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Neil Brock

Football Manager 2015 Features Video Official Feedback Thread

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This! The demo is there for undecided people. Other than that you know what you are getting

The demo is of no use when it comes to the AI squad building, the demo lasts 6 months and it takes at least 4 years before you can judge the AI squad building.

I disagree with Dave, this is not like buying 'The Evil Within', that is a new game and all they can do is show you what to expect, if there ever becomes a 'The Evil Within 20' I am sure people would be asking questions about the stupid AI.

I guess what people that have long term saves were maybe hoping for was information along the lines of "The AI now targets players that are needed for certain positions", "The AI now does not buy the best young talent and let them rot", "The AI does not allow it's team to age without replacements".

Something along those lines, a simple "it's been worked on" is not really giving any information.

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I personally cannot understand why SI have apparently changed marketing tact and gone for one video only so far with info in and thats it. Hardly heard anything else from them since. Not sure thats the best way to go but what i do know.

And yes to daylight post. Although i agree with Dagenham_Dave somewhat i also agree that i certainly would have liked to have heard more intricate details about how the AI has been improved, some people have said its not a feature as its continually improved every year but i disagree as its clearly hugely important to a very large portion of Fm fans.

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No info? How about this then?

Just to clarify, AI improving squad building is not a feature. It's something that we do every version as we're always looking to improve it. The transfer market and how it works always undergoes work 'under the hood' so to speak. Given the importance now being given to player roles and as Miles said, how the AI now uses roles more effectively then this is something they'll be looking at in terms of squad building.

Edit: Guys, this is a complex module in the game. There might not be anything specific, apart from what Neil mentioned, but they always working on it and fine-tuning things. If you find anything regarding illogical transfers or squad building in future, please report it.

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No im sorry but thats exactly what i meant. They have said its not a feature? Hardly much info in that post by Neil is there. Im talking about features as daylight states above in his post! Its great that they are always looking to improve it but what have they done, what improvements have been made? 3 lines of info isnt exactly much.

Edit: And thats fair enough mate, i know its a complex and difficult part of the game to change but just some more detailed nfo would be nice. If they dont have any then ii personally find that worrying as no info to give means minimal changes in my eyes.

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Hunt3r that is exactly what we mean in terms of being vague, so what changes have been made? how does the AI react towards squad building?

Also with all respect of course AI squad building is a feature, it is a feature as much as anything else in the game, without AI squad building there is no game.

Everything gets worked on every year, dear me, for some reason media gets worked on every year, is that no longer a feature then?

It's all good.

I have bought every game of CM/FM, hell I even went through the CM04 nightmare and still I came back for more, I am all out of leaps of faith, if SI can no longer give information on something as important as AI squad building but can go in depth about stupid media responses being added then I will spend my cash on other games.

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No im sorry but thats exactly what i meant. They have said its not a feature? Hardly much info in that post by Neil is there. Im talking about features as daylight states above in his post! Its great that they are always looking to improve it but what have they done, what improvements have been made? 3 lines of info isnt exactly much.

It's 3 lines more than other games companies give you. As my edited post state, there might not be anything specific to tell. It might just be a case of improving or fine-tuning the AI logic in certain ways. Something like the AI targeting certain roles rather than just looking at overall positions is a fairly big deal, if no-one realises. It'll help the AI buy a ball-winning Sandro when it needs one instead of a Modric to do the ball-winning, for instance, keeping the squad better balanced.

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Is the beta out next week?

they said two weeks before the launch date... the lunch date is 3 weeks today so the beta comes out 2 weeks before the launch date which would make next friday the launch date for the beta..

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Probably if not most probabaly next week. Maybe on or around Friday.

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It's 3 lines more than other games companies give you.

It's important not to overlook this point. Go on an EA forum and ask the developer specific details about the latest iteration of their various franchises.

Whilst you may feel that SI aren't giving you enough specific detail, they are giving more information than is normal in this industry.

Just look at the posts from Neil D in the recent Fifa vs. FM thread. It is rare to get that sort of developer : user interaction and it should not be overlooked.

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to be fair, i think i have read someone from si that positions and roles are going to be checked better by ai which is supposed to buy players specifically for position/role. so, that is a bit of an improvement i guess.

Is that not the part that Hunt3r quoted from Neil?

Again it is really vague if it is.

Given how many players complain about this and how important it is to the long term save SI really should be showing us something about it.

Maybe showing a team 10 years from now and how the AI has built the squad, saying how it has changed since previous versions, a simple "something they'll be looking at" with regards to the new player roles is hardly confidence inspiring.

At the moment I actually find the silence saying a lot, I even seen a thread closed by Neil asking about the AI squad building with Neil saying "try the demo", the demo is useless to judge this.

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It's important not to overlook this point. Go on an EA forum and ask the developer specific details about the latest iteration of their various franchises.

Whilst you may feel that SI aren't giving you enough specific detail, they are giving more information than is normal in this industry.

Just look at the posts from Neil D in the recent Fifa vs. FM thread. It is rare to get that sort of developer : user interaction and it should not be overlooked.

Actually this is also not true, there are many devs that are very very hands on with their player base, they stay in touch with them and take time to respond to their posts and answer questions.

I have beta tested a lot of games in the past and again in those games you find quite often you can have 1 to 1 chats with the actual devs.

Let's not judge every developer as a mini EA.

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Is that not the part that Hunt3r quoted from Neil?

Again it is really vague if it is.

Given how many players complain about this and how important it is to the long term save SI really should be showing us something about it.

Maybe showing a team 10 years from now and how the AI has built the squad, saying how it has changed since previous versions, a simple "something they'll be looking at" with regards to the new player roles is hardly confidence inspiring.

At the moment I actually find the silence saying a lot, I even seen a thread closed by Neil asking about the AI squad building with Neil saying "try the demo", the demo is useless to judge this.

You're not likely to get something like that. When the game is out, ask one of your buddies to do that so you can see and decide if you want to play the game or not.

I think the AI looking at specific roles rather than general positions is a big deal. You don't? Fine. As Neil said on Page 1, daylight, please stop now with this. SI has given you and everyone else an answer already. Thanks.

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As Neil said on Page 1, daylight, please stop now with this. SI has given you and everyone else an answer already. Thanks.

Fine, thanks for the quote.

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Is that not the part that Hunt3r quoted from Neil?

Again it is really vague if it is.

Given how many players complain about this and how important it is to the long term save SI really should be showing us something about it.

Maybe showing a team 10 years from now and how the AI has built the squad, saying how it has changed since previous versions, a simple "something they'll be looking at" with regards to the new player roles is hardly confidence inspiring.

At the moment I actually find the silence saying a lot, I even seen a thread closed by Neil asking about the AI squad building with Neil saying "try the demo", the demo is useless to judge this.

We'll know soon enough from those that will have the beta and then the full game. The reason they're not going in depth about it on here is probably because the people who specifically work on AI squad building don't post on here. Neil can't probably say much because he works on the forum software and things like that so he probably doesn't know the specifics. They're not promoting the squad building improvements because it's only the hardcore on here who give a damn. Basically we just have to be patient and make a decision after the game is released.

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I am not sure I see AI squad building as that big an issue, but do get that it seems to be for quite a few people on here.

I've built a bit of a super team in Germany, now in 2025 (with Leipzig) so it's been a journey, just (or finally) won 3 leagues on the bounce, but then Dortmund, Schalke and Bayern have bounced back and I've not won the league for two seasons.

If AI was that messed up, they'd never bounce back would they?

AI is a long way from being better than a human isn't it?? Or on a game of this much resources and scope, but it's not as bad for me as some seem to think. I've seen it a lot worse.

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AI is a long way from being better than a human isn't it?? Or on a game of this much resources and scope, but it's not as bad for me as some seem to think. I've seen it a lot worse.

I think people are rightly peeved that iteration after iteration, we see a 38 year old Cristiano Ronaldo wheeled out at Real Madrid, who are sitting on millions of Euros and could have replaced him a decade ago with the "new Ronaldo". AI squad building is an issue which can make the game too easy after 5+ seasons. Hopefully the continued tweaks to this area make a difference this year.

However, I agree with you that whilst this is a problem historically, it isn't automatically a cakewalk to the title in spite of these quirks which are in our favour.

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We mustn't forget about the new scouting system. It should make it a little more difficult to find and buy young superstars of the future.

However, I agree with you that whilst this is a problem historically, it isn't automatically a cakewalk to the title in spite of these quirks which are in our favour.

FM15 is almost out. I'm in 2038 and I've still not won the Champions League on FM14 yet. :(

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I think people are rightly peeved that iteration after iteration, we see a 38 year old Cristiano Ronaldo wheeled out at Real Madrid, who are sitting on millions of Euros and could have replaced him a decade ago with the "new Ronaldo". AI squad building is an issue which can make the game too easy after 5+ seasons. Hopefully the continued tweaks to this area make a difference this year.

However, I agree with you that whilst this is a problem historically, it isn't automatically a cakewalk to the title in spite of these quirks which are in our favour.

Fair one. But real life transfers can not always make sense either though. Jack Rodwell and Man City, Liverpool and Andy Carrol, Bebe and Vitoria to Man Utd and away again.

I am looking forward to the game. The features look nice.

Everyone knows it will be what it is here. Patches will be released.

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FM15 is almost out. I'm in 2038 and I've still not won the Champions League on FM14 yet. :(

That may be more down to the player than the game though. ;)

*runs the fine line of not mentioning anything to do with squad building* ............ doh!

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That may be more down to the player than the game though. ;)

*runs the fine line of not mentioning anything to do with squad building* ............ doh!

Actually - if AI squad building was *that* bad, HUNT3R would have won the Champions League.

Unless........ :brock:

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Hey, I won leagues! It just took me a while :D

With the scouting system change, it might take even longer!

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Has the Beta ever come out earlier than expected? I am dying here, didn't play FM 14 due to a broken laptop. I want it!

Beta's are like trains. Only ever later than you want them to be (and no, that is NOT an official comment :D )

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I dare FM to release the BETA tomorrow night, if they don't they are chicken :eek:

Yeah that will get them going .... KingMack dares you! He dares you!

In truth you should have used the 'cluck, cluck, cluck' sounds, that may have pushed them over the edge.

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Do you have this attitude with every game you buy? I'm buying The Evil Within for the PS4 tomorrow. I haven't been all over the developer's forum demanding they tell me everything that's in the game. I like the premise of it, I've seen a few gameplay videos of it, and it's a genre I enjoy playing, therefore I'll buy it.

As far as this game goes, it's Football Manager, you know what it'll be. The same game it always is with various improvements and enhancements. When did the customer base get so flaming precious?

They want to sell a product, i´m asking about said product, as i do not know if i´ll buy or not. That is simple, it is logical and therefore i´m doing it. Just like i would if i was being sold a phone, a computer or anything else where the new product should surpass the old. I´d ask about specs and guess what, i´d actually get an answer. Not just "It´s being improved every year". SI are making a claim, then to some extent prove it or atleast offer some information about it.

They released 30 minutes of footage, they had press conferences as a new feature, but it really is´nt. Just like AI improvements is´nt a new feature, but an improvement. So why are we being told about press conference improvements, but not in regards to the AI?

Ai is a huge part of the game and throughout the years, numerous of threads and posts have revolved around this exact part of the game. And the company line is "it´s being improved". That is just not good enough and therefore i´m asking about it. If you dont have anything to offer in regards to my questions about ai - which you don´t - then just move along, as im not interested in your opinion.

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You got more than "it's being worked on". I have repeated this a few times now and I'm not going to again.

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You got more than "it's being worked on". I have repeated this a few times now and I'm not going to again.

IIf you are referring to post 612, i jsut got to laugh. I could not care less about what you want to do or do not want to do. I´m asking SI a question, about their game on their forum.

I´m looking for further elaboration on those couple of lines, if you can´t deliver exactly that, then there is no point in answering me again and again and again.

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IIf you are referring to post 612, i jsut got to laugh. I could not care less about what you want to do or do not want to do. I´m asking SI a question, about their game on their forum.

I´m looking for further elaboration on those couple of lines, if you can´t deliver exactly that, then there is no point in answering me again and again and again.

If they can and want to elaborate, they will. Just be patient then, but don't expect an answer.

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Beta's are like trains. Only ever later than you want them to be (and no, that is NOT an official comment :D )

Like train - better to be a bit late than to crash.

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I think this is a big release for SI this year having many medium/long term fans underwhelmed by the offerings of the last two years and the underdeveloped match engine particularly. I think another weak offering will turn people off it for a while. Personally, having played football manager games for years, the last two years were the least enjoyable games made by SI, having produced the most immersive games for about 20 years prior…if the trend continues this year will be hard to keep buying…it could be 3 strikes and you’re out.

It has been an interesting approach this year from SI...last two years there was much more hype from SI around the releases focusing on enhancements in graphics and the new match engine. In essence the general feeling is that both were underdelivered.

I'm wondering whether SI have learned a lesson in that they're managing expectations this year...is it that they don't want to raise customer expectations and have that anti-climatic/disappointed feeling permeate the forums and buyers as they haven't improved things much or have they legitimately had very strong development cycle this year and are underplaying things so that customers will be more than satisfied on release giving the feeling of ‘they’re back on track’ with a 'promise less, deliver more' approach and have finally seen some potential of the match engine realised…certainly I hope it’s the latter and we see huge improvements in the elusive balancing of the match engine and the non slidiness/ice hockey viewing of matches…would be great if that is case…we’ll see soon enough I guess…

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Neil/Hunter i don't know if you guys know the answer to this but being a Guiseley fan, They have a Main squad and then a U21, U16, and then on their site they have a Academy squad and then a development squad..

My question is on their development squad they have players from Jan-April 2000 range and are listed as 14 yrs of age... my question is does fm15 have like a U16 squad or just U18 is the lowest and also is 15 still the lowest age for youth or is it changed to 14

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Love how people turn to amateur psychology and imply hugely in depth motivation and/or deviousness by SI to justify their theories :)

It's quite simple, advertising tack is somewhat different this year as mediums have changed somewhat and many of us haven't kept up so expect this forum to be central to it all, well it isn't any more.

There's still time before release to hype it some more and I'm sure they will, I'm also sure nothing much has changed in the way they're making testing and selling the game.

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To be honest, and this sounds more harsh than its actually meant, but I dont pay much attention to you Mods when it comes to topics like this as it feels like you never disagree with anything SI do or say so. Other topics are of course different and you have all offered valuable input so no offense meant. Just my opinion. Either way i still underwhelmed by it all and disappointed that its clear the main focus currently, and for the last few years, is the 3d engine! Kriss im sorry but even with social media platforms that they use and other ways to market the game its still a very quiet release. Perhaps it is just to manage expectations this year as they havent made many big changes. I guess we'll see!

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Lol

whats even more interesting is people/companies doing things without consciously knowing why they are doing them ;)

that they've got burned by the avalanche of criticsm the last two years and perhaps lessons have been learned...of course that remains to be seen

the medium of delivery was not what was questioned, nor the motivation or the message itself...more getting at the crux of things...have SI been able to deliver an enhanced product at its fundamental level (ie its match engine)...we shall see...we're all hoping they have...

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any idea if we can see the directors / owners and customize the cups to see a real version of the premier league trophy, la liga serie A etc

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In

Neil/Hunter i don't know if you guys know the answer to this but being a Guiseley fan, They have a Main squad and then a U21, U16, and then on their site they have a Academy squad and then a development squad..

My question is on their development squad they have players from Jan-April 2000 range and are listed as 14 yrs of age... my question is does fm15 have like a U16 squad or just U18 is the lowest and also is 15 still the lowest age for youth or is it changed to 14

players have to be 16 to be in gane just under 21 and under 18 squads

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To be honest, and this sounds more harsh than its actually meant, but I dont pay much attention to you Mods when it comes to topics like this as it feels like you never disagree with anything SI do or say so. Other topics are of course different and you have all offered valuable input so no offense meant. Just my opinion. Either way i still underwhelmed by it all and disappointed that its clear the main focus currently, and for the last few years, is the 3d engine! Kriss im sorry but even with social media platforms that they use and other ways to market the game its still a very quiet release. Perhaps it is just to manage expectations this year as they havent made many big changes. I guess we'll see!

The last two lines of my post was an explanation of the response I got from SI when I pointed out privately that people seemed underwhelmed by the low key roll out :D

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The last two lines of my post was an explanation of the response I got from SI when I pointed out privately that people seemed underwhelmed by the low key roll out :D

Fair enough mate, like i said before its only on topics like that when i feel the mods are biased to whatever SI say, you're mods for the official forums so i dont blame you as such. Just my opinion anyway, of course i could be entirely wrong! I certainly value yours and the other mods input on everything else in regards to FM!

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The last two lines of my post was an explanation of the response I got from SI when I pointed out privately that people seemed underwhelmed by the low key roll out :D

I'm just waiting on 1 of you mod type fellows to go all Forest Gump on us.

"Life is like a box of chocolates...."

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