Football Manager 2014 - Full Game Feedback/Tilbakemelding 14.1.3

[Shake Appeal]

Some players I think might make these poor decisions sometimes, but the differences in my chelsea save and my morecambe save shouldnt be similair.

Well there'll likely always be a fundamental obstacle that isn't SI's fault... artificial intelligence. Showing the difference between a player with Finishing 20 and Finishing 8 is an easy problem, because you just make one shot more accurate and powerful than another; it's a relatively simple task of probabilistic plotting in a 3D space. But showing the difference between a player with Decisions 20 and Decisions 8 is really, really ****ing hard, because the correct 'Decision' in any situation is contextual, subjective, and argued over even among human players and observers, let alone a set of programming instructions masquerading as players. They have the problem of not only making players as smart as possible, artificially, but portraying a range of 'smartness' that is realistic at every level. I don't envy that.

[Bad_Religion]

After playing ~30 games on Full, these are my issues with the ME as it stands:

1. Ratings in general are a little too tough, or morale too closely and too quickly tracks with the ratings, or both.

While this is fine in principle, too many game systems are linked to the player ratings, and the result is wild morale swings and strange assessments/valuations of players. Couple this with the 'nerfing' of a lot of the player talks on morale, and you're more at the whims of players' moods than ever. And it's particularly cruel to particular positions.

2. Shot selection is poor.

While the shot count is arguably a little too high, the quality of those shots is generally bad. The foremost problem is strikers shooting as soon as they get sight of goal, especially when there is space for them to take the ball into. So they will get free at the top of the box from a through ball and shoot from 20 yards when there is ample space to take the ball to the penalty spot and make the chance more certain. At its worst, I've seen a player on a clear breakaway shoot from the edge of the centre circle with no defenders ahead of him.

Remember when you last saw a striker opt not to shoot at first and instead round the goalkeeper to tuck it in from close distance in FM14? Me neither.

3. The Match Engine favours CCCs, but doesn't know what they are.

It seems like CCCs are more likely to be scored than any other shot, which is obviously right, but how the game assesses whether a chance is 'clear' is suspect, or at least the depiction of it in-game is, which makes it jarring and frustrating for the human user. In particular, when coupled with the poor shot selection above, strikers seem to miss their best opportunities with greater than usual frequency, even as their shots per game and shots on target ratio stay credible. This may be because they aren't, in the game's eyes, actual clear cut chances. But they look that way to the user, so they annoy.

4. Strikers miss chances, strikers rate poorly, strikers suffer overall.

Because strikers are firing in a lot of tame efforts from range rather than being incisive, the game thinks they're doing worse than they are. Combined with point 1., above, they frequently receive lower ratings than they deserve unless they score or assist, even if all their other match stats are fine. And because strikers have a unique extra pressure through game mechanics that hurt their morale for not scoring regularly, they suffer more overall than any other position except full backs at the moment. Check your league's highest average rated players and see how many of them are strikers. Now check how many of them are wide men or wingers. Which brings me to...

5. Attacking wide play is overpowered, because full backs don't know where to be.

This is the most bitched-about aspect of the ME at present, with good reason. Exposed full backs (that is, full backs not supported by defensive midfielders or other wide players tracking back) don't know where to be much of the time. They close down when they should stand off and stand off when they should close down, often dashing back just in time to play a striker onside. Contrary to a lot of what's said here, they seem to have no problem making tackles. What they particularly struggle with is blocking crosses, shepherding players wide, and slowing down attacking runs to allow other players to get back. I don't know whether they lack these things in their in-game toolkit, or whether SI were overzealous in addressing their inflated ratings in earlier versions of the game by making them flatly suck, but yeah, they suck. If your team doesn't have wingers or inside forwards running at corners of the back four, you're playing with a handicap.

Curiously, it seems to be a particular problem for olayers in the DL and DR positions, while WBLs/WBRs and players who play as lone MLs/MRs (e.g. as defensive wingers) struggle less.

As a (related?) aside, it's particularly difficult to unpick a defence head on with a through ball on the ground (which is a shame, because these are among the most beautiful goals in the game when they happen), and players tend to go wide because it's the path of least resistance. This could all just be deceptive because strikers regularly fluff seemingly simple chances in the box, though. Central play seems to be running uphill.

(By the by, wing backs and wingers attacking the box at a diagonal still struggle with making the right decision [as the user sees it] to shoot, cross, or just turn around and pass 30 yards back to midfield. But this has been an occasional issue in the ME for years, and isn't new to FM14.)

6. Set pieces are a mixed bag.

At direct free kicks, players rarely hit a placed shot that curls toward the corners of the goal. Instead they just blaze away, and the result usually flies harmlessly high and wide. At indirect free kicks, the shot is often drilled low and weak into the first defender. Ditto with corners. As many people have noted, these underhit set pieces also result in a disproportionate amount of corners scored at the near post, either from a header, or because the defender at the near post doesn't know what to do when it falls in front of them, and the attacking players are handed an easy tap-in.

7. Goalkeepers spill weak shots, hold powerful ones.

This is almost certainly just a bundle of different animation issues, but it's a disconnect for the human user when top-corner rockets are plucked from the air, while weak striker one-on-ones (see above) are spilled around the box. This may be tied to how the game assesses chances: see above. As an aside, goalkeepers are still really, really bad at handling accidentally over-hit crosses that land on the crossbar.

8. Players still regularly pass it out of play under no pressure, and goalkeeprs now carry the ball out of the box for good measure.

Needs little explanation, but it's particularly egregious among players who've got to the byline and are debating what to do next. I'm not sure whether they're trying to pass it off a defender for a corner, but whatever it is, it's not working. The goalkeeper thing is similarly jarring. If these errors happened once in a blue moon they'd actually make the game feel more realistic (because these things do happen in reality), but their frequency in FM reminds the user that this isn't real football.

...

Just about everything else is the best it's ever been, and when I watch matches on Extended instead of Full, I can honestly say it's the most convincing simulation of football yet.

Pretty much spot on.

Defending (fullbacks) issue seems to be everyone's biggest priority, but I could not highlight enough how "2. Shot selection is poor" and "6. Set pieces are a mixed bag" are annoying currently.

Hopefully, SI will be able to fix all these issues because I would hate it if they just fixed the most obvious ones like fullbacks and high number of shots while ignoring quite a few other important ones.

[nozshand]

Only agree to the morale issue, playing as arsenal. I have no trouble defending. After 29 league games played, I'm now on top with 65 pts, 62 goals with only 19 concedes. Giroud scored 19 goals out of 23 games he played. Only problem I'm having now is that my home record is significantly better than my away records. I lost 2 games with 7 draws away concedes 14 goals

[Svenc]

Potential bug, I dunno. But if you click on the "team instruction" button mid-game and confirm with "ok", what you don't get is the "cancel" button that appears before your changes are actually applied - usually when the ball is out of play/during stoppage time. Your new instruction just gets colored green and that's it.

I noticed that my d-line modifications didn't seem to have an effect assessing such until I clicked on my team's button and assessed the team instructions via the team tactics screen, rather than modifying the in-match "team instructions" you get to assess right in the match viewer. When I did the modifications there and confirmed, I was getting the "cancel pending changes" button you get after having made changes that weren't applied yet too.

Thoughts?

[Shake Appeal]

Only agree to the morale issue, playing as arsenal. I have no trouble defending. After 29 league games played, I'm now on top with 65 pts, 62 goals with only 19 concedes. Giroud scored 19 goals out of 23 games he played. Only problem I'm having now is that my home record is significantly better than my away records. I lost 2 games with 7 draws away concedes 14 goals

I'm second in my league with the best defensive record by some distance.

That fact is not incompatible with the goals I'm conceding being terrible goals of a reasonably consistent type, often caused by terrible positioning and closing down (or lack of closing down) by my full backs.

Potential bug, I dunno.

...

Thoughts?

Yep, I've experienced this lots of times. Sometimes substitutions don't go through either (if you go to the screen you'll see green and red marks next to the players you chose to substitute, but the same players are still on the field).

And yeah, as a rule I make sure 'Cancel Pending Changes' shows up to trust any instructions or subs have gone through.

[nozshand]

I'm second in my league with the best defensive record by some distance.

That fact is not incompatible with the goals I'm conceding being terrible goals of a reasonably consistent type, often caused by terrible positioning and closing down (or lack of closing down) by my full backs.

Yep, I've experienced this lots of times. Sometimes substitutions don't go through either (if you go to the screen you'll see green and red marks next to the players you chose to substitute, but the same players are still on the field).

And yeah, as a rule I make sure 'Cancel Pending Changes' shows up to trust any instructions or subs have gone through.

My understanding would be that the 3d match engine doesn't do a very good job of representing the background algorithm correctly. It could be that your full-backs simply got outplayed by your opponent but 3d match engine simply create a sloppy play scenario of random choosing.

[Svenc]

And yeah, as a rule I make sure 'Cancel Pending Changes' shows up to trust any instructions or subs have gone through.

"Glad" I'm not alone. Haven't played much so far, so I noticed this just now. Definitely new for FM 2014 though. Changing the shouts instructions of yore right from the match screen worked flawlessly though.

3d match engine simply create a sloppy play scenario of random choosing.

The ME isn't some kind of random scenario creator that creates play out of outcomes such as "show a goal" though. If that was the case, it wouldn't work any. It goes through play sequence by sequence. There are bugs, there are closing down and defending issues etc., occasionally bad 3d animations, but that's pretty much it.

[lpichette]

There are bugs, there are closing down and defending issues etc., occasionally bad 3d animations, but that's pretty much it.

I would disagree... Those are not the only issues. Player ratings are off...too low affecting player value and morale. Player decisions are off somehow...SI would only know how or why. just played 20 games and for some reason again this season I have had 6 long term inuries (over 6 weeks) in my last 12 games. I understand the soak test and all that. But im tired of being soaked with injuries. Two seasons in a row..cmon man.

[Aytumious]

Any news on when the update is going to come? Today? Tomorrow? This Week? Next Week?

The patch will be released when it is ready.

[valehannes]

This guy is 16 and hasn't achieved anything in football, so why does he feel that he deserves a raise from £90 p/w to £1300 p/w?

Because you want to hire him.

What is the point in valuing him at £65k if they want over £26m for him. How the hell does that make ANY sense? I've edited players to 200CA/PA and seen them leave for £900k (AI to AI), yet this player is nowhere near that level and they want stupid amounts for him.

Because the valuation is what the "game" thinks hes worth and the price asked is what the club thinks hes worth. Clearly the club doesn't want to sell.

Edit: The game doesn't recognise when you've been promoted. By this, I'm referring to players saying 'playing in Division 2' AFTER the season has ended and promotion has been secured.

You've not been promoted til you're promoted. That happens sometime in late june in epl.

[Jimmious7]

OK here's my opinion after playing a full season at the Second Division of Greece with a mediocre team:

- The interface is slick, the game has a great flow and generally everything except the ME...I like. A lot. Good job!

- However, the ME is so unrealistic currently that for my personal preferences...it's unplayable. And I will elaborate:

The amount of shots per match is ridiculously high. In average it was around 30-35 in this season for all the matches of my team. In real football the number is 15-20 even in the best leagues with the best teams. This happens mainly for two reasons I believe, having played all my matches with Extended Highlights:

a) Defenders are too passive. They let attackers come at them and rarely do you see them winning a ball with "their bodies" or tackle successfully or generally go first at the ball. Usually they wait and retreat in the area as the attackers come at them. And attackers dribble them A LOT.

b) Especially wing backs are pathetic. They don't know where they are, who they are marking and why. People are dribbling them as if they're training cones and they rarely are in a good position to start with. Also, as someone said nicely before me, it's not that they don't tackle per se but more that they can't do anything else...

There's a lot of work to be done with the ME and I'm really hoping for a solid patch soon, since I do enjoy everything else in the game a lot and I want to go back in

Cheers!

[jackob]

Really interested to find out how many of you play on 2d?

In principle, 2d for me is the ideal engine for the following reasons:

- tactical visibility

- still leaves something to the imagination

- means you don't have to watch your 25m striker stood still looking like a lost zombie (just an inevitable consequence of the 3D game's growing pains)

- is clearly impressionistic rather than 'realistic' - i.e. it is a depiction of the match. Meaning you, as a viewer, are not tempted to ask it questions which - until it is literally FIFA 2018's engine! - it could not possibly answer.

this said, it is all the more frustrating that the 2d ME, from a pure viewing pleasure/engagement perspective, seems to have gone backwards. Statistical quirks are not a strength of mine, but I will raise:

- the ball now appears to 'skid' around the 2D turf? this is a terrible shame

- shots seem to just 'roll over' the goalkeeper. very unsatisfying to watch on 2d. This was never the case before

- there is no sense of impact/percussion when players kick the ball now. It used to feel really impressive when Montolivo would curl one from 25 yards. Almost as if you could see his boots making contact with the ball...?!!?

- it seems to be harder to judge different degrees of ball height. This is a big blow to the clarity and enjoyment of the viewing experience. Where did this go?! The ball often seems 'glued' to the floor, even though I am sure on 3d it isn't.

A real shame. For the first time in 15 years of champ I may have to temporarily abort.

(Of course there is a bigger 'thought piece' here, which is around the ME as being 'figurative' (i.e. it literally attempts to show everything that happens as if it were a pure transcribed reality) or 'illustrative' (my preference, where the ME is supposed to ILLUSTRATE what your players did, and how the game pans/panned out.)

The first of these invites inevitably negative comparisons with dedicated 'figurative' MEs like Fifa or PES, the second is where I believe FM needs to be...and why my preference remains for 2d.

[PaulC]

Really interested to find out how many of you play on 2d?

In principle, 2d for me is the ideal engine for the following reasons:

- tactical visibility

- still leaves something to the imagination

- means you don't have to watch your 25m striker stood still looking like a lost zombie (just an inevitable consequence of the 3D game's growing pains)

- is clearly impressionistic rather than 'realistic' - i.e. it is a depiction of the match. Meaning you, as a viewer, are not tempted to ask it questions which - until it is literally FIFA 2018's engine! - it could not possibly answer.

this said, it is all the more frustrating that the 2d ME, from a pure viewing pleasure/engagement perspective, seems to have gone backwards. Statistical quirks are not a strength of mine, but I will raise:

- the ball now appears to 'skid' around the 2D turf? this is a terrible shame

- shots seem to just 'roll over' the goalkeeper. very unsatisfying to watch on 2d. This was never the case before

- there is no sense of impact/percussion when players kick the ball now. It used to feel really impressive when Montolivo would curl one from 25 yards. Almost as if you could see his boots making contact with the ball...?!!?

- it seems to be harder to judge different degrees of ball height. This is a big blow to the clarity and enjoyment of the viewing experience. Where did this go?! The ball often seems 'glued' to the floor, even though I am sure on 3d it isn't.

A real shame. For the first time in 15 years of champ I may have to temporarily abort.

(Of course there is a bigger 'thought piece' here, which is around the ME as being 'figurative' (i.e. it literally attempts to show everything that happens as if it were a pure transcribed reality) or 'illustrative' (my preference, where the ME is supposed to ILLUSTRATE what your players did, and how the game pans/panned out.)

The first of these invites inevitably negative comparisons with dedicated 'figurative' MEs like Fifa or PES, the second is where I believe FM needs to be...and why my preference remains for 2d.

2D classic or regular 2D?

[dsouthy]

2D classic or regular 2D?

I play 2D, sometimes swap between Classic and Regular. Never been a fan of 3D as it shows up bugs more. Never noticed any unplayable bugs like others on here...

[Gooner88]

Really interested to find out how many of you play on 2d?

In principle, 2d for me is the ideal engine for the following reasons:

- tactical visibility

- still leaves something to the imagination

- means you don't have to watch your 25m striker stood still looking like a lost zombie (just an inevitable consequence of the 3D game's growing pains)

- is clearly impressionistic rather than 'realistic' - i.e. it is a depiction of the match. Meaning you, as a viewer, are not tempted to ask it questions which - until it is literally FIFA 2018's engine! - it could not possibly answer.

this said, it is all the more frustrating that the 2d ME, from a pure viewing pleasure/engagement perspective, seems to have gone backwards. Statistical quirks are not a strength of mine, but I will raise:

- the ball now appears to 'skid' around the 2D turf? this is a terrible shame

- shots seem to just 'roll over' the goalkeeper. very unsatisfying to watch on 2d. This was never the case before

- there is no sense of impact/percussion when players kick the ball now. It used to feel really impressive when Montolivo would curl one from 25 yards. Almost as if you could see his boots making contact with the ball...?!!?

- it seems to be harder to judge different degrees of ball height. This is a big blow to the clarity and enjoyment of the viewing experience. Where did this go?! The ball often seems 'glued' to the floor, even though I am sure on 3d it isn't.

A real shame. For the first time in 15 years of champ I may have to temporarily abort.

(Of course there is a bigger 'thought piece' here, which is around the ME as being 'figurative' (i.e. it literally attempts to show everything that happens as if it were a pure transcribed reality) or 'illustrative' (my preference, where the ME is supposed to ILLUSTRATE what your players did, and how the game pans/panned out.)

The first of these invites inevitably negative comparisons with dedicated 'figurative' MEs like Fifa or PES, the second is where I believe FM needs to be...and why my preference remains for 2d.

I play on 2d for similar reasons and I agree with your points, particularly regarding ball height. Everything looks as if it is smashed across the floor and I don't think it was a problem in previous years.

[Brizza]

I play on 2d for similar reasons and I agree with your points, particularly regarding ball height. Everything looks as if it is smashed across the floor and I don't think it was a problem in previous years.

I'd second that. I always play 2D as I've found it easier to suspend my disbelief and skim over the slightly odd 3D animation. The number of "goals" that I've seen on this version that actually turned out to be the ball skimming over the bar is remarkable. I'd also second the "ball going straight through the keeper" thing too.

[frank_olaf]

What version of the database should the game being using? I started my save when the game was released (before the patch for 14.1.3) and Lewandowski is still set as joining Bayern in 2014. Was this updated in patch 14.1.3?

Thanks

[Jimmious7]

I hope I won't sound mean or offensive, but I don't think we should be looking at the 2D issues. It's an obsolete feature of the game and the focus should be (and probably is) in the 3D representation.

[milnerpoint]

I hope I won't sound mean or offensive, but I don't think we should be looking at the 2D issues. It's an obsolete feature of the game and the focus should be (and probably is) in the 3D representation.

Obsolete to who? Plenty people use the 2D engine.

[RTHerringbone]

I hope I won't sound mean or offensive, but I don't think we should be looking at the 2D issues. It's an obsolete feature of the game and the focus should be (and probably is) in the 3D representation.

I think you'd be surprised by how high a proportion of the user base use 2D.

[Richard76]

I hope I won't sound mean or offensive, but I don't think we should be looking at the 2D issues. It's an obsolete feature of the game and the focus should be (and probably is) in the 3D representation.

I think you'd be surprised how many people use 2D.

[Jimmious7]

I think you'd be surprised how many people use 2D.

I don't doubt that. I guess people also play without any visuals too. But still, with the ME having tremendous issues in the "main representation" which is the 3D one, I would expect the visual issues of the 2D to be "secondary". Well of course if SI is able to deal with everything at once, that's awesome

[milnerpoint]

I don't doubt that. I guess people also play without any visuals too. But still, with the ME having tremendous issues in the "main representation" which is the 3D one, I would expect the visual issues of the 2D to be "secondary". Well of course if SI is able to deal with everything at once, that's awesome

Why, because you use 3D more?

[RTHerringbone]

But still, with the ME having tremendous issues in the "main representation" which is the 3D one, I would expect the visual issues of the 2D to be "secondary".

The thing is, the representation of the ME, whether 2D or 3D will remain as it is until underlying match engine mechanics are fixed.

As such, the priority will be to fix the outstanding mechanical issues, which by default will ripple through to the front end graphical representations.

[thomas_e]

Even though graphics is not top priority in FM, I gotta say it has a really nice look this year. Gameplay isn't perfect yet, but I'm sure we will get there. Personally, I often use 2D when I'm not sure about how my tactic are working in specific situations, and when analyzing those situations 2D is great.

But for "normal" matches, I really like the 3D engine and for me that's the only way to play it now. But there are probably more players still using 2D than I would think.

Btw, is there any news on release date for the next patch? Really enjoying the game, but I don't feel that I'm playing the full game yet

[RTHerringbone]

Btw, is there any news on release date for the next patch? Really enjoying the game, but I don't feel that I'm playing the full game yet

Nope. PaulC mentioned a couple of days ago in this thread that there is no fixed date for the next update.

[thomas_e]

Nope. PaulC mentioned a couple of days ago in this thread that there is no fixed date for the next update.

Cheers for your quick reply, mate. Don't isolate your fullbacks, play wide along the wings and set your striker as a trequartista to make assist and not score goals for a bit more then and whats the option? Not play FM14 because it's not 100% yet.. like that's gonna happen!

[Babak G]

I think you'd be surprised by how high a proportion of the user base use 2D.

Having done a quick poll on the forum, it was just about 35%-40% who played 2D.

[luka_zg]

I used to play 3d since it was implemented in the game but last year I switched to 2D because of all the bugs so I don't see them and I can not go back to 3D now. I tried but to me 2D is just perfect and I don't think I'll ever go back to 3D.

[Ben Cary]

I play in 2d , on a black and white portable, occasionally snacking on my stockpile of marathon bars, I fear change.

[Jimmious7]

The thing is, the representation of the ME, whether 2D or 3D will remain as it is until underlying match engine mechanics are fixed.

As such, the priority will be to fix the outstanding mechanical issues, which by default will ripple through to the front end graphical representations.

This I agree with 100%

Number of shots per game for example doesn't have anything to do with the way you see them!

And chill out people, no problem with the 2D for me, you can enjoy it as much as you want. Just my 2 cents though, this year's 3D engine is very cool

[daylight]

I play in 2d , on a black and white portable, occasionally snacking on my stockpile of marathon bars, I fear change.

Haha, well played

[Lostsouls]

Out of all the issues (and to be honest the game is nowhere near as unplayable as some user are implying) there is only one that I'm a little bit bothered about and thats contracts for lower league players BSS/BSN as it's pretty impossible to offer longer contracts for players for more than 1 season and really makes it difficult to keep players and build your squad.

[jimbob1000]

Feel i have to mention this although i can already see the reply's.

Am in my 3rd season at Villa, i'm doing great so despite all the issues i can still manage to keep my save going.

My strikers are having to have 16 shots between them for every goal they score, whilst my midfield and defence are averaging a goal every 4 shots each.

As i said i'm in season 3 and it is getting progressively worse. I have Benteke and Bony up front and they have the lions share of the chances(10-20 shots a game between them) but rarely find the back of the net from the easiest of chances, yet my defenders and midfielders are tucking these chances away at a much better rate, so there is a obvious and blatant issue here.

I'm even considering dropping the forwards for AMC's just to guarantee myself a few more goals.

[theking1]

Just to clarify folks....The bugs are still there in 2d just not seeing any dodgy animations to compound the bugs

[Nikopol]

Just to clarify folks....The bugs are still there in 2d just not seeing any dodgy animations to compound the bugs

I feel the other way around. Many things look like bugs because of the dodgy animations even though the things that happen on the pitch are authentic. Taking a look at some situations in 2D shows you that a lot of times it's the graphical limitations *of 3D that makes a few things look like a bug.

[Sunstrikuuu]

Out of all the issues (and to be honest the game is nowhere near as unplayable as some user are implying) there is only one that I'm a little bit bothered about and thats contracts for lower league players BSS/BSN as it's pretty impossible to offer longer contracts for players for more than 1 season and really makes it difficult to keep players and build your squad.

I think contracts are a bit odd at all levels. Looking at renegotiating contracts with Arsenal bonuses seem really weird. Consider:

Szczesny's appearance fee doubles. His unused substitute fee goes up more than tenfold. His clean sheet bonus triples. That's in 2014, in the last year of his deal.

Koscielny's appearance fee increases from £10k to £25.5k. His clean sheet bonus is basically the same. His unused substitute fee increases more than sixfold. He has three years left on his existing contract.

Vermaelen's appearance fee increases by a third. His clean sheet bonus triples. His unused substitute fee is essentially unchanged. He's in the last year of his deal and featured fewer than 20 times in the 13-14 season.

Gibbs's appearance fee doubles. His goal bonus increases by half. His clean sheet bonus increases slightly. His unused substitute fee increases sevenfold. His salary increases a little bit, but his squad status decreases to Backup. He has four years left on his contract and started regularly in the previous season.

Ramsey's contract doesn't have anything too egregious, though his appearance fee nearly doubles. He has four years left on his deal and appeared thirty times in 13-14.

Oxlade-Chamberlain's appearance fee quadruples. His goal bonus triples. His unused substitute fee increases more than tenfold. His base salary doubles. He has four years left on his existing deal.

Ozil's fees increase, though none especially insanely except for the appearance fee which nearly doubles. His wage increases by a third and his squad status drops. He has four years left on his existing deal.

Giroud's appearance fee triples. His goal bonus triples. His unused substitute fee increases tenfold. He has two years left on his deal.

Podolski won't negotiate since I've pissed him off. That one's entirely my fault.

Monreal wants to increase his appearance fee by half, his clean sheet bonus by half and his unused substitute fee from £1.7k to £11k. He wants an increase in wage and a decrease in squad status from First Team to Backup. He has three years left.

Walcott wants to quintuple his appearance fee and goal bonus. He also wants to increase his unused substitute fee from £5k to £36k. He wants an increase in wage and a decrease in status from Key Player to Rotation. He has two years left.

Mertesacker wants to more than triple his appearance fee and his clean sheet bonus. He also wants a ninefold increase in unused substitute fee. He has one year left on his deal.

Arteta wants both a pay cut and a squad status decrease. Despite that he wants to more than double his appearance fee and quintuple his unused substitute fee. He has one year left on his deal.

Cazorla's demands aren't that odd, though he wants to triple his goal bonus and double his appearance fee. He has two years left.

Wilshere wants to decrease his squad status and increase his wages. He also wants to more than triple his goal bonus, increase his unused substitute fee eightfold and quadruple his appearance fee. He has four years left.

I'm willing to check other teams on request. But this falls in line with my feeling that the biggest problems with the game are financial calculations. I know there are examples of players getting paid more than £50k appearance fees or £20k as unused substitutes, but those players are getting paid £450k a week. The idea of a player asking for £40k to appear in a match while getting £80k a week is ludicrous.

[Pelz]

I think contracts are a bit odd at all levels. Looking at renegotiating contracts with Arsenal bonuses seem really weird. Consider:

Szczesny's appearance fee doubles. His unused substitute fee goes up more than tenfold. His clean sheet bonus triples. That's in 2014, in the last year of his deal.

Koscielny's appearance fee increases from £10k to £25.5k. His clean sheet bonus is basically the same. His unused substitute fee increases more than sixfold. He has three years left on his existing contract.

Vermaelen's appearance fee increases by a third. His clean sheet bonus triples. His unused substitute fee is essentially unchanged. He's in the last year of his deal and featured fewer than 20 times in the 13-14 season.

Gibbs's appearance fee doubles. His goal bonus increases by half. His clean sheet bonus increases slightly. His unused substitute fee increases sevenfold. His salary increases a little bit, but his squad status decreases to Backup. He has four years left on his contract and started regularly in the previous season.

Ramsey's contract doesn't have anything too egregious, though his appearance fee nearly doubles. He has four years left on his deal and appeared thirty times in 13-14.

Oxlade-Chamberlain's appearance fee quadruples. His goal bonus triples. His unused substitute fee increases more than tenfold. His base salary doubles. He has four years left on his existing deal.

Ozil's fees increase, though none especially insanely except for the appearance fee which nearly doubles. His wage increases by a third and his squad status drops. He has four years left on his existing deal.

Giroud's appearance fee triples. His goal bonus triples. His unused substitute fee increases tenfold. He has two years left on his deal.

Podolski won't negotiate since I've pissed him off. That one's entirely my fault.

Monreal wants to increase his appearance fee by half, his clean sheet bonus by half and his unused substitute fee from £1.7k to £11k. He wants an increase in wage and a decrease in squad status from First Team to Backup. He has three years left.

Walcott wants to quintuple his appearance fee and goal bonus. He also wants to increase his unused substitute fee from £5k to £36k. He wants an increase in wage and a decrease in status from Key Player to Rotation. He has two years left.

Mertesacker wants to more than triple his appearance fee and his clean sheet bonus. He also wants a ninefold increase in unused substitute fee. He has one year left on his deal.

Arteta wants both a pay cut and a squad status decrease. Despite that he wants to more than double his appearance fee and quintuple his unused substitute fee. He has one year left on his deal.

Cazorla's demands aren't that odd, though he wants to triple his goal bonus and double his appearance fee. He has two years left.

Wilshere wants to decrease his squad status and increase his wages. He also wants to more than triple his goal bonus, increase his unused substitute fee eightfold and quadruple his appearance fee. He has four years left.

I'm willing to check other teams on request. But this falls in line with my feeling that the biggest problems with the game are financial calculations. I know there are examples of players getting paid more than £50k appearance fees or £20k as unused substitutes, but those players are getting paid £450k a week. The idea of a player asking for £40k to appear in a match while getting £80k a week is ludicrous.

Sadly it's as bad in the lower leagues... Currently playing with Aldershot in Skrill Premier - when it comes to renegotiation of contracts players often want appearance fees equivalent to half of their weekly wage and in most cases a huge increase in overall wages whilst only being prepared to sign one year extensions. Then the process repeats itself next season, so you end up releasing all your better players unable to afford their wages only to then find them signing for clubs of lesser stature (quite often division below) on a quarter of what they were asking you for... It's ridiculous. The same goes for a lot of free agents (though not all)... the amount of times i've gone in for a players, offered a contract at the high end this standard of football can offer, only for him to go sign for half if not less the wages at a lesser club is beyond count now.. Makes building long term squads nigh on impossible.

[Babak G]

Have the AI transfer bids been fixed in 14.1.3? I thought they were but Im receiving low ball offers. Getting bids of 500k for a player worth 3.2m plus and 1.8m for a player 4.5m plus in pre-season of second season.

[Macshimmy]

Makes building long term squads nigh on impossible.

Here's Neil Lennon's rather inspired solution in my game; allow other clubs to handle the crazy bonuses:

http://i1043.photobucket.com/albums/b439/macshimidh/celtic_feeder.png

[Pelz]

Here's Neil Lennon's rather inspired solution in my game; allow other clubs to handle the crazy bonuses:

http://i1043.photobucket.com/albums/b439/macshimidh/celtic_feeder.png

Haha, that's certainly one way to do it! Sadly loan restrictions may stop me from implementing this little bit of genius!

[Chris21]

Be nice if we got a progress update from SI now...The full game has been out over a week yet no news.

Don't get me wrong I'm happy to wait and continue to play but given the issues it would be nice to hear some kind of update about the update.

[Babak G]

Uploading my save game right now and its called Rovers New Beta.

QPR just made a bid for Rochina and its 1.8m and he's valued at 4.5m.

Ive negotiated and mentioned he's worth 6.5m (still a low fee IMO) and they will revert back to me.

In fact, Im sure you will receive 1-2 offers for some of my other players in the next few days too and you can check it out by even offering players out.

[Ben Kenney]

I think contracts are a bit odd at all levels. Looking at renegotiating contracts with Arsenal bonuses seem really weird. Consider:

Szczesny's appearance fee doubles. His unused substitute fee goes up more than tenfold. His clean sheet bonus triples. That's in 2014, in the last year of his deal.

Koscielny's appearance fee increases from £10k to £25.5k. His clean sheet bonus is basically the same. His unused substitute fee increases more than sixfold. He has three years left on his existing contract.

Vermaelen's appearance fee increases by a third. His clean sheet bonus triples. His unused substitute fee is essentially unchanged. He's in the last year of his deal and featured fewer than 20 times in the 13-14 season.

Gibbs's appearance fee doubles. His goal bonus increases by half. His clean sheet bonus increases slightly. His unused substitute fee increases sevenfold. His salary increases a little bit, but his squad status decreases to Backup. He has four years left on his contract and started regularly in the previous season.

Ramsey's contract doesn't have anything too egregious, though his appearance fee nearly doubles. He has four years left on his deal and appeared thirty times in 13-14.

Oxlade-Chamberlain's appearance fee quadruples. His goal bonus triples. His unused substitute fee increases more than tenfold. His base salary doubles. He has four years left on his existing deal.

Ozil's fees increase, though none especially insanely except for the appearance fee which nearly doubles. His wage increases by a third and his squad status drops. He has four years left on his existing deal.

Giroud's appearance fee triples. His goal bonus triples. His unused substitute fee increases tenfold. He has two years left on his deal.

Podolski won't negotiate since I've pissed him off. That one's entirely my fault.

Monreal wants to increase his appearance fee by half, his clean sheet bonus by half and his unused substitute fee from £1.7k to £11k. He wants an increase in wage and a decrease in squad status from First Team to Backup. He has three years left.

Walcott wants to quintuple his appearance fee and goal bonus. He also wants to increase his unused substitute fee from £5k to £36k. He wants an increase in wage and a decrease in status from Key Player to Rotation. He has two years left.

Mertesacker wants to more than triple his appearance fee and his clean sheet bonus. He also wants a ninefold increase in unused substitute fee. He has one year left on his deal.

Arteta wants both a pay cut and a squad status decrease. Despite that he wants to more than double his appearance fee and quintuple his unused substitute fee. He has one year left on his deal.

Cazorla's demands aren't that odd, though he wants to triple his goal bonus and double his appearance fee. He has two years left.

Wilshere wants to decrease his squad status and increase his wages. He also wants to more than triple his goal bonus, increase his unused substitute fee eightfold and quadruple his appearance fee. He has four years left.

I'm willing to check other teams on request. But this falls in line with my feeling that the biggest problems with the game are financial calculations. I know there are examples of players getting paid more than £50k appearance fees or £20k as unused substitutes, but those players are getting paid £450k a week. The idea of a player asking for £40k to appear in a match while getting £80k a week is ludicrous.

If you have a save game which shows such demands then I would love to have a look.

Details on how to upload can be found here - http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/368795

[rooneyviet]

I play 2d too, but 2d ME is the same with 3d ME :-<

[Kriss]

Be nice if we got a progress update from SI now...The full game has been out over a week yet no news.

Don't get me wrong I'm happy to wait and continue to play but given the issues it would be nice to hear some kind of update about the update.

You've been here since 2007 and you still don't get it?

There's nothing to update until the next update is ready, when it is it'll be out there so quick there won't even be time to tell you it's ready

[Alekos]

You've been here since 2007 and you still don't get it?

There's nothing to update until the next update is ready, when it is it'll be out there so quick there won't even be time to tell you it's ready

Well to tell you the truth I don't get it either..I can understand you don't set a date because if you fail to provide the patch the specific date most people here will start moaning..But it is better to tell us(of course you are not obliged to) how you are going and where you stand(something similar has happend last year as far as I can remember)..For example you could say we are close to solve most of bugs raised but we need some more time and hope till the end of this week or the other(fingers crossed)patch will be out..This will also make people stop asking when and where all the time..

[Chris21]

You've been here since 2007 and you still don't get it?

There's nothing to update until the next update is ready, when it is it'll be out there so quick there won't even be time to tell you it's ready

Ummm I've seen PaulC give updates on how updates are going plenty of times? I remember last year a ME update was delayed and he came on and explained why which was great and fair play to him for that and most of us appreciated that despite the update was delayed. All I'm saying is the game has officially been out over a week now and we have no clue on how things are going which is unfortunate.

[themadsheep2001]

Ummm I've seen PaulC give updates on how updates are going plenty of times? I remember last year a ME update was delayed and he came on and explained why which was great and fair play to him for that and most of us appreciated that despite the update was delayed. All I'm saying is the game has officially been out over a week now and we have no clue on how things are going which is unfortunate.

Paul has actually spoken about this already, check back through the thread. He's not going to pop in every 5 minutes saying "not there yet".

When its ready, SI will release it. That is all we know right now

[YKW]

I feel the other way around. Many things look like bugs because of the dodgy animations even though the things that happen on the pitch are authentic. Taking a look at some situations in 2D shows you that a lot of times it's the graphical limitations *of 3D that makes a few things look like a bug.

Yes I feel this way entirely.

A great example is with the GKs. They dive, make a save, and then stand up. However, while they are getting up they are still sliding with the momentum of the save. Makes it look strange, but doesn't change anything about the game.