Historical Regens

[nwlufc]

An option to play with Historical Regens.

It could start with being as simple as your Youth Intake containing a club legend/ cult hero. If the game creates a Pele (A world's best Brazilian forward) why couldn't that actually be 16yr old Pele?

 

Legends Databases that dump 100's of world class players into the game at start up are very popular - there is the support for this.

[KUBI]

You would need a license from every player or their relatives, which makes it quite unrealistic.

[nwlufc]

There's a Baseball Management Sim that does this - Out of the Park - is that different do you know? Because I can't imagine anybody going to the lengths you say would be needed and their historical databases are very well built.

[nie jem frytek]

Football Manager 2016 isn't even available to buy on Steam now due to licensing. FM 2017 won't be available in the near future. Imagine how much would FM cost if they would actually add Pele etc.? You would be better with buying your own low league club and managing it yourself in real life.

[santy001]

Now entirely speculation on my behalf. But rights in the US with their sports and how players are a member of a particular body and such suggests perhaps there's something there where the organisation keeps rights or is a central administration for them. The players pretty much always belong to the league which isn't the case in most countries outside of the US.

Or potentially they flat up just don't care.

While even the financial side might not be prohibitive, how do you go about getting contact details for those rights holders/managers now. 

A very real problem is rating them as well, while FIFA likes to pretend that the legends of yesteryear are comparable to todays players, but defending and attacking have moved on. Fitness levels have changed massively, while their technical attributes would be comparable to the best of today, very few could fairly be claimed to have comparable stamina/endurance/natural fitness etc. 

[Guest]

On 18/10/2017 at 00:24, nwlufc said:

There's a Baseball Management Sim that does this - Out of the Park - is that different do you know? Because I can't imagine anybody going to the lengths you say would be needed and their historical databases are very well built.

Much easier to buy an all encompassing license from a single organisation such as MLB, much trickier when you have to do the same with a game of with a significantly wider global presence & one that woudl find it difficult to assign attributes to historical players than a sport that has detailed statistical records.

That's before you even venture into the workload compiling all the data plus the issues of whether those generated players have the same development path as their real life counter part & why are they needed when the game world already self-populates with new players.

[michaeltmurrayuk]

On 10/20/2017 at 00:20, santy001 said:

Now entirely speculation on my behalf. But rights in the US with their sports and how players are a member of a particular body and such suggests perhaps there's something there where the organisation keeps rights or is a central administration for them. The players pretty much always belong to the league which isn't the case in most countries outside of the US.

It's not even possible in the US, EA were sued and lost for including historic teams in Madden a couple of years back - meaning you need to sign a license with every historic player you want to include (plus another one for the historic teams), its possible for current players the NFL might have changed their terms so when current players retire the NFL keeps their rights. And that was for the NFL who pretty much own the players.

For football it is pretty much the same situation, with FIFPro (players union) being the ones who license most if not all of the individual player rights, it then becomes a question of whether they still have the rights to license retired players and then there is the question of how much money they'd want for that license (as it would be a separate license as I doubt any retired players are currently getting royalties under the current license as they aren't included in the games).

Then as Barside said even if you could get the license, you then have the problem of the research (though most of it would have been collected for older FM games so you could extract some data from those databases for players from the last 20 years, but you'd still need to reformat and update it for the current database) as well as determining which version of the player to pick unless you have several (which creates even more work).

[Jakarooney]

There’s  plenty of databases. people have made with hundereds of legends from all around the world on steam workshop. Very easy to implement and use, although it can get a little cluttered with so many potentially world class players knocking about. Still fun though.

[Spurs08]

On 21/10/2017 at 17:19, michaeltmurrayuk said:

It's not even possible in the US, EA were sued and lost for including historic teams in Madden a couple of years back - meaning you need to sign a license with every historic player you want to include (plus another one for the historic teams), its possible for current players the NFL might have changed their terms so when current players retire the NFL keeps their rights. And that was for the NFL who pretty much own the players.

For football it is pretty much the same situation, with FIFPro (players union) being the ones who license most if not all of the individual player rights, it then becomes a question of whether they still have the rights to license retired players and then there is the question of how much money they'd want for that license (as it would be a separate license as I doubt any retired players are currently getting royalties under the current license as they aren't included in the games).

Then as Barside said even if you could get the license, you then have the problem of the research (though most of it would have been collected for older FM games so you could extract some data from those databases for players from the last 20 years, but you'd still need to reformat and update it for the current database) as well as determining which version of the player to pick unless you have several (which creates even more work).

There's also the huge problem that at some point in time SI pretty radically changed how they rated players. Certainly in the FM07 eras a lot of top Prem players had several 20s while still being at a reasonable CA, and at some stage - likely gradually - this changed and those kind of attributes were reserved purely for the likes of Messi and Ronaldo. There's a good chance this is all too subjective for a formula to do a decent job of converting old attributes into ones appropriate for the current game, very much limiting the value of old databases as a resource.

[Neil Brock]

Reviewed so locked.