Jambo98 Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 So after someone found and revived last years thread, it seemed like enough interest to post this again and try and generate some fun. For a bit of background, the threads for the last 3 years. The experiment ran a year before that as well, but was not my creation and i think the very first thread might be MIA after the various forum changes. http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/419757-FM15-The-community-formation-experiment http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/387570-How-important-is-a-quot-formation-quot-A-community-tactical-experiment (Not sure why 2 of the links paste as normal links, and only the last as an insert / preview.......never mind! ) Background / Premise This is really designed as a bit of fun. A change for people to try something different in tactical terms. It is not a "challenge" as such - there are no points award, not league tables or anything like that. It is an experiment around challenging our ideas of how much a "formation" truley matters. There have been various great threads over the last 2 or 3 years specifically challenging that fact, and this is just taking that concept and adding an element of getting users outside their comfort zone and trying something they might never have tried before. Last year we had more interest than ever, including @Rashidi being kind enough to get involved and feature this in an entire series on his popular youtube channel General Principles Everyone has to use the same database (17.2.1 i think we are on now?) - with no database edits Other add ons are fine - its only important that the starting squads are the same for everyone Past experience the same for everyone - "international experience" for everyone and coaching badge the same (highest level) Everyone has to use the same starting team - We would agree in advance, and if it was popular maybe run 2 versions with different teams Inward transfers limited to 2 permanent signings, one loan signing (a bit arbitrary, but its how i vaguely remember the original thread) No limitations on outward transfers / loans The experiment tends to be about what you can achieve in 1 single season, but there is no reason you cannot continue beyond that, including providing tactical updates in here It is preferable to play this on "full fat" FM, rather than FM touch as, i believe, the later has quite a difference in terms of tactical familiarity. Given that this experiment likely involves quite a bit of tactical maneuvering, it would mean we dont compare apples with apples. That said, it is designed to be fun and not competitive, so if for some reason you really refuse to play the full game and must play the "kids version" ( ) Then i wont stop you taking part. I do however reserve the right to mock you. Updates in this thread are highly encouraged - Obviously with a tactical slant given this is TTF, but give as much detail as you like - Telling / showing us how you took your allocated formation and made it work is what it is all about - Share ideas, give feedback to others, all the things this forum does well in general. Tactics Each user who wants to take part gets given one of the default formations - I use a complex machine (e.g, a bit of basic VB code...) to make sure the picks are random, they are not allocated by me. The formation (that is to say the player slots on the pitch), must not be changed in anyway. So if you get 5 - 4 - 1 you must keep a flat back 5, a flat midfield 4 and a single striker in the central slot. Any other tactical options can be customised - This is the essence of the experiment - using roles, duties, team and player instructions, you can try to take a basic shape and make it function in different ways We have tended to exclude the "most popular" default formations. So 442 flat and 4231, and of course 41221 which is probably the most used). It can be a bit subjective, and you can argue to exclude a few others but that sort of limits the number of people we can involve If we get huge interest, like last year, we can easily start to allocate a second round of formations. No huge issue if we eventually end up with 2 people using the same formation If the interest is sustained, we could run a second iteration with a different team (also relies on me not losing interest in organising!) NEW THIS YEAR - You will see the actual process of the formation being allocated, less there be any suggestions that i manipulate things! (I can just tell how excited you are.....) The Team Ah always the hardest part! We will never get a team that everyone will agree on, but as a general guide: Avoid the EPL, as in general we all know that league so well. There is a nice additional aspect to this being a team that a lot of us will not have managed, or come up against quite as often Generally stick to big Euro leagues - So Italy, Spain, Germany are the obvious ones. Holland / Portugal possible but the squads outside the CL Teams there can be a bit patchwwork Avoid teams who are in the Champions League - The challenge of making your formation work is that little bit more fun if you are not a true top tier team If we can pick a team who are in the Europa, that certainly adds an extra aspect Stick to teams who are probably expected to finish outside the CL spots, but also stick to teams likely to be in the top 8 / 10 to give us balance between making the best of the players we have, and not being too hard by having a terrible squad Try to find a team with a relatively balanced squad, since transfers are limited and the formations will vary a lot. I will do second post detailing the suggested teams shortly and we can get going! If you want to be involved, just post saying so and comment on the team if you like, will aim to start drawing teams tomorrow, unless we agree on a team earlier! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 10, 2017 Author Share Posted February 10, 2017 The team ok so @AndySummers was kind enough to summarise some of the teams in the old thread. Ideally we would go for a Europa team, in my opinion, and we did France last year so probably rule that out along with the EPL. A quick glance at Holland and Portugal makes me think that beyond the "big 3" in those respective countries, the squads are probably not right for this (possibly AZ in holland but a bit low on quality). Italy Sassuolo - Europa qualified, predicted position 9th - Personally i really like this option. A nice varied squad, one potential superstar and a few other strong players. Also the faiytale aspect to there recent history Fiorentina - Europa qualified, predicted position 6th - Used in this experiment a few years ago, so possibly not one to repeat although a decent enough squad Lazio - Not in Europe, predicted position 7th - A nice varied squad, and i think the very original side used in the first version of this (long since lost i think). Sampdoria - Not in Europe, predicted position 11th - Think this would be a bit of a stretch in terms of squad quality and balance / versatility to be honest Torino - Not in Europe, predicted position 8th - An interesting one, more balanced squad, some nice bits of quality if you can hold onto them Spain Celta - Europa qualified, predicted position 8th - Another really interesting candidate, good quality and variety, in a very tough league Athletic - Europa qualified, predicted position 6th - My fave team to manage, but not sure how suitable to this. The basque limitation the obvious issue here, but a really varied starting squad Soceidad - Not in Europe, predicted position 10th - Possibly not quite a versatile enough squad, but an interesting team with a top half prediction Valencia - Not in Europe, predicted position 5th - Probably the strongest starting squad on the list, good variety. Possibly "too strong" in terms of how we generally go for this challenge? Germany Hertha - Europa qualified, predicted position 9th - Quite a versatile, yet not all that interesting seeming squad? Mainz - Europa qualified, predicted position 7th - Somewhat the Sassuolo of germany, small club but quite a big squad. Would be a big challenge, but an interesting back story again Schalke - Europa qualified, predicted position 4th - Similar to Valencia, in that strong squad and arguably "too good" Wolfsburg - Not in europe, predicted position 6th - A good sized and experienced squad with a spread of positions, and quite a large bank balance i think given the clubs backing I am sure we could add plenty others, but that is my attempt at a summary of the main contenders. My personaly choices would probably be Sassuolo, Celta or Wolfsburg. If pushed i would probably go for Sass, as Serie A is also one of my fave leagues for the tactical variety in opposing teams. TEAM SELECTED = SASSUOLO Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 10, 2017 Author Share Posted February 10, 2017 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 10, 2017 Author Share Posted February 10, 2017 reserved Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fosse Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 How many people can participate? I'm in, Celta would be my choice Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westy8chimp Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 7 minutes ago, Fosse said: How many people can participate? 1. Fosse - Celta Vigo (if they are indeed an option) 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7. 8. 9. 10. youre banned you didn't read the OP ... everyone will be the same team I throw my hat in the ring unless there is an expected time frame for updates etc... I only get to play a few hours per week Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fosse Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Just now, westy8chimp said: youre banned you didn't read the OP ... everyone will be the same team I throw my hat in the ring unless there is an expected time frame for updates etc... I only get to play a few hours per week I know, we've not decided on a team yet so they were my vote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 10, 2017 Author Share Posted February 10, 2017 No limit on how man can take part. I dont tend to do a full on vote for teams, as we want to decide fairly quickly, but i tend to go with a consensus of opinions in the thread. That or i just become a dictator and select one There is no limit to the speed. There is no start and end point to this. People can join at any time, and it goes on as long as people want to keep posting updates. Post 2 updated with my view of the teams available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armistice Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 I would choose to play as Mainz really, Spanish league tends to get boring imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westy8chimp Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Sampdoria or Lazio would be my vote... lovely kits . Celta have a few stars but may be too favourable to certain tactics to get the best out of them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakob8b Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Awesome, would love to get in on this! I'll obviously play with whatever team but Sassuolo looks the most interesting to me. Celta and Wolfsburg would be my top pick from the other leagues. Let's pick a team and get started, can't wait to see what formation I get! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJanitor Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 In. Sampdoria or Fiorentina take my vote! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thels Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 I'd like to join this. Don't mind which team is picked, maybe avoid Bundesliga for the lack of licenses Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
herne79 Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Good to see this back . Count me in (although a little pushed for time atm). Sassuolo or Fiorentina gets my vote. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bitner Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Like the idea, but i don't think i have the time to actually take part. But i'm following 4sho. <3 Cheers, Bitner Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndySummers Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 I'd be happy with any of the leagues if I get in on this, but for the sake of expressing a preference I'd be biased towards Serie A. Lots of competition and, I would hope, tactical variety and it is less awash with money. I don't know if this sort of thing is 'encouraged' so I won't post the specifics, but those Italian clubs all have a very similar range of transfer funds and bank balances. Within +/-£5m for the transfer funds, £7m for the overall bank balance. There is a much greater variation in La Liga and the Bundesliga. If the intent is to showcase formations and to manage player resources, the equality in Serie A is appealing. My favourite three would be: 1. Lazio 2. Sassuolo 3. Torino I'd be happy to update a 'records' spreadsheet to highlight 1st season performance for sake of comparison; everyone's league record, golden boot and assisters list. Just a little stat sheet for added interest (highly dependant on everyone playing fairly!). If it helps to encourage players to post season reviews and that sort of thing, all the better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldywaldy Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 In! Sassuolo or Mainz have my preference, but I'm good either way. I'm just hoping I end up with a semi-reasonable formation this year Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanno11 Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 I would like to get involved. I would prefer Serie A, for a bit of a change, but don't mind the club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadAss88 Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I like the idea and will gladly join! I find the following teams the most interesting : Hamburg SV & Lazio Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 Ok so as predicted, a lot of varied opinions Serie A seems the fave so far, which i think is fair. We did Ligue 1 and la Liga before that, so back to Serie A. Sassuolo probably emerging as just the fave, with Lazio, Fiorentina and Samp all getting a couple of mentions. I am still scared by Fiorentina. The first running of this, we had them and i lost the league title in the 92min of the last game, by one goal on goal difference. Will make a final call in the morning, so post a few more views and i will start to assign tactics to everyone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bantamtim Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I'd be up for this - need something to get me back into FM properly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wereldbol Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 i'm in and i vote for sassuolo as well Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TacticsGuy Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I'm in, I don't mind which team Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 Post 3 updated with the full list of default formations in this years game. It seems like Sassoulo is going to be the way to go. Will look at confirming and allocating formations shortly Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eriktous Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I'd like to join, as well. I don't have enough knowledge of clubs and competitions to have any preferences. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 Right time to start allocation formations thebn, now that we are settled on the team! @Fosse - 4141 DM Asymetric AML @westy8chimp - 4411 2 DM @nightwalker22 - 3421 DM @Jakob8b - 532 WB Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 @TheJanitor - 5122 DM Narrow @thels - 451 @herne79 - 343 @AndySummers - 4312 Narrow Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 @waldywaldy - 4141 DM (NB - this one might fall into the "too common" category - Shout if you think so and we can redraw you) @Sanno11 - 523 Narrow @BadAss88 - 4222 DM Narrow @Bantamtim - 4411 (NB - again could be classed as "too common" - shout if you think so) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 @wereldbol - 4240 DM Wide @TacticsGuy - 433 Narrow @eriktous - 4123 Narrow @Jambo98 - 4321 DM Narrow Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 Right, phew, sorry for the huge long posts - if the gif's showing the selection happening are too much, let me know That should be everyone allocated who has asked to be part of it so far - Hope i have not missed anyone! Shout if i have and of course for anyone else wanting to get involved, just leave your name here and i will allocate you a formation soon as i notice. As for my "draw"........ 4321 DM Narrow.......sheez. No idea what to do with that shape, which i suppose is exactly the point! It is not actually a 4321, but rather a 41221 narrow on the formation screen (Note to SI....your default tactic naming could probably be improved / simplified!). Will have a look now and a think and see what ideas i can come up with! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndySummers Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Hmm, the one formation I was hoping to avoid was the 442 diamond and this is as close as it gets. Just having a quick look over my test load, it is about the worst formation for Matteo Politano, and it is a big blow having Simone Missiroli injured in a midfield-heavy formation. Already having wild ideas of doing something funky with the '1' and using Matri's 18 off the ball attribute here. Timo Letschert could make for an interesting fullback here, as Gazzola and Lirola are underwhelming. Early thoughts indicate this may be the XI heroes (roles not selected), but I'll set up properly later and maybe look to begin, running this alongside my Argentinos save. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 Is Berardi not out for months? Do i have an out of date DB or something? He starts as injured for 3 months when i loaded up a test save? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
poobington Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I'm in! Just need to buy the game now Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJanitor Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Completely caught me off guard, both in term of team choice and formation-wise. Never tried a flat back five before. Would be an interesting one, some good talents in Sassuolo who can fit different roles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TacticsGuy Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 4-3-3 narrow, looking forward to it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TacticsGuy Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 How do I upload screenshots or images on here? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndySummers Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 20 minutes ago, TacticsGuy said: How do I upload screenshots or images on here? There's a 'choose files' option just below the text box when you post. So: Take your screenshot in-game with the F12 button. Locate it on your hard-drive, crop it in something like Paint if needed. Select the file from your PC, upload it within your post. Any images you upload will sit in bulk at the bottom of your post. If you set the cursor for where in your post you want the image to sit and then click on the '+' icon on the pic, it will drop it into the desired location. The location of screenshots on your hard drive is a bit obscure. But if you right click on 'Football Manager 2017' within Steam, choose 'View Screenshots' and then 'Show on disk' it will take you to where they are stored on your PC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndySummers Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 51 minutes ago, Jambo98 said: Is Berardi not out for months? Do i have an out of date DB or something? He starts as injured for 3 months when i loaded up a test save? He wasn't on my info load yesterday. But he now is on the game I've just set up. Jeez, talk about a kick in the teeth! I assume there's been a recent update, as I haven't changed any settings in that time? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fosse Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 1 hour ago, TheJanitor said: Completely caught me off guard, both in term of team choice and formation-wise. Never tried a flat back five before. Would be an interesting one, some good talents in Sassuolo who can fit different roles. I had that last year, I found it quite frustrating because the wingback's starting position is quite deep and I struggled for width but that could just be a failure of mine Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakob8b Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 2 hours ago, Jambo98 said: @Jakob8b - 532 WB Great, I'm normally not one for 3 (or 5) men defences, so this should be a nice challenge. Look forward to getting started! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdvancedStrayMaker Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Could I join please? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
herne79 Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 343, nice . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeekyABC Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Would it be possible to enter this challenge please? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgevolker Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I would like to join too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armistice Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Nice, I've experimented recently with 3 defenders formations so I am looking forward to it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westy8chimp Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Quote @westy8chimp - 4411 2 DM haven't time to load a game with sass tonight.. but not a bad tactic .. already some ideas of how ill use it in my three slots ...lends itself quite nicely to a counter tactic ... and an attacking 'clear ball to flanks' strategy. hopefully there is some pace in the wide areas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
herne79 Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Thanks for taking the time for doing this again @Jambo98. Nice one . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 @poobington - 4231 DM Narrow @DeekyABC - 3142 DM @sgevolker - 424 Wide @AdvancedStrayMaker - 442 Diamond Narrow Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldywaldy Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 I'll take a less common formation if possible. If I end up with 3 or 5 at the back I'm calling shenanigans on the draw though Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo98 Posted February 11, 2017 Author Share Posted February 11, 2017 Yeah thats fair enough, i think 4141 is pretty commonly used.....so... @waldywaldy - 4123 DM Narrow Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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