Ajax – When The Real World Meets Football Manager FM14

[Cleon]

Thanks for the reply! Well, now I am in a quandary should I sell him if he does not fit my tactical roles slightly somehow adjust the tactic to have a role which can accomodate him within the side? From what I've read you tend to stick with your tactics rather than changing them to accomodate players right?

Once I know how I'll be playing then yeah I stick to that which means players must have certain attributes etc.

[Spiegel]

Hi all,

I picked up this young talent for pennies, but I'm a bit stuck on how to develop him, he lacks some key attributes.

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=15D2BC947BB212EC!1415&authkey=!AKxz73Ec7Ea2r6A&v=3

I'm thinking he'd make a solid DLP, but want to gauge some opinions on him.

[Cleon]

Hi all,

I picked up this young talent for pennies, but I'm a bit stuck on how to develop him, he lacks some key attributes.

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=15D2BC947BB212EC!1415&authkey=!AKxz73Ec7Ea2r6A&v=3

I'm thinking he'd make a solid DLP, but want to gauge some opinions on him.

For someone who is almost 19 he is really poor imo. The thing is, he is so poor in majority of areas that he will still be being developed in his late 20's. I'd not even waste my time developing him especially if you are Ajax, you get much better players than him via the academy.

If you still want to develop him though then you need to decide his position and role for your side and quickly. Because at almost 19 and with 9 decisions he's never going to be a good playmaker at the top level. Add to this he has no off the ball or positioning either so can't really defend or attack. Sure, you'll be able to make attributes rise but he needs too much working on imo. Your best bet would be to put him on the BWM schedule and just leave him on that.

[Spiegel]

Thanks Cleon.

I'll try and push him as a BWM. I'm currently training his positioning.

It's a shame as he's technically solid, and arrived with a Model Professional personality.

Some of my more talented youths, Hoekstra being the gem (He now has a Perfectionist personality - I could do with adjusting his temperament, though i'm struggling to find defensive tutors...)

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=15D2BC947BB212EC!1425&authkey=!AEUkFqhI8QLT_4Q

How did you get on with Kishna? i've got all his key attributes to 16+, though he's so unbalanced...

[Cleon]

Kishna is posted somewhere in this thread, not sure of the page. But he was mainly all 18-20's for every single important attribute.

[lam]

For someone who is almost 19 he is really poor imo.

This is one of the hardest things to resist in the game I think. I see so many players that catch my eye at late 18's early 19's where I think "oh. they look good", only to realize that they are now to old and should be considerably better.

I think this is still a hangover of my dark days () of using Genie and buying ANYONE that had a PA over 180. When you play the game properly, you have to find those 16/17 year olds that arent quite as good as the 18/19 year olds, but that clearly have another year or two on them.

LAM

[lam]

Cleon,

Out of curiosity, what is the highest fee you would/have paid for what is clearly a talented 16/17 year old?

I recently bought this chap:

I won't say what position I'll have him playing in, lets see if someone can work it out.

He cost me a massive £7.5m but even at 16 he is starting to get some games under his belt. My only real concerns around him is his low aggression..... still trying to work out a way of increasing this.

LAM

[Cleon]

Cleon,

Out of curiosity, what is the highest fee you would/have paid for what is clearly a talented 16/17 year old?

LAM

Hmm it depends really how I'm playing the save. Sometimes I set myself limits just to make the game harder for myself, so it might be a £2.5 million max that I can spend on players. On my Sheff Utd save though I'd buy anyone as long as they fit my style and would pay any price if I thought they fitted my vision. Although anything £20 million plus for someone 16/17 isn't something I do often.

[Cleon]

Ah just seen you edited the post. He looks good, I like how he is already mentally strong. He could play a number of positions but if he was mine I'd likely turn him into a DLP long-term. But he could be equally decent as an IF, DW, DC etc.

[lam]

Ah just seen you edited the post. He looks good, I like how he is already mentally strong. He could play a number of positions but if he was mine I'd likely turn him into a DLP long-term. But he could be equally decent as an IF, DW, DC etc.

He is my Libero(A) long term replacement of Vertonghen. (hence why aggression was a worry). Playing your old Libero/no strikers tactic.

[Cleon]

He is my Libero(A) long term replacement of Vertonghen. (hence why aggression was a worry).

Get you being adventurous

His aggression shouldn't be an issue because he has good all around attributes for the role.

[Falahk]

Out of curiosity, what is the highest fee you would/have paid for what is clearly a talented 16/17 year old?

probably around £2m if the player cant slot into the first team right away (if he can play in the first team I would might pay more)

------------------

Cleon: what PPM's would you train your libero in if you could?

[Cleon]

probably around £2m if the player cant slot into the first team right away (if he can play in the first team I would might pay more)

------------------

Cleon: what PPM's would you train your libero in if you could?

Well the PPM's depend on what I want him to do and how it fits with my current style. I think currently my PPM's are gets forward when possible, dictates tempo, runs with ball thru centre, tries killer ball often.

[Spiegel]

Reviewing my squad personalities, when I notice this;

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=15D2BC947BB212EC!1426&authkey=!AFFmtwBaIja-23k&v=3

[Gee_Simpson]

What should I do if I'm managing a team in Spain? I've started my final save on FM13 with Real Sociedad and unfortunately, the Spanish league doesn't have a youth division in the game, only the 'B' teams compete in leagues in the game (in Sociedad's case, Segunda Division B). The B team has it's own manager and if I send my youth players there, I won't be able to control their training. Is there any other way of getting them game time during the season in which I have full control over their progress?

[DBurns]

What should I do if I'm managing a team in Spain? I've started my final save on FM13 with Real Sociedad and unfortunately, the Spanish league doesn't have a youth division in the game, only the 'B' teams compete in leagues in the game (in Sociedad's case, Segunda Division B). The B team has it's own manager and if I send my youth players there, I won't be able to control their training. Is there any other way of getting them game time during the season in which I have full control over their progress?

Go into the editor, click on File, the Load Database.

Then click on Clubs, type in Barcelona and double click on the relevant team.

On the details page, it should mention 'Reserve Teams'

Click add then select 'B Team'

Down the left hand side it should now say Barcelona B

Go back and find the original Barcelona B and double click on the relevant team.

Go to 'Staff and Players' then select all the players/staff then click 'Edit'.

On the 'Contract' section. change their club from F.C. Barcelona 'B' to F.C. Barcelona ''B'' who will have a reputation of 1000.

Finally you will need to swap the teams in Liga Adelante so go into that and click 'Teams' then click F.C. Barcelona 'B'and swap them with F.C. Barcelona ''B''

Save this as something, then fire up a new game.

Barcelona is just an example as I posted that in the Barcelona thread.

[Gee_Simpson]

Go into the editor, click on File, the Load Database.

Then click on Clubs, type in Barcelona and double click on the relevant team.

On the details page, it should mention 'Reserve Teams'

Click add then select 'B Team'

Down the left hand side it should now say Barcelona B

Go back and find the original Barcelona B and double click on the relevant team.

Go to 'Staff and Players' then select all the players/staff then click 'Edit'.

On the 'Contract' section. change their club from F.C. Barcelona 'B' to F.C. Barcelona ''B'' who will have a reputation of 1000.

Finally you will need to swap the teams in Liga Adelante so go into that and click 'Teams' then click F.C. Barcelona 'B'and swap them with F.C. Barcelona ''B''

Save this as something, then fire up a new game.

Barcelona is just an example as I posted that in the Barcelona thread.

What does this do exactly?

[DBurns]

What does this do exactly?

Changes the B team to a reserve team like in England.

[Gee_Simpson]

Alright thanks. I won't bother though as I don't want to start over again.

[kandersson]

This thread is fantastic, thank you Cleon for the effort

[Gee_Simpson]

@ Cleon - What would you do with the Under 19's if you were managing in the Spanish League with there being no Under 19 league in the game?

[Falahk]

@ Cleon - What would you do with the Under 19's if you were managing in the Spanish League with there being no Under 19 league in the game?

surely there is some sort of u19 league, should be a few regional once if I recall it right

are you sure that your team have a side entered in one of those thought

[Dark Demon]

There's leagues but some of the reserve teams in Spain, like the B teams I think, have their own manager and you have no control over training etc unless you edit it with the editor.

[Falahk]

There's leagues but some of the reserve teams in Spain, like the B teams I think, have their own manager and you have no control over training etc unless you edit it with the editor.

personally I like the spanish system better, particularly if you manage to get your b team promoted to the secound tier

while you dont have full control over training you will have players that dont quite fit into the first team just yet play at a much higher level then they would have done in a reserve league, and as such they tend to progress faster

[Cleon]

I have all the players I want to develop in the first team, so its not really an issue for me.

[Gee_Simpson]

surely there is some sort of u19 league, should be a few regional once if I recall it right

are you sure that your team have a side entered in one of those thought

Nah, there is Spanish Under 19 leagues IRL but not in the game for some reason. Only your 'B' squad competes in a league.

There's leagues but some of the reserve teams in Spain, like the B teams I think, have their own manager and you have no control over training etc unless you edit it with the editor.

This.

[Gee_Simpson]

I have all the players I want to develop in the first team, so its not really an issue for me.

Interesting.

I may do this then but the only thing is, I'm not great tactically and I worry if I play a raw youngster that I want to develop in a top league like La Liga, we might struggle. I guess I can give them run outs in lesser games and cup matches and give them a few sub appearances in bigger games.

[USA Bhoy]

Not sure if this is the right forum for my question, but I thought I would ask. If you think it is more suited to another post, I can move it... Anyways, I would love some input on developing my youth players. I am currently managing Celtic, so I have a full team, a reserve squad, and a u19 squad. I have spent most of my (meager) funds on buying youth players and trying to develop them. My question is, how much additional growth can be attribuatable to first team football vs u19 or reserve team football? I believe I read in another post that you do not loan out players until after they have developed the ppms and that you consider homegrown status (if relevant) when making that choice. I was curious though, if keeping my players in house and offering the odd 30 min run- out here and there will stunt thier development. Should I be shipping players out on year long loans to other Scottish Premier League squads (with key player status required) to ensure that they get plenty of first team exposure and develop that way? I was just looking for any input on this issue of if people have had better experience one way or the other. Thanks in advance

[Cleon]

Not sure if this is the right forum for my question, but I thought I would ask. If you think it is more suited to another post, I can move it... Anyways, I would love some input on developing my youth players. I am currently managing Celtic, so I have a full team, a reserve squad, and a u19 squad. I have spent most of my (meager) funds on buying youth players and trying to develop them. My question is, how much additional growth can be attribuatable to first team football vs u19 or reserve team football? I believe I read in another post that you do not loan out players until after they have developed the ppms and that you consider homegrown status (if relevant) when making that choice. I was curious though, if keeping my players in house and offering the odd 30 min run- out here and there will stunt thier development. Should I be shipping players out on year long loans to other Scottish Premier League squads (with key player status required) to ensure that they get plenty of first team exposure and develop that way? I was just looking for any input on this issue of if people have had better experience one way or the other. Thanks in advance

You could have saved time but actually reading the thread, the entire of this thread explains all of the above

The exact question you've asked must have been answered atleast 10 times in detail throughout the thread

[Falahk]

Nah, there is Spanish Under 19 leagues IRL but not in the game for some reason. Only your 'B' squad competes in a league.

what is this then?:

[Gee_Simpson]

what is this then?:

Ah, I think I know what it is. Maybe it's because I have started a game with a German start date (26th June) and atm it shows up as 'No Current Division'. I'll see if the division appears after the 1st July.

[Spiegel]

I have all the players I want to develop in the first team, so its not really an issue for me.

Hi Cleon,

How many players do you tend to keep at the club?

I ask as i'm toying with the idea of eventually having a small first team squad (of around 16-18) and using my youth squad to supplement it.

I've got my core group of players in the first team, it's just a case of clearing out my Jong side...

[Cleon]

Ah, I think I know what it is. Maybe it's because I have started a game with a German start date0 (26th June) and atm it shows up as 'No Current Division'. I'll see if the division appears after the 1st July.

It won't show until the U19's league actually starts normally.

Hi Cleon,

How many players do you tend to keep at the club?

I ask as i'm toying with the idea of eventually having a small first team squad (of around 16-18) and using my youth squad to supplement it.

I've got my core group of players in the first team, it's just a case of clearing out my Jong side...

I have 2 players for every single position for first and youth team.

[Gee_Simpson]

It won't show until the U19's league actually starts normally.

Ah right, that's good to know. Cheers

[Foleroo]

Off topic Cleon but you couldn't tell me where you got those drills as I can't seem to view them on the first page and I'd love to try a few with my U11 team.

[soccer.joel]

@ Cleon - What would you do with the Under 19's if you were managing in the Spanish League with there being no Under 19 league in the game?

I manage in Spain and my under-19's have played in a league every season. I only use my B team to send young backup keepers or players who won't make the first team and I can't loan out for cash

[MattKita]

I'm looking to do this with a team in the Polish league. I really want to build a great structure there with youth constantly coming through and us competing for league and hopefully in Europe. My question is, I want to make my team the home breeding ground for Polish national players.

My goal was to make my team strictly Polish born players so they can play for the NT, but should I expand my squad and include other nationalities and bring them up as well?

[Cleon]

I'm looking to do this with a team in the Polish league. I really want to build a great structure there with youth constantly coming through and us competing for league and hopefully in Europe. My question is, I want to make my team the home breeding ground for Polish national players.

My goal was to make my team strictly Polish born players so they can play for the NT, but should I expand my squad and include other nationalities and bring them up as well?

I can't possibly answer that as its all about preferences and which way suits you

[MattKita]

I can't possibly answer that as its all about preferences and which way suits you

Ah. Haha well my concern was that not expanding might hurt my income and success I can bring to the club, but if I do bring in foreign kids I don't want it to hinder the Polish born players by taking game time and such. Tough choice.

[hehehemann]

MattKita - I am doing the same thing but over in the Czech Republic with Slavia Prague. I have signed only two non-czech youngsters in the five seasons i have been establishing the clubs youth. We now have the best youth facilities, training facilities and youth recruitment in the country, its costing a pretty penny to keep it all running so it means I have to unload one of my prospects each season. The first couple of seasons were a slog but the team is now all czech but two and my squad is very young now. As 16/17 year olds the youth were getting first team starts, now most of them are nearing 20 and we have the best team in the league. The challenge now comes trying to keep the squad together each season, all the big teams come snooping around but as most of the youngsters have Slavia as their fav club I can still keep them on contracts so far.

I would say stick to the homegrown, maybe one or two absolute foreign gems if they are cheap but dont forget to raid your own league too and secure the future polish talent from your competition.

[begilsson]

Maybe this could be a good thread to ask this: I have a 16 y/o central defender, national rep, hot prospect. I want to use my 25 y/o central defender, worldwide rep, indispensable, as his tutor, but the 16 y/o doesn't show up on the list of tutees. None of them are learning moves. What am I missing?

[tomtuck01]

Maybe this could be a good thread to ask this: I have a 16 y/o central defender, national rep, hot prospect. I want to use my 25 y/o central defender, worldwide rep, indispensable, as his tutor, but the 16 y/o doesn't show up on the list of tutees. None of them are learning moves. What am I missing?

Is one of them currently injured? If so, then that'll be the reason.

[begilsson]

Is one of them currently injured? If so, then that'll be the reason.

No, none of them are injured. My "old" CB can tutor other players, while my "young" CB can be tutored by other players. Been like this for 18 months now. And to clarify; both are natural in the centreback position.

It's weird that i can ask the 26 y/o CB to tutor players with whom he shares no positions whatsoever (not even unconvincing/awkward), like my young ST/AMC, but not a player who's basically a young himself.

[underkiller]

I got his kid to my watford save: 16 years old, have personality: Model Professional, and have only 10 on determination. Should i tutor him? (I havent any model professionals players in my squad to tutor him).

[Cleon]

I got his kid to my watford save: 16 years old, have personality: Model Professional, and have only 10 on determination. Should i tutor him? (I havent any model professionals players in my squad to tutor him).

No you'd be crazy to tutor him unless you have another Model Pro who has higher determination.

[underkiller]

thanks for input:)

But if i search for personality i can get some with model professional on free transfers. If i pick up a crap league two player with 2 start potensial rating and are using him as a tutor for a 16 y old kid with 4 star potensial, will the 4 stars potensial go down to 2 stars? Are you only transfering personality and his prefered moves, or do i destroy the CA\PA for the 16 years old also?

[Shake Appeal]

It only affects personality and PPMs (or just personality, depending on which option you select).

What's his Media Handling, as a matter of interest?

[underkiller]

Media friendly. So you telling me Shake Appeal that i can pick up some free transfers of players who have model professional personality (Even if they have **** stats and 1-2 stars max) and if i use them as a tutor the potensial wonderkid CAN transfer their personality, without loosing any CA\PA. ? OR?

[tomtuck01]

Media friendly. So you telling me Shake Appeal that i can pick up some free transfers of players who have model professional personality (Even if they have **** stats and 1-2 stars max) and if i use them as a tutor the potensial wonderkid CAN transfer their personality, without loosing any CA\PA. ?

That's exactly what he's telling you.

Also, for fututre reference, don't put too much influence on the star ratings. Better to read scout/coach reports.

[ronaldo1026]

Hey Cleon - excellent stuff, I have been learning from you and applying your advice on all sorts of topics. I started an Ajax save a month or so ago on FM13, as they're my favorite team, but stopped once I loaned too many players out and learned that this isn't always better than just training them yourself. I'm waiting to start this save in 14 solely because I'm excited to have a Jong Ajax squad playing in the Eerste Division this year. Do you have any plans on carrying this over and do you have any advice on the issue of taking control of Ajax and Jong Ajax - or should I leave Jong Ajax up to my assman?