Ajax – When The Real World Meets Football Manager FM14

[mikcheck]

Cleon i'm sorry of you've already answer to this but how do you manage your youth development in first team? Do you chose some of them, maybe 2 or 3 to be in the first team in the easiest games and also launch them late in the game with a comfortable result in your favor?

[Wizard boy]

Just looked at my facilities. Training facilities adequate, youth facilities adequate, youth setup category 2 I assume thats not great and youth recruitment average. How much does that need improving?

[Guest Satchy]

Quite a bit, actually. Here are the breakdowns.

Training Facilities:

- Top, Good, Average, Adequate, Fairly Basic, Basic

Youth Facilities:

- State of the Art, Excellent, Good, Average, Adequate, Basic, Minimal

Youth Recruitment:

- Extensive, Well-Established, Above Average, Average, Fairly Basic, Basic, Limited

[Wizard boy]

Quite a bit, actually. Here are the breakdowns.

Training Facilities:

- Top, Good, Average, Adequate, Fairly Basic, Basic

Youth Facilities:

- State of the Art, Excellent, Good, Average, Adequate, Basic, Minimal

Youth Recruitment:

- Extensive, Well-Established, Above Average, Average, Fairly Basic, Basic, Limited

Thought so. So I need money which at the moment I don't have. Hopefully the players will get to a certain level so can sell them for decent money. What do I need to get youth recruitment to a better level?

[lewis999]

You have to go into the boardroom and its the bottom option under networking. If you meant what do you need in the other sense then money really, and I suppose an ambitious owner.

[Wizard boy]

You have to go into the boardroom and its the bottom option under networking. If you meant what do you need in the other sense then money really, and I suppose an ambitious owner.

I don't have neither then. He doesn't seem to be that ambitious. I offered 2 players to clubs for 20 mil each. One went other turned it down. Did notice in finances 16mil a year is payed out in bonuses and 11 in loyalty bonuses. When I gave them all contracts I lowered what they wanted. Some of them ask ridiculous amounts. Why do I have to pay 23k for appearance fee? What the hell is the 110k wage for.

[lewis999]

I don't have neither then. He doesn't seem to be that ambitious. I offered 2 players to clubs for 20 mil each. One went other turned it down. Did notice in finances 16mil a year is payed out in bonuses and 11 in loyalty bonuses. When I gave them all contracts I lowered what they wanted. Some of them ask ridiculous amounts. Why do I have to pay 23k for appearance fee? What the hell is the 110k wage for.

I hardly ever play with brilliant teams to start with so almost all of the time when I go to negotiate contracts unless it's a player I absolutely need and just accept what he wants and try not to **** him or his agent off I try and haggle with them so I can get either his wages down, his various bonuses down or reduce the % of his clauses such as 'Promotion wage rise' or 'yearly wage rise' etc. That way when you add all the players together i'm saving a fair amount of money. Most players will budge if you have a high enough reputation as a manager and club even if it's just 5k a week.

[Stonebiter]

Hey Cleon i have a Question about one of my newgen players. He was introduced from my Youth Chief as "one oft the best players of his generation" from this years youth intake. In the years before my best newgens were introduced as "one of the best Players which the club has ever got" or something like that. Both descriptions are for 5 Star Players but which ones is the better one or doesn't it matter at all.

this is the player:

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[Wizard boy]

I hardly ever play with brilliant teams to start with so almost all of the time when I go to negotiate contracts unless it's a player I absolutely need and just accept what he wants and try not to **** him or his agent off I try and haggle with them so I can get either his wages down, his various bonuses down or reduce the % of his clauses such as 'Promotion wage rise' or 'yearly wage rise' etc. That way when you add all the players together i'm saving a fair amount of money. Most players will budge if you have a high enough reputation as a manager and club even if it's just 5k a week.

Mine wasn't a good team but 37 years later its starting to come together. I will have make sure future players dont get high bonus fees

[Wizard boy]

Just signed this player. Did cost 5mil but hopefully he`ll be worth it. hard part will be letting him go. finding that quite hard to do.

[Rashidi]

Hey Cleon i have a Question about one of my newgen players. He was introduced from my Youth Chief as "one oft the best players of his generation" from this years youth intake. In the years before my best newgens were introduced as "one of the best Players which the club has ever got" or something like that. Both descriptions are for 5 Star Players but which ones is the better one or doesn't it matter at all.

this is the player:

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

My two cents - best player of his generation would refer to a fixed period of time, as in the X generation Y gen or Z gen. Thats like a span of years like 10-15 years. Whereas "best player we've ever got" would refer to the clubs timeline which is longer..so I would go whoopie with the latter.

[Cleon]

His generation is the better one in terms of potential as that means he is one of the best players ever for that time period. The 'could be one of the best to ever come through the ranks one' means he is still good but not as good as the generation.

And apologies for missing the question, I didn't see the reply on my phone

[fuhrerul]

how ambition and sportsmanship influence a player? ambition has effect only on player development and makes the player want to join/stay succesful clubs or also influence a player performance on the pitch? same for sportsmanship, where does it influence a player? in development, on the pitch, outside the pitch?

[Cleon]

how ambition and sportsmanship influence a player? ambition has effect only on player development and makes the player want to join/stay succesful clubs or also influence a player performance on the pitch? same for sportsmanship, where does it influence a player? in development, on the pitch, outside the pitch?

Ambition is more an off the field attribute rather than on the field one.

Sportsmanship is all about what happens in a game. If a player will cheat, dive etc.

[fuhrerul]

Ambition is more an off the field attribute rather than on the field one.

Sportsmanship is all about what happens in a game. If a player will cheat, dive etc.

thanks Cleon. what about dirtiness? what does it do if sportsmanship does that?

[Cleon]

thanks Cleon. what about dirtiness? what does it do if sportsmanship does that?

Dirtiness is how often the player will look to break the rules. So he might stamp on people, use his hand to block the ball etc.

[Pukey]

Great thread this. Inspired me to have more faith in my youth team as well. Been using some of the methods in the thread on other youngsters I'd signed from other clubs for half a season and now starting to give my youth team members a few games. A striker I have called Anthony Hodges scored on his debut and became the youngest scorer in Spurs' history in the process http://i.imgur.com/TXBqhv7.jpg

His composure was 9 before I worked on it for 2 months, working on his strength atm and will probably work on his heading next. Will try and provide an update on him and a few other players at the end of this/next season

[Wizard boy]

Great thread this. Inspired me to have more faith in my youth team as well. Been using some of the methods in the thread on other youngsters I'd signed from other clubs for half a season and now starting to give my youth team members a few games. A striker I have called Anthony Hodges scored on his debut and became the youngest scorer in Spurs' history in the process http://i.imgur.com/TXBqhv7.jpg

His composure was 9 before I worked on it for 2 months, working on his strength atm and will probably work on his heading next. Will try and provide an update on him and a few other players at the end of this/next season

Before reading this thread, I never really bothered with youth side of it but have to say im getting so much more enjoyment out of it. Watching youngsters come through. Ive now got 10 players from the under 18's in first team. not all of them turmed out as good as I'd hoped but them that did are really world class especially my midfielder Ryan Johnson who is now 19 and valued at 25m. Just upgraded youth facilities to good and moving to a new 58k seater stadium. Can't wait to see how well the youngsters with 5* PA become

[Cleon]

Glad to hear you are both enjoying the development side of things

Without a doubt I think this is the best FM thread that I've ever done in terms of helping people understand the game better. Some of the results of tutoring and training what you've all been posting are great, never seen so many people get good results before

I plan on doing another of these on FM14 with whatever club I have my long term game with.

[Wizard boy]

Glad to hear you are both enjoying the development side of things

Without a doubt I think this is the best FM thread that I've ever done in terms of helping people understand the game better. Some of the results of tutoring and training what you've all been posting are great, never seen so many people get good results before

I plan on doing another of these on FM14 with whatever club I have my long term game with.

Brilliant news. I look forward to reading it.

[Abaddon879]

I wonder whether it might be an idea to put together a summary of the key points raised in this thread, something of a reference guide perhaps that you could print out and have beside you when playing FM. I am one of many I expect who still has a pen and paper next to me when playing FM to make notes and plan things out. A guide such as this would be an excellent resource I believe.

[Cleon]

I wonder whether it might be an idea to put together a summary of the key points raised in this thread, something of a reference guide perhaps that you could print out and have beside you when playing FM. I am one of many I expect who still has a pen and paper next to me when playing FM to make notes and plan things out. A guide such as this would be an excellent resource I believe.

It's all relevant though, so splitting it up into key sections just doesn't work because you need to understand personality, the training and so on. Summerising it into key points would still be a very lengthy article and would miss out some key info of some kind because its almost impossible to break down.

You can print this out via my site though (link in profile) as its split into individual articles.

[Wizard boy]

This is my star midfielder. i wondered if anyone else had him.

[tomtuck01]

This is my star midfielder. i wondered if anyone else had him.

How, he's a regen?

[Wizard boy]

How, he's a regen?

Actually forgot he was a regen. Been playing this game way too long I think. He's a still a great player.

[Spiegel]

Excellent thread, started my own Ajax game on the back of this. Currently in the middle of rebuilding the Coaching staff, it's fascinating to look at this side of the game.

Some really nice prospects in the team. Just out of curiosity, how has Lukoki developed? I intend to alternate him on Crossing, Technique, Dribbling and Stamina. Then use the Winger Training to boost his decisions and balance.

Not the most complete player in the world, but I think if I try to max out what he's good at, he'll make a cracking specialist off the bench!

[Gee_Simpson]

Glad to hear you are both enjoying the development side of things

Without a doubt I think this is the best FM thread that I've ever done in terms of helping people understand the game better. Some of the results of tutoring and training what you've all been posting are great, never seen so many people get good results before

I plan on doing another of these on FM14 with whatever club I have my long term game with.

Nice

[Cleon]

Excellent thread, started my own Ajax game on the back of this. Currently in the middle of rebuilding the Coaching staff, it's fascinating to look at this side of the game.

Some really nice prospects in the team. Just out of curiosity, how has Lukoki developed? I intend to alternate him on Crossing, Technique, Dribbling and Stamina. Then use the Winger Training to boost his decisions and balance.

Not the most complete player in the world, but I think if I try to max out what he's good at, he'll make a cracking specialist off the bench!

I didn't develop Lukoki it was my biggest regret. I think Tom did though.

[tomtuck01]

I didn't develop Lukoki it was my biggest regret. I think Tom did though.

Nope. Used him a few times, but preferred Andersen on the right so he didn't get the necessary game time. Like with you, a bit of a regret.

[ModernLefty]

Actually forgot he was a regen. Been playing this game way too long I think. He's a still a great player.

Haha, I know the feeling, the amount of time and effort I've spent on my regens they're all seeming pretty real to me too.

[Wizard boy]

Haha, I know the feeling, the amount of time and effort I've spent on my regens they're all seeming pretty real to me too.

This the furthest I've ever been. Just reached 2200 games. Not sure what the furthest is that someone has got. I want keep going to see how far it goes.

[Cleon]

This the furthest I've ever been. Just reached 2200 games. Not sure what the furthest is that someone has got. I want keep going to see how far it goes.

See how far what goes?

[Wizard boy]

See how far what goes?

Before I get bored of it. Does the game have a limit or does it go on forever?

[Cleon]

Before I get bored of it. Does the game have a limit or does it go on forever?

It goes forever, there isn't a cap.

[Wizard boy]

It goes forever, there isn't a cap.

What is the furthest you have gone into the game?

[mibsweden]

I am at 2,534 games in management now, autumn 2053.

[Wizard boy]

I am at 2,534 games in management now, autumn 2053.

Im in 2054. 2,206. Win rating has gone up to 49% used to be about 44.

[janeka]

I need some help. After reading this thread, I decided to use this training method, training attributes by month cycle. The problem is that the players doesn't improve almost nothing.

For example, I decided to improve Dennis Praet "Off the Ball". In all season training this attributte, only raised one point. I am West Brom, he is playing in the first team and I have Top Training Facilities and each Training Category have at least 4 stars. What could I been doing wrong? Sorry for my english.

[mikcheck]

Cleon did you use a 3 DC tactic with this Ajax save?

[Cleon]

I need some help. After reading this thread, I decided to use this training method, training attributes by month cycle. The problem is that the players doesn't improve almost nothing.

For example, I decided to improve Dennis Praet "Off the Ball". In all season training this attributte, only raised one point. I am West Brom, he is playing in the first team and I have Top Training Facilities and each Training Category have at least 4 stars. What could I been doing wrong? Sorry for my english.

If you've followed the thread then you should have seen some improvement. You must have not done all the required steps and missed something out. My guess if you left general training high.

Cleon did you use a 3 DC tactic with this Ajax save?

Nope played 4-1-2-2-1

[janeka]

Probably I missed out something, but it wasn't that. My training is set to Balanced and Low. I think I will read all this again to see if I did something wrong.

Below are the list of the things I do:

-Set General Training to Balanced and Low;

-Choose the attributte I want to train and set it to heavy;

-I change the training focus depending how much the player improved;

Cleon, do you think I missed something?

[Cleon]

Probably I missed out something, but it wasn't that. My training is set to Balanced and Low. I think I will read all this again to see if I did something wrong.

Below are the list of the things I do:

-Set General Training to Balanced and Low;

-Choose the attributte I want to train and set it to heavy;

-I change the training focus depending how much the player improved;

Cleon, do you think I missed something?

And what do you do for the general/match training bar at the very top. What % is that set on? It should be 20% or lower.

[janeka]

I set it to 10%.

[Cleon]

Very strange if you did all that then and saw no improvements at all. I think you've either done soemthing wrong or not remembered the attributes properly. Because even if you did something wrong they'd still improve the optimal amount because they still train the other attributes. You got a screenshot of before and after?

You say you used monthly cycle on attributes, what others did you work on?

[janeka]

Below are the screenshots of Cirigliano and Praet (Beginning of first and second season). In Praet I think I spend the all season training Off the Ball (he raised 2 points not 1).

In Cirigliano I change between Strenght, Marking, Positioning, Off the Ball and Composure.

Cirigliano

First Season

Second Season

Praet

First Season

Second Season

What do you think? Am I being too "demanding"? (don't know what word to use )

[Cleon]

I honestly don't know what to say. Although you shouldn't set individual focus on 1 attribute for a year as that's a waste of training, so I guess that's the issue with Praet.

The other player Ciri, I actually have him and developed him on one of my other saves using the same approach highlighted in this thread here are my results;

Now I’m guessing he might not exactly be many peoples first choice but I think he’ll be great after a little bit of training.

The fault with Ezequiel Cirigliano is his personality, it’s balanced which means he isn’t good at anything. So when I buy him I’ll be tutoring him to get that changed for the better. On a plus side though he already has the PPM plays short simple passes.

So what made me choose him?

I’m a massive fan of this player in real life and have watched him play many times so that was a big decision in me buying him, not that it would make any difference to FM. But I like to buy players I like in real life. But that aside I think he has a good set of core attributes for his age for the deep lying playmaker role.

• 14 passing
  
• 15 technique
  
• 13 composure
  
• 14 creativity
  
• 13 decisions
  
• 14 flair
  
• 14 teamwork
  
• 14 workrate
  
• 13 tackling
  

Are all quite high already so that’s a bonus. Plus its hard to find someone who can be creative and still do the defensive side of things too which his attributes should allow. While he is to be the main focal point of the tactic when we have possession, he still needs to do the nitty gritty stuff and is still expected to be an exceptional defensive midfielder who offers protection to the back three.

I’m not buying him to play the deep lying playmaker role from the start, this is something he will do in the coming seasons but he’s not ready yet so will be used mainly as the defensive midfielder and provide cover for Tiote.

Luckily for me I had my £7 million offer for the player accepted by River Plate and signed him at the start of the season.

Training & Tutoring

The first thing I did was to get him tutored by Cabaye who is fairly determined. I would have paired him with Tiote who is determined but he got injured so that wasn’t an option unless I waited a few weeks but I didn’t really want to waste time.

I decided I’d work on these attributes in a cycle of 2 month periods meaning that I’d focus on one of these for 2 month then move onto the next one;

• Tackling
  
• Technique
  
• Passing
  
• Positioning
  
• Stamina
  
• Strength
  

It’s important that he can still defend so I’ve worked on this part of the game first so he doesn’t lack in these attributes. Plus he is already playing the defensive midfielder role so he needs to required attributes to pull it off effectively.

End of Season One Progress Update

At the end of the first season I could start to see that Ezequiel Cirigliano was developing into the player I thought he would. He’s still not the deep lying playmaker standard yet but he is progressing along nicely.

I’ve managed to change his personality type via a successful stint of tutoring from Cabaye, so now he is spirited which is better than balanced. He also managed to pick up a PPM from the tutoring session which was the tries killer balls often PPM. Which was good news because it means I didn’t need to teach him that one now, so it saved me a few months work. As soon as the tutoring session ended I started training Ezequiel Cirigliano the PPM dictates tempo to add to his PPM list.

The improvements from training are also visible and you can see he has improved quite a lot during this first season. He’s looking like a really good player now and that it was £7 million well spent.

Here are his stats for the first season;

End of Season Two Progress Update

This was a massive season for both the player and club with us playing champions league football. Plus we were the defending league champions and looking to retain the title. So there was a lot more harder games and every game became a bit game in my eyes.

Because of how Ezequiel Cirigliano was developing I decided that halfway through the second season rather than focus on single attributes I’d focus on a role. So I stuck him on the deep lying playmaker role and gave it an heavy intensity. I did this because I felt the player had progressed more than enough on the attributes I had worked on the previous season. Plus he had developed some of the other attributes to a more respectable level as well.

This is what he looks like at the end of the second season;

[mitjamvp]

I need an opinion on youth training. By reading all these threads i found some guys technique of training players by reducing GENERAL TRAINING INTENSITY to low and players personal FOCUS INTENSITY to heavy. I cant find his post but it seems to work quite well for me since the players main training is to develop attributes they need for their positions + they do general training which is connected to the way i play. (since i try playing control, short passing game) i mostly work on players technical and tactical ability.

So i was wondering, since most youth players need some work with their physical abilities, and the easiest way is to improve them early, it would be smart (well atleast in my mind) to set general training for my u19s to Fitness.

Has anyone tried setting training like that or has some simmilar experience?

I would love to try it but i dont really want to sacrifice some of my players future

[janeka]

I know your thread about Cirigliano, and when I compared yours with mine after one season, thats when I realised I must do something wrong. I put two players tutoring Cirigliano (Gonzalo Jara (Fairly Determined) and Billy Jones (Determined), and the only thing that he changed was his Media Handling, not even Determination increased. I think the game broke down

[mikcheck]

Thanks Cleon

[Guest Satchy]

I put two players tutoring Cirigliano (Gonzalo Jara (Fairly Determined) and Billy Jones (Determined), and the only thing that he changed was his Media Handling, not even Determination increased.

It takes a bit sometimes, and by that I mean even after they've been tutored. Re-tutoring can speed up the process, but not always straight away either, in my experience. I tutored Kenny Tete twice and his determination went up initially during the first tutoring, but never increased during the 2nd tutoring, and his personality only became resolute a few months after the 2nd tutoring. So just be patient.