Jump to content

I Just Don't Understand This Game


Recommended Posts

Ok, it's got to a point where my frustrations are just too much, I just don't understand this game at all, it seems like no matter what I do or who I play I get dominated and lose, i've tried so many variations of player combinations and tactics and team instructions and just nothing. What am i doing wrong??

I read all the tactical threads so i make sure i'm playing the right partnerships, but even that hasn't helped, yet whenever I go on holiday my AssMan chooses the same formation and wins, maybe it's just the instructions I don't understand...

Usually I like to play an attacking, fluid 4-2-4, with direct passing, high tempo, high line, lots of closing down and freedom of movement, yet I found whenevr I did that I got destroyed, so I switched to a 4-5-1 with the same instructions, nothing.

SO then I tried playing a 4-3-3, anchor man, advanced PM & Central midfielder, retain possession & work ball into the box, and that just resulted in a bunch of long shots, again no chances and me being destroyed.

It seems like no matter what I try and do it just ends with me being picked apart, and i'm so close to just giving up and going back to the last FM for the first time ever, because I just feel totally lost and confused, and no matter how many times I read the tactics forum and make adjustment, they just seem to make no difference... Please help me...

Link to post
Share on other sites

Try using a formation which has 2 in the deep midfield, on defensive duty. A deep lying playmaker (D) and a DM (D) makes you concede a lot less goals. Even if your central midfield is empty, it still works.

Also try using shouts which seem to contradict the mentality. For example, counter or defensive with a high defensive line works wonders.

If the opposition has a formation with 3 in the central midfield, use exploit the flanks. If they have 2, use exploit the middle. If you have quick players (especially wingers) use pass into space.

I really struggled with the game early on, but those ideas definitely improved our performances.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd suggest posting in the tactics discussion forum with some in depth information on your preferred 4-2-4. Any formation can be successful if implemented properly.

My best guess would be that you probably have 4 players in attacking positions at all times, leaving your 2 midfielders and full backs isolated. When you lose the ball, the opposition probably has acres of space to play with. You might want to try a less fluid, more reserved approach. I fell into the mistake of thinking an attacking formation requires an attacking and fluid approach...well, it's a disaster.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe a good place to start would be in the low leagues where setting up player roles etc are not as important and you can focus on the game and using the shout outs to help influence the way the players play. This in turn allows you to tutor yourself into what shout outs work best for your team. I have only have my formation setup, nothing else is done and have had a great time playing and found a few shout outs that really impacted on the team and made them push more for those important goals to secure our chance of winning the games.

Link to post
Share on other sites

If you are playing against better teams (and if they dominate you then they are probably better) then adopt a counterattacking mentality. Stop pressing the opposition. Let them come to you. Drop your defensive line deeper. Don't play the offside trap. Accept that your opponent will have 60% of possession. You will still get 2-3 good scoring chances per match, and if you have good forwards and attacking midfielders then you will convert 1-2 of those per game.

Once you get better players and your team becomes good enough to control the game then you can switch to a more attacking mentality. Until then, you are only helping your opponents by trying to dominate them.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I had the same problem. I have this magic 442 formation I won the champion league with my ebbfleets team with. Based on counter attack. Next season I want to go more attacking but lost most games. It is all about what styles suits your team. I lost most games because I changed my formation instead of direct and high tempo went for low tempo and work ball into the box. We struggled to break most teams down. 442 is magic for me with direct counter. You have to just okay to your strength instead of hopping things will work because you want it to

Link to post
Share on other sites

The thing that is most important to realise is that implementing a new tactic takes many months. The players have to get used to playing it, and you will have patchy performances until they do. So it is important to have patience in the first few months of any game, or when you try to implement a large tactical change. This means a lot of frustrating games where you play really bad, but it is part of the learning curve.

I feel it is also important to not make a bunch of tactical changes in the early stages of a tactic. You will need 2 or 3 games without changing anything to see what works and what doesn't. Use the analysis panel to check out the stats, look at how people pass and move, where chances come from. Then, when you have decided on changes, make only a couple at a time, and repeat the process. Eventually, you should arrive at something that works. I wish you good luck =}.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Usually I like to play an attacking, fluid 4-2-4, with direct passing, high tempo, high line, lots of closing down and freedom of movement, yet I found whenevr I did that I got destroyed, so I switched to a 4-5-1 with the same instructions, nothing.

SO then I tried playing a 4-3-3, anchor man, advanced PM & Central midfielder, retain possession & work ball into the box, and that just resulted in a bunch of long shots, again no chances and me being destroyed.

It seems like no matter what I try and do it just ends with me being picked apart, and i'm so close to just giving up and going back to the last FM for the first time ever, because I just feel totally lost and confused, and no matter how many times I read the tactics forum and make adjustment, they just seem to make no difference... Please help me...

4-2-4 is suicide. Then, you tried too many changes and the team got confused. Start over and stick to only a couple of tactics.

Link to post
Share on other sites
4-2-4 isn't suicide.

According to the tactic gods - any tactic can work.

4-2-4 is used quite alot IRL, it should be able to be emulated in the game.

In which case I'd suggest posting this in the tactics forum with as much detail about player roles, positions, team and individual instructions as possible and get some advice from the experts.

Link to post
Share on other sites
4-2-4 isn't suicide.

According to the tactic gods - any tactic can work.

4-2-4 is used quite alot IRL, it should be able to be emulated in the game.

Depends what you mean by 424 tbh.

I can't think of any RL team who have played what I would consider to be a 424 in the last 50 years.

Any formation that has four attacking players who offer little or nothing in defence is going to be an issue, especially against teams who sit back behind the ball.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Try and play a solid back 3 with dm in front. All my succesfull tactics this year are set on very rigid, too much freedom doesn't seem to help. Stop messing with the d-line, if you drop deeper your players will get more chances. Tempo is also important, a higher one will mean more chances but also more misses, so tou should let it as it is, at least fir the first half of the season.

Link to post
Share on other sites
4-2-4 isn't suicide.

According to the tactic gods - any tactic can work.

4-2-4 is used quite alot IRL, it should be able to be emulated in the game.

Depends what you mean by 424 tbh.

I can't think of any RL team who have played what I would consider to be a 424 in the last 50 years.

Any formation that has four attacking players who offer little or nothing in defence is going to be an issue, especially against teams who sit back behind the ball.

I would've also said what Cougar ssaid, it does depend what you're meaning by 4-2-4. I assume it's not a flat one, with four strikers (which would be suicide IMO) but with two wingers? If so, that's better, but I'd still be worried about being caught down the flanks.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes it's always 2 wingers.

A lot of these tips are really useful appreciate them guys, I know the general weakness of the 4-2-4, it's always been an issue being caught down the flanks, but normally it works far better then it has been. At any rate I no longer have the personnel to implement it having just got rid of all my wide men.

I'm basically just trying to get a 4-3-3 to work now, i'm gonna try dropping 2 DM's (anchor and deep lying playmaker), generally I've been leaving tactics a while but recently i suppose i started choppimng and changing more, but familiarity is still really high...

Link to post
Share on other sites

I play a formation that is basically a 4-2-4 and it took me a food three seasons to get the roles right, the attackers offering enough defensively. I have a flat back four with my full backs playing two different roles. One is set to be more of a sitting fullback while the other rampages forward. I have a DM who is sat to the left and the a CM while I play a f9 and adv forward in attack. This tactic mixed with high work rate and teamwork has taken an average Cambridge side to the PL. From starting with this tactic it has taken me about 14 seasons to make the rise so this is by no way a super tactic or anything like that. Interestingly after about 12 years playing the same kind of way I tried to make my side more about possession, nicer to watch and I ended up getting relegated from the championship. For seven or eight seasons I was yo-yo ing around the skrill premier just about clinging onto my job but all that hard graft has paid off big time.

Link to post
Share on other sites

N_rnberg_x_Frankfurt_Statistiky_Statistiky_z_pa.png

Tactics. What is wrong. When my team have 22 shots, 7 shots on goal. Opponent have 3 shots, one shot on goal and scored goal after added time. Added time was three minutes, but 4 minutes was played. What is wrong, that team can not scored second goal, when they have pressure and chances, and opponent scored goal after added time. I just do not understand the logic of the game in certain situations. The tactic was set only to keep the result. Opponent scored at any time and no matters that opponent is worse or better than team.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I play with a 4-2-4 formation and I love it. However it is always going to be a bit cavalier really -- with teams creating lots of ccc's against you if you don't have the perfect cb pairing. I'm managing Boavista and this formation has taken me to the Champions League as the 2nd placed team in Portugal -- but I went through a rather bizarre spot at the start of the last season where I beat Olhanense 7-2 away, then lost 7-1 away to Benfica (which is my biggest ever defeat on FM, but which I felt was an incredibly harsh scoreline), then won 7-4 at home to Portimonense.

I like to think of myself as a modern day Kevin Keegan so I can take the rough with the smooth -- although our first campaign in Europe could be rather painful...

Link to post
Share on other sites
Tactics. What is wrong. When my team have 22 shots, 7 shots on goal. Opponent have 3 shots, one shot on goal and scored goal after added time. Added time was three minutes, but 4 minutes was played. What is wrong, that team can not scored second goal, when they have pressure and chances, and opponent scored goal after added time. I just do not understand the logic of the game in certain situations. The tactic was set only to keep the result. Opponent scored at any time and no matters that opponent is worse or better than team.

You just don't get it, do you?

7 shots on target from 22 is very poor. You were held at bay by a team that successfully played a counter or defensive Mentality against you.

Stop spamming everywhere with this nonsense please - are you the new jimbob1000?

In many ways, it's appropriate that you posted here, as you clearly don't understand this game.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I play with a 4-2-4 formation and I love it. However it is always going to be a bit cavalier really -- with teams creating lots of ccc's against you if you don't have the perfect cb pairing. I'm managing Boavista and this formation has taken me to the Champions League as the 2nd placed team in Portugal -- but I went through a rather bizarre spot at the start of the last season where I beat Olhanense 7-2 away, then lost 7-1 away to Benfica (which is my biggest ever defeat on FM, but which I felt was an incredibly harsh scoreline), then won 7-4 at home to Portimonense.

I like to think of myself as a modern day Kevin Keegan so I can take the rough with the smooth -- although our first campaign in Europe could be rather painful...

Yes, this is exactly how I normally play and see myself haha, i'm a newcastle fan so my earliest memories were of that Newcastle side, and i've alwaus loved that style of play. I'm generally not bothered if I concede goals as long as i'm scoring and creating loads of chances, but that isn't happening at all, I even got dominated by a non-league dutch side. I'm clearly doing something fundamentally wrong, what thought is the issue...

Link to post
Share on other sites
I play with a 4-2-4 formation and I love it. However it is always going to be a bit cavalier really -- with teams creating lots of ccc's against you if you don't have the perfect cb pairing. I'm managing Boavista and this formation has taken me to the Champions League as the 2nd placed team in Portugal -- but I went through a rather bizarre spot at the start of the last season where I beat Olhanense 7-2 away, then lost 7-1 away to Benfica (which is my biggest ever defeat on FM, but which I felt was an incredibly harsh scoreline), then won 7-4 at home to Portimonense.

I like to think of myself as a modern day Kevin Keegan so I can take the rough with the smooth -- although our first campaign in Europe could be rather painful...

I regularly read scout messages. Then I choose from three tactics that I use, which is eventually biggest problem for opponent.

Link to post
Share on other sites
You just don't get it, do you?

7 shots on target from 22 is very poor. You were held at bay by a team that successfully played a counter or defensive Mentality against you.

Stop spamming everywhere with this nonsense please - are you the new jimbob1000?

In many ways, it's appropriate that you posted here, as you clearly don't understand this game.

Well it was poor. When opponent scored after added time goal from only one shot on goal is what? Sorry, but I'm not the first who met with similar problems. But you still advocate your version! I understand the game? Sorry I'm doing everything that I could for understand the game. But still I do not understand some of the decisions of the game! Some decisions are very often defy logic. I do not want spam. Spamming is not for me, but I want it shown that is not always true that the game is about tactics. The game have lot of mistakes.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Yes, this is exactly how I normally play and see myself haha, i'm a newcastle fan so my earliest memories were of that Newcastle side, and i've alwaus loved that style of play. I'm generally not bothered if I concede goals as long as i'm scoring and creating loads of chances, but that isn't happening at all, I even got dominated by a non-league dutch side. I'm clearly doing something fundamentally wrong, what thought is the issue...

Could you post a screenshot of your 4-2-4 tactic please? I'm just interested to see how you've set the team up and may be able to help a little bit.

For reference here are the 3 games that I referred to earlier (I got the scores wrong as I wasn't on the game at the time). The images are too big to embed here so just click.

7-2 home win vs Olhanense

7-2 home defeat to Benfica

7-4 away win vs Portimonense

You can see the Benfica result is just a fluke bad defeat caused by not putting away a hatload of chances, and then giving away 3 penalties...

Link to post
Share on other sites
Well it was poor. When opponent scored after added time goal from only one shot on goal is what? Sorry, but I'm not the first who met with similar problems. But you still advocate your version!

Lets get some basic facts straight here.

Added time is a MINIMUM amount of time, a referee can play as much as he wants. There is ZERO issue with more time being played than shown.

I'll also add what I posted in your deleted thread:

You created TWO clear chances in that match from 22 shots and you only had 49% possession. You managed to score one goal but didn't kill the game off.

When you only have a one goal lead the opposition are always in with a chance of getting a point, with nothing to lose they pushed forward in the last stages of the game and scored an equaliser. There is absolutely no issue with this and it happens in real life all the time.

Link to post
Share on other sites
When you only have a one goal lead the opposition are always in with a chance of getting a point, with nothing to lose they pushed forward in the last stages of the game and scored an equaliser. There is absolutely no issue with this and it happens in real life all the time.

That sums it up perfectly. It can be tough to take and frustrating to experience, are you sure you aren't transplanting that frustration onto an imagined fault with the game OP? Easily done.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Lets get some basic facts straight here.

Added time is a MINIMUM amount of time, a referee can play as much as he wants. There is ZERO issue with more time being played than shown.

I'll also add what I posted in your deleted thread:

You created TWO clear chances in that match from 22 shots and you only had 49% possession. You managed to score one goal but didn't kill the game off.

When you only have a one goal lead the opposition are always in with a chance of getting a point, with nothing to lose they pushed forward in the last stages of the game and scored an equaliser. There is absolutely no issue with this and it happens in real life all the time.

Yes in real football can be. In FM I saw very little matches, where my team had a similar goal from minimum chances in added time. Often when opponent had more shots, they scored two, three goals and did not need to even clear chance on this. It did not happen the first time. And I'm not the only one

Link to post
Share on other sites
Yes in real football can be. In FM I saw very little matches, where my team had a similar goal from minimum chances in added time. Often when opponent had more shots, they scored two, three goals and did not need to even clear chance on this.

So why are you complaining about it then when you accept it happens in real football?

Often the opposition score more than you when they have shots? I can't say I'm surprised, the simple answer is that the AI managers are better than you!

I really don't know what to say Dreamerko, the game does not cheat you, that is a 100% fact, you just need to learn how to play better.

Link to post
Share on other sites
So why are you complaining about it then when you accept it happens in real football?

Often the opposition score more than you when they have shots? I can't say I'm surprised, the simple answer is that the AI managers are better than you!

I really don't know what to say Dreamerko, the game does not cheat you, that is a 100% fact, you just need to learn how to play better.

Why I complain, because the game generates more bugs for opponent than for my team. How you explain, that my team have pressure 80 minutes, and have 15x more fouls than opponent. Opponent have only one foul in match. In real football I never seen, team which only defend, that have only one foul in match. In real football is it exactly the opposite. Team which is only defend, have more fouls than team which have pressure
Link to post
Share on other sites
it is really painfull sometimes to watch the game and the results that come up. it is frustrating the way you can lose game but that is why you are here, isn't it? that is why we all love football and why we love this game.

it is not perfect, far from it. goalkeepers make strange decisions, center backs make stupid backpasses, there is ******** of corners and it can be frustrating at times. all this is true to some extent, but it is even bigger truth - the fact - the game does not cheat on you.

maybe you know how real football works, maybe you have great ideas but you just do not know how to translate them into the game. and you aren't most objective person analyzing the stats either.

calm down and try to remember it is just a game. keep it simple, learn and enjoy.

I felt robbed of good result. Yes it is painfull. When it happens one two times in season or more seasons, it would be Ok, but it happens quite often, and I do not think it would be wrong tactics. When I lost match after poor play. Ok poor day, poor play, poor result. It is OK.
Link to post
Share on other sites
Why I complain, because the game generates more bugs for opponent than for my team. How you explain, that my team have pressure 80 minutes, and have 15x more fouls than opponent. Opponent have only one foul in match. In real football I never seen, team which only defend, that have only one foul in match. In real football is it exactly the opposite. Team which is only defend, have more fouls than team which have pressure
Any chance you could upload the game because I would bet my next months wages you did not "have pressure for 80 mins". Yes it is frustrating that you concede a goal deep into stoppage time and it's from one of the only chances the opposition get but that is the beauty of football. You seem to think you have a god given right to have own than that match because of your oh so many efforts on goal but did you analysize the match? You created very few shots on target and a woeful amount of CCC's. With tweaks to your tactics and a better understanding of the team you have you wouldn't have to worry about conceding late on because you would be out of sight. The game does not favour the AIyes there are issues with the ME but the ME is the same for me as it is for you and I've managed to create a tactic that has taken a team from non league to the premier league. There are many people across these forums that would give their time and their understanding of the depth in tactics to help you but that isn't good enough for you. I would ditch FM, load up FIFA, put it on amateur level and win your games at a canter as that is what seems to be what you expect.In this version of the game the more you put in the more you get out of it. As someone that never wavered from a straight 442 until this version I came say hand on heart that now I take more time and care with tactics the more and more I am enjoying it, Spend a bit more time reading than spouting off and you will see the benefits.
Link to post
Share on other sites
Any chance you could upload the game because I would bet my next months wages you did not "have pressure for 80 mins". Yes it is frustrating that you concede a goal deep into stoppage time and it's from one of the only chances the opposition get but that is the beauty of football. You seem to think you have a god given right to have own than that match because of your oh so many efforts on goal but did you analysize the match? You created very few shots on target and a woeful amount of CCC's. With tweaks to your tactics and a better understanding of the team you have you wouldn't have to worry about conceding late on because you would be out of sight. The game does not favour the AIyes there are issues with the ME but the ME is the same for me as it is for you and I've managed to create a tactic that has taken a team from non league to the premier league. There are many people across these forums that would give their time and their understanding of the depth in tactics to help you but that isn't good enough for you. I would ditch FM, load up FIFA, put it on amateur level and win your games at a canter as that is what seems to be what you expect.In this version of the game the more you put in the more you get out of it. As someone that never wavered from a straight 442 until this version I came say hand on heart that now I take more time and care with tactics the more and more I am enjoying it, Spend a bit more time reading than spouting off and you will see the benefits.

It was two different matches.

First matches was, when my team have 80 minutes pressure and have 15x more fouls than opponent which is only defend. Frustrating was, that in 81 min. opponent have first attack and the game give penalty for opponent. First shot of opponent in match.

Second match was, when opponent scored after added time with first shot on goal.

Link to post
Share on other sites
see jops who opened this thread? he has much better attitude and has already learned something about his tactics. you might take his example instead of screaming you are being prosecuted by some binary code. it is just foolish.

I started with FM seven years ago. So I'm no novice.

Link to post
Share on other sites
It was two different matches. First matches was, when my team have 80 minutes pressure and have 15x more fouls than opponent which is only defend. Frustrating was, that in 81 min. opponent have first attack and the game give penalty for opponent. First shot of opponent in match. Second match was, when opponent scored after added time with first shot on goal.
Feel free to upload the games or SS of the matches and the stats and analysis. Would love to take a look.
Link to post
Share on other sites
It was two different matches.

First matches was, when my team have 80 minutes pressure and have 15x more fouls than opponent which is only defend. Frustrating was, that in 81 min. opponent have first attack and the game give penalty for opponent. First shot of opponent in match.

Second match was, when opponent scored after added time with first shot on goal.

It seems like you're struggling to get invested in your game, and creating a "me vs the game" paradigm, rather than a "my team vs the opposition" one. The game didn't give a penalty for the opponent, the referee gave a penalty because someone in your team committed a foul, or someone in the other team dived!

I understand your frustrations though. You need to work at shifting your perspective to be a focused winner, rather than a lamenting loser (losing in the game I mean, not as an insult).

Link to post
Share on other sites
I started with FM seven years ago. So I'm no novice.

Yes but equally I started with FM 15 years ago, I've won the champions league with Honved, Groningen, NEC, Newcastle, turned the Hungarian league into one of the best ever, won the Serie A 15 times in a row with Inter, but every version is different and this is one of the first times I just have to hold my hands up and say "i'm stumped, help".

Good news in, thanks to all the tips on here, last few games have gone much better!! Switched up my 4-3-3 a bit and started watching the extended highlights. Realised one major problem is despite having numbers in defence with 2 DM's (DLP>S and A>D) I was still getting dominated, realised it was because i was telling them to stand off so they were just sitting there inviting pressure onto themselves. Since I changed that:

Utrecht 2 - 0 MVV

Utrecht 3 - 1 PSV

Feyenoord 3 - 3 Utrecht

Now playing more like how I imagined, with Toornstra in CM spreading it to the overlapping fullbacks, and my strikers have started linking up great. Here is my formation now:

http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198052174832/screenshots/

And my 4-2-4 as requested by unknown:

http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198052174832/screenshots/

Link to post
Share on other sites
I would've also said what Cougar ssaid, it does depend what you're meaning by 4-2-4. I assume it's not a flat one, with four strikers (which would be suicide IMO).

Define "suicide". This is exactly what I employed here. http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/384210-The-problem-with-FM?p=9419074&viewfull=1#post9419074 I also did this in prior FMs (2012 in particular, I had a save built for a side like that, though I've no idea if it would have been as successful after climbing to the top tiers.) Doesn't make much sense to encourage a possession based style or employ defending mentality based on that, obviously. :D That's another (small) part of these forums at times. On the one hand you have people who really struggle with the ambiguity or making out on the pitch what they are encouraging (and then never get to the stage where they can joyfully toy around), on the other there's also a bit of stuff that just gets dismissed right out off the bat.

Obviously it all has limitations and all that. I didn't give a thing about keeping possession in either of these saves, in the FM 2012 the side struggled to keep possession at home against relegation fodder sometimes, but what does that matter if you bang in the goals and exploit the very physical players you scouted for that very style? And with lesser quality of players you might be pulling off a 1980s Watford, a side ultimately exposed by the very direct style it employed and hitting a ceiling of how far that could go. But ideally you'd want people to jump be able to these conclusions themselves. But suicide as such, not really. :) Maybe if the AI was better, actually recognized what was going on and just played keep-ball, or in an online environment where players would notice and adopt likewise, but the AI frequently gets massively overrated by like anyone.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Ok, it's got to a point where my frustrations are just too much, I just don't understand this game at all, it seems like no matter what I do or who I play I get dominated and lose, i've tried so many variations of player combinations and tactics and team instructions and just nothing. What am i doing wrong??

I read all the tactical threads so i make sure i'm playing the right partnerships, but even that hasn't helped, yet whenever I go on holiday my AssMan chooses the same formation and wins, maybe it's just the instructions I don't understand...

Usually I like to play an attacking, fluid 4-2-4, with direct passing, high tempo, high line, lots of closing down and freedom of movement, yet I found whenevr I did that I got destroyed, so I switched to a 4-5-1 with the same instructions, nothing.

SO then I tried playing a 4-3-3, anchor man, advanced PM & Central midfielder, retain possession & work ball into the box, and that just resulted in a bunch of long shots, again no chances and me being destroyed.

It seems like no matter what I try and do it just ends with me being picked apart, and i'm so close to just giving up and going back to the last FM for the first time ever, because I just feel totally lost and confused, and no matter how many times I read the tactics forum and make adjustment, they just seem to make no difference... Please help me...

Watch some real football matches from a tactical point of view, it helps.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You still only advocate your truth. Today I played another brilliant match. My goalkeeper made another incomprehensible error and opponent scored easy goal. My goalkeepers made three similar errors in fourteen match. I lost all three matches. Nobody from any opponent goalkeepers did not do the same mistake ... useless waste of words, because you will still repeat your truth. But I do not understand the game. Rather, you do not want to accept the complaint. The game certainly is not perfect as you guys think.

I'm remember match where my team had a seven clear chance. Possesion 78%. Twentyfive shots. Fourteen shots on goal. Opponent have one shot, no clear chance and result was 1:1. In this season later. Very similar situation. Match result was 0:0. But biggest shock was match. Where my team had possesion was 86%. More than 30 shots. 18 shots on goal, Twelwe clear chances. Opponent had not any shot in match and won match 1:0.

In this season later. Opponent had not clear chances, 10 shots, 5 shots on goal, possesion 58% and won 5:0.

In this season later. My team had 2 clear chances possesion 57%. Opponent had not any clear chaces and won match 2:0.

Do not talk to me about the tactics, because sometimes it absolutely does not work.

Link to post
Share on other sites
The game certainly is not perfect as you guys think.

It isn't.

Fixing solely on a few statistics will always prove frustrating, though. In particular as even if you dominated every match in every season statistically, there's a good few percentage of those you won't win, that's how a low scoring game such as football is: if a side would dominate like that in Handball or Basketball the points and goals would ALWAYS follow, not necessarily so in football (which makes it such an interesting sports in the first place, you'll never 100% sure who will win, on the day even the lesser of the two sides who are league tiers apart have their chance to fight). But also because possession of the ball in itself means very little (shots a tad more), and CCCs in FM are classified occasionally very liberally: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmj6thag7qI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRj7ATvIg_M

As an example: Opta, who collect football data, analyzed that but the very best of the best of strikers have a CCC conversion ratio of 50% and more (many have one of 30% and less). But according to Opta, a CCC is a chance that sees the forward free on goal with only the keeper in the way. Clearly not the case in FM.

Link to post
Share on other sites
But biggest shock was match. Where my team had possesion was 86%. More than 30 shots. 18 shots on goal, Twelwe clear chances. Opponent had not any shot in match and won match 1:0.

Would love to see a screen of those stats. 86% possession sounds scarcely believable.

Link to post
Share on other sites
It isn't.

few statistics will always prove frustrating

Frustrating is that very often but really very often opponent does not need any great chance and is able to score goal from anything. Often from one two shots in match. Another frustrating is opponent goalkeeper. Sometimes he is more than brilliant.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Would love to see a screen of those stats. 86% possession sounds scarcely believable.

Probably impossible. because I do not know where the file is located. Probably it is removed. All the games, which I have not played , I removed, but I never forgot on this match

Link to post
Share on other sites
You still only advocate your truth. Today I played another brilliant match. My goalkeeper made another incomprehensible error and opponent scored easy goal. My goalkeepers made three similar errors in fourteen match. I lost all three matches. Nobody from any opponent goalkeepers did not do the same mistake ... useless waste of words, because you will still repeat your truth. But I do not understand the game. Rather, you do not want to accept the complaint. The game certainly is not perfect as you guys think.

I'm remember match where my team had a seven clear chance. Possesion 78%. Twentyfive shots. Fourteen shots on goal. Opponent have one shot, no clear chance and result was 1:1. In this season later. Very similar situation. Match result was 0:0. But biggest shock was match. Where my team had possesion was 86%. More than 30 shots. 18 shots on goal, Twelwe clear chances. Opponent had not any shot in match and won match 1:0.

In this season later. Opponent had not clear chances, 10 shots, 5 shots on goal, possesion 58% and won 5:0.

In this season later. My team had 2 clear chances possesion 57%. Opponent had not any clear chaces and won match 2:0.

Do not talk to me about the tactics, because sometimes it absolutely does not work.

If you're having that much possession, and that many shots, and not scoring, then you're doing something wrong. It's quite easy to build a tactic that dominates possession in 14, but unless you're Opta, stats don't really matter. The number of goals you score does. You can have 99% of the possession, but if you don't score, what's the point? Instead of looking at the possession stats and believing you have some kind of divine right to win based on that, how about you actually look at the chances you're missing, or the ones your opposition are scoring. I'd be willing to bet there's a pattern to both.

Link to post
Share on other sites
It's quite easy to build a tactic that dominates possession in 14, but unless you're Opta, stats don't really matter.

:D

Still might be worth taking a look at them, if only to unsettle a few common misconceptions. Opta once analyzed that in far less than 60% of the cases the team that has more possession eventually wins a match. Shot counts were a tad more telling though, but not the decisive factor, but that is natural. Possession in itself says absolutely nothing about its quality, whereas shots are taken deep into the opponent's half. Thus, you need to actually penetrate that, which immediately makes shot counts a more telling statistics than possession which can be kept nicely and safely by making tons of backwards and sideways passes in your own area.

It is no coincidence that if you sort last week's PL table by average shots per game, you'll get a decent mirror of the actual standings by points. kiwpBuX.jpg

In contrast, Swansea and Southampton, who collect some of the highest average possession per game (Swansea's actually number one), aren't quite top of the table, and the bottom three in terms of possession would still be save rather than be relegated. Aston Villa in particular appear a side all built on hitting opponents on the break, for instance. That doesn't mean you should encourage sides in FM to just blast it, as clearly, the more shots you get, the higher the standings. :D That would be a case of confusing cause and effect: The better teams usually dominate a match and penetrate areas to get those shots going, that's why they have more shots per game.

What it all means that, as I argued, even if you dominated all the matches of your season "statistically", each one of them, you could still expect quite a few that you would "dominate" such, but still come out with a draw or loss. Such is the nature of an extremely low scoring sports as football (and football is an extremely low scoring sports). It is not to be confused with the game deliberately granting you a loss or draw just cause though. Unless you never stood a chance to begin with (far inferior team), you can win every match. It just means that doesn't mean you will do so. It's as hard to take on the chin for real managers as it is on FM. Some might question the logics to compare real-life football data collected to FM. But FM's match play is tweaked and soak tested over many many many matches to mirror real-life football data as closely as can.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Probably impossible. because I do not know where the file is located. Probably it is removed. All the games, which I have not played , I removed, but I never forgot on this match

Its always the case that these matches that really stick out have been deleted.....

Link to post
Share on other sites
If you're having that much possession, and that many shots, and not scoring, then you're doing something wrong. It's quite easy to build a tactic that dominates possession in 14, but unless you're Opta, stats don't really matter. The number of goals you score does. You can have 99% of the possession, but if you don't score, what's the point? Instead of looking at the possession stats and believing you have some kind of divine right to win based on that, how about you actually look at the chances you're missing, or the ones your opposition are scoring. I'd be willing to bet there's a pattern to both.

Do not tell me about the tactics. Something wrong? Who decides whether my team we converted or not converted chance to goal. Game Match Engine. Not tactics. If there was something wrong with the tactics, so they do not create chances.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Do not tell me about the tactics. Something wrong? Who decides whether my team we converted or not converted chance to goal. Game Match Engine. Not tactics. If there was something wrong with the tactics, so they do not create chances.

Don't forget, there's more to it than just tactics. Player morale/motivation also plays a part.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Do not tell me about the tactics. Something wrong? Who decides whether my team we converted or not converted chance to goal. Game Match Engine. Not tactics. If there was something wrong with the tactics, so they do not create chances.

You don't create chances!

From the pic in post #17 you created TWO clear chances despite having 22 shots.

There is 100% a problem with your tactics, however instead of learning whats wrong and how to fix it you stick your fingers in your ears and ignore all the advice you've been given over the last few months.

There is nothing anyone can do to help you until you accept you are doing something wrong.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...