Football Manager 2014 - Update 14.2.2 - Feedback Thread

[jc1]

I also think the time it takes teams to get from one end of the pitch to the other is a lot faster than in real life, leading to more action around the penalty area at both ends, which in turn leads to a higher number of set pieces in those areas. This is down to ball physics IMO. The ball sometimes travels unrealistic distances, particularly from clearances and defensive headers.

This is true, I have decent wingers and forwards etc but they're all world class sprinters in this game, 100 meters in around 6-7 seconds

[Pitalo]

Here's a quick feedback from me, I started a new career game for 14.2. It's has been really frustrating for me to play this game, since actually I don't play the "game". I like to play FM a tad bit realistic and always start unemployed with sunday league reputation. In patch 14.1 I was able to get some job interviews and some job offers. In 14.2 it's been extremely hard to get an interview. My nationality is Dutch and I haven't been able to find a team who really wanted to take an opportunity to interview me. Fed up with the "holiday-option with apply to anything", I've been trying to find like minded people on the forums. I did find plenty of other gamers who have the same issues with 14.2 and unfortunatelly there are no signs of improvements. In one case a SI-(moderater?/employee?) has claimed that this wasn't an issue and he had no such issue with his game. I don't want to put fingers anywhere or on anybody, let me be clear on that. For me, it's like a prayer with no end. I have a game, which I can't play the fashion I like. That's frustrating...

I hope to find more people here who have the same issue, that we may help each other out in a constructive way.

(Please excuse me for my bad grammar)

[wwfan]

That's cool. I'm not greedy. I don't need £100K, £80K will suffice

Seriously, just in your opinion, what else in the ME do you think needs to be improved?

Most of what I think needs improving gets completely missed by these forums. Too many people focus on one off incidents rather than repeating patterns. There are a bunch of things involving lateral and vertical dynamism that need improving, which will all impact on the quality of wide play. Players also get over-attracted to their default positions rather than engaging with play directly around them, which is causing a lot of the bad passing issues. Corner delivery is too one dimensional and defending of corners needs some work. Players aren't prioritising getting behind the ball or stopping it getting between the parallels, which results in too many free headers. Headers and passes often don't have enough weight on them.

I don't have too many issues with the quality of finishing, general attacking or defensive play, which all seems pretty well balanced to me. That said, I do think FCs are too selfish, too rushed in decision and too slow in movement at times, which is knocking onto top class strikers failing to fashion enough good chances for themselves, meaning they rely on the quality of their side's teamwork more than they necessarily do in reality. I also think there's some poor logic in shot choice in relation to how closely tracked the shooter is when he takes the shot, but I doubt this would do anything significant in increasing goals from strikers, merely make their misses look more realistic.

[Azmodai]

I'm enjoying the game itself very much, since I play conference leagues though, it's very tough for me to get a job and if this bug were to be fixed, I would be satisfied as it's the only game breaking bug for me... I love career games where I jump around and I can't do it in this game

[palladino]

Updated the game(wasn't a very smart decision), ruined the holidays, contemplating suicide!

Now on a more serious note, is this all you can do SI? Come on guys, the game has gone from bad to worse! I mean, this is a football game, in which the STRIKER doesn't score, at all. Is this too much to ask? A game should be fun, because is just a game. Keep it simple and please, PLEASE, give us the chance to roll back the updates!!!

[janesy20]

Updated the game(wasn't a very smart decision), ruined the holidays, contemplating suicide!

Now on a more serious note, is this all you can do SI? Come on guys, the game has gone from bad to worse! I mean, this is a football game, in which the STRIKER doesn't score, at all. Is this too much to ask? A game should be fun, because is just a game. Keep it simple and please, PLEASE, give us the chance to roll back the updates!!!

Got to agree with the majority, I thought after 14.1.4 we were getting somewhere but 14.2 seems to back to square one if not worse.

Major issues

- First touch of my players is absolutely horrendous I'm talking 5-10yards away from them

- My players can't string two passes together (please, please don't tell me it's my tactics, they were working for every other update until now)

- Too many goals from corners/mistakes...yet the AI never makes a single mistake when it comes to these.

This update is terrible and I hope another one is released soon to counteract these issues.

[cachirro]

This is a horrible ME, damn, how can an update make things worse??? cmon

it's ridiculous the amount of goals i (and my network mates) suffer from controlled balls in the GK, he just freaking stupidly passes it to the opponent striker just outside the area, what the hell is this!??!

the game is so unrealistic, it's like an arcade riping you off more coins.

it must be the damn gk distribution bug all over again, he either sees the opponent as a teammate, or wants to pass to some defender and ignores the opponent is in the line of pass, ridiculous.

[isignedupfornorealreason]

Corner delivery is too one dimensional and defending of corners needs some work.

.

I said that three or four times in this thread, the last of which got deleted. >_>

To re-iterate the deleted post; Corner delivery issues are much more obvious at the lower leagues, and so is crossing. And it seems to me that with each update to 'fix' it all that is being done is 'moving' a default line which projects the trajectory which, ALL crosses must follow. Hence one dimensional. We saw it with early near post corners, then far post with three 'general areas' for the ball to land based on the attribute and finally we see it with the skimming off the goal line area.

I'm simplifying, obviously the coding or programming for this has to be more advanced, but it certainly doesn't look like it. Hence, next year I think most people would be satisfied with no real "updates" and a much more refined match engine because 14 is fantastic, once you the bloody engine is ironed out visually.

[bieritarier]

Most of what I think needs improving gets completely missed by these forums. Too many people focus on one off incidents rather than repeating patterns. There are a bunch of things involving lateral and vertical dynamism that need improving, which will all impact on the quality of wide play. Players also get over-attracted to their default positions rather than engaging with play directly around them, which is causing a lot of the bad passing issues. Corner delivery is too one dimensional and defending of corners needs some work. Players aren't prioritising getting behind the ball or stopping it getting between the parallels, which results in too many free headers. Headers and passes often don't have enough weight on them.

I don't have too many issues with the quality of finishing, general attacking or defensive play, which all seems pretty well balanced to me. That said, I do think FCs are too selfish, too rushed in decision and too slow in movement at times, which is knocking onto top class strikers failing to fashion enough good chances for themselves, meaning they rely on the quality of their side's teamwork more than they necessarily do in reality. I also think there's some poor logic in shot choice in relation to how closely tracked the shooter is when he takes the shot, but I doubt this would do anything significant in increasing goals from strikers, merely make their misses look more realistic.

So if I understand you correctly you say

- players are not aware of the play going on around them enough. My take on how this displays in the ME: Players running into each other, players not challenging for the ball although clearly in the best position to do so, passes hitting players in the back, players unnecessarily retreat into the box

- players are attracted to their default position (sort of a knock-on/extension of the point earlier) - Symptoms: Wingers (AML/AMR) not tracking back properly when the opp full back pushes up, players not offering passing option, generally not enough player movement.

- bad decision making, especially by strikers - symptoms: pointless long shots, very bad misses (shooting from the edge of area with ball going out for a throw-in. etc), generally no/little chance for top quality strikers to get a goal in congested areas.

I believe you're about covering 90% of the issues people are raising here. Of course you have got both the insight into the ME mechanics and the Tactcal interface as well as a great understanding of football in general to comment on the actual issues.

What I find extremely disappointing (and this is not by any means directed at you) is that pretty much the first response to any issue someone raises is "get help at the tactics forum". Yes, this is a good forum with plenty of helpful an knowledgeable people, but there's a million ways to instruct footballers IRL and still have success. Why? Because players, in particular pro players will adapt to the game situation (meaning what the opposition does) automatically, without being micro-managed into it.

As an example, Pep Guardiola does not need totell Mandzukic, Müller, Ribéry and Robben to not statically stand next to the defenders for minutes (all of them at the same time!) while Kroos, Schweinsteigr Alaba and Lahm pass the ball between themselves until they lose it or hoof a hopeless ball forward. I don't think he needs to tell them to play be less attacking (drop mentality/strategy in FM terms) or drop the dline deeper. I'd even say Bayern do neither. they will just constantly be on the move in the area in front of the box to pass the ball around. They do it because it is the right thing to do when the area in front of the box or in the box is too congested. You say this is probably caused by some issues with player awareness in the game. Others call it brainless. No matter what you call it, it's an issue.

[Ampburner]

Must admit I do think this patch is a bit ropey. Getting a ton of injuries since the recent update and it's incredibly frustrating. Other parts are vastly improved however. Nice to see my strikers scoring.

[imabearlol]

About the only thing you do have power over are your tactics though. So when people direct others to the tactics forum they aren't necessarily dismissing the problems, but directing them to about the only place that might be able to help them.

I see some of these issues too and the update's been particularly brutal to my AML and CM ratings, but I'm 24-9-1 in the EPL currently having only conceded 9 goals in March. It's clearly still possible to win even though the football we see isn't exactly great, so for those suddenly experiencing a 30 game loss streak it's more likely to be something else. It's one thing to give feedback on the status of the update, it's another to moan and slag SI endlessly without trying to do what you can yourself and fix it (or not play until the new update).

[palladino]

About the only thing you do have power over are your tactics though. So when people direct others to the tactics forum they aren't necessarily dismissing the problems, but directing them to about the only place that might be able to help them.

I see some of these issues too and the update's been particularly brutal to my AML and CM ratings, but I'm 24-9-1 in the EPL currently having only conceded 9 goals in March. It's clearly still possible to win even though the football we see isn't exactly great, so for those suddenly experiencing a 30 game loss streak it's more likely to be something else. It's one thing to give feedback on the status of the update, it's another to moan and slag SI endlessly without trying to do what you can yourself and fix it (or not play until the new update).

Yeah, cause that's exactly why I've paid for this game, to not play and wait...Jesus, some people...

PS: I know, I know, it's my tactic, I'm stupid, SI updates rule!

[themadsheep2001]

snip

What he's talking about has rarely been mentioned tbh, in fact I've probably seen issues with lateral movement mentioned just a handful of times.

The reason the tactics section is offered is because its the single quickest way to start isolating an issue, and in truth most of the time it IS a user based approach, experience past and present marks this out the case the majority of the time. but its also excellent for spotting things that are not working the way the instructions are given. And when you couple with Pkms etc, you quickly build up an excellent picture of what's right and wrong.

[wwfan]

So if I understand you correctly you say

- players are not aware of the play going on around them enough. My take on how this displays in the ME: Players running into each other, players not challenging for the ball although clearly in the best position to do so, passes hitting players in the back, players unnecessarily retreat into the box

- players are attracted to their default position (sort of a knock-on/extension of the point earlier) - Symptoms: Wingers (AML/AMR) not tracking back properly when the opp full back pushes up, players not offering passing option, generally not enough player movement.

- bad decision making, especially by strikers - symptoms: pointless long shots, very bad misses (shooting from the edge of area with ball going out for a throw-in. etc), generally no/little chance for top quality strikers to get a goal in congested areas.

I believe you're about covering 90% of the issues people are raising here. Of course you have got both the insight into the ME mechanics and the Tactcal interface as well as a great understanding of football in general to comment on the actual issues.

What I find extremely disappointing (and this is not by any means directed at you) is that pretty much the first response to any issue someone raises is "get help at the tactics forum". Yes, this is a good forum with plenty of helpful an knowledgeable people, but there's a million ways to instruct footballers IRL and still have success. Why? Because players, in particular pro players will adapt to the game situation (meaning what the opposition does) automatically, without being micro-managed into it.

As an example, Pep Guardiola does not need totell Mandzukic, Müller, Ribéry and Robben to not statically stand next to the defenders for minutes (all of them at the same time!) while Kroos, Schweinsteigr Alaba and Lahm pass the ball between themselves until they lose it or hoof a hopeless ball forward. I don't think he needs to tell them to play be less attacking (drop mentality/strategy in FM terms) or drop the dline deeper. I'd even say Bayern do neither. they will just constantly be on the move in the area in front of the box to pass the ball around. They do it because it is the right thing to do when the area in front of the box or in the box is too congested. You say this is probably caused by some issues with player awareness in the game. Others call it brainless. No matter what you call it, it's an issue.

There are, of course, issues in the ME. However, nothing makes it unplayable. For a good number of posters, a visit to the tactics forum can help them play better football. There's nothing in the ME to prevent solid tactic from working exactly as well as they always did. What tends to happen is people who build tactics around ME flaws (e.g. those who tried to combat the FB / winger engagement issue in an earlier build) discover that their tactic doesn't work at all when these flaws have been ironed out and get frustrated. Those are the people the tactics forum can help.

Your last paragraph indicates the difference between tactical issues and identifying bugs. You seem to be expecting the players to play naturally. To an extent, they do. However, tactical instructions must have some meaning or we don't have a game. If you are telling a player to stay high all the time and not deviate, then the team to play short passes, then incoherence between the strata should be a result. You might see a world class player compensating at times and scoring anyway, but you can;t expect it to happen all the time if you've told him to do otherwise. If that happened, your tactical input would have no meaning and all you'd need to do would be buy the best players.

Such patterns are nearly always tactical. In general, it will be quite simple for an experienced tactician to explain why your tactical instructions are resulting in incoherent play and suggest a fix. If you are seeing this type of incoherence, then a visit to the tactics forum would be very useful.

[bieritarier]

Don't get me wrong, I have a 19-1-0 record in the league and won all 6 of my CL matches (easy group) since the update. it's not that. Though I do have issues with how many many situations play out.

For one, there's a lock of movement, especially from my striker. Second, even on a standard strategy and a standard dline, my DM(d) can often be found 5 yars away form the box with only my DCs covering since my full backs also pushed up. this is insane, and not what the strategy tells them to do. Then there's the ridiculous amount of times strikers either don't take the shot when clearly in great position or unnecessarily blast it at goal when clearly having better options.

Yes, you can fix a lot of things tactically. Yes if you go on a huge losing streak it's probably tactical.

and here's the but: Many people struggle to translate the role descriptions into what a certain player will do on the pitch. People expect their own players to adapt to certain situation in a way they see it on TV and from the stands day in and day out. Add in a couple of issues that keep players from actually doing what the role descriptions says properly and you're in a position where you get the _behavior_ you try to emulate only by trial and error or by people giving you advice on what works for them.

That may not necessarily be the way things will play out for you because researchers are doing a fabulous job in not getting the difference between a player preferred move and a tactical instruction given to the players. Problem is, PPMs pretty much override your tactical instructions. All of this combined is a source of frustration. Especially when you've finally found something that works and produces about the football you yant to see, then post another patch your players are unable to control a pass from 3 feet away (and I'm not talking about a "pass" that is trying to kill the receiver and ricochets into orbit after the impact).

Most people could not care less about the calculations in the background that make certain things to occur. What counts is whether what is visualized by 2d/3d makes sense in the context of the players/teams playing. And unfortunately too often, it doesn't.

Again, I don'T believe this ME is actually bad. Actually, apart from a few issues it's about the best we've seen so far. And if SI did a better job to help people understand where they're going wrong as well as improved the tactical interface to actually a) provide really meaningful explanations of what a role/strategy/philosophy does and b) provide more feedback on how specific roles interact it would go a long way.

[bieritarier]

Such patterns are nearly always tactical. In general, it will be quite simple for an experienced tactician to explain why your tactical instructions are resulting in incoherent play and suggest a fix. If you are seeing this type of incoherence, then a visit to the tactics forum would be very useful.

I agree that there are of course patters that are caused by tactics. I'm not a tactical genius either. I'm winning, though not as convincingly as I would like. Is it a big deal? to some extent. Can I live with it? right now, yes, though I might have to ditch the game once the season is over until the next patch anyway since no player that would help the team wants to join, which is from my pov another bug.

But let me give you an example of what annoys me. If I play attacking or control along with a high dline, I too often have my players on attack duty, even the CM(a) statically standing around. ok, lower the dline and maybe drop mentality a notch is the consensus in the tactics forum. However, that is not what I want to do, because it kills my defensive play when I lose the ball. So what I want to achieve is a high line and heavy pressing when not in possession. The pressing should really start that the byline. Playing standard or even counter that'S not gonna work. Playing with a low dline that'S not gonna work.

What I want my players to do is press high when not in possession, but drop a bit deeper and create space behind the defense when in possession. A strategy I can define in one sentence, but cannot recreate even remotely in the game to save my life.

And that's what I mean with awareness of players. Either that, or let me set the strategy for "with ball" and "without ball" separately...

[isignedupfornorealreason]

Player awareness and issues;

Long balls over the top - I didn't see this much before but is the new 'lobbed goal'. Defender hoof balls it, bounces over everyone, striker nips in goal. I've scored a ton of these...

Goalkeepers, I've seen some weird stuff happening. One the opposition keeper collected the ball (by his feet), walked to the edge of the inside of his box and then 'dived' to catch it... Only for my striker to walk over, pinch it and cross it for the goal. -I get what the engine is probably trying to display but... yeah-

There's also a graphical glitch, part of the issue of the d-line being so far back. I'm on control strategy and my players are camped on the goal line sometimes. Same for the opposition. Saw a good game where the keeper caught the ball into his own net and play carried on as normal. Thought it would have been an own goal but, guess the officials weren't paying attention.

They're minor issues (beside the long ball one and aforementioned corners/crosses).

[theopert]

Merry Christmas. Wish your family a safe and happy time.

I wish the player ratings were based on progressive aggregation of attributes.

I wish I could distribute up to the maximum allowable number of points for each attribute which currently is at 20, for Technical, Mental, Physical, and not worry about the 200 cap which forces a regression.

Thanks for reading.

[BiggusD]

My impressions of 14.2.0 so far:

* High precision on long passes, many underhit short passes.

* Both my players and the opponent opts to shoot from very tight angles even though there are several players storming into the box.

* I feel there is a sort of "randomness" to effort. I don't get the feeling that the opponent has thwarted my tactic... rather, it looks like my players are on strike; one match, Gaitan takes on one, two, three players and mostly shoots from an angle but sometimes get dangerous crosses in. The next he gets the ball, walks a few paces and then gets tackled. Sure it could be that a hopelessness creeps in because my tactic is annulled by the opponent manager's genious, but it does not look that way. It feels like a toss of the dice and snake eyes came up instead of spider eyes.

* Since 14.1.3 I have tried Eastleigh, Las Palmas and now Lazio. Promoted twice with Eastleigh in two seasons; they were then utterly bankrupt and I was unable to assemble a team of 20+ players. Las Palmas second in Adelante; 20kpw less wage budget in Primera the next season thanks to massive debt. Lazio looks to be okay, though. My question is this; do -any- lower league club break even? Has anyone managed to increase their budget after a promotion?

* Dribbling raids at a slow pace can go on for a long time even though two players are on his back. I know tackling needs a nerf, but this seems a bit too much.

Other than this, much good.

[imabearlol]

Yeah, cause that's exactly why I've paid for this game, to not play and wait...Jesus, some people...

PS: I know, I know, it's my tactic, I'm stupid, SI updates rule!

Just because you paid for it doesn't mean you have to play it. If you don't like it learn from this lesson and don't buy it in the future. However since you're moaning here somehow I don't think you'll learn your lesson.

[wwfan]

What I want my players to do is press high when not in possession, but drop a bit deeper and create space behind the defense when in possession. A strategy I can define in one sentence, but cannot recreate even remotely in the game to save my life.

Use the much higher d-line and hassle team instructions with a lower mentality system. If you want to keep a higher mentality, having less players on attack duties will also encourage them to drop deeper in possession.

[Shakes]

* Since 14.1.3 I have tried Eastleigh, Las Palmas and now Lazio. Promoted twice with Eastleigh in two seasons; they were then utterly bankrupt and I was unable to assemble a team of 20+ players. Las Palmas second in Adelante; 20kpw less wage budget in Primera the next season thanks to massive debt. Lazio looks to be okay, though. My question is this; do -any- lower league club break even? Has anyone managed to increase their budget after a promotion?

IME all lower league clubs make losses. However my current team has been given a wage budget of 38k and a transfer budget of 1 million, based on them losing money at their current spend of 9k. So it is possible that you get a wage budget increase, although arguably it shouldn't be.

[janesy20]

Use the much higher d-line and hassle team instructions with a lower mentality system. If you want to keep a higher mentality, having less players on attack duties will also encourage them to drop deeper in possession.

by lower mentality you mean what exactly? I want to recreate this aswell but i find my team far too high in posession. do you mean change from Attacking to Counter or something? Because surely changing to counter means they play fast football once they get it...I don't want that, I want to play a passing game i.e arsenal or swansea.

I just find there is far too much going on in the game nowadays I don't seem to know my a**e from my elbow so to speak. Match training, team instructions, individual instructions, opposition instructions, PPMs...if one of those is wrong...things go wrong!

[wwfan]

by lower mentality you mean what exactly? I want to recreate this aswell but i find my team far too high in posession. do you mean change from Attacking to Counter or something? Because surely changing to counter means they play fast football once they get it...I don't want that, I want to play a passing game i.e arsenal or swansea.

I just find there is far too much going on in the game nowadays I don't seem to know my a**e from my elbow so to speak. Match training, team instructions, individual instructions, opposition instructions, PPMs...if one of those is wrong...things go wrong!

If you want passing football, then use the shorter passing, lower tempo and retain possession team instructions. Counter doesn't mean fast, direct play. That is one type of counter-attacking football, sure, but an other type is keeping possession deep and working space before launching a pinpoint TB.

[themadsheep2001]

by lower mentality you mean what exactly? I want to recreate this aswell but i find my team far too high in posession. do you mean change from Attacking to Counter or something? Because surely changing to counter means they play fast football once they get it...I don't want that, I want to play a passing game i.e arsenal or swansea.

I just find there is far too much going on in the game nowadays I don't seem to know my a**e from my elbow so to speak. Match training, team instructions, individual instructions, opposition instructions, PPMs...if one of those is wrong...things go wrong!

Yup, but that doesnt stop you playing slow football, you still have the options to adjust the tempo and/or passing. Currently playing Counter, push higher, hassle opponents, stay on feet.

The bold is always why I recommend people drop into the tactics section and outline how they want to play. I personally advocate building an approach from the top down. Outline a general philosophy before attempting to start adjusting individual play instructions

EDIT: wwfan beat me to it

[janesy20]

if I concede one more time from a corner I'm going to self-admit myself to a mental hospital.

This is by far the worst patch I have ever tried. Short passing game is non-existant. The AI is far too 'good' in short...it needs a complete overhaul.

[janesy20]

Yup, but that doesnt stop you playing slow football, you still have the options to adjust the tempo and/or passing. Currently playing Counter, push higher, hassle opponents, stay on feet.

The bold is always why I recommend people drop into the tactics section and outline how they want to play. I personally advocate building an approach from the top down. Outline a general philosophy before attempting to start adjusting individual play instructions

EDIT: wwfan beat me to it

I spend half my life on that forum mate. I've followed everyones instructions and find myself back at square one all over again. Ignore me, I'm just frustrated!

[themadsheep2001]

I spend half my life on that forum mate. I've followed everyones instructions and find myself back at square one all over again. Ignore me, I'm just frustrated!

Hah, see thats why I wouldn't ignore you. No one likes to see someone not enjoying the game, especially when they are putting the time in to try and understand where they are going wrong (if indeed they are going wrong). I think it's certainly worth opening your own thread in that section detailing who you are, how you want to play, and screenshots of how you are playing currently. The tactics section is incredibly helpful, but is so much info there it can be overwhelming, sometimes its better to just state your case on how you want to play and go from there. I'm pretty much done for the night, but happy to have a look in the morning at any thread you create, see if I can help at all

[MichaelBrown]

It's only common courtesy to have a read before posting and not to explicitly say you don't have time to read the comments. But in answer to your question, yes. The quality of first touch has plummeted. I'm not sure whether SI are acknowledging this as a problem, if it all though.

Have you seen the amount of crap that is posted in this thread? I wouldn't bother reading every page either, hoping that somebody has already noted an issue.

[CityAndColour]

Getting players injuring themselves while making a challenge a hell of a lot.

[janesy20]

Hah, see thats why I wouldn't ignore you. No one likes to see someone not enjoying the game, especially when they are putting the time in to try and understand where they are going wrong (if indeed they are going wrong). I think it's certainly worth opening your own thread in that section detailing who you are, how you want to play, and screenshots of how you are playing currently. The tactics section is incredibly helpful, but is so much info there it can be overwhelming, sometimes its better to just state your case on how you want to play and go from there. I'm pretty much done for the night, but happy to have a look in the morning at any thread you create, see if I can help at all

Thanks, it's not that I've not had a successful tactic up until 14.2, I don't think that's even the issue. I do the Youth Academy Challenge and as such I'm a victim of my own success. Just promoted to the Bundesliga with a team that I would consider too strong for the Second Division but not quite strong enough to hold my own in Bundesliga. As I can't sign any external players as per rules of the challenge I'm stuck with what I have. I created my own version of the infamous Modern Warfare tactic that was knocking about on FM13 ( i think it was) and it got me as far as the Bundesliga but trying to use it against teams that are considered much stronger than I - I've taken 5 defeats out of my first 6...What I think I need is first and foremost a defensive tactic, possibly stretching to one that attacks on the counter.

Issues I notice with how I play are:

- Lots of sendings off

- Lots of injuries

-using short passing the ball is either under hit causing interceptions, or over hit causing really bad touches (I'm talking 10yard+)

- Far too much 'good' movement from the AI they play how I would like to replicate.

- Conceding too many goals from set pieces.

But I've tried so many options and tactics I can't seem to get my head straight, I can't afford to get the sack - it'll be 10 seasons worth down the drain and if I can survive this season I reckon I'll be fine from there after. Once I get chance probably after Xmas I'll create a thread on the forum...it's difficult when there's so much to take into consideration.

EDIT: Ah...think I've cracked it, I've created an immensely defensive formation designed at grinding out draws.. I had 33% and 3 shots on goal and they had 67% and 30 shots on goal. But the one stat that matters...0-0 I'll use this tactic home and away 70% of the time and pick the lesser teams the bottom 6/7 of the league I'll use an attacking tactic at home, hopefully this is the one!

[CityAndColour]

I would hazard a guess that too many sendings off may mean your players are often out of position or outnumbered, causing the need to slide or lunge in. This also seems to cause a lot of injuries to the tackler.

[Svenc]

How does the match engine actually work? Does it take into account our tactics and the quality of our players, then calculate a result? Is that result then manifested in the number of goals rather than the quality thereof?

That must be a fairly common misconception, given that a lot of players focus entirelly on creating teams that dominate a few key isolated statistics (shots, possession, etc.) without watching match context and seeing that as an indication of quality tactics or at least the best way to ensure stable results in the long run. Similarily, from such theories stems a lot of other frustrations, such as the supposed super keeper that suddenly appears so that the result would stay the way it would be fixed to be, or strikers missing countless sitters because of the same. If the calculations were happening as you implied, the ME would create arbitrary sequences of play fitting a result (and they would be pretty useless, honestly). This isn't the case, it is a sequence by sequence thing in chronological order, with various events (the most obvious ones being goals, naturally, but also players occassionally getting upset over wrong calls or getting frustrating after missing many chances) also influencing play, and be it only via an AI that reacts to going one goal down or taking the lead, even if you yourself never do anything in-match. See for instance this http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/361388-Is-FM-a-simulator-or-an-illusion?p=9038743&viewfull=1#post9038743 and some of the following posts. Some numbers, such as the 1/8 of a second calculations, are outdated though, as you can reading in the following most recent interview: http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/11/25/talk-of-the-terrace-football-manager-interview/

The only catch is that this isn't done real-time, but that doesn't really matter and is needed for performance reasons (imagine not yours but all the matches happening around you at the same time being simulated in real-time too, we're talking 90 minutes of play, not two by six minutes as in default setting FIFA or PES). But this is also done so that the match viewer you then get to view the match through after a half was calculated knows where "highlights" or "extended highlights" are. Still it doesn't matter for you as by every change you or the AI make in a match the thing gets re-calculated from that minute the change was applied.

[Totalfootballfan]

Ehhh… I can understand how it’s possible to miss some bugs but you can kill me I don’t understand how it was possible to miss “Tactical switch” bug. You only need once switch between tactics to see that players positions mixed up and their tactical settings mixed up too.

I’ve got only one reasonable explanation that in very last minutes some crucial tweaks had been made to game code and there’s totally no time to test it.

[Bill_Strevros]

Svenc, interesting post, thank you for posting.

[OPAgusta]

What I have noticed so far from the new patch:

- Tackling is much better

- Pressing is much better especially for someone like me who loves to play high def line and hassle opponent

- Players sometimes have loose first touch as in he receives the ball and it bounces several yards out of his foot. This for me is good as this is what happens in reality even with the most technically gifted player

- Sometimes the ball gets left behind when a player run with ball which makes the player stops for a while to recover the ball. Again, reality, great!

- Players attempt shots from tight angle, especially my IF who cuts inside, even when several players are waiting inside the box. Now, this drives me nuts, I would not say it is a bug, it is just how the ME works i guess

- "Reduced instances of direct free kicks aimed too close to crossbar inflating woodwork stats"

Let me tell you what happens in my save game. Every time a player attempts to shoot from free kick, I always predict inside my head "it will definitely hit the woodwork". As it turns out it happens like 4 out of 5 times. It makes me feel like a god.

- Woodwork, woodwork, and woodwork! I swear to god I average 2.5-3 woodwork per game. 5-6 woodwork per game is not a rare occurrence. Is it maybe because I use superior team like Barcelona who have a lot of shot attempts? Which brings me to the next point...

- Shot attempts have not been reduced although non of my player is given an instruction to "shoot on sight"

- In the situation when my full back is marking opponent's winger at the corner area, one the the DC's will stray out of his position and try to also mark this winger. This results in a opposition striker left unmarked. This happens when "hassle opponent" is used but even then this is highly unusual. Please do not tell me to fix my tactic as this is highly unusual in real life scenario (Imagine Gerard Pique doing it but it happens in my save game!)

- 2 DCs mark a same opponent player which leave another opponent player unmarked especially when anticipating long ball. I had to set both DC's duty to Defend to avoid it happening as ideally one should be set to Defend and another Stopper

- Goalkeeper taking a freekick from his own corner area instead of defender. This results in goal for opponent if the keeper passes it wrongly as the net is empty. Happens twice in my save game but fortunately to my opponent!

- I do not have a problem with tactical familiarity as it will go back up as soon as possible

[Georgik]

MADNESS ! )

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Just because you paid for it doesn't mean you have to play it. If you don't like it learn from this lesson and don't buy it in the future. However since you're moaning here somehow I don't think you'll learn your lesson.

Indeed some of us FM/CM players of 10 years plus have come to this conclusion in the last year or so Which is a shame.

[steve dewilde]

stupid corner goals

gk acting like real moron

insane poor first touch of thechnical players

those are the ones that bother me on this latest patch

[Jimmious7]

Yeah the corner goals are a bit of an issue. I can't seem to find a way to stop the opponents from creating chances/scoring from corners.

Has anyone found a good setup for defending corners?

[mortiscausa]

Yeah the corner goals are a bit of an issue. I can't seem to find a way to stop the opponents from creating chances/scoring from corners.

Has anyone found a good setup for defending corners?

Someone ? This is so annoying !!!

[Giant Ant With a Gun]

Indeed some of us FM/CM players of 10 years plus have come to this conclusion in the last year or so Which is a shame.

Only in the last year? It's taken you a while to catch on, hasn't it?

[Hit the upright]

End of November 1 conceded so far

man

tall

tall

back

mk far

back

close down

tall

forward

near

[Rob4590]

MADNESS ! )

SI are aware of this issue - but need PKMs to fix it - please see this thread: http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/377098-Reviewed-14.1.4-Crazy-Penalty-Shootout

[petergoddard]

Don't get me wrong, I have a 19-1-0 record in the league and won all 6 of my CL matches (easy group) since the update. it's not that. Though I do have issues with how many many situations play out.

For one, there's a lock of movement, especially from my striker. Second, even on a standard strategy and a standard dline, my DM(d) can often be found 5 yars away form the box with only my DCs covering since my full backs also pushed up. this is insane, and not what the strategy tells them to do. Then there's the ridiculous amount of times strikers either don't take the shot when clearly in great position or unnecessarily blast it at goal when clearly having better options.

Yes, you can fix a lot of things tactically. Yes if you go on a huge losing streak it's probably tactical.

and here's the but: Many people struggle to translate the role descriptions into what a certain player will do on the pitch. People expect their own players to adapt to certain situation in a way they see it on TV and from the stands day in and day out. Add in a couple of issues that keep players from actually doing what the role descriptions says properly and you're in a position where you get the _behavior_ you try to emulate only by trial and error or by people giving you advice on what works for them.

That may not necessarily be the way things will play out for you because researchers are doing a fabulous job in not getting the difference between a player preferred move and a tactical instruction given to the players. Problem is, PPMs pretty much override your tactical instructions. All of this combined is a source of frustration. Especially when you've finally found something that works and produces about the football you yant to see, then post another patch your players are unable to control a pass from 3 feet away (and I'm not talking about a "pass" that is trying to kill the receiver and ricochets into orbit after the impact).

Most people could not care less about the calculations in the background that make certain things to occur. What counts is whether what is visualized by 2d/3d makes sense in the context of the players/teams playing. And unfortunately too often, it doesn't.

Again, I don'T believe this ME is actually bad. Actually, apart from a few issues it's about the best we've seen so far. And if SI did a better job to help people understand where they're going wrong as well as improved the tactical interface to actually a) provide really meaningful explanations of what a role/strategy/philosophy does and b) provide more feedback on how specific roles interact it would go a long way.

Completly agree with you.

I come here to this forum and several others and I read a lot of complains that people take as bugs and I don't have the problems that they report... so, it must be their tactics. Not that my tactical view is great but until now I'm doing ok.

Then we have this thing with the tactical system, sliders are done, roles, duties and concepts are here to stay. That's fine, I didn't have a problem with sliders and I don't have a problem with this system, I understand it but I know I can improve. The problem and it seems to me that SI and some moderators around here are being very rigid and stubborn is:

a) many people wants to play for the fun of it and not having to read books, articles and encyclopedias about football in order to understand players roles and duties, strategies and philosophies and these people are a lot more in number that the ones who have the patience to dive in those articles

b) roles and duties descriptions should have been updated with better explanations and not just simply the ones from fm13: this can be understand either as incompetence or disregard for customers

c) last but not least, although is always a kind of subjective, there are tactical details that I think should not be so rigid: there were a few on / off instructions that are now unavailable. If I want to use a DLP I will know that we will hold the ball but if I don't want him to hold the ball the only thing I can do is to change his role that will also change his mentality and CF... completly a potatoe logic A simple on / off instruction and I am obligated to change an entire role!!!

[forameuss]

a) many people wants to play for the fun of it and not having to read books, articles and encyclopedias about football in order to understand players roles and duties, strategies and philosophies and these people are a lot more in number that the ones who have the patience to dive in those articles

See this is where you're completely wrong. You're acting like someone's slamming a 500 page book down in front of you and saying "go on, 'ave that". They're pointing you to the tactics forum, where the knowledgable types there will be able to distill what they need to say down into a few posts. There is no need to read "books" or "encyclopedias".

Can't say I disagree with the rest of what you say though.

[milnerpoint]

I dont think its fair to say SI are incompetent or that they disregard anyone because you dont like the role descriptions, they suit me fine.

Also a DLP doesnt hold up the ball.

[petergoddard]

See this is where you're completely wrong. You're acting like someone's slamming a 500 page book down in front of you and saying "go on, 'ave that". They're pointing you to the tactics forum, where the knowledgable types there will be able to distill what they need to say down into a few posts. There is no need to read "books" or "encyclopedias".

Can't say I disagree with the rest of what you say though.

lool not 500 hundred but even at the tactics forum you have to read a lot... I did, I have learned and I am glad with it, but not everyone thinks like this. I'm not saying that they are right (or wrong) for not reading, studying and learning, they want to have fun, to play a fun and simple game.

Forget to say that it would be most useful to have a player instruction "be more expressive" and "be more disciplined"

[Richard76]

Yeah the corner goals are a bit of an issue. I can't seem to find a way to stop the opponents from creating chances/scoring from corners.

Has anyone found a good setup for defending corners?

No. Not sure how you could either. For me the issue with defending corners is the ridiculous powder puff clearing headers that fall straight to the opposition inside the area to slot home.

[Pafeu]

I dont think its fair to say SI are incompetent or that they disregard anyone because you dont like the role descriptions, they suit me fine.

Also a DLP doesnt hold up the ball.

Yes, he does hold up the ball.