ddidiodion Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 And this is why we'll end up with Mourinho, the same Mourinho who has lost the dressing room in both of his last jobs.We need patience, youth and forward thinking. A coach from the new breed of managers, Not someone only here for 2 years to win trophies - mainly because we don't have a squad anywhere good enough to challenge for trophies. And we need someone who will actually win stuff. Pochettino wont. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy Howard Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 And we need someone who will actually win stuff. Pochettino wont. So only Pep or Mourinho are ever going to win stuff? Anyways, LVG has gone apparently. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddidiodion Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 So only Pep or Mourinho are ever going to win stuff?Anyways, LVG has gone apparently. There are other options, less ideal or guaranteed ones. But someone isn't going to go from being a middling manager at Spurs to being good enough to achieve what Man Utd want to achieve. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmy Howard Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 There are other options, less ideal or guaranteed ones. But someone isn't going to go from being a middling manager at Spurs to being good enough to achieve what Man Utd want to achieve. That's very belittling of what he has achieved at Spurs. He's an excellent manager and transformed that team. What Man Utd want to achieve is completely the problem. No one, I fear, is going to be good enough for what we want to achieve in the short term, it's completely unrealistic. The club needs a complete overhaul - we need a long term solution - not one here to win a few trophies and then bugger off and not one that's nearing retirement with outdated methods. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 That's very belittling of what he has achieved at Spurs. He's an excellent manager and transformed that team.What Man Utd want to achieve is completely the problem. No one, I fear, is going to be good enough for what we want to achieve in the short term, it's completely unrealistic. The club needs a complete overhaul - we need a long term solution - not one here to win a few trophies and then bugger off and not one that's nearing retirement with outdated methods. What United need to do is stop the rot first. While keeping tabs on managers coming through. The ideal of managers sticking around for 6-7 years is a rarity in truth. The only chance of that is one of the old boys, and none are currently ready for that. Maybe Neville, which we will find out at Valencia. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redshift Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Anyways, LVG has gone apparently. Eh? What's this? If only that were true. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harryseaess Posted December 22, 2015 Author Share Posted December 22, 2015 LvG gone, Giggs for Stoke and Mourinho after that apparently. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddidiodion Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 That's very belittling of what he has achieved at Spurs. He's an excellent manager and transformed that team.What Man Utd want to achieve is completely the problem. No one, I fear, is going to be good enough for what we want to achieve in the short term, it's completely unrealistic. The club needs a complete overhaul - we need a long term solution - not one here to win a few trophies and then bugger off and not one that's nearing retirement with outdated methods. He's transformed the team from one that wins nothing to? Oh yeah... one that wins nothing. We need a manager who knows how to win. Winning breeds winning and the longer we go without doing it the harder it is to start again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ72 Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Eh? What's this? If only that were true. Trevor Sinclair claiming it is true. Not sure what gives him the scoop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gizzy Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Can't see Jose starting for the Chelsea game. That would be mental, and a game he would need to win. Better to wait until after that game. Excited. Love Jose Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddidiodion Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Don't think I'd want him here if he didn't want to manage against Chelsea. He's got a perfect working knowledge of their squad and we have a shot at the title, can't be giving away points just because it might be a bit awkward. It also doesn't seem like Jose at all, the man loves a confrontation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gizzy Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Yeah suppose. You have convinced me Dion. Lets 'av it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt_e Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 All of that seems to have come from Sinclair who has now said he left his phone out at a Christmas party. Gotta love the standards of journalism with these things Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icondacarver Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 If we get tonked by Stoke he will be gone which is a shame in a way but once we went down the route of sack and splash cash, we were on that train. Next guy will splash more cash and have us no better and then get sacked. With the guy after him, we will rein in the spends which will doom his reign and so on and so on. Welcome to reality of football that SAF shielded us from Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSB Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 The quick turnover of managers was never going to be stymied once we hired a guy considering retirement. Get Jose in to win some pots and dispel this idea that Fergie is some sort of irreplicable god and then get the long term guy in when it all goes to ratshit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddidiodion Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 If we get tonked by Stoke he will be gone which is a shame in a way but once we went down the route of sack and splash cash, we were on that train. Next guy will splash more cash and have us no better and then get sacked. With the guy after him, we will rein in the spends which will doom his reign and so on and so on. Welcome to reality of football that SAF shielded us from I mean it hasn't done any harm to literally every other club in existence apart from Arsenal over the last 20 years has it? Managers are plenty capable of bringing about short term success, if a club can't survive a change of managers and remain successful it's a very badly run club. This idea that we're doomed if we don't find a replacement for SAF is silly, stick with good managers and success will come. If someone special crops up then nab them, if not go for the next safe pair of hands. What we need to do is sort upstairs out, we can't allow every manager to come in and change everything and "rebuild", that is over now. What we need is managers who will come in and improve on what we have. Whether Jose is that guy or not is a matter of opinion, but the idea that you can't be hugely successful while chopping and changing managers isn't true. You don't go for a long term option unless there is a viable long term option available and those are exceptionally rare. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSB Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Has anyone been consistently successful changing managers without putting shitloads of cash behind them though? Which is harder to do both for us under Glazer and relatively to other teams in the division like Chelsea and city. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt_e Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Has anyone been consistently successful changing managers without putting shitloads of cash behind them though? Which is harder to do both for us under Glazer and relatively to other teams in the division like Chelsea and city. How many clubs have been consistently successful keeping their manager without putting shitloads of cash? Unless you run like god producing world class players through a youth system it's virtually impossible to compete long term without significant spend. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddidiodion Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Barcelona, Real Madrid, Bayern, Chelsea, City, Juventus to a lesser extent. Basically all the clubs we're competing against. You don't try and plan around having a freak of nature, we aren't going to go out get someone who stays around for 7 years and wins 5 titles and a Champions League. It might happen purely through luck, but you can't just base your club around picking one up. And we're not going to do it without putting loads of cash in, because everyone else is putting loads of cash in too. That's just how football is now, even Bayern spend big despite having a monopoly on their own countries talent and a very savvy business model. If the club is limited by cash flow then that's the end of the story, we won't compete for domestic and European honours. We also won't attract any potential, probably mythical next-SAF because he'll go somewhere without financial limitations. We all have our own views on the club financed based on not a lot, it doesn't really change how we go about business either way though. You attract the best manager you can to improve on what you have with the resources you have available, if we can get Pep or Mourinho then grand, if not we'll have to look for lower budget options. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gizzy Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 There is no long term in the top tier of football any more. Wenger will be the last one. Look at Pep, he is the only manager around who has any sustained success and he chooses not to stick around. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icondacarver Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Barcelona, Real Madrid, Bayern, Chelsea, City, Juventus to a lesser extent. Basically all the clubs we're competing against. You don't try and plan around having a freak of nature, we aren't going to go out get someone who stays around for 7 years and wins 5 titles and a Champions League. It might happen purely through luck, but you can't just base your club around picking one up. And we're not going to do it without putting loads of cash in, because everyone else is putting loads of cash in too. That's just how football is now, even Bayern spend big despite having a monopoly on their own countries talent and a very savvy business model. If the club is limited by cash flow then that's the end of the story, we won't compete for domestic and European honours. We also won't attract any potential, probably mythical next-SAF because he'll go somewhere without financial limitations. We all have our own views on the club financed based on not a lot, it doesn't really change how we go about business either way though. You attract the best manager you can to improve on what you have with the resources you have available, if we can get Pep or Mourinho then grand, if not we'll have to look for lower budget options. We can't spend like those guys, another summer of £250m spent and the debt will be back to near 2008 levels. The Glazers are more likely to take an approach that gives them maximum ROI with the least risky outlay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rio_V Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 The Pep model is interesting. He seems to stay for success and then leave before anything bad happens. He will probably try to manage at least one top club in England, France, Spain, Germany and Italy before he is done. As long as he is winning like this, he dictates where he goes, who comes with him and when he leaves and where he goes to. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ72 Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 We can't spend like those guys, another summer of £250m spent and the debt will be back to near 2008 levels.The Glazers are more likely to take an approach that gives them maximum ROI with the least risky outlay. Thought that was the reason we went for Moyes. Keep things steady without spending anything. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddidiodion Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 We can't spend like those guys, another summer of £250m spent and the debt will be back to near 2008 levels.The Glazers are more likely to take an approach that gives them maximum ROI with the least risky outlay. You get what you pay for, the club will spend what it is willing to spend. So far almost all predictions have been wrong in that regard. It seems the dominating factor in predictions is the natural optimism of the person making the prediction. Ultimately we'll see when it happens, clubs running on a budget still need to be able to switch managers without going into free fall though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
VamPook Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 There is no long term in the top tier of football any more. Wenger will be the last one.Look at Pep, he is the only manager around who has any sustained success and he chooses not to stick around. He wants the challenge of winning in every league. Cant fault that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
metal_guitarist Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 U18s made hard work of a very winnable FA Youth Cup tie tonight. Beat QPR 2-1 after Extra Time, Callum Whelan and then Marcus Rashford from the penalty spot. Fosu-Mensah MOTM easily, the QPR players couldn't get near him, they just bounced off of him! Chelsea next in the 4th round, think that'll be the end of our cup run. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rio_V Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Is Fosu-Mensah our best U18 player? Do you think he is a future United player? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Race 9 Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Is Fosu-Mensah our best U18 player? Do you think he is a future United player? he looks a good prospect for u21's last week they played him at right back and he was devastating great speed work rate crossing, set up 2 goals he is supposed to be a DC/DM from what I saw I would put him as RB in 1st team now looked class very strong Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 So Van Gaal has been told (again) that he must win 2 of the next 3 games to keep his job. Partly because a) United want to "keep their word" b) some of the board/heirarchy still are unsure/against over Mourinho (read: Sir Bobby) c) They are still trying to (belatedly) chase Guardiola until they exhaust all chances with him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icelander83 Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Not good enough over the last 18 months? It's fine, just prove yourself over the next 2 weeks and you get to keep your job Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TioPatinhax Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Listened to a couple of Man Utd fans yesterday on TalkSport, and most are against Jose taking over at Old Trafford, really strong feelings against him. Is he really this unliked in Manchester by the fans in general? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kawee Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 The next three games are in less than 2 weeks though aren't they? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icelander83 Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 The next three games are in less than 2 weeks though aren't they? With LvG managing it'll feel like 2 weeks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTHerringbone Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Seems van Gaal has stormed out of the press conference ahead of the Boxing Day match. Lasted less than 5 minutes Daniel Taylor @DTguardian 2m2 minutes ago Press conf lasted 4mins 58secs. Key line pre-walkout: Van Gaal said he had received assurances from Woodward, Ferguson and Gill #mufc Link to BBC: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/35166770 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Button Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Who cares about assurances from Ferguson and Gill? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTHerringbone Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Who cares about assurances from Ferguson and Gill? I think Gill is a Director of the club and Ferguson definitely is (plus some sort of ambassador). They aren't nobodies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
VamPook Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Assurances that he only has the next 3 games? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ72 Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Good to see he's passionate. Now get that passion into your football Louis. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigcwwe Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Seems van Gaal has stormed out of the press conference ahead of the Boxing Day match. Lasted less than 5 minutes Daniel Taylor @DTguardian 2m2 minutes ago Press conf lasted 4mins 58secs. Key line pre-walkout: Van Gaal said he had received assurances from Woodward, Ferguson and Gill #mufc Link to BBC: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/35166770 Watched the presser on MUTV and he certainly didn't "storm out", more of a casual walk off. He was clearly narked with the media though and rightly so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redshift Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Not rightly so at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddidiodion Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Loads were all quite happy to report that he'd been sacked last night with very little evidence, probably should have been a little easier on the old trigger finger. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redshift Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Ah ok, I didn't see anything last night. If it was about his performance than it would have been deserved. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt_e Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Loads were all quite happy to report that he'd been sacked last night with very little evidence, probably should have been a little easier on the old trigger finger. Aye, especially given the source was an ex-City player as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigcwwe Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Loads were all quite happy to report that he'd been sacked last night with very little evidence, probably should have been a little easier on the old trigger finger. In terms if the reports of his sacking which of course turned out to be false. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georginho_juventusygr Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 The journalists should be happy that they got wine and mince pies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Race 9 Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 The journalists should be happy that they got wine and mince pies. lol;) as a utd fan for over 40 years I will be hoping stoke administer the knock out punch.....on boxing day:brock: hate to even think it but this is how many long standing utd fans feel was hoping he would do the decent thing, but the more I hear him speak deep down I believe he thinks he is doing a good job, that's the worry he is living on his long past glories he is deluded Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themadsheep2001 Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Loads were all quite happy to report that he'd been sacked last night with very little evidence, probably should have been a little easier on the old trigger finger. This. Phil McNulty even had the nerve to defend it by saying "we get abuse on Twitter". Basically resorted to schoolyard reasoning. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Race 9 Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 The next three games are in less than 2 weeks though aren't they? the 3 games included Norwich so if its right he has to win the next 2....that wont happen, if stoke do us which on current form is very likely he is gone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddidiodion Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Actually have this weird feeling Stoke will be a bit of a turning point, the mood seems to have shifted slightly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Race 9 Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 we will see if he has lost the players...............if they are behind him they will fight for their lives if its a lacklustre performance like the dying embers of the moyes era then we will know Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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