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Neil Brock

Football Manager 2014 - Update 14.3.1 Update FEEDBACK THREAD

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Only thing i can find is Expenditure tab

Staff wages

This month - 174,932

Last month - 437,330

This season - 2,491,829

Last season - 5,467,820

Nothing about a maximum staff wage cap.

Can you do a pic of your allowable staff from the boardroom screen?

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Has a problem with players incessantly taking ridiculous long-range shots been acknowledged?

Its down to your tactics as well as their attributes & PPMs.

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Its down to your tactics as well as their attributes & PPMs.

Except my tactics are doing just fine. My results on the whole are good. If the match engine is recognising my team and set-up to be superior to the AI's then one could infer that my tactics aren't the problem - otherwise I wouldn't be winning matches. I can't think of anyone in my team who has the shoots from distance PPM.

If we were to assume that attributes were the problem, how low would you expect the decision making and team work ratings to be for a Premier League-level footballer to come to the conclusion that attempting a lob from 50 yards is a more expedient option than passing to a nearby team-mate (an option not precluded by my tactics)? Five? Ten? It's got to be very low to come to make such a bizarre decision. Obviously my players have good enough ratings for those two attributes for me not to expect 50 yard lobs to be attempted.

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If we were to assume that attributes were the problem, how low would you expect the decision making and team work ratings to be for a Premier League-level footballer to come to the conclusion that attempting a lob from 50 yards is a more expedient option than passing to a nearby team-mate (an option not precluded by my tactics)? Five? Ten? It's got to be very low to come to make such a bizarre decision. Obviously my players have good enough ratings for those two attributes for me not to expect 50 yard lobs to be attempted.

It is known and acknowledged that players will, on occasions, shoot from range when they have time and space to dribble closer to the goal first.

It isn't such a prevalent issue that a 50 yard lob will be attempted on a regular basis though.

More often than not, it will be a driven shot from 25-30 yards.

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It is known and acknowledged that players will, on occasions, shoot from range when they have time and space to dribble closer to the goal first.

It isn't such a prevalent issue that a 50 yard lob will be attempted on a regular basis though.

More often than not, it will be a driven shot from 25-30 yards.

Right, thank you. Yes I see those too. I also see shots taken with alarming regularity (more than the long-range attempts) from tear-jerkingly wide angles. I was hoping this would be patched up in 14.3.1 but it clearly hasn't been.

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Except my tactics are doing just fine. My results on the whole are good. If the match engine is recognising my team and set-up to be superior to the AI's then one could infer that my tactics aren't the problem - otherwise I wouldn't be winning matches. I can't think of anyone in my team who has the shoots from distance PPM.

"Tactics" encompass a wide range of choices you make as the manager.

If you are winning matches then they are working to a certain degree, if your team are taking too many long shots for your liking then your tactics aren't working for you. Its perfectly possible to win games and still not be happy with the way the team played. Its clearly an issue for you as you've made a post about it so you need to decide if you want to tweak those winning tactics to try to improve the performance while still getting the wins which is really what managers do IRL.

As a general rule your tactics should be "tweaked" for every match you play as you face different opposition, different formations, different threats & different styles of play. The trick is being able to identify what needs tweaked and how to tweak it to get the best out of your players to give them the best chance of winning.

In terms of long shots the common issues are giving your players time on the ball to see & attempt passes and making sure they have players making themselves available to receive passes. If a player can't see a pass and he is under pressure a shot is often the end result as the low risk option.

If we were to assume that attributes were the problem, how low would you expect the decision making and team work ratings to be for a Premier League-level footballer to come to the conclusion that attempting a lob from 50 yards is a more expedient option than passing to a nearby team-mate (an option not precluded by my tactics)? Five? Ten? It's got to be very low to come to make such a bizarre decision. Obviously my players have good enough ratings for those two attributes for me not to expect 50 yard lobs to be attempted.

I don't know as I don't tend to look at attributes too much these days.

I doubt SI staff could even look at an attribute spread and tell you how a player will play on the pitch. I need to see a player on the pitch in match situations, overtime I get used to them. In my squad I can tell you which players will panic, which like to play safe and which will take pot shots but its all from watching them rather than just looking at their profile page.

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Right, thank you. Yes I see those too. I also see shots taken with alarming regularity (more than the long-range attempts) from tear-jerkingly wide angles. I was hoping this would be patched up in 14.3.1 but it clearly hasn't been.

So the 50 yard lobs happen 'incessantly' and the 25-30 yard shots happen with 'alarming regularity'. Not to mention those from 'tear jerkingly wide angles'.

Tell me, if your team is winning so much, how exactly are you scoring any goals? :p

For the record, the only one of the above I see with any regularity is players shooting slightly too early when through on goal. The other ones happen too, but nothing out of the ordinary. But then I play a patient, short passing game with the emphasis on my deep lying forward laying off through balls for my wingers to smash home from close range. Which seems to work just how I want it to. Which is nice.

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So the 50 yard lobs happen 'incessantly' and the 25-30 yard shots happen with 'alarming regularity'. Not to mention those from 'tear jerkingly wide angles'.

Tell me, if your team is winning so much, how exactly are you scoring any goals? :p

For the record, the only one of the above I see with any regularity is players shooting slightly too early when through on goal. The other ones happen too, but nothing out of the ordinary. But then I play a patient, short passing game with the emphasis on my deep lying forward laying off through balls for my wingers to smash home from close range. Which seems to work just how I want it to. Which is nice.

On the semantics point, 'incessant' lobs, long rangers happening with 'alarming regularity' and shots from 'tear-jerkingly wide angles' are obviously not mutually exclusive. So we'll ignore that one.

Having said that, the crux of what you say is important, your obvious cynicism aside. Some of the goals I see are the result of decent passages of play. Otherwise, I have seen many matches where my striker will miss a couple of decent chances but then my centre-back will make up for the deficit (which is how I am guessing the ME views it?!) with a finish of the highest aplomb. Alternatively I will get a couple of headers at a corner. I would much rather my striker finished off his chances. It would be a lot more realistic. It would also be more realistic if players just stopped ill-advised attempts at goal, no matter how questionable the frequency (whether it's once a match or once every three matches it doesn't matter... they happen too often).

Players taking unrealistic shots from wide angles happens in every single game of mine. I have no doubt about that. Admittedly, the 'incessant' lobs might only be happening every third match, but the wide-angle frivolities are palpable in literally every match. It was a complaint of mine in previous patches too. The problem here is that in many cases the way in which the player taking the shot got to that position in the first place is highly unrealistic - IRL you don't often see players jinking around 3-4 players of the opposition, getting to the byline then attempting an audacious shot at goal. In the FM world that happens all the time.

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yes the wide shots thing is doing my head in. just had Mata dribble his way into thier area, going past 2 players, to lightly tap the ball into the keepers gloves, Diego costa head over from 2 yards..

and when is the , random dodgey pass out of play, very wide shot, random pointless clearance right at the end of the game going away? looks completly stupid, final whistle is about to happen, got a counter attack on... pass get hoofed across field and right out of play.. whistle.

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Otherwise, I have seen many matches where my striker will miss a couple of decent chances but then my centre-back will make up for the deficit (which is how I am guessing the ME views it?!) with a finish of the highest aplomb

So what you're essentially saying here is that the ME recognises that your striker has missed a couple of chances and thinks, 'oh no, he's supposed to win this, er let's get his centre half to score instead, that'll make up for it'.

:lol: - That is my only response to this.

It would also be more realistic if players just stopped ill-advised attempts at goal, no matter how questionable the frequency

No it wouldn't. Real life footballers take shots of questionable sense in almost every match you watch. How many times do you see a situation, for example, where a striker has a really obvious pass to a man in space but takes the shot himself?

There are still a couple of issues around when players shoot, but it's nothing close to being 'alarming regularity', and I've yet to experience a wide angled shot which induces a jerking tear in my eye.

But maybe that's just me.

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The shots from wide angles especially by AMR and AML are a major issue and cannot be blamed purely on tactics. In my first season I was lucky Jarvis scored 7 and Downing 11 although how many chances they missed was probably double that. It is unrealistic though especially when your wingers outscore your centre forwards. I have had Downing roll the ball into the path of my striker for a neat finish but there was no rhyme or reason to it as it was the same position both players had been in before many times so that also proves the tactic was capable of creating chances for my striker so either it's a player intelligence issue or an ME one. And before some blame it on the players Joe Cole, Ravel Morrison and whoever in that role tends to do the same. Whether some of the time it's due to the striker not being in the box I don't know but it could be. Yet lone strikers we are told should be on a support duty so that does negate them being higher up the pitch possibly so it is a bit of a quandary. However I have tinkered with a lone forward on attack and the issue does still occur so I suspect that it is as I said a player intelligence or ME problem.

Second season I tried work into the box and cross more often. The shots did decrease slightly but so did the goals. I have also tried shoot less often as a PI but it didn't really help. Crosses are also poor with very few finding their target even though I have tried using aim at Andy Carroll as an instruction, I think the problem with that is that drill crosses is to feet and float is to head. A floated cross is useless for a TM so what we really need is a drill to head option and a square pass option for those wide players.

Come to think about it I might try "more disciplined" as a Team Instruction and see if that works but really we need disciplined/expressive as a Player Instruction.

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So what you're essentially saying here is that the ME recognises that your striker has missed a couple of chances and thinks, 'oh no, he's supposed to win this, er let's get his centre half to score instead, that'll make up for it'.

:lol: - That is my only response to this.

Well I'm not sure how else to explain my decent results.

and I've yet to experience a wide angled shot which induces a jerking tear in my eye.

Sounds like someone is either living in denial or up to his usual contrarian antics.

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Sounds like someone is either living in denial or up to his usual contrarian antics.

Sounds like someone is taking what he's seeing and extrapolating. Is it that hard to believe that some people aren't as bothered about things as you are?

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Sounds like someone is taking what he's seeing and extrapolating. Is it that hard to believe that some people aren't as bothered about things as you are?

No? Good post though mate.

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Sounds like someone is taking what he's seeing and extrapolating. Is it that hard to believe that some people aren't as bothered about things as you are?
No? Good post though mate.

Zeeriboy whilst I have little doubt in believing you are observing some of the real flaws in the game, the story you have concocted to go with them is absurd

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Hah forameuss, he called you mate in a depricating manner, that's you lost this argument!

Zeeriboy whilst I have little doubt in believing you are observing some of the real flaws in the game, the story you have concocted to go with them is absurd

Consider myself telt.

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Let's keep this thread about feedback on the game and not each other, please?

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Hah forameuss, he called you mate in a depricating manner, that's you lost this argument!

Zeeriboy whilst I have little doubt in believing you are observing some of the real flaws in the game, the story you have concocted to go with them is absurd

Wtf, what story have I concocted?

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Quote Originally Posted by Dagenham_Dave

So what you're essentially saying here is that the ME recognises that your striker has missed a couple of chances and thinks, 'oh no, he's supposed to win this, er let's get his centre half to score instead, that'll make up for it'.

Well I'm not sure how else to explain my decent results.
Wtf, what story have I concocted?

this one

Edit - ok pedantically you didn't concoct it, just go along. mild apologies

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Otherwise, I have seen many matches where my striker will miss a couple of decent chances but then my centre-back will make up for the deficit (which is how I am guessing the ME views it?!) with a finish of the highest aplomb. Alternatively I will get a couple of headers at a corner. I would much rather my striker finished off his chances. It would be a lot more realistic. It would also be more realistic if players just stopped ill-advised attempts at goal, no matter how questionable the frequency (whether it's once a match or once every three matches it doesn't matter... they happen too often).

This theory isn't true at all. Your DC isn't scoring to make up for that fact that your strikers didn't. There are no artificial rules like that.

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This theory isn't true at all. Your DC isn't scoring to make up for that fact that your strikers didn't. There are no artificial rules like that.

Fine. But the point I am trying to make is that if tactics are faulty, why does that translate into strikers missing chances which my centre backs can convert? Surely if tactics are the problem then the striker shouldn't be finding himself in striking positions.

The other quite annoying thing I constantly (yes, constantly, easily once a match if not more) is a GK taking hold of the ball then running it out for a corner. Does anyone else see this?

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Fine. But the point I am trying to make is that if tactics are faulty, why does that translate into strikers missing chances which my centre backs can convert? Surely if tactics are the problem then the striker shouldn't be finding himself in striking positions.

The other quite annoying thing I constantly (yes, constantly, easily once a match if not more) is a GK taking hold of the ball then running it out for a corner. Does anyone else see this?

But why do defenders score at all then? It's not a massively rare occurrence that a striker misses a chance, but a defender scores. Ramos scored two against Bayern. Hull almost had their three center backs scoring against Arsenal. Why does there need to be such a conspiracy?

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The other quite annoying thing I constantly (yes, constantly, easily once a match if not more) is a GK taking hold of the ball then running it out for a corner. Does anyone else see this?

I'm up to almost 2000 hours on this version so far, and I can hand on heart say I have never once seen this scenario. Sounds utterly bizarre. That's not to say I haven't saw goalkeeping blunders, as I have. But not once do I recall a goalkeeper actively catching a ball, then turning to run it out for a corner. In one of the early patches, it was quite common for the keeper to catch it and run it outside the box, leading to all manner of needless sendings off, but that's long since been fixed.

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The other quite annoying thing I constantly (yes, constantly, easily once a match if not more) is a GK taking hold of the ball then running it out for a corner. Does anyone else see this?

Before you go crazy thinking you're the only one, I see this too. Not sure how often it happens, but probably once a game as a guess.

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I'm up to almost 2000 hours on this version so far, and I can hand on heart say I have never once seen this scenario. Sounds utterly bizarre. That's not to say I haven't saw goalkeeping blunders, as I have. But not once do I recall a goalkeeper actively catching a ball, then turning to run it out for a corner. In one of the early patches, it was quite common for the keeper to catch it and run it outside the box, leading to all manner of needless sendings off, but that's long since been fixed.

I think he is talking about the one where the keeper goes to catch or stop a ball and steps backwards giving away a corner.

Happens far too often, I see it at least two/three times a match I would estimate. Not sure if its an ME bug or the way the animations portray it but it should be on SI's list to be fixed.

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It's basically the 'keeper's momentum when catching a cross that carries him over the line. SI is aware of it, so it'll be fixed for FM15.

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Keepers are generally morons. Catching crosses is pathetic, rushing out when the ball is crossed and leaving unguarded goal happens too often. Worst ME ever. First version of FM14 (even Beta) was way better, even though it did have flaws, but not this big.

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I think he is talking about the one where the keeper goes to catch or stop a ball and steps backwards giving away a corner.

Happens far too often, I see it at least two/three times a match I would estimate. Not sure if its an ME bug or the way the animations portray it but it should be on SI's list to be fixed.

Seriously? I've never seen this either? Mind you, since I got my tactic working the way I wanted, I normally view only key highlights now, so that could be it, but I don't remember it happening when I used to watch extended highlights. Weird.

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Seriously? I've never seen this either? Mind you, since I got my tactic working the way I wanted, I normally view only key highlights now, so that could be it, but I don't remember it happening when I used to watch extended highlights. Weird.

Watch comprehensive. It happens 3-4 times a game.

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Seriously? I've never seen this either? Mind you, since I got my tactic working the way I wanted, I normally view only key highlights now, so that could be it, but I don't remember it happening when I used to watch extended highlights. Weird.

I think I saw this at the very start of my save, but I hadn't seen it in over a decade, (managing San Marino). I have had a little dabble managing other clubs though, (Partizan and Celtic for example), and while it has only happened to me once in 3.5 seasons, I have seen it happen regularly to the opposition. Not 2-3 times a match regular, but certainly once every couple of months at least.

Watch comprehensive. It happens 3-4 times a game.

I do, and it doesn't.

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You honestly don't see 'keepers catching crosses and stepping out of bounds?

I'd love your copy of the game if that's the case.

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You honestly don't see 'keepers catching crosses and stepping out of bounds?

I'd love your copy of the game if that's the case.

I do. I've said I do.

It happened to me at the beginning of my San Marino save when I was in Serie C and Serie B.

It happened to me when I was managing Partizan.

I have seen it happen regularly to both opponents of Partizan and Celtic.

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Can someone confirm if what happens when the keeper takes it behind for a corner is classed as a save? I'd like to look back on some of my games from last season and see if it happened at any point, as I certainly don't recall ever seeing it.

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how come keepers can catch the ball with 6 players on top of him, always catch, rarely punch.

and top players being really nervous in away games at rubbish teams, please sort that it is stupid.

goal of the month, once again a Free kick, rather then anything decent.

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how come keepers can catch the ball with 6 players on top of him, always catch, rarely punch.

I have a keeper right now who punches those more than he catches, but I guess that has to do with his tendency to punch attribute. It does happen, but 'keepers could be improved quite a bit on crosses.

and top players being really nervous in away games at rubbish teams, please sort that it is stupid.

No, it's not stupid. You need to manage your team better.

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I have a keeper right now who punches those more than he catches, but I guess that has to do with his tendency to punch attribute. It does happen, but 'keepers could be improved quite a bit on crosses.

No, it's not stupid. You need to manage your team better.

This i would genuinely learn to know how, when it comes to top players being nervous in away games vs rubbish teams.

If my team is performing well and we have a very safe lead. What would they be nervous about?

Morale is superb. Winning comfortably. Star player is nervous, who also happens to be the captain.

I haven't figured out why they're nervous. Doesn't make sense to me either.

But, as i mentioned, i would genuinely learn to know how and how to deal with it.

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Star player is nervous, who also happens to be the captain.

I haven't figured out why they're nervous. Doesn't make sense to me either.

This is an area where better AM feedback would be a lot more helpful. I've found in similar situations that a player jumps to 'nervous' if he's been on the end of a hard tackle by a bruiser from the other team for example. This only usually lasts a few minutes tho before he's back to normal. The problem is I only noticed it once as it happened to coincide with a highlight I was watching. Nine times out of ten, this happens in between highlights and short of going back and replaying the whole game, it's difficult to know what's triggered it.

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This i would genuinely learn to know how, when it comes to top players being nervous in away games vs rubbish teams.

If my team is performing well and we have a very safe lead. What would they be nervous about?

Morale is superb. Winning comfortably. Star player is nervous, who also happens to be the captain.

I haven't figured out why they're nervous. Doesn't make sense to me either.

But, as i mentioned, i would genuinely learn to know how and how to deal with it.

It could be down to a few things.

Dagenham_Dave mentioned one and this the opposition putting in crunching tackles on him. Bravery might have something to do with this? Composure maybe? Not sure.

Complacency is another. They're self-confident and unaware of the dangers around them. What if he misplaces a pass straight to the opposition and they come close to scoring? That would wake him up and might well cause him to be nervous as he's now realising dangers around him and that it wasn't as easy as he thought it would.

Confidence could be another reason too. He could be nervous because he's low on confidence. An in-game event could trigger this, like a misplaced pass or a really bad shot at goal.

There's also a hidden stat for pressure, but I don't know much about it.

I'm sure I've forgotten one or two, but hopefully this helps. I'd consider changing captains if he's getting nervous often. He's going to affect the players around him and cause them to become nervous too. It might just cost you in a game.

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I think the fact it could be so many things just adds to the frustration.

In real life, if a player is nervous I can go up to him and ask him why. But there's no private chat option for it.

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I think the fact it could be so many things just adds to the frustration.

In real life, if a player is nervous I can go up to him and ask him why. But there's no private chat option for it.

It really isn't that complicated. I mentioned all the possible factors that I know of, because he wanted to know. It's easy to see if a player is over-confident/complacent. Low confidence and morale go hand in hand, imo, and in-game events affecting this you can see by watching what happens on the pitch. Same with the opposition targeting the player with hard tackles.

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I have a keeper right now who punches those more than he catches, but I guess that has to do with his tendency to punch attribute. It does happen, but 'keepers could be improved quite a bit on crosses.

No, it's not stupid. You need to manage your team better.

it is stupid, its the way it happens, Why should Man Utd be nervous away to Reading, or some other bottom end of the table club, but never nervous when they play top teams, hence stupidity.

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it is stupid, its the way it happens, Why should Man Utd be nervous away to Reading, or some other bottom end of the table club, but never nervous when they play top teams, hence stupidity.

when, do they Become nervous in the match? Wat is the score then? Let me also ask, what your team talk was, before the game?

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it is stupid, its the way it happens, Why should Man Utd be nervous away to Reading, or some other bottom end of the table club, but never nervous when they play top teams, hence stupidity.

Well that should be fairly obvious tbh.

They are away to a team that everyone expects them to beat easily, in your media comments & team talk you perhaps put more pressure on the team and those players that don't handle pressure well or have weak personalities can easily get nervous from fear of letting the team down.

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Well that should be fairly obvious tbh.

They are away to a team that everyone expects them to beat easily, in your media comments & team talk you perhaps put more pressure on the team and those players that don't handle pressure well or have weak personalities can easily get nervous from fear of letting the team down.

I am on a huge domestic unbeaten run (managing Celtic) and we almost just lost to Motherwell. I was playing the Reserves because we have Chelsea in Europe during the week and the players were 1-0 down going into injury time. I think there was only 1 player who's body language was not negative, (and he was a Model Pro). All the others were literally pooing themselves and panicking. I think it's really realistic. There is more than 1 type of pressure. I honestly think this little part of the game works really well. (Surprisingly well when you consider the depths involved).

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I think it's precisely because it works so well that there are a fair few who just don't get it.

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Fine. But the point I am trying to make is that if tactics are faulty, why does that translate into strikers missing chances which my centre backs can convert? Surely if tactics are the problem then the striker shouldn't be finding himself in striking positions.

The other quite annoying thing I constantly (yes, constantly, easily once a match if not more) is a GK taking hold of the ball then running it out for a corner. Does anyone else see this?

I'm with you about the long shots and stupid angles. Just come off the back of a 0-0 draw with Chelsea. By any metric I dominated the game.

Posession 60%-40&

Shots 19- 5

On target 9 - 0

Corners 12- 0

Pass completion 78% 64%

Chelsea were reduced to long shots because we were solid defensively. Chelsea were all over the place at the back, but my players simply chose to act like idiots having a kick about. Full backs and wide midfielders cutting in and shooting ten yards out and two yards from the by line constantly. One full back attempted this FOUR times and has no PPMs. AM's and Strikers put clean thru electing to shoot from 30 yards. Seems to me that decision making is influenced by stats. The full back mentioned earlier has better shooting stats than passing or crossing. So although the obvious and sensible thing to do is cross the ball or cut it back, the player seems to think "I am better at shooting than passing" which leads to ridiculous frustration.

I was nearly inclined to rage quit after losing the semi final of the European Cup 1-0 over two legs when three times in the return leg my striker was put clean through and shot from 20-30 yards out under no pressure.

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Is it normal for tactics changes and substitutions to take an average of about 6 - 8 minutes to complete? I made a substitution in my last match at the 77th minute and he didn't come on until the 86th I think it was. That wasn't a one-off either as my subs seem to always come on about that length of time after I actually make them. It's the same as tactic changes although it's usually the subs that take ages to come on.

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