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Kurt Hoo

Mourinho retires in 3 years and Guardiola sacked everytime

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i choose Man United .

Mourinho can't get job after 3 years and retires...

and Guardiola he's sacked everytime after the 1st season due to Man City's poor results.

Nearly every Manager in FM likes crazy attcacking which really makes me wonder.

i call them bugs...

 

by the way one of my little kid's PA drops from 174 to 136(due to a 3 weeks knee injury?).:eek:

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4 minutes ago, Kurt Hoo said:

and Guardiola he's sacked everytime after the 1st season due to Man City's poor results.

We'll have to wait and see if that is really unrealistic.

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21 minutes ago, Kurt Hoo said:

one of my little kid's PA drops from 174 to 136(due to a 3 weeks knee injury?).

If that's what has happened please raise it in the bugs forum along with an upload of your saved game.

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50 minutes ago, herne79 said:

If that's what has happened please raise it in the bugs forum along with an upload of your saved game.

 

well, it's true but i only have the latest save. in fact i heard this before in chinese FM forum.

and i think the Mourinho issue is surreal, after all ,he can come to china to manage...

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I trialled a few saves early on and Guardiola always gets sacked by an under-performing City.

edit: Yes, Klopp gets the chop every time too!

Mourinho does alright. In my career save I'm in my 5th year and he's still there.

Maybe in your save he's still traumatised at being replaced by a nobody!

Edited by phnompenhandy

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In my saves its not Pep, but Klopp who gets fired in the first year every time. Pep usually does alright and then moves on to an international role. And Mou always wins everything with ManU and never leaves. In ever one they win PL titles, CL titles and FA cup titles.

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4 hours ago, Kurt Hoo said:

by the way one of my little kid's PA drops from 174 to 136(due to a 3 weeks knee injury?).:eek:


PA doesn't change at any point.

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If Mourninho is remaining unemployed, its likely due to a combination of his reputation and preferences. He has one of the highest starting reputations of any manager. He also has some preferences that will limit where he will accept work. And a lot of top managers may not ever choose to go manage in China because of the reputation levels not being high enough.

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2 minutes ago, isignedupfornorealreason said:

Yeah it does. Serious injuries can drop the maximum PA always has done.

Nope. Injuries can reduce the chance of the player REACHING the PA set in the database. But the PA is a completely static piece of data, once a player has gotten a PA set by the game, that PA will never, ever change, no matter what happens. Do note that I am talking about the actual hidden number in the database, not any coach or scout assessment in game, as that is a completely different thing from the PA number.

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53 minutes ago, isignedupfornorealreason said:

Yeah it does. Serious injuries can drop the maximum PA always has done.

and in some cases, in a sudden PA changes without any reason..drop or rise..

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10 minutes ago, Kurt Hoo said:

and in some cases, in a sudden PA changes without any reason..drop or rise..

This does not happen and should not happen. If you have an example, post it in the bugs forum to be examined by SI.

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14 hours ago, isignedupfornorealreason said:

Yeah it does. Serious injuries can drop the maximum PA always has done.

Three weeks knee injury is hardly serious though, is it? 

 

And regarding sacking, there`s quite a lot of managers getting sacked by December/January, however that might be the case IRL aswell, haven`t compared numbers. I

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17 hours ago, oulzac said:

In my saves its not Pep, but Klopp who gets fired in the first year every time. Pep usually does alright and then moves on to an international role. And Mou always wins everything with ManU and never leaves. In ever one they win PL titles, CL titles and FA cup titles.

Same here. Mourinho stayed at Man United until 2024, won 5 league titles (4 in a row) as well as a couple of Champions League titles. He's now at PSG.

Jurgen Klopp rarely makes it past December with Liverpool and in easily 20 different saves he has NEVER managed 2 seasons with Liverpool. In my current long-term save he was sacked in December, managed Valencia briefly, BMG for 6 months and then retired :/ 

Pep is similar to Klopp in getting sacked within a year every time. He's currently with Spurs (has been there for several years) and has not won a single trophy, rarely even qualifying for Europe.

Edited by ..Valhalla..

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21 minutes ago, ..Valhalla.. said:

Same here. Mourinho stayed at Man United until 2024, won 5 league titles (4 in a row) as well as a couple of Champions League titles. He's now at PSG.

Jurgen Klopp rarely makes it past December with Liverpool and in easily 20 different saves he has NEVER managed 2 seasons with Liverpool. In my current long-term save he was sacked in December, managed Valencia briefly, BMG for 6 months and then retired :/ 

Pep is similar to Klopp in getting sacked within a year every time. He's currently with Spurs (has been there for several years) and has not won a single trophy, rarely even qualifying for Europe.

 

i believe their obsessive about attacking make themselves be sacked. SI should improve it.

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Just as you have expectations from your club's Board, so will AI managers.

Mourinho / Guardiola will in all likelihood be expected to win the Premier League and perform very well in Europe / domestic cup competitions.  They both can't win the PL or the FA Cup or whatever else, so it wouldn't be surprising if one/both get the sack - especially if you are doing well with your chosen club.  Don't forget your impact here as well.

fyi in my latest save nobody got the sack after the first season, not even Wenger who finished 7th with Arsenal (they won the FA Cup which probably saved him).

Different people will have different experiences, which is part of the fun of the game.

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Pep often gets sacked by City on my game but Mourinho tends to do well.  Guardiola normally bounces back though and is managing Arsenal in 2027 on my current save

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Guest

My game is in December 2017, and Chelsea are on their third manager already (one of them was a caretaker).

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On 30/12/2016 at 13:15, Kurt Hoo said:

by the way one of my little kid's PA drops from 174 to 136(due to a 3 weeks knee injury?).:eek:

I think the more relevant question is how do you know his PA dropped from 174 to 136?

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7 hours ago, herne79 said:

Just as you have expectations from your club's Board, so will AI managers.

Mourinho / Guardiola will in all likelihood be expected to win the Premier League and perform very well in Europe / domestic cup competitions.  They both can't win the PL or the FA Cup or whatever else, so it wouldn't be surprising if one/both get the sack - especially if you are doing well with your chosen club.  Don't forget your impact here as well.

fyi in my latest save nobody got the sack after the first season, not even Wenger who finished 7th with Arsenal (they won the FA Cup which probably saved him).

Different people will have different experiences, which is part of the fun of the game.

[SARCASM]Come on Herne, you know that kind of rational talk has no place on this forum, if a post doesn't include at least some mention of a conspiracy theory or massive exaggeration it's just not acceptable.[/SARCASM]

 

In all seriousness though people, not a single person posting on this thread is seeing one or both of those managers get sacked "every time". Of course there is a good chance of one or both of them failing to meet expectations and losing their job in season 1, especially if you are managing a club that prevents them from being successful, but left to their own devices one or both of those managers will do enough to keep their job after the first season more often than not.

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Same here, Pep and Klopp will always be sacked in first season.. unrealistic to be honest, because I can't count how many times I have seen them sacked in first season.

Edited by Wells

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Pep klopp sacked after first season 

And if I replace Jose as manager he doesnt get another job

If you leave him at utd he does very well and is there for years

Edited by kingrobbo

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16 hours ago, Cougar2010 said:

I think the more relevant question is how do you know his PA dropped from 174 to 136?

i use Geniescout to filter high PA kid(160+) to buy, so i know.

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1 minute ago, Kurt Hoo said:

i use Geniescout to filter high PA kid(160+) to buy, so i know.

and there is the answer.

Genie scout doesn't know the actual PA, it only estimates it from what it can see as a 3rd party application.

Therefore the PA didn't actually drop.

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3 minutes ago, Cougar2010 said:

and there is the answer.

Genie scout doesn't know the actual PA, it only estimates it from what it can see as a 3rd party application.

Therefore the PA didn't actually drop.

well, the PA-change things do exsit. i've played this game since FM08 and heard so many similar stories conformed by Geniescout, FMRTE or official tools. what really confuses me is that it's because of  only 3-weeks knee injury.

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Man City have gone from Guardiola to Marcelino to Louis Van Gaal before my game has reached the end of 2017.

Klopp is still clinging on to his job in the second season but I can't imagine he will survive much longer as Liverpool are currently 12th after 14 matches.

 

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13 minutes ago, Kurt Hoo said:

well, the PA-change things do exsit. i've played this game since FM08 and heard so many similar stories conformed by Geniescout, FMRTE or official tools. what really confuses me is that it's because of  only 3-weeks knee injury.

No they haven't been confirmed, not even close.

There has been a "rumour" for many years that long term injuries can cause PA drops on rare occasions but I don't think this has ever been confirmed by SI.

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2 hours ago, Cougar2010 said:

and there is the answer.

Genie scout doesn't know the actual PA, it only estimates it from what it can see as a 3rd party application.

Therefore the PA didn't actually drop.

Genie scout reads game date not displayed in the UI, it doesn't estimate anything. 

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In the majority of my saves so far, Klopp gets sacked halfway into the first season and ends up at Sevilla/Valencia, Van Gaal ends up at Chelsea and Barca always sack Enrique.

It was the same in last year's version too with Benitez always eventually ending up at Arsenal once Wenger retired. 

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4 hours ago, Kurt Hoo said:

i use Geniescout to filter high PA kid(160+) to buy, so i know.

There's your answer. 

Me advising you above to raise players with PA drops in the Bugs forum is now pointless.  If you use an unsupported unofficial 3rd party application in the game, then you won't get any help from SI and (as you've now seen) it could actually be having a bad affect on your game.

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4 hours ago, Cougar2010 said:

There has been a "rumour" for many years that long term injuries can cause PA drops on rare occasions but I don't think this has ever been confirmed by SI.

I do remember a post by Neil Brock fairly recently (in the last year or two) confirming that PA can drop, but only because of rare, very serious injuries.

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Genie scout wil not impact on the save file, it only reads data & discounting a bug in its code it will read the data with 100% accuracy.

Edit: Plus what HUNT3R, PA drops due to very serious injuries are part of the game code, iirc they have been for at least a decade.

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3 hours ago, ddidiodion said:

Genie scout reads game date not displayed in the UI, it doesn't estimate anything. 

 

42 minutes ago, Barside said:

Genie scout wil not impact on the save file, it only reads data & discounting a bug in its code it will read the data with 100% accuracy.

Edit: Plus what HUNT3R, PA drops due to very serious injuries are part of the game code, iirc they have been for at least a decade.

As I understand it Genie scout could never "read" the actual PAs as they were never available to the user or 3rd party apps.

Years ago Genie scout used to estimate PA based on the available data but it was never accurate.

Things may have changed and if Dion is right from his earlier post and PA is now available to the user in number terms then its fair to assume that it could have carried over to Genie scout.

The question is are the actual PAs now available? I don't know, Dion's earlier post is the first I've heard of it.

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6 minutes ago, Cougar2010 said:

 

As I understand it Genie scout could never "read" the actual PAs as they were never available to the user or 3rd party apps.

Years ago Genie scout used to estimate PA based on the available data but it was never accurate.

Things may have changed and if Dion is right from his earlier post and PA is now available to the user in number terms then its fair to assume that it could have carried over to Genie scout.

The question is are the actual PAs now available? I don't know, Dion's earlier post is the first I've heard of it.

Have you got the in game editor? Simply load it up and when you modify columns in the search bit go to hidden > PA

 

Genie Scout has been reading in-game code to pull out PA values since at least the 2007 edition, you can check very easily by loading up previous editions and seeing that PA's match up between that and the pre-game editor. It's injectors like FMRTE that occasionally used to throw up bizarre bugs by messing with the code but Genie Scout never actually modifies your save file.  

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20 minutes ago, ddidiodion said:

Have you got the in game editor? Simply load it up and when you modify columns in the search bit go to hidden > PA

 

Genie Scout has been reading in-game code to pull out PA values since at least the 2007 edition, you can check very easily by loading up previous editions and seeing that PA's match up between that and the pre-game editor. It's injectors like FMRTE that occasionally used to throw up bizarre bugs by messing with the code but Genie Scout never actually modifies your save file.  

No, I don't any editors & never have.

2007 sounds far too early for genie scout to be doing that but I'm no expert on it.  I've certainly seen threads before confirming that Genie scout couldn't read actual PAs, it only ever estimated them.  If thats changed its perhaps linked to SI releasing the IGE meaning more data was available but thats only a guess.

 

EDIT

Having searched back time maybe flies or perhaps I've just confused it with something else but there are posts dating back to around 2008/2010 saying that Genie scout can read PA so saying it worked in 2007 is likely correct as well.

Edited by Cougar2010

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There was a tool on Genie Scout that predicted what a player would look like when they reached their potential, obviously that was very speculative, which is maybe what you're thinking of? 

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My current save in December of first season has Klopp's Liverpool and Guardiola's City sitting second and third and looking like putting title challenges together. Mourinho's Man Utd are in eighth, well off the Champion's League spots.

So it's certainly not the same in every save.

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I suspect a lot of this will also be dependent on which whether the Premier League is loaded and also whether it's running on full detail or not.

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4 hours ago, HUNT3R said:

I suspect a lot of this will also be dependent on which whether the Premier League is loaded and also whether it's running on full detail or not.


That too. That said on full it depends. He didn't do that great on the 2016 in the Bundesliga, which in parts was imo due to the oft isolating of the central forward off his prefered 4-1-4-1, and more importantly, the really aggressive d-lines as off FM 2016, which he would always insist upon as to the traits given into the db.  The City research has made him immediately adopt a 4-1-2-3 DM as his most likely preference, which is basically the 4-1-4-1 he used before at Bayern (if he didn't switch mid-match, as frequently the case), except with AML/AMR except of MLs/MRs. So it's even more attacking now. When previously he dropped additionally points due to the high lines, there is a clear trend if you watch in this too.

He's playing so aggressively he simply gets hit on the break and concedes additionally soft goals off easy balls over the top/ in between the channels off a barely retreating d-line, oft with both backs being really aggressively pushed up. Naturally, that replicates reality some, we've already seen punditry questioning his approaches. Every option is meant to have drawbacks to consider, whilst on previous iterations pushing all up could have been argued to be a bonus point to the possession stats no matter what.

It still could make him underperform in comparable drastic ways, like close to ten matches lost in the Bundesliga in the odd bad run, which is loads, as AI don't have any awareness of such, seemingly if it's hit like that multiple times (in particular a single match). What he experiences when results turn sour is not unlike what all the conspiracy theorists drum up so that they can further go with the rationale they'd be too good at the game and the game would punish them for it, in such cases frustratingly distracting from the actual issue (AI decision making). Which is: racking up shots like silly in no space against opponents conversely dropping deep immediately, whilst every shot off his opponents tends to be in some space due to the back doors being open.

edit: I don't see him underperforming every time, but naturally his currently job is a much more competitive affair than what he had domestically at Bayern, which is a club that has no equal anymore in its country, even compared to previous eras of Bayern dominance.
 

Edited by Svenc

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14 games in to a new save and Klopp sacked due to poor league position as Liverpool are 12th. Seems pretty unrealistic.

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Just now, Tiger666 said:

14 games in to a new save and Klopp sacked due to poor league position as Liverpool are 12th. Seems pretty unrealistic.

Sounds like he should have been sacked.

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Just now, Tiger666 said:

After 14 games? It's not even December.

Was he sacked due to the poor league position? Is the league loaded? There's a lot missing in your post.

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Just now, HUNT3R said:

Was he sacked due to the poor league position? Is the league loaded? There's a lot missing in your post.

I said he was sacked due to poor league position. The league is loaded and playable.

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