1. Fergie's Red Empire

[themadsheep2001]

23 hours ago, warlock said:

We're counting on you! 

Right, so i have the the shape and style of play nailed down. United largely looking to control the game, but when given space, they break in numbers and with pace.

Early screens tomorrow evening, after that it's about how the results play out over the season, I'll put screens and TI/PI up so people can go on from there

 

 

[warlock]

1 hour ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Early screens tomorrow evening

Good man!

[Ji-Sung Park]

Props to @goqs06 for trying this, I like the looks of it! However, lower D-Line? Not so sure about that, but still a nice effort.

I do feel that @felley nailed it though. I was raised a Man Utd supporter and having read the books and watched countless of games, we have to say that Ferguson was not a very tactically oriented manager - with micromanagement on player movement etc. He let the players play freely and to their strengths = very few TI/PI settings. He would go crazy if players took too many long shots or missed obvious passing opportunities, but that doesn't always mean he worked the ball into the box for instance.

For all the 4-3 against City's there were quite a few Basel/Benfica's also, demonstrating that Ferguson was first and foremost a very old school manager, relying totally on player form etc.

[Ji-Sung Park]

On 26.3.2018 at 23:15, themadsheep2001 said:

Early screens tomorrow evening, after that it's about how the results play out over the season, I'll put screens and TI/PI up so people can go on from there

 

You may proceed..

[themadsheep2001]

4 minutes ago, Ji-Sung Park said:

You may proceed..

Real life gets in the way. They'll go up in a few hours 

 

[Ji-Sung Park]

1 minute ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Real life gets in the way.

Hate it when that happens.

[themadsheep2001]

On 27/03/2018 at 10:28, Ji-Sung Park said:

Props to @goqs06 for trying this, I like the looks of it! However, lower D-Line? Not so sure about that, but still a nice effort.

I do feel that @felley nailed it though. I was raised a Man Utd supporter and having read the books and watched countless of games, we have to say that Ferguson was not a very tactically oriented manager - with micromanagement on player movement etc. He let the players play freely and to their strengths = very few TI/PI settings. He would go crazy if players took too many long shots or missed obvious passing opportunities, but that doesn't always mean he worked the ball into the box for instance.

For all the 4-3 against City's there were quite a few Basel/Benfica's also, demonstrating that Ferguson was first and foremost a very old school manager, relying totally on player form etc.

This isn't true. On the contrary Ferguson was tactically orientated, he just didn't micro manage heavily , with the Barcelona semi final being one of the big exceptions, where he and Quieroz basically mapped out the exactly positions he wanted them to fall back to. But that shouldn't be taken as a lack of tactical nous, he was very adept at reading sides 

 

[Ji-Sung Park]

1 minute ago, themadsheep2001 said:

This isn't true. On the contrary Ferguson was tactically orientated, he just didn't micro manage heavily , with the Barcelona semi final being one of the big exceptions, where he and Quieroz basically mapped out the exactly positions he wanted them to fall back to. But that shouldn't be taken as a lack of tactical nous, he was very adept at reading sides 

 

All of this is basically your opinion, not a fact. 

[themadsheep2001]

4 minutes ago, Ji-Sung Park said:

All of this is basically your opinion, not a fact. 

I'll take Rio Ferdinand and Paul Scholes views on his coaching, as well as the fact he mapped out the Barcelona game in training (yes that actually happenes, he and Carlos physically walked the players through their positions) as demonstration of his acumen. 

[Ji-Sung Park]

1 minute ago, themadsheep2001 said:

I'll take Rio Ferdinand and Paul Scholes views on his coaching, as well as the fact he mapped out the Barcelona game in training (yes that actually happenes, he and Carlos physically walked the players through their positions) as demonstration of his acumen. 

3 decades at United and two CL titles. 3 decades with the greatest sides England ever saw. 

[themadsheep2001]

7 minutes ago, Ji-Sung Park said:

3 decades at United and two CL titles. 3 decades with the greatest sides England ever saw. 

But that doesn't actually talk about his attention to tactical management does it? As well as ignoring every other trophy he won. 

[Ji-Sung Park]

14 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

But that doesn't actually talk about his attention to tactical management does it? As well as ignoring every other trophy he won. 

Did I say he was a mongoloid when it came to tactics? No, I said that he wasn't tactically astute. You can't win all those trophies without having a grasp on tactics, but there were a lot of times he was completely dismantled by more tactically aware opponents. Like Barca in '07(?).

He lacked the cynical traits that outdid United many times, especially in Europe. It became evident in his latter years (6-1 loss to City for instance). 

Edited March 29, 2018 by Ji-Sung Park

[themadsheep2001]

9 minutes ago, Ji-Sung Park said:

Did I say he was a mongoloid when it came to tactics? No, I said that he wasn't tactically astute. You can't win all those trophies without having a grasp on tactics, but there were a lot of times he was completely dismantled by more tactically aware opponents. Like Barca in '07(?).

He lacked the cynical traits that outdid United many times, especially in Europe. It became evident in his latter years (6-1 loss to City for instance). 

It was Barca in 09, and he'd outdid them in 08.

United were down to 10 men against City, he prompt won the 9 of out the next 10 conceding 2 goals.

Either way, it's still not relevant to whether he was tactically savvy. You can be tactically savvy and still not win.

[simonbyrneno.4]

On 3/26/2018 at 22:15, themadsheep2001 said:

Right, so i have the the shape and style of play nailed down. United largely looking to control the game, but when given space, they break in numbers and with pace.

Early screens tomorrow evening, after that it's about how the results play out over the season, I'll put screens and TI/PI up so people can go on from there

 

 

Any early screens or anything yet? Very interest in your set up

[felley]

7 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

This isn't true. On the contrary Ferguson was tactically orientated, he just didn't micro manage heavily , with the Barcelona semi final being one of the big exceptions, where he and Quieroz basically mapped out the exactly positions he wanted them to fall back to. But that shouldn't be taken as a lack of tactical nous, he was very adept at reading sides 

 

You've literally just provided the contradictory evidence that disproves your point

Ferguson came to rely on his assistants/coaches for getting him through tough tactical battles. Queiroz was massively important in turning United into a top continental side in that 2004-08 period. In his twilight years, Fergie went back to his roots and dragged his team to titles through sheer willpower and simple tactical instructions.

[themadsheep2001]

9 minutes ago, felley said:

You've literally just provided the contradictory evidence that disproves your point

Ferguson came to rely on his assistants/coaches for getting him through tough tactical battles. Queiroz was massively important in turning United into a top continental side in that 2004-08 period. In his twilight years, Fergie went back to his roots and dragged his team to titles through sheer willpower and simple tactical instructions.

Ferguson started doing this back in 2002. It reached its peak in 2008.

In his twilight years Ferguson still did the same, but was at the point it needed rejuvinating. Van Persie was the band aid he needed for his final title.

United's shape and style constantly changed throughout his career

To add: you could debate his trend for split strikers was relatively new for the prem in the last 90's

The lopsided shape wasn't Querioz's; that was Ferguson

[howard moon]

1 minute ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Ferguson started doing this back in 2002. It reached its peak in 2008.

In his twilight years Ferguson still did the same, but was at the point it needed rejuvinating. Van Persie was the band aid he needed for his final title

Yeah people forget he willingly broke up the Beckham - Keane - Scholes - Giggs quartet to accommodate Veron because he knew you could no longer win the CL with 2 box-to-box midfielders. He was playing variations on single striker formations before Mourinho arrived and made them vogue in the Prem.

[themadsheep2001]

So attached is the Team Setup:

GK: Sweeper Keeper (Defend): Distribute Quickly, Distribute to Full Backs

RB: Right Fullback (Support): N/A

CB: Centre Back (Defend): N/A

CB: Centre Back (Defend): N/A

LB: Left Wingback/Complete Wingback (Attack): N/A

DM: Defensive Midfielder (Support): Dribble Less (to bypass press can add more direct passes, or become a deep lying playmaker. This position changed frequently, depending on player)

RM: Right Winger (Attack): N/A

MCL: Roaming (or Advanced) Playmaker (Support): More Direct Passes. You could use the other support roles, as happened with different players used (Fletcher etc), but as with those, you lose the ability to spray passes across the pitch

AML: Inside Forward (Attack): N/A  Roaming, Mark Tighter, Stay Wider (this can change again, depending on whether you wanted him to spear through the middle or isolate the full back)

AMCR: Shadow Striker (Attack): Mark Tighter, Roaming.

CF: Complete Forward (Support): Mark Tighter, Roaming

 

With the roaming, you'll frequently find your all action trio interchanging positions

 

Early days, but this is how it stands. As with the real life emulation your left flank is ultra attacking, and can be prone to counters. Your left back is a key purchase, as with Evra he needs to be able to cover the entire flank, and have recovery ability.

[yonko]

7 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

It was Barca in 09, and he'd outdid them in 08.

 

In 2009 and 2011 Pep killed Fergie. In 2008 Fergie outdid Rijkaarjd thanks to Quieroz. Without him, nothing...his hands were shaking. SAF was great man manager, but tactically he was very basic. That's why he needed assistants who were good tactically like Quieroz.

[themadsheep2001]

1 minute ago, yonko said:

In 2009 and 2011 Pep killed Fergie. In 2008 Fergie outdid Rijkaarjd thanks to Quieroz. Without him, nothing...his hands were shaking. SAF was great man manager, but tactically he was very basic. That's why he needed assistants who were good tactically like Quieroz.

I'm going to have the exact same debate again.

For those who want it, the emulation is above. I'll more (and a proper write up over the easter weekend)

[yonko]

Just now, themadsheep2001 said:

I'm going to have the exact same debate again.

For those who want it, the emulation is above. I'll more (and a proper write up over the easter weekend)

There is no debate. It's a well known fact why Quieroz was his assistant. Rio Ferdinand and Scholes have shared the same opinion.

[howard moon]

50 minutes ago, yonko said:

In 2009 and 2011 Pep killed Fergie. In 2008 Fergie outdid Rijkaarjd thanks to Quieroz. Without him, nothing...his hands were shaking. SAF was great man manager, but tactically he was very basic. That's why he needed assistants who were good tactically like Quieroz.

In 2011 he took on possibly the greatest club side ever with Fabio, Valencia, Park, Hernandez and a past-their-best Ferdinand, Evra, Giggs and Vidic in the starting XI. I’m not sure tactical acumen came into the result. In fact winning the league and reaching a CL final with that team says more than losing that final it to Barca. 

[howard moon]

1 hour ago, themadsheep2001 said:

So attached is the Team Setup:

GK: Sweeper Keeper (Defend): Distribute Quickly, Distribute to Full Backs

RB: Right Fullback (Support): N/A

CB: Centre Back (Defend): N/A

CB: Centre Back (Defend): N/A

LB: Left Wingback/Complete Wingback (Attack): N/A

DM: Defensive Midfielder (Support): Dribble Less (to bypass press can add more direct passes, or become a deep lying playmaker. This position changed frequently, depending on player)

RM: Right Winger (Attack): N/A

MCL: Roaming (or Advanced) Playmaker (Support): More Direct Passes. You could use the other support roles, as happened with different players used (Fletcher etc), but as with those, you lose the ability to spray passes across the pitch

AML: Inside Forward (Attack): N/A  Roaming, Mark Tighter, Stay Wider (this can change again, depending on whether you wanted him to spear through the middle or isolate the full back)

AMCR: Shadow Striker (Attack): Mark Tighter, Roaming.

CF: Complete Forward (Support): Mark Tighter, Roaming

 

With the roaming, you'll frequently find your all action trio interchanging positions

 

Early days, but this is how it stands. As with the real life emulation your left flank is ultra attacking, and can be prone to counters. Your left back is a key purchase, as with Evra he needs to be able to cover the entire flank, and have recovery ability.

Really interesting set-up. 

I’m interested in what made you go for control and structured?

Also, as the formation is the defensive shape, why you’ve staggered the central midfielders?

[themadsheep2001]

36 minutes ago, howard moon said:

Really interesting set-up. 

I’m interested in what made you go for control and structured?

Also, as the formation is the defensive shape, why you’ve staggered the central midfielders?

United sought to control matches, but we're also not afraid of the counter attack. Short high tempo passing gives you that control, while also leaving the ability to counter quickly when the space opens up. They weren't relentless, but speed of movement was key to so much of the attack. 

Structured, for the long and short of it was how Ferguson set up. 

The formation screen is a mix of both iirc. 

The formation is chosen because Ronaldo would not initially drop back, partly because of who he was, but also for the counter if the ball was won back quickly. He dropped back if the opposition attack then became concerted 

The midfield operated as a staggered duo, with the all action AMC filling in offensively and defensively. It allows for them to be in a position to counter, but also falls back into a relatively tight defensive shape if the ball wasnt won back quickly 

[herne79]

@themadsheep2001  About bloody time .

Obviously a successful system but also an interesting choice in personnel for the roles especially when considering the PPMs.  That's where a lot of people go wrong imo: they either don't consider how different players will play the roles and/or get led up the garden path by the game giving them information about who "should" be playing where and in which role.

[yonko]

1 hour ago, howard moon said:

In 2011 he took on possibly the greatest club side ever with Fabio, Valencia, Park, Hernandez and a past-their-best Ferdinand, Evra, Giggs and Vidic in the starting XI. I’m not sure tactical acumen came into the result. In fact winning the league and reaching a CL final with that team says more than losing that final it to Barca. 

Past their best? Yeah, right. Why didn't Fergie use the 2008 tactic vs Barca in 2009 and 2011?

Winning the league and reaching the CL final is a sign of great man management by SAF, no doubt. But the fact is that he wasn't a tactical manager at all. Nothing wrong with that, mind you. 

[howard moon]

26 minutes ago, herne79 said:

@themadsheep2001  About bloody time .

Obviously a successful system but also an interesting choice in personnel for the roles especially when considering the PPMs.  That's where a lot of people go wrong imo: they either don't consider how different players will play the roles and/or get led up the garden path by the game giving them information about who "should" be playing where and in which role.

I second this. Ever since seeing the formation I’ve been wondering about Pogba as a SS rather than him being the RPM. 

On my FM17 save I’m playing as United and have 4 midfielders: Pogba, Saúl Niguez, Weigl and Ander Herrera. When wondering how to make this group work with a 07/08 style system, I’d always assumed Pogba would be in the Scholes role.

To be honest, I don’t think I have the right players in midfield to pull this off, but that’s a different matter... 

[Jean0987654321]

1 hour ago, yonko said:

Past their best? Yeah, right. Why didn't Fergie use the 2008 tactic vs Barca in 2009 and 2011?

Winning the league and reaching the CL final is a sign of great man management by SAF, no doubt. But the fact is that he wasn't a tactical manager at all. Nothing wrong with that, mind you. 

Good God Almighty. You can't be serious. A manager who survived almost 3 decades is NOT a tactical manager? My God :o

[Gegenklaus]

What does a tactical manager even means? 

[jc577]

Just now, Gegenklaus said:

What does a tactical manager even means? 

I was thinking the same thing  Probably coaches like Pep, Bielsa, Klopp etc. Basically any coach who emphasis position play and/or intense pressing 🙄

[Jean0987654321]

5 minutes ago, Gegenklaus said:

What does a tactical manager even means? 

You'll have to ask @yonko that. Tactics are part of being the manager. Even Bielsistos know that but Bielsa don't....

[Gegenklaus]

It was a serious question though.

[themadsheep2001]

1 hour ago, howard moon said:

I second this. Ever since seeing the formation I’ve been wondering about Pogba as a SS rather than him being the RPM. 

On my FM17 save I’m playing as United and have 4 midfielders: Pogba, Saúl Niguez, Weigl and Ander Herrera. When wondering how to make this group work with a 07/08 style system, I’d always assumed Pogba would be in the Scholes role.

To be honest, I don’t think I have the right players in midfield to pull this off, but that’s a different matter... 

Weigl DM

Saul playmaker 

Pogba AMC 

Herrera cover for Saul 

I'm tracking both of them long term. Fallen out a but with Herrera, would sell him for Saul if I get a decent offer 

[howard moon]

41 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Weigl DM

Saul playmaker 

Pogba AMC 

Herrera cover for Saul 

I'm tracking both of them long term. Fallen out a but with Herrera, would sell him for Saul if I get a decent offer 

Will have to have a think about Saul in that role. He doesn’t strike me as a playmaker, more a general all-rounder. The ideal player there would be Kroos.

When you post more, I’d be really interested to see how Pogba plays as a SS (and why you chose that instead of playing him deeper). Don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone play him there, and I never considered it as a possibility tbh.

Edited March 29, 2018 by howard moon

[themadsheep2001]

7 minutes ago, howard moon said:

Will have to have a think about Saul in that role. He doesn’t strike me as a playmaker, more a general all-rounder. The ideal player there would be Kroos.

When you post more, I’d be really interested to see how Pogba plays as a SS. Don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone play him there, and I never considered it as a possibility tbh.

Would be good to see a screenshot of him 

I have milinkovic-savic there at the moment 

[howard moon]

5 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Would be good to see a screenshot of him 

I have milinkovic-savic there at the moment 

This is him after one season with me. 

[Gegenklaus]

1 minute ago, howard moon said:

This is him after one season with me. 

That's a brilliant playmaker! High mentals (vision, decision, anticipation, composure concentration, off the ball), decent physicals and brilliant technique, mate.  

[warlock]

20 minutes ago, howard moon said:

This is him after one season with me. 

See that bit where it says his three best roles are all midfield playmaker?

[blackdevil]

Interesting choice of Pogba in the Tevez role and Sanchez in the Ronaldo position.  I'd have had Sanchez playing the Tevez or Rooney role and Pogba playing the Ronaldo role.

The reason for putting Pogba in the Ronaldo role is that he's quick, good in the air, can dribble and score goals.

 

This discussion does highlight the great thing about football, everyone has different views on the same game.

Edited March 29, 2018 by blackdevil

[felley]

19 hours ago, Jean0987654321 said:

Good God Almighty. You can't be serious. A manager who survived almost 3 decades is NOT a tactical manager? My God :o

There seem to be a lot of black and white views floating around here. In saying that Fergie recognised his own strengths and limitations by calling on help and expertise from others is not the same thing as saying he was terrible at tactics.

He was an innovator himself many times but in this specific period relied heavily on Queiroz's input regarding shape and structure.

@themadsheep2001 Interesting set-up but I honestly feel you are taking elements from the 07/08 side and warping it into something slightly different that works for you. As others have outlined, obviously there's always going to be debate to be had around roles and fitting the current squad into that framework due to attributes/PPM's etc. but I really don't think a Winger and RPM represent what United were up to that season.

[yonko]

19 hours ago, Jean0987654321 said:

Good God Almighty. You can't be serious. A manager who survived almost 3 decades is NOT a tactical manager? My God :o

If that is your criteria for tactical manager...Good God Almighty.

SAF had many great qualities that helped him not just survive 3 decades but achieve so much success. But tactics is not one of those qualities. Even players who played under him have said that wasn't his strong suit. And I don't remember him introducing anything innovative in terms of tactics. 

[yonko]

19 hours ago, Gegenklaus said:

What does a tactical manager even means? 

Someone who is obsessed with and is good at the tactical side of the game. Introduces tactical concepts and tactical development. Micro management and tactical break down for each of his players as well as the opposition. Someone who is good a communications the tactical side of the game to the players.

Examples: Bielsa, Pochetino, Pep, Mourinho, Klopp, Cruyff, Sampaoli

Note: other managers do not ignore the tactical side of course. But they keep it simple, it is not their strength, rather they focus on man management and/or recruitment, good selection.

[themadsheep2001]

20 minutes ago, felley said:

There seem to be a lot of black and white views floating around here. In saying that Fergie recognised his own strengths and limitations by calling on help and expertise from others is not the same thing as saying he was terrible at tactics.

He was an innovator himself many times but in this specific period relied heavily on Queiroz's input regarding shape and structure.

@themadsheep2001 Interesting set-up but I honestly feel you are taking elements from the 07/08 side and warping it into something slightly different that works for you. As others have outlined, obviously there's always going to be debate to be had around roles and fitting the current squad into that framework due to attributes/PPM's etc. but I really don't think a Winger and RPM represent what United were up to that season.

There were 3 seasons and the roles and players changed. I haven't warped anything thank you very much 

The cm role varied on who was there, as did the DM and wide mid. Nani could dribble and carry the ball out wide, Hargreaves couldnt really, Giggs could dribble but didn't have the legs. Roles changed to fit the players. 

Scholes dictated play at Cm, covered a lot of ground, but covered less and less, Fletcher didn't dictate. 

[themadsheep2001]

22 hours ago, herne79 said:

@themadsheep2001  About bloody time .

Obviously a successful system but also an interesting choice in personnel for the roles especially when considering the PPMs.  That's where a lot of people go wrong imo: they either don't consider how different players will play the roles and/or get led up the garden path by the game giving them information about who "should" be playing where and in which role.

I've been busy! 

But yeah, with those three years there are two things to consider: the overall framework, and individual roles. The former stayed roughly the same, but the latter could change based on the players and opposition, even the formation could swap and change. Even without role changes, the players would play it differently. Mata is a very different SS to Pogba when he plays. 

I'm yet to try Pogba as the heartbeat, mostly because I've been trying to get Savic into the side, I'm sure he will be very different with his PPMs

For example, Lingard could be a wide mid attack on the right. I don't really have a fading pace winger for Giggs. 

If I had Koke, I could have that Hargreaves style right mid. 

 

[Gegenklaus]

53 minutes ago, yonko said:

Someone who is obsessed with and is good at the tactical side of the game. Introduces tactical concepts and tactical development. Micro management and tactical break down for each of his players as well as the opposition. Someone who is good a communications the tactical side of the game to the players.

Examples: Bielsa, Pochetino, Pep, Mourinho, Klopp, Cruyff, Sampaoli

Note: other managers do not ignore the tactical side of course. But they keep it simple, it is not their strength, rather they focus on man management and/or recruitment, good selection.

Thanks, Yonko. And interesting that you mention Klopp. I never thought of him that way but after reading a lot about the game against City, and how they managed to attack City with their press, really opened my eyes about Klopp. He is much more than just heavy-metal football. Thanks for the answer. 

[yonko]

1 hour ago, Gegenklaus said:

Thanks, Yonko. And interesting that you mention Klopp. I never thought of him that way but after reading a lot about the game against City, and how they managed to attack City with their press, really opened my eyes about Klopp. He is much more than just heavy-metal football. Thanks for the answer. 

Klopp is a proponent of the Geggenpressing. He's actually an interesting breed for me. On the surface he looks more like a man management/players manager considering how emotional he is and how he connects with his players. But underneath it all, he's into tactics. He has given Pep Guardiola the most problems over the years. Liverpool are perfectly equipped and managed by Klopp to play again Pep's City. It will be fascinating two games in the CL 1/4 finals, can't wait.

[Gegenklaus]

45 minutes ago, yonko said:

Klopp is a proponent of the Geggenpressing. He's actually an interesting breed for me. On the surface he looks more like a man management/players manager considering how emotional he is and how he connects with his players. But underneath it all, he's into tactics. He has given Pep Guardiola the most problems over the years. Liverpool are perfectly equipped and managed by Klopp to play again Pep's City. It will be fascinating two games in the CL 1/4 finals, can't wait.

Not to deviate the topic of this thread too much, but I agree. I can't wait for those two to meet. Last season's Liverpool and this current side seems different, and it is evident that Klopp changed the system after the first match against Tottenham which has improved the defense is quite interesting. And the pressing - at it's peak - is jaw-dropping. 

[goqs06]

On 3/29/2018 at 23:18, themadsheep2001 said:

So attached is the Team Setup:

GK: Sweeper Keeper (Defend): Distribute Quickly, Distribute to Full Backs

RB: Right Fullback (Support): N/A

CB: Centre Back (Defend): N/A

CB: Centre Back (Defend): N/A

LB: Left Wingback/Complete Wingback (Attack): N/A

DM: Defensive Midfielder (Support): Dribble Less (to bypass press can add more direct passes, or become a deep lying playmaker. This position changed frequently, depending on player)

RM: Right Winger (Attack): N/A

MCL: Roaming (or Advanced) Playmaker (Support): More Direct Passes. You could use the other support roles, as happened with different players used (Fletcher etc), but as with those, you lose the ability to spray passes across the pitch

AML: Inside Forward (Attack): N/A  Roaming, Mark Tighter, Stay Wider (this can change again, depending on whether you wanted him to spear through the middle or isolate the full back)

AMCR: Shadow Striker (Attack): Mark Tighter, Roaming.

CF: Complete Forward (Support): Mark Tighter, Roaming

 

With the roaming, you'll frequently find your all action trio interchanging positions

 

Early days, but this is how it stands. As with the real life emulation your left flank is ultra attacking, and can be prone to counters. Your left back is a key purchase, as with Evra he needs to be able to cover the entire flank, and have recovery ability.

@themadsheep2001 this is quite spot on except for a few roles... could you explain why van der sar is a SK, and Scholes a RPM/AP - Scholes was not much a dribbler - he was good because of his passing and quick movements. I would opt for a CM (S) with lots of PIs. TI are good though. And its already been mentioned that Ronaldo played mostly on the right flank that season.

On 3/30/2018 at 03:23, jc577 said:

I was thinking the same thing  Probably coaches like Pep, Bielsa, Klopp etc. Basically any coach who emphasis position play and/or intense pressing 🙄

Not all tactical coaches are like that though - Mourinho, Ancelotti, Mancini, Zidane anyone?

On 3/30/2018 at 04:45, themadsheep2001 said:

Would be good to see a screenshot of him 

I have milinkovic-savic there at the moment 

He could be the next Scholes/Keane if we sign him and nurture him to become a team leader.

On 3/30/2018 at 05:43, blackdevil said:

Interesting choice of Pogba in the Tevez role and Sanchez in the Ronaldo position.  I'd have had Sanchez playing the Tevez or Rooney role and Pogba playing the Ronaldo role.

The reason for putting Pogba in the Ronaldo role is that he's quick, good in the air, can dribble and score goals.

 

This discussion does highlight the great thing about football, everyone has different views on the same game.

Sanchez would work in the Tevez role as both have very high work rate.

13 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

There were 3 seasons and the roles and players changed. I haven't warped anything thank you very much 

The cm role varied on who was there, as did the DM and wide mid. Nani could dribble and carry the ball out wide, Hargreaves couldnt really, Giggs could dribble but didn't have the legs. Roles changed to fit the players. 

Scholes dictated play at Cm, covered a lot of ground, but covered less and less, Fletcher didn't dictate. 

Fletcher destroys play like a BWM, not a playmaker.

10 hours ago, Gegenklaus said:

Not to deviate the topic of this thread too much, but I agree. I can't wait for those two to meet. Last season's Liverpool and this current side seems different, and it is evident that Klopp changed the system after the first match against Tottenham which has improved the defense is quite interesting. And the pressing - at it's peak - is jaw-dropping. 

@Gegenklaus I don't mind any talk of tactical acumen being mentioned, it's ok to hold such conducive discussion here!

Edited March 31, 2018 by goqs06

[themadsheep2001]

1 hour ago, goqs06 said:

@themadsheep2001 this is quite spot on except for a few roles... could you explain why van der sar is a SK, and Scholes a RPM/AP - Scholes was not much a dribbler - he was good because of his passing and quick movements. I would opt for a CM (S) with lots of PIs. TI are good though. And its already been mentioned that Ronaldo played mostly on the right flank that season.

Not all tactical coaches are like that though - Mourinho, Ancelotti, Mancini, Zidane anyone?

He could be the next Scholes/Keane if we sign him and nurture him to become a team leader.

Sanchez would work in the Tevez role as both have very high work rate.

Fletcher destroys play like a BWM, not a playmaker.

@Gegenklaus I don't mind any talk of tactical acumen being mentioned, it's ok to hold such conducive discussion here!

1) The Keeper doesn't actually matter here, I've used Gk defend. What matters are the instructions on moving the ball quickly. 

2) the roaming playmaker isn't really dribbling, what he is doing is receiving and passing constantly in a sea of space, its that part of Scholes I'm replicating. The ball needs to be finding him as the key playmaker hence no CM Support role 

3) Ronaldo played on the left and the right over the three years . I'm using the left sided set up because I don't have a fading left winger, but I do have the outright right winger and right mid options that United have 

[herne79]

@goqs06 No need to promote your own thread in other people's thanks.