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Mr U Rosler

DAWNBRINGER..........for FM16

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Greetings Managers,

I wasn't sure i'd be posting a tactic this year, the forum's been a bit quiet and i'm not sure there's much appetite for them anymore, however a few people asked me for something so i'm happy to share what I've got.

I think the days of just plugging in a tactic and steaming up the league without any thought or effort are pretty much gone, thank god. The Match Engine is pretty robust these days, as should be, which means we have to work a little harder for our success which makes it all the more rewarding when we achieve it.

So, whilst the tactic is proven, I firmly believe you will now have to get all of the other managerial elements basically correct for you to see it at its full potential.

In other words, you need to be a good manager……. which is the whole point of the game after all.

A game can be lost in the pre-match press conference or at half time or with a poor player conversation or through suddenly having to field multiple players who are not match fit due to poor squad management.

A good tactic is no longer guaranteed to override poor management.

Poor management will likely override a good tactic.

Only good management & good tactics guarantees long term success.

So, after all that, I have found a system of play I like. I have exceeded expectations with both the strongest team in the league and more importantly the weakest and combined with selective recruitment I believe anyone can use it and improve year on year to meet your chosen objectives as long as you combine it with sensible management.

I built the tactics to satisfy my own preference for entertaining, high tempo, fairly direct football with lots of variety in play and a solid defensive platform.

Here’s what I ended up with.

DAWNBRINGER

DqqaemC.jpg

Formation

Yes, it’s an asymmetric 4-2-3-1.

I was seeking good pitch coverage, a balance of threats from wide and thru the middle, vertical & horizontal runners and defensive solidity.

This is the formation, combination of roles & duties which enabled me to achieve what I’m after.

The System

Key to the success of the system is the wide play, which works differently on either flank. On one side we have a RMD supported by a more conservative Full Back, on the other a ‘full on’ attacking full back with loads of space to attack.

Cover is provided by 2 BWM, its unusual not to have a ‘sitter’ in this formation (BWM’s are highly mobile, closing down etc) but due to the fact that all the players in the AM strata operate quite deep and when out of possession get in front of the ball it gives us a really solid 4-5-1 shape in defence. The RMD is a bit hit & miss defensively but our conservative Full Back behind him provides cover.

Our 2 central midfielders, although defensively minded are ideally situated to build attacks, more often than not feeding the ball into one flank or another or thru the middle if an obvious pass is on.

The main issue with FM16 is ‘quality of chance’, I had tactics which resulted in more shots at goal but were a bit hit & miss as they were not good chances.

By essentially spreading 5 players across the width of the penalty area, slightly staggering their depth we are able to create a good number of high quality chances due to players being unmarked and in space.

RESULTS

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8ONssan.jpg

Smashed it with City, won League Cup, lost in Champions League final vs Bayern but comfortably saw off Lazio, Chelsea & Real Madrid over 2 legs. Used Bony pretty much all season as Aguero was out, with a proper Striker would easily have got over 100 league goals.

I said in another thread i'd test with Bournemouth and if I kept them up i'd post the tactic. Happy to make that call after 11 games. On an 8 game unbeaten run, beat Man City & Everton 3-0 and a good 0-0 away at Arsenal. Happy to make the call now we'll be staying up :brock: (will complete season and update)

Although the results achieved are with ‘default’ squads (got Kone for Bournemouth) I believe the tactic can be massively enhanced with recruiting the right type of players.

For example, Navas was my main RMD, he has 10 finishing. With my £195m transfer budget I could get a MONSTER here and that alone must result in more goals. Due to Aguero being massively injury prone I had to play Bony pretty much all season, this is another area in the team that could easily be massively improved…… you catch my drift?

As such I have detailed below my ideas on how the system works and what type of players you should be looking for to get the best out of it. Just my ideas of course, you will likely have your own and there will be many paths to success.

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The Roles

Attack

Trequartista, Raumdeuter, AMC

Essentially the RMD operates as a wide Striker, the Trequartista roams around seeking space as he sees fit. So during transition after winning the ball we have 2 highly mobile forwards finding pockets of space and hopefully being available to receive a pass. That pass is normally provided by one of our AMC’s who link play beautifully from midfield before often arriving unmarked in the box to cause havoc.

I have seen some brilliant attacking play, even with Bournemouth, with the 2 AMC’S running the show, switching play from flank to flank or slotting the killer thru ball to the Treq or RMD.

RAUMDEUTER – There are various fanciful descriptions of this role, but the most apt to my eyes is ‘Wide Poacher’, he’s often on the shoulder of the Full Back looking for the ball into space.

In possession he can go either way, cut inside for a shot or outside for the cross. He comes into his own when play is building on the opposite flank, timing a diagonal run straight into his near post with a true poacher’s instinct.

Recruit the right one and he’ll be your highest goal scorer.

Trequartista – Our man roams around the pitch seeking space, literally from touchline to touchline making it nearly impossible to pick him up. I think Treq’s are misunderstood and seen as some kind of maverick, luxury player. Nothing can be further from the truth, they work very hard running our opponents back line, never giving them a moments peace, pulling defenders out of position, creating space for themselves and others. They can be truly devastating and in my opinion are the best attack minded striking role. You might be surprised to find ‘work rate’ on their preferred attributes… trust me on this one.

AMC – Classic ‘link player’ bringing the ball out from deep midfield, instigating many attacks before arriving late and unmarked in the box to provide shots or assists. Had really high ratings here.

The reality is our front ‘Quad’ link really well together and all do their fair share of creating & goal scoring, its satisfying to often see all 4 linking to put a killer move together.

We also have our left full back adding a further complication for defenders to deal with.

Our attack is based on intelligent and unpredictable movement which usually leaves at least 1 of these guys, unmarked and in space ready to receive a pass.

Key Attributes

RMD

Acceleration

Off the ball

Dribbling

Finishing

AMC

Passing

Vision

Flair

Work Rate

Trequartista

Work Rate

Off the ball

Composure

Finishing

Midfield

Pretty simple, 2 players, one role.

Essentially we are looking for 2 midfield destroyers who can be decisive in breaking up play, winning early ball and using it well.

You may think they will often be outnumbered but as stated previously the AMC’s and even RMD/Treq’s do a lot more work defensively than you would think.

Our 2 midfielders operate like ‘shock troops’, when we turn the ball over they have licence to go hard and go early in an attempt stifle a counter attack before it can build, winning us quick ball in dangerous positions. Failing that they are required to ‘buy’ us time to get into our defensive shape by closing down and forcing sideways, backwards passes rather than forward passes.

If they are quick enough they will pick up many simple interceptions rather than having to tackle everyone all the time.

They see a fair bit of the ball, its important they are also competent passers.

Look for;

Acceleration

Tackling

Work Rate

Passing

Defence

All three duties are represented here (4 if you include ‘cover’).

The Centre Backs are straightforward enough, try and get two quick ones, definitely 1, put the quickest Centre Back in the left hand ‘cover’ position.

The right Full Back is set to ‘support’ duty, as well as doing sterling defensive work he will often seek out the RMD roaming somewhere up his flank or hit an early cross from deep, he also likes to switch play to the opposing flank which can be very effective. As such we need someone with a good range of passing as well as crossing ability

The left Full Back is absolutely key and can be a game changer, I had hatrick’s out of Kolarov but their main job is assists, they often have space to operate and deliver a deadly cross or pass.

They still have a lot of defensive responsibility and will likely run further than anyone else on the pitch, we need a real athlete here who is also an accomplished user of the ball.

Look for

Centre Back

Positioning

Tackling

Marking

Jumping Reach

(+ make sure at least 1 is quick)

Right Back

Passing

Crossing

Tackling

Marking

Left Back

Stamina

Work Rate

Crossing

Passing

Goalkeeper

Aerial Ability

Reflexes

Handling

One on Ones

Just get the best GK you can.

Before anyone asks,

NO OPPOSITION INSTRUCTIONS

TRAINING

This is not a thread about training but I have Match training on tactics until fully fluid then leave it on Team Work. General training I do a month of fitness pre-season, a month on Team Blend then leave it on Balanced.

TEAM TALKS

I’ll leave that to you but complacency is your enemy.

At half time, if in doubt tell them you’re not happy. I use assertive for everything (except when I’m angry…)

And don’t be lazy, do you your own team talks even if you only using AM recommendations.

PROTECTING A LEAD

I don’t do anything, the tactic is defensively solid, counters well so you’re more likely to score another than concede. We want to stay on the ‘front foot’.

CHASING THE GAME

I tend to favour substituting poorly performing (or tired players) than messing with the tactic.

However, you can simply change the mentality to Attacking, the tactic responds well to this. Normally for the last 20/25 minutes.

RE-TRAINING

Re-Train attacking players liberally.

If you have more than one quality striker re-train him to AMC or AMR if he has the right stats.

Re-Trained Strikers can be ideal for AMC roles if they have the required work rate and well rounded attributes.

Other than that, I hope you enjoy the tactic and thread.

Feedback welcome, results, great players you find for specific roles etc.

Please bear in mind this is not a ‘win button’ tactic, it’s a logical system of play with a clear identity which enables you to build to its strengths rewarding you with realistic, expansive attacking football.

You still need to ‘play the game’ and manage well. Do this and you will prevail.

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I'm going to try this out with my Dortmund side.

I get really heavily involved in the game (I already "play the game" and manage well, as you've recommended) but my tactics are just never quite up to scratch, so I'll play the game as I always do but employ this tactic to see how it goes.

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Mr Rosler, I've always been a fan of your work and I can assure you there are still a lot of us that are extremely grateful for your work. Please don't stop! Can't wait to try your latest masterpiece.

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I've played 10 games with the tactics so far and not had much success in all honesty. I find my team are picking up a lot of yellow / red cards, all of our chances on goal are either long range efforts or come from a defenders mistake when they mistime a clearing header. Perhaps its due to a lack of quality in my squad (FC United)? It seems very much like a long ball tactic whereby the opposition have most of the possession and pick up every free ball in midfield...

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If you get a chance, it would be hugely entertaining to see a video of this in action! Or perhaps just a pkm?

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Having a similar experience to TheDentalist playing in Vanarama South, played 18 games so far and some of the stats are quite a difference to the rest of the division. Conceded 5 goals from corners (next highest 3), 5 goals from free kicks (NH 3). I've picked up 42 yellow cards (NH 30) and 4 red cards (NH 2) with 289 fouls committed (NH 218). So I think a big part of my problem is we are conceding a lot of set pieces which we don't seem to defend too well against. A lot of the other goals conceded (29 total) seem to come from strikers dropping off, playing the ball out wide to the winger, then making a run in and getting a free header in the 6 yard box from the cross

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Not played it non league guys, although will be doing for my main save.

Defensive set piece routines are the default ones as i had no problems conceding from them in my test saves.

Will now look at this.

Surprised there are possession issues as even my Bournemouth team have one of the highest in the Prem.

In short term, NON LEAGUE, i'd look at removing 'get stuck in' and perhaps change 1 or both central midfield roles to a standard CM/D.

Will be starting a long term save with Maidstone after I've completed the Bournemouth Season so if the tactic doesn't work down there a non-league version will be produced.

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Interested to see how people are getting on in a top division.

4 more games with Bournemouth before work this morning, 2 wins, 2 defeats so another 6 points towards safety.

Still looking good.

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Mr Rosler - big fan so I will look to try this immediately! Thank you for sharing!

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Thanks Mr Rosler i play in the Northern Irish leagues so i will give it a try there.

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I am a big fan of your work and I shall be trialling this in league 2 with Portsmouth. They are a decent side in a low league so could work like Man City did for you.

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Looks like it will need to be re-worked for lower leagues.

I think it should be a pretty quick fix, will get onto it after finishing Bournemouth season.

Funnily enough, had the same situation with Apex last year, the re-worked lower league version ended up being better than the original, even for top teams.

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I have used all your tactics for about 3 years now, so will gladly give this a try with my Newcastle save and report my progress.

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Nice one I will try this tonight, as I like your tactics and had great success with a few of them.

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Loved your tactics in the past few seasons. I've been on the edge about getting the game till now, seeing this up has pushed me over the verge. I know my plans for the weekend, Spurs save to commence tonight...

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Loved your tactics in the past few seasons. I've been on the edge about getting the game till now, seeing this up has pushed me over the verge. I know my plans for the weekend, Spurs save to commence tonight...

Spurs look a good outfit this year.

Should go well :thup:

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Glad to see you back. I remember using your tactics in FM2014 and they were awesome. As most guys here seem to be uncertain what exactly the 'Raumdeuter' position is - I live in Germany (from it was created). It's basically an hommage to Thomas Muller and resembles the way he plays. You never knows where he is, sometimes he's out on the wing, sometimes he goes back to midfield, sometimes he's in the box as an upfront striker and sometimes he's a secondary striker.

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Early doors testing it with United, my defence looks a lot better as does the overall control on matches but it does lend itself to referee's book. How much does unticking 'Get Stuck In' effect the tactic?

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I've been trialling this with Liverpool, I signed Puncheon and Trindade de Vilheda as AM's for cover and was intending to use Lallana as the Raumdeuter. This was all well and good until Arsenal bid £40M for Lallana on deadline day! I accepted and brought Volland in as his replacement. So my team is as follows:

Mignolet

Clyne, Skrtel, Sakho, Moreno

Henderson, Emre Can

Volland, Firmino, Coutinho

Sturridge

And my 2nd XI is:

Bogdan

Flanagan, Lovren, Gomez, Enrique

Milner, Allen

Ibe, T de Vilheda, Puncheon

Benteke

with Ings as the 3rd striker.

So far in the league I have pretty much been on top in every game. I have played 10; won 7 and drawn 3. I haven't scored that many goals - only 16 which is 6th in the league but I've only conceded 4 and 3 of those was in a 3-3 draw to Man U away (my last game). The 2nd best team has conceded 6. I do think the lack of goals is due to Benteke not being suited to the role and he's been playing in nearly all of the games. Sturridge came back from injury and I scored 3 against Man U away Sturridge got 1 of them.

I am top of the league, 2 points ahead of City and Spurs.

In the Euro cup I have used my 2nd XI and lost 2 and won 1 of the games in the Euro Cup. I am not bothered about that competition. I did beat West Ham away in the League Cup with my 2nd XI though - the next round I face Chelsea.

A couple of observations: I am getting a lot of yellow cards Moreno already has 6 for the season and Can is 1 away from a suspension already too. I don't dominate posession that often - I've had a few 51% games but I do think I've had the majority in all games. The AM's haven't been performing yet - they are both very inconsistent and they never both have a good game it seems. Did you find the same thing Mr R?

As the players get more used to this tactic I am sure it will be great. It is by far anything better than I have done in FM16 so far. Great work! I will keep you posted on the season.

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Mr Rosler, I've always been a fan of your work and I can assure you there are still a lot of us that are extremely grateful for your work. Please don't stop! Can't wait to try your latest masterpiece.

I can confirm this. Very happy with your new tactic and I hope more will follow.

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Thanks for the posts.

Still a WIP, will be reviewing 'get stuck in', i'm hoping dropping it off wont have too much of an impact.

Its the full backs that seem to get in trouble.

Erik86, i would expect your goalscoring to pick up considerably, likely just need one or two attackers to hit form.

My AMC's were very consistent with City but they are world class, hit & miss with Bournemouth which is understandable.

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And my 2nd XI just beat Chelsea's first XI in the League Cup 2-1 with 54% possession. Amazing.

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Probably won't use this, as i hate asymetrical formations (Petty i know). But wanted to say thanks, i'm a big fan of your tax and always look forward to you're insightful posts. Don't stop :)

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Thanks for the posts.

Still a WIP, will be reviewing 'get stuck in', i'm hoping dropping it off wont have too much of an impact.

Its the full backs that seem to get in trouble.

Erik86, i would expect your goalscoring to pick up considerably, likely just need one or two attackers to hit form.

My AMC's were very consistent with City but they are world class, hit & miss with Bournemouth which is understandable.

It's already looked better with Sturridge back and in actual fact I seem to do better with Ings instead of Benteke. I think Benteke is the problem! I wish Firmino and Coutinho could hit form, then I'll be flying.

Still.... I'm top, I am unbeaten so this is by no means a complaint. It's phenomenal as I've been so inconsistent in my own tactics.

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Can't wait to give this a go dude! Nice one. Have just won the league first season with Arsenal but have 4 league games left so will trial it out in those.

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i'm going to give this a go on my newcastle save as only a few games into new season and struggling with tactic i had

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I had a quick go with it , in the SPFL using Partick Thistle Pld 6 W 4 D1 L1 , 4 of those games i had 16 yr old youth keeper in.

I will stick with it for the next season and see how it pans out

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Quick update on the Bournemouth test.

Now passed the 40 point mark with 12 games still to go, my only objective with them was to stay up.

Very satisfied with that. Will finish season tomorrow.

xsPiYAI.jpg

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right i've give it 10 games with my newcastle side and i'm really undecided. P 10, W2, D3, L5. Highlights been 3-0 victory over spurs and coming back from 3-0 down at man city to get it back to 3-3 only for them to score in injury time, but i've scored 14 goals and conceded 19.

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ive been playing with Leicester, and its the full-backs defensively where I get opened up. That and my CB's passing to the oppo forwards (which has happened a lot). But other than that, its been pretty solid. Picked up a lot of draws against top 5 sides, matching them on stats as well. One aberration was getting hammered 8-0 by Spurs in the FA Cup, but I had swapped 7 players, and as you say, you have to manage in this version, not just hope for the tactic to make you look good.

Jamie Vardy is banging them in as the Treq, but Mahrez struggles as the Ram, which surprises me. I need to look into that

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Playing nearly a full season with Bournemouth has been very useful. (1 game to go)

We had a very bad run for a while in the second half of the season as i thought we would at some point, its during these times you learn the most about a tactic. Still looking at a top 10 finish though which is exellent with Bournemouth.

I definately think i can tighten it up a fair bit, but doing this without blunting the attack will be the difficult part.

Few things i now don't like which will be fixed.

These fixes should also help lower league performance.

Will get to testing them tonight :thup:

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If you want an inpartial tester happy to trial with portsmouth :)

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Playing a Basingstoke save, got promoted via the playoffs to the National conference using a 4411 that i knocked up...but thats died a death, have started using this tactic, but find the volume of Yellow and red cards a hinderence...happy to help trial any new versions.

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Going to start a new save with Shrewsbury in League 1 - I'll give this a go!!

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Currently trying with Curzon Ashton predicted to finish 22nd, No better team to try it with. played 3 friendlies so far: -

Struggled past the reserves 3-2 - at one point was 2-1 down

then lost 1-0 v Hyde even game 50% possession, 11 shots to 10 - 2 CCCs each

then a 3-0 win v st helens again 50% possession, 13 shots to 6 however 3 CCCs to 0

I've set up about 10 friendlies to try and get the tactic as fluid as poss - I also have changed the left BWM to a CM (D) as well as taking get stuck in off. I will give it 10 games in the league or so and see how I fare.

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Currently trying with Curzon Ashton predicted to finish 22nd, No better team to try it with. played 3 friendlies so far: -

Struggled past the reserves 3-2 - at one point was 2-1 down

then lost 1-0 v Hyde even game 50% possession, 11 shots to 10 - 2 CCCs each

then a 3-0 win v st helens again 50% possession, 13 shots to 6 however 3 CCCs to 0

I've set up about 10 friendlies to try and get the tactic as fluid as poss - I also have changed the left BWM to a CM (D) as well as taking get stuck in off. I will give it 10 games in the league or so and see how I fare.

Testing similar set up. Have also moved defensive line to normal.

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is that highly recommended pal? Or just a test of your own?

Still testing.

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Hope the testing is going well Mr Rosler. Bought the game yesterday and really want to try with Stalybridge who are my favourite team. As they are non league I'm looking forward to seeing if you manage to release a version in the not so far away future which is suitable for semi-pro teams down the football league ladder. Hope you are having a great weekend.

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Using a mix of this formation with a 4-3-3 i was using @ Stockport and its going pretty well. 10 wins 2 draws 2 losses, since using it (NOT FLUID).

First full season using my variant. Won 7 lost 2.

Should have won both lost games as well.

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Not going so well at the mo - 6 games in won the first 2 then it's all gone wrong - lost 3 and drawn 1

the results have been as follows: -

Corby H 2-1 win 6 shots to their 7, 2 CCCs to their 1, 55% possession

AFC Telford A 1-0 win 7 shots to their 9, 1 CCC to their 2, 57% possession

Boston A 2-1 loss 0 shots at half time to their 8 - ended up 8 shots to their 10, 1 CCC each 50/50 possession

Harrogate H 4-2 loss we did outplay them 60% possession and 17 shots but we were 1-0 down when our keeper got injured on 40 minutes and I had no sub keeper. the other 3 goals were nonsense goals, so I don't really count this particular game.

Alfreton A 0-0 draw, we deserved to win - 10 shots to 1, 1 CCC to 0 and 58% possession

AFC Fylde H 2-1 loss 7 shots to their 10, 3 CCCs to their 1 and 56% possession

so a bit mixed, decent possession but not clinical enough it seems, hard to attract good players though that fit the tactic!

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Removing 'get stuck in' seems to weaken any tactic, but using it results in too many fouls, yellow & red cards.

Back to the drawing board i think.

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Removing 'get stuck in' seems to weaken any tactic, but using it results in too many fouls, yellow & red cards.

Back to the drawing board i think.

I did that with my tactic and it didn't seem to impact it at all...maybe even made it better ;)

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Removing 'get stuck in' seems to weaken any tactic, but using it results in too many fouls, yellow & red cards.

Back to the drawing board i think.

It does get a lot of yellows but not too many - A few bans here and there but the tactic is still fantastic.

EDIT: As I typed this I had a player sent off for two yellows! Typical.

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