on defend (DLP and BWM), both FB's on support. GK (d) FB (s) CB (d) CB (d) FB (s) DLP (d) BWM (d) W (s) AP (s) IF (a) CF (a) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 I usually switch around my attacking backs. My left back is the more attacking one, but I have a attacking right back who I use when the opposition left flank is weaker or if I need a goal. Same with my Inside Forwards upfront - on the left on Attack and on the right on Support. Switching those roles around on which side I want to come trough and switching players regularly keeps it unpredictable in my opinion. The only games I lost or drew this season at Ajax was when I played a really weak side due to being in February and still in 3 competitions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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