Two playmakers in one team?

[Samizdat]

What are people's thoughts on having two playmakers in one team? I always assumed that one was preferable in FM14, but now that my playmaker is out on the right wing in a classic 4-3-3 line-up, I'm wondering what would happen with a DLP in either the DMC spot or one of the two MC spots (probably along a BBM)?

Would they clash, or are they complementary or simply far enough apart?

[Marsupian]

I quite regularly play with two playmakers in the team. The only thing that changes is that you have another player with more creative freedom who plays riskier passes. Putting it in perspective using the TI play riskier passes, more expressive and maybe using a very fluid philosophy would be similar to playing a bunch of playmakers together.

I wouldn't worry about it and just see how the team plays. Make changes based on what happens on the pitch. It can become a problem when you have too many people coming deep to collect the ball trying to play a forward pass with not enough players running forward to get on the end of it.

I have a 4-3-3 where the left winger is an advanced playmaker, the DM a regista and the two MC's box to box midfielders. It did perfectly fine.

[JD nawrat]

Two playmakers is fine providing you have them set up in distinct, complimentary roles.

For example, AP/A and AP/A both in MC doesn't really do much for each other - whereas DLP/S and AP/A in MC does; one will drop deep to find the ball and look to play it to his teammate higher up the pitch. Think a bit like Xavi and Iniesta and their functions for Barcelona - Xavi would look to find the ball first and play it upfield, usually towards Iniesta or Messi (not a playmaker but the main threat for the team).

Personally I've had a lot of success with a midfield trio of AP/A, B2B (both MC) and DLP/D (in DMC). The DLP/D is primarily defensive but starts attacks and tries to get the ball further upfield for the AP/A to eventually pull strings around the final third.

[jamez_b]

I play with a regista and an advanced playmaker - support at the moment which works wonderfully well. Excellent for keeping possession and racking the passes up. My formation is as follows:

These are the stats toward the end of the season:

I've found with the right players you can get some really good movement and quick interplay, it makes it very difficult for the opposition to completely shut down your creative outlet as there is always another in support. I was inspired by the way Diaz and Aranguiz interact for Chile/U de Chile and seems to be working, possession rarely goes below 60% and it's great to watch.

[Samizdat]

Thanks everyone - you've all given me a lot to consider and work with.

[Ö-zil to the Arsenal!]

I play with a regista and an advanced playmaker - support at the moment which works wonderfully well. Excellent for keeping possession and racking the passes up. My formation is as follows:

These are the stats toward the end of the season:

I've found with the right players you can get some really good movement and quick interplay, it makes it very difficult for the opposition to completely shut down your creative outlet as there is always another in support. I was inspired by the way Diaz and Aranguiz interact for Chile/U de Chile and seems to be working, possession rarely goes below 60% and it's great to watch.

I like the look of that tactic; nice job!

[janesy20]

@jamez_b looks very similar to my successful Juve tactic!

[jamez_b]

Yeah similar shape and the idea to keep the ball as much as possible. My main brief when I started this little mexico games was that i wanted to create more of a tactical hybrid of Herrera and Sampaoli and it seems to be working nicely.

These two videos show America at their very best:

[video=youtube_share;UuTclA37Mjc]

[video=youtube_share;4bemmctP3zY]

I love how Martinez, dos Santos and Sambueza interlink in the heart of midfield. Sambueza is very creative too so in theory i'm playing with three play makers in the middle of the park.

Definitely need the right players though as I've tried the formation on a few other teams and it's no where near as effective.

Also struggles against 4-3-3 but i'm slowly finding a way to win against it without moving away from the way i want to play.

[tomtuck01]

I play with five playmakers.

[brod]

I was just about to post about this. I play with 4 playmakers - 2 MC's that are DLP's and support, and 2 AMC's that are AP's on Attack. It doesn't seem to have had that much effect on anything to be honest, though I think I need a better striker.

I have a ball winning midfielder in the DM postion, and the DL and DR are CWB on automatic to provide width.

Can you have too many?

[baboyray]

DLP-D in the DM position and AP-A in the CM position works great for me

[Marsupian]

I was just about to post about this. I play with 4 playmakers - 2 MC's that are DLP's and support, and 2 AMC's that are AP's on Attack. It doesn't seem to have had that much effect on anything to be honest, though I think I need a better striker.

I have a ball winning midfielder in the DM postion, and the DL and DR are CWB on automatic to provide width.

Can you have too many?

The effect is that when a player has a decision to pass to two players and one is a playmaker the playmaker is the preferred option (everything else being equal). Basically playmakers attract the ball and play will be channeled through them. This also means that if you only have one playmaker he doesn't have any further bias towards any of the players in the team while if you have multiple he will have a bias to pass to another playmaker. Because of this lone playmakers can be more aggressive in their passing.

[brod]

The effect is that when a player has a decision to pass to two players and one is a playmaker the playmaker is the preferred option (everything else being equal). Basically playmakers attract the ball and play will be channeled through them. This also means that if you only have one playmaker he doesn't have any further bias towards any of the players in the team while if you have multiple he will have a bias to pass to another playmaker. Because of this lone playmakers can be more aggressive in their passing.

So with 4 playmakers they'll all be looking to pass to each other? I was kind of hoping for some kind of passing quadrant between them all which would keep the ball for me and create lots of opportunities as well.

Also, I try to play the players as what there best description is, which my starting 4 are Wilshere and Ramsey (DLP's), and Ozil and Angel Correa (AP's).

[aderow]

Can you have too many?

That's a valid question

Been thinking about this lately.

[RTHerringbone]

I play with five playmakers.

Really? How does that all hang together?

Some sort of 4-4-2 diamond with a Treq in the front two?

I moved from no playmakers to three and really enjoyed the massive impact it had on how we play.

In general - there's no need at all to fear using one, two (or five!) playmakers - almost anything can work in FM given the right balance.

[RTHerringbone]

So with 4 playmakers they'll all be looking to pass to each other? I was kind of hoping for some kind of passing quadrant between them all which would keep the ball for me and create lots of opportunities as well.

Also, I try to play the players as what there best description is, which my starting 4 are Wilshere and Ramsey (DLP's), and Ozil and Angel Correa (AP's).

Play will naturally gravitate towards them, and then will (to an extent) remain circulated between them whilst they evaluate the options available.

In my experience, it does increase the pass count (and so the possession, which some people seem obsessed by), but not to the extent that it blunts any attacking intent.

[Kawee]

Who make the runs though?

Most I've used is 3, but 2 is my favourite amount. I'm working with AP(A) in MCL, and a Regista in DM right now, and it's working absolutely fine. I like to have a playmaker bring the ball out of defense, and another crafting chances in the final 3rd. My 3rd main creator tends to be a long complete forward. So although he isn't a true playmaker, he crafts a lot of chances for others.

I don't really know why people are so obssessed with possession and playmakers, I sometimes see in the tactics session. The most beautiful football the engine produces, in my experience, is when you have lots of runners and goal-scorers. My team, for example, have 5 goal-scoring positions, and it's absolutely joy to watch them make runs for each other.

[aderow]

Who make the runs though?

Most I've used is 3, but 2 is my favourite amount. I'm working with AP(A) in MCL, and a Regista in DM right now, and it's working absolutely fine. I like to have a playmaker bring the ball out of defense, and another crafting chances in the final 3rd. My 3rd main creator tends to be a long complete forward. So although he isn't a true playmaker, he crafts a lot of chances for others.

I don't really know why people are so obssessed with possession and playmakers, I sometimes see in the tactics session. The most beautiful football the engine produces, in my experience, is when you have lots of runners and goal-scorers. My team, for example, have 5 goal-scoring positions, and it's absolutely joy to watch them make runs for each other.

I'd imagine the guys who aren't playmakers

[RTHerringbone]

I'd imagine the guys who aren't playmakers

Precisely

You can deliberately set up to have a relatively static middle, and focus on the movement mostly happening out wide.

I've been using a FM "4-1-2-2-1" recently (what normal people call a 4-3-3) with a DLP (D) at DM, and a DLP (S) and AP (A) at MC.

My movement is all about the wide men, and I want the centre of the pitch to see us recycle the ball and wait for our time to look for the wide runners.

Most sensible things in this game can work, you just need to know what it is you want to work.

[Letissier1980]

I've always liked the thought of a DLP at dm. Especially against 4-4-2's as I believe he would get a lot of the ball and draw players out. Do you find that the case rt?

[RTHerringbone]

I've always liked the thought of a DLP at dm. Especially against 4-4-2's as I believe he would get a lot of the ball and draw players out. Do you find that the case rt?

He certainly gets a lot of the ball, as he drops into the defensive line to offer a short option. It doesn't necessarily draw players out as a result, but it does ensure that you have a deep ball player on the ball as quickly as possible.

[aderow]

Precisely

You can deliberately set up to have a relatively static middle, and focus on the movement mostly happening out wide.

I've been using a FM "4-1-2-2-1" recently (what normal people call a 4-3-3) with a DLP (D) at DM, and a DLP (S) and AP (A) at MC.

My movement is all about the wide men, and I want the centre of the pitch to see us recycle the ball and wait for our time to look for the wide runners.

Most sensible things in this game can work, you just need to know what it is you want to work.

Yep. Personally, my side's movement comes from the wide men and the APa. The playmakers keep my side from being over aggressive and impatient.

[tomtuck01]

Really? How does that all hang together?

Some sort of 4-4-2 diamond with a Treq in the front two?

In a diamond, two CM's (DLP-S and AP-A), an AMC (AP-A), and two Strikers (both Treq's).

Basically two Treq's move deep taking the central defenders with them creating space for the AMC to cause havoc. (Errr, in my side, Joao Pedro).

[brod]

I'm not a fan of wingers. I prefer my width to come from the full backs, which I have set to automatic. I see the point about the runners though.

I've tweaked my tactic for the new season now. Last season it was:- 2 DLP's at MC on support and 2 AP's at AMC on attack, the width coming from the DL and DR as wing backs on automatic, and my striker set as a poacher. I figured he would be the one to profit from all of those playmakers! This was either Walcott or Benteke, and wasn't a great success.

Going into my new season, I've kept the DL and DR as they were, changed one of the MC to DLP on defend, changed one of the AMC to an AM on attack and then changed the striker to an advanced forward. I've also changed retain possession to shorter passing as well. And bought Balotelli, which is a upgrade on Walcott/Benteke.

[Falahk]

I play with five playmakers.

I did to, some time ago, thought with a different formation, here goes an old screen from fm10:

thats a midfield of: DLP/d DLP/d, AP/a, AP/s, AP/a

[bbgunn]

Just wanted to add my two cents/pence/yen here...

I also play with two playmakers. I'm currently running a 4-1DM-2-2AMLR-1 formation. My DM is a DLP/D, one CM is an AP/A and the other is a BBM. The DM is our best player, but the two CMs are the weakest of our starters (two stars). And yet, we often dictate play at will. Since setting the tactics like that, I rarely have a game where we create fewer chances than the other team. If we lose, it's because of our finishing or defensive lapses. It should be said, though, that I currently have one of the top teams in the division.

My forward is a False Nine; I don't know if that also counts as a playmaker or not. I'm still learning about that role.