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Dutch Football Pyramid - Based on real life

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CrowBar

CrowBar

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Hi guys. The last few days I have been busy expanding the Dutch leagues in FM 17. My objective was to have a playable and realistic pyramid, trying to stay as close to reality as feasibly possible. As most will know, as of 16/17, for the first time in history the Dutch have a complete football pyramid allowing.

Features:

  • Dutch leagues til level 5 (Eredivisie, Jupiler League, Tweede Divisie, Derde Divisie, Hoofdklasse), might expand to include Eerste klasse (lvl 6) later.
  • Changed KNVB beker to have all divisions join in, pro-clubs get a bye til a later round, amateurs play qualification rounds (seeded). This is the only thing that is not totally realistic, because in real life there are far less teams joining and it is a far more complicated system to figure out who gets to participate each season.
  • All saturday & sunday leagues have their region boundaries set.
  • All clubs have their prefered competitions set (saturday or sunday), the game should recognise which club to put in which league each season. There is a possibility of a club being in the 'wrong' league one season, but the game will fix this itself eventually, it doesn't matter too much -- considering in real life it is a plausible situation the KNVB has to deal with too at the end of a season. 
  • Champion from the Tweede Divisie promotes to the Jupiler League, nr. 20 from Jupiler league relegates.
  • No's 17 & 18 from the Tweede Divisie relegate automatically to the Derde Divisie, no's 15 & 16 qualify for the relegation play-off at the end of the season.
  • Derde Divisie champions (2) promote to the Tweede Divisie. Derde Divisie split into two sub-divisions (saturday and sunday). Each division is split into three periods, at the end of a period there is a "period champion" who qualifies for the play-offs at the end of the season. In total there are 6 period winners who compete with the no's 15 & 16 for the last 2 spots in the Tweede Divisie.
  • No's 17 & 18 from the Derde Divisie relegate to the Hoofdklasse. No's 15 & 16 qualify for the relegation play-off and compete with the Hoofdklasse period winners for the two spots.
  • Hoofdklasse champions (4) promote to the Derde Divisie. Hoofdklasse divided into 4 sub-divisions (Saturday A & B, Sunday A & B), each division has 3 periods. In total there are 12 period winners who qualify for the promotion play-off. No's 15 & 16 relegate automatically to the eerste klasse (inactive division at the moment), this is partly real, because in real life there is also a relegation play-off for the no's 13 & 14 with the period winners of the Eerste Klasse. I might add this later together with a playable Eerste Klasse.
  • Basic competition history added to the Tweede Divisie, Derde Divisie & Hoofdklasse
  • Added primary and secondary kits to teams up til the Hoofdklasse that didn't have any kits attached, the primary being based on real life, and the secondary mostly fictional with some exceptions.
  • Tweaked most club names of the playable divisions to be more consistent (e.g. Dordrecht -> FC Dordrecht, Katwijk -> VV Katwijk, Lienden -> FC Lienden)
  • Tweaked some clubs not having the correct city, some were given the district (gemeente in Dutch) not the city or village.
  • Added some missing "year founded" to some clubs.
  • All clubs that did not have a stadium attached have one now.
  • No players added, only the ones in the default database are in the teams.
  • Real tax rules of Netherlands added in a seperate file, the default ones were not realistic. Thanks to @Slabbekoorn.
  • Real fixture & discipline rules as they are in each division, as good as possible.
  • Eredivisie & Jupiler league TV broadcast changed to pay-to-view, due to Fox Sports exclusive deal in real life.

If there are any problems, please report and I'll try to see if I can help.

Special thanks to;

@Slabbekoorn For helping me with problems in the editor and giving solutions.

@Reddiablo For giving the kick-off in his topic to creating this file.

Without you both this wouldn't have been as plausible to do.

 

Download link: Version 2.5

Mirror 1: http://www103.zippyshare.com/v/hR9adI2j/file.html

Mirror 2: https://www.mediafire.com/?uqxn5y1lwxll2h1

Mirror 3: http://www.filedropper.com/netherlands-footballpyramidv25

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Wolf_pd

Wolf_pd

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Thanks a lot! Starting a holiday save to see how everything goes and check on how much movement there is between divisions. Always fun to see.

Edit: question regarding regional boundaries answer found in another thread.

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Wolf_pd

Wolf_pd

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13 hours ago, Reddiablo said:

Fantastic job!

I'm running through the file now, amending things to my central database :)

Will create a spin off with some transfer updates etc, and a few tweaks etc. to players - but probably will be during/after the weekend.

Assuming I think I know which central database you mean, what happens to those changes when SI has a data update? Reason I ask is because those data updates are holding me back a bit to start a project.

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Jeroen Thijssen

Jeroen Thijssen

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34 minutes ago, Wolf_pd said:

Assuming I think I know which central database you mean, what happens to those changes when SI has a data update? Reason I ask is because those data updates are holding me back a bit to start a project.

@CrowBar has created a fantastic update, which I am further amending and shall release shortly. Possibly today, probably tomorrow...
I am cross entering everything into my database, and have implemented a bunch of things from his adjustments (granted, not everything)

This will mean that this amended data will be in automatically as per potential future data patches/updates

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CrowBar

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6 hours ago, niceman14 said:

I can't download it ! Files corrupted ? Any solutions ? 

I added an extra download link, just in case.

I also updated the file, I fixed a minor issue I came by in the Hoofdklasse (slight oversight in the period rules).

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Wolf_pd

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41 minutes ago, niceman14 said:

I can't download it ! Files corrupted ? Any solutions ? 

No, zippyshare has an odd way of letting you download. Took me a while to understand that I needed to rightclick and save as. I am using Chrome btw. Not sure if that is a reason?

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Jeroen Thijssen

Jeroen Thijssen

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33 minutes ago, CrowBar said:

I added an extra download link, just in case.

I also updated the file, I fixed a minor issue I came by in the Hoofdklasse (slight oversight in the period rules).

Download link: Version 2.1

Mirror 1: http://www42.zippyshare.com/v/kJnlWCGz/file.html

Mirror 2: https://www.mediafire.com/?9nlze2t5qns1ax6

What are your exact changes? Have already been amending v 2.0...

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CrowBar

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6 minutes ago, Reddiablo said:

What are your exact changes? Have already been amending v 2.0...

In all the 4 hoofdklasses: Stage 1 -> League Settings (all groups) -> League Fate Actions, I forgot to duplicate the one there and change the duplicate into stage 1. That means two league fate actions:

"Set other league fate, Top Playoff, Top Playoff 0"  and "Set Other League fate, Top Playoff, Top Playoff, 1"

That's only thing I fixed.

 

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Jeroen Thijssen

Jeroen Thijssen

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Amended thanks.

After verifying I do get a message: 

 

Error in nation rules:

Promoted and relegated teams do not match up for Eredivisie (2 relegated) and Jupiler League (3 promoted) (extra teams requested = 0) ;  which doesn't make much sense to me...

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Slabbekoorn

Slabbekoorn

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31 minutes ago, Reddiablo said:

Amended thanks.

After verifying I do get a message: 

 

Error in nation rules:

Promoted and relegated teams do not match up for Eredivisie (2 relegated) and Jupiler League (3 promoted) (extra teams requested = 0) ;  which doesn't make much sense to me...

Don't worry we got the same errors. First save, then verify all competitions, next save and close the editor. Verify Tweede Divisie, save, exit editor, load it again. Keep repeating until it has verified all. If you're still stuck you'll have to save as a new file.;)

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Jeroen Thijssen

Jeroen Thijssen

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Fair enough. One small thing I'm noticing for myself right now is that it's structured as

Eredivisie
Jupiler League
Tweede Divisie
Topklasse -> Derde Divisie Zaterdag & Derde Divisie Zondag
Hoofdklasse -> Hoofdklasse Zondag A, Hoofdklasse Zondag B, Zondag A, Zondag B.  (This could be because the Hoofdklasse wasn't verified yet)

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CrowBar

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37 minutes ago, Reddiablo said:

Fair enough. One small thing I'm noticing for myself right now is that it's structured as

Eredivisie
Jupiler League
Tweede Divisie
Topklasse -> Derde Divisie Zaterdag & Derde Divisie Zondag
Hoofdklasse -> Hoofdklasse Zondag A, Hoofdklasse Zondag B, Zondag A, Zondag B.  (This could be because the Hoofdklasse wasn't verified yet)

You're probably using the Sortioutsi fix, right? If so, they didn't change the name of the Topklasse yet. That's the only explanation I can think of. In the editor it is correct and in my game it is also Derde Divisie. The issue of Sortioutsi not being up to date I already reported there, and it is an easy fix in their files.

Hoofdklasse names seem fine in the editor & ingame too. Not sure what that is?

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Jeroen Thijssen

Jeroen Thijssen

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21 minutes ago, CrowBar said:

You're probably using the Sortioutsi fix, right? If so, they didn't change the name of the Topklasse yet. That's the only explanation I can think of. In the editor it is correct and in my game it is also Derde Divisie. The issue of Sortioutsi not being up to date I already reported there, and it is an easy fix in their files.

Hoofdklasse names seem fine in the editor & ingame too. Not sure what that is?

Hmm yeah, that´ll be the issue. But that means that this problem will not occur for people who do not use the Susi update - correct?

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CrowBar

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9 minutes ago, Reddiablo said:

Hmm yeah, that´ll be the issue. But that means that this problem will not occur for people who do not use the Susi update - correct?

Yes, but you can easily go into their file and fix it. Just remove everything Topklasse related.

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CrowBar

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Small update again, not a game breaking issue -- just a small annoyance, after the first season the divisions that have periods would have the club history put into the clubs a bit too many times (as many times as there are periods, which looks weird). Didn't notice it before, sadly. I fixed this.

Sorry for the update in such a short time. But I didn't want to leave this annoyance in.

@Reddiablo : In case you want to know: I fixed this by going through all the divisions that have periods in the editor and removing the "Store League History" markers on everyone in the League Settings under each period stage (to be exact, I did this 7 times in the League Settings (All Groups), and 2 times in the individual group rules of the League settings of the 2 Derde divisies). Just check all the league settings and make sure that that option is not enabled at all, that should do it.
 

Download link: Version 2.2

Mirror 1: http://www28.zippyshare.com/v/4vH0eLI5/file.html

Mirror 2: https://www.mediafire.com/?y3ind2n6ijdbcq0

 

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CrowBar

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52 minutes ago, Llew_Arshavin23 said:

Don't clubs Tweede Divisie clubs, like AFC, have to notify KNVB whether or not they want to be eligible for promotion (and the move from semi-professional to professional) midway through the season?

It's not an option anymore, it's a must to promote when finished at first place. That is why they made the Tweede Divisie in the first place, to lower the gap between the amateurs and pro's.

The situation you described was last season and before between Topklasse and Jupiler League, they could always refuse it. Not anymore today.

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Karld50

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Thanks again for this can't wait to give this challenge a try!

Just a quick question but is it recommended to set the options for add key players and add key staff when starting a game with this league enabled? Cheers

Also not sure if it's an issue with my laptop but I can't download the file because it keeps detecting malware. Most probably a false positive but annoying nonetheless. 

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CrowBar

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37 minutes ago, Karld50 said:

Thanks again for this can't wait to give this challenge a try!

Just a quick question but is it recommended to set the options for add key players and add key staff when starting a game with this league enabled? Cheers

Also not sure if it's an issue with my laptop but I can't download the file because it keeps detecting malware. Most probably a false positive but annoying nonetheless. 

Small parts of the Derde Divisie, and most of the Hoofdklasse have mostly empty teams & no staff, so yes, I think it wouldn't be a bad idea to add key players & key staff for those teams.

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Jeroen Thijssen

Jeroen Thijssen

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31 minutes ago, franss said:

Great job! Only one remark: in the "reddiablo version" the Hoofdklasse lists now Hoofdklasse Zondag A, Hoofdklasse Zondag B, Zondag A en Zondag B..

Shouldn't happen. I had that before as well - but it seems fine right now. Are you using other updates as well - eg. any files you have from Sortitoutsi.net?

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CrowBar

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34 minutes ago, franss said:

Thanks! Appreciated. I'll try to be patient... (BTW: it does work fine and it looks good on the screen. It is only in the league selection screen that is shows as I mentioned)

I checked Reddiablo's update in the Editor, but the names are correct there as far as I can see. Ingame it is fine for me too. Not sure if I overlooked anything.

EDIT: By the way, I don't know if it is intentional (probably?) but in Reddiablo's version, there are no periods. Just a fair warning in case you expected periods there.

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Slabbekoorn

Slabbekoorn

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I just want to give everyone a heads up that a major update is coming up in a couple of days because I have finally figured out how to create the Dutch Periods perfectly with 0 errors. Now forgive us if you already started a save but I have been tackling this problem since FM2015 and couldn't seem to fix it perfectly untill now.

I'll post the full explanation later this day in the editors hideaway topic so other people can see and learn how to do this. Then we are going to add it to Reddiablo's file for the final version.

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CrowBar

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16 hours ago, Reddiablo said:

Hm. I actually took your last file and then made lots of changes from there. So I left all the divisions etc. in tact, but did make a lot of tweaks to players etc.

But as said, no competition changes

Weird, because I opened your file (from steam workshop), and the stages of the periods (Derde Divisie, Hoofdklasse) were gone. Only the period stage of the Jupiler League was still there.

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Slabbekoorn

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16 minutes ago, CrowBar said:

Weird, because I opened your file (from steam workshop), and the stages of the periods (Derde Divisie, Hoofdklasse) were gone. Only the period stage of the Jupiler League was still there.

I also can not see any periods or playoffs from Tweede Divisie and below. Reddiablo has put a lot of time and effort in his file but adding these playoffs (periods are easier) manually will take up a lot of work... So what are we going to do?

@Reddiablo

What kind of changes did you make exactly? If you haven't changed any nation rules then we can remove your file its nation rules and add your file just like my tax rules were added. It'll still keep your database changes (like names/player/region/city/club edits).

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CrowBar

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13 minutes ago, Slabbekoorn said:

I also can not see any periods or playoffs from Tweede Divisie and below. Reddiablo has put a lot of time and effort in his file but adding these playoffs (periods are easier) manually will take up a lot of work... So what are we going to do?

@Reddiablo

What kind of changes did you make exactly? If you haven't changed any nation rules then we can remove your file its nation rules and add your file just like my tax rules were added. It'll still keep your database changes (like names/player/region/city/club edits).

He changed players, contracts, club names, etc.

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franss

franss

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Still very interesting... I wish I could help, but unfortunately I don't have enough knowledge. And I still don't know how to use the editor properly, either. Because When I do make other changes, does that mean I can't use a new version of this file? 

Futhermore It looks like that from the Zaterdag B Hoofdklasse only 2 teams are relegated? Is that correct?

(and finally: I 'd love to see an KNVB amateur cup added....)

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Slabbekoorn

Slabbekoorn

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30 minutes ago, franss said:

Still very interesting... I wish I could help, but unfortunately I don't have enough knowledge. And I still don't know how to use the editor properly, either. Because When I do make other changes, does that mean I can't use a new version of this file? 

Futhermore It looks like that from the Zaterdag B Hoofdklasse only 2 teams are relegated? Is that correct?

(and finally: I 'd love to see an KNVB amateur cup added....)

The Dutch periods are the main issues we're having (plus the false verifying error) and I've been working with the editor for 5 years now and I'm the editing the main file now and still run into problems. If you make changes (I guess to the file?) then you don't have our newest changes, your best bet is to change it in a seperate file without the advanced rules.

The Hoofdklasse relegation should work normally but we'll look into it, but the teams that are in the playoff can still stay in the league if they win the playoff tournament.

And finally, the Districtbekers are for Eerste klasse and Tweede Klasse, we don't have the Eerste Klasse unlocked and there are no Tweede Klasse clubs in the game.

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franss

franss

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Thanks for this extensive answer. I love to use the editor (add staff members, and affilaite clubs mainly)  but still don't feel like I know what I'm doing especially not with other files (like the reddiablo one) active. Is there a good and useful guide to the editor use?

 

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franss

franss

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Just Checked;
Unique ID 862765 has name "Hoofdklasse Zaterdag A" but short name is "Hoofdklasse Zondag A"
Unique ID 862766 has name "Hoofdklasse Zaterdag B" but short name is "Hoofdklasse Zondag B"
Unique ID 862769 has name "Hoofdklasse Zondag A" but short name is "Zondag A"
Unique ID 862769 has name "Hoofdklasse Zondag B" but short name is "Zondag B"

so maybe this will explain it a bit...

 

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Slabbekoorn

Slabbekoorn

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@franssThanks for the error, we'll look into it. 

The best way to learn is by checking other files in the editor and try to replicat them, there also are some stickies in the Editor Forum. In my case it was trial, error, trial, error, error and another error.

@Wolf_pdThe file is already done and posted in the other thread, but CrowBar is the op and we still need to change Reddiablo's file in one without nation rules and maybe merge the two files. 

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