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Neil Brock

Football Manager 2014 - Full Game Feedback/Tilbakemelding 14.1.3

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My girlfriend has just told me I should have waited until Christmas to get the game as all the bugs may have been solved by then - for the first time I am thinking she may be right and I should have waited a couple of months!!!

You can never tell, the first beta SI released was pretty good fun, the only problem I had was too many goals, of course they changed this and it had knock on effects, the next update could (we hope) fix the other problems that have cropped up, this game still has the potential to be the best ever, lets see what the next update brings.

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I thought about the internet connection too, but I haven't encountered any other problems, so discounted that (even worked from home all day with no issues and need to be connected to do that!)

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You can never tell, the first beta SI released was pretty good fun, the only problem I had was too many goals, of course they changed this and it had knock on effects, the next update could (we hope) fix the other problems that have cropped up, this game still has the potential to be the best ever, lets see what the next update brings.

Yeah, the first BETA was the best version of this game yet. Only issues I had was too many goals and terrible finishing.

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In my second season and come the end of September I notice all of the players who got promoted into the under 19 squad haven't played any games since the pre season friendlies. I haven't touched their statuses or moved them between my squads of anything and my u19s have been playing games.

If I then go through each player and select to make available for the u19s then they seem to start playing. Isn't just being in the u19 squad enough any more?

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I thought about the internet connection too, but I haven't encountered any other problems, so discounted that (even worked from home all day with no issues and need to be connected to do that!)

On steam try changing your setting to a neighboring country. Maybe the steam server in your country is having a bit of problem if your connection is fast usually but your download is slow on steam.

You can do that by going into settings>download>download region

I was having a similar problem, the server in my country was super slow then I switched to a german server and it went 10x faster.

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Actually, it was probably my team selection. I forgot to reinsert a key player who'd been suspended and had a green replacement, who made a couple of horrible mistakes that allowed the last minute goal in the first match and at least one of the three goals in the second match.

Maybe I should suggest an Ass Man function that reminds the user that a player has returned from injury or suspension prior to submitting your team. Something like "John Smith is now available for selection again after his suspension. Bob White is also match fit after his recent injury. Are you sure you wish to submit your team?"

There used to be a message stating a player had returned to full training, was it taken out?

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We get too accustomed to winning by the end of a previous iteration of FM. Either we've designed a tactic the ME can't cope with, hoovered up all the world's great players, and/or seen many of the AI teams sink into shadows of their former selves. We forget that sport is random and get addicted to patterns. If those patterns don't appear in the next FM (and they won't, at least at first, because many of the flaws that allowed them will have been fixed), we cry foul and broken......

Which, according to your logic, only becomes true at the release of the following years iteration! This argument never ceases to amuse me.

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AI vs tactics no idea but I do know that if your tactics look faulty use the analysis, OK so I’m Luton I won promotion last year and I have won the division two title by a fair way this season, 96 goals for and 36 against, tidy attacking and defending, yet in my last 14 games I’ve won only three and drawn 11 so here is my analysis of those last 14 games.

Left hand sides Luton, right hand sides opposition in all columns

[TABLE=class: MsoNormalTable]

[TR]

[TD][/TD]

[TD]Score[/TD]

[TD=width: 56, bgcolor: transparent]Shots[/TD]

[TD=width: 52, bgcolor: transparent]On target[/TD]

[TD=width: 52, bgcolor: transparent]off target[/TD]

[TD=width: 51, bgcolor: transparent]blocked[/TD]

[TD=width: 56, bgcolor: transparent]woodwork[/TD]

[TD=width: 49, bgcolor: transparent]CCC[/TD]

[TD=width: 49, bgcolor: transparent]HC[/TD]

[TD=width: 59, bgcolor: transparent]Long shots[/TD]

[TD=width: 51, bgcolor: transparent]saved[/TD]

[TD=width: 57, bgcolor: transparent]Possession[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=width: 91, bgcolor: transparent]Totals[/TD]

[TD=width: 51, bgcolor: transparent]23-17[/TD]

[TD=width: 56, bgcolor: transparent]236-120[/TD]

[TD=width: 52, bgcolor: transparent]101-59[/TD]

[TD=width: 52, bgcolor: transparent]100-47[/TD]

[TD=width: 51, bgcolor: transparent]33-16[/TD]

[TD=width: 56, bgcolor: transparent]13-11[/TD]

[TD=width: 49, bgcolor: transparent]18-17[/TD]

[TD=width: 49, bgcolor: transparent]44-23[/TD]

[TD=width: 59, bgcolor: transparent]79-45[/TD]

[TD=width: 51, bgcolor: transparent]77-41[/TD]

[TD=width: 57, bgcolor: transparent]58.14[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR]

[TD=width: 91, bgcolor: transparent]Average per game[/TD]

[TD=width: 51, bgcolor: transparent]1.64-1.21[/TD]

[TD=width: 56, bgcolor: transparent]16.85-8.57[/TD]

[TD=width: 52, bgcolor: transparent]7.21-4.21[/TD]

[TD=width: 52, bgcolor: transparent]7.14-3.35[/TD]

[TD=width: 51, bgcolor: transparent]2.35-1.14[/TD]

[TD=width: 56, bgcolor: transparent]0.92-0.78[/TD]

[TD=width: 49, bgcolor: transparent]1.28-1.21[/TD]

[TD=width: 49, bgcolor: transparent]3.14-1.64[/TD]

[TD=width: 59, bgcolor: transparent]5.64-3.21[/TD]

[TD=width: 51, bgcolor: transparent]5.5-2.92[/TD]

[TD=width: 57, bgcolor: transparent][/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

Possession 58.14 over the 14 games, fairly dominant I would say but as you can see I’ve only managed 23 goals for and 17 against, However, I’m getting in twice as many shots, 79 of the 236 were long despite my instructions not to shoot long but in fairness it’s not much different from the teams I’ve faced, 2.98 per game as opposed to 2.66 per game. My on target ratio is 7.21 against 4.21, off target its 7.14 against 3.35, Blocked its 2.35 against 1.14, Hit the woodwork 0.92 against 0.78, all pretty much what you would expect as I’m getting off twice as many shots. CCCs now here is the rub 1.28 against 1.21, half chances a different story 3.14 against 1.64, getting on for twice as many, then there is shots saved 5.64 against 3.21. So in reality I’m dominating every game except in regards CCC, to me that doesn’t make sense, my keeper and defence are good they must be the opposition is not getting that many chances, my attackers must be good I’ve won the league and I’m not just getting shots away I’m making the opposition GKs work hard every game, so all you folks who say the answer is in the analysis pick that one apart.

CCCs: Thanks to OPTA, we know that most players convert less than 50% of their CCCs. Of the 33 players having 10 or more CCCs in last season's EPL, only 8 scored with 50% or more of them. In contrast, 11 converted 30% or less. Further, some strikers are almost completely reliant on CCCs for their goals, normally Target Man or Poacher types. As we've explained in these forums for FM13, that is one reason why they generally don't make good lone forwards. In contrast, as page two of the article illustrates, more complete strikers can fashion chances out of nothing.

In this Guardian article, OPTA even go so far as to determine a probability conversion for each chance. In a match in which Newcastle outshot Reading by 16 to 7 and had 56% of possession, they lost 2-1. The OPTA analyst suggests that Reading deserved to win, for they had the two best chances in the match with a 49% and 69% probability of conversion, compared to Newcastle's best chance, which had a 34% probability. In actuality, Reading won because they scored from a 17% probability chance. Across the match the data suggested Reading should score 1.6 goals and Newcastle 1.4, so the 2-1 result was a fair one. Whereas FM doesn't yet have that level of analysis, an educated subjective eye on the match analysis screen should be a good substitute.

Possession: Thanks to OPTA stats and The Guardian, we have exact knowledge of how often a team wins when having more possession (57%) and more shots (71%). Even if you always dominate the shot count, over a 60 match season you should expect to fail to win circa 18 times. Obviously, you will win some matches very easily. The key to being good at FM is not those matches, but reducing this 30-40% figure to one that will ensure you win some trophies.

Basically, if you are winning roughly 7 out of 10 matches across all your seasons when you have more shots and are converting between 40 and 50% of your CCCs, then there's no issue here. There is, of course, more to football than possession and shot counts, which you need to take on board to move beyond your current analytical approach.

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Which, according to your logic, only becomes true at the release of the following years iteration! This argument never ceases to amuse me.

I have no idea what point you are trying to make.

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So how's the new Fm2014 v Fm2013 in terms of transfers (wasnt this supposed to be much improved?), ME & tactics ?.

Whats better or worse?. Im still mulling over whether to buy the new one after buying every previous version......

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There used to be a message stating a player had returned to full training, was it taken out?

That is only for injuries (hence the full training bit) There is none for suspensions, unless i've missed it in Fm14. It certainly wasn't for 13

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Critizising player form now has no visible effect on morale whatsoever. Maybe there's a morale change too tiny to bring it to a new level, but there's no visible effect anyway. So this feature appears to have been reduced to the point of uselessness, or "nerfed" as they say.

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Critizising player form now has no visible effect on morale whatsoever. Maybe there's a morale change too tiny to bring it to a new level, but there's no visible effect anyway. So this feature appears to have been reduced to the point of uselessness, or "nerfed" as they say.

This is part of why the low/average morale brought about by low/average player ratings is so punishing; we have fewer obvious tools to address it than we did one version of the game ago.

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I know there are some 'issues' regarding ratings, shots etc not sure about transfers (I play with the first window off). But I've found a pretty big bug which needs fixing ASAP, playing against Man Utd and Ashley Young didn't dive once! Please, please, please sort this out.

Aside from that loving the game.

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CCCs: Thanks to OPTA, we know that most players convert less than 50% of their CCCs. Of the 33 players having 10 or more CCCs in last season's EPL, only 8 scored with 50% or more of them. In contrast, 11 converted 30% or less. Further, some strikers are almost completely reliant on CCCs for their goals, normally Target Man or Poacher types. As we've explained in these forums for FM13, that is one reason why they generally don't make good lone forwards. In contrast, as page two of the article illustrates, more complete strikers can fashion chances out of nothing.

In this Guardian article, OPTA even go so far as to determine a probability conversion for each chance. In a match in which Newcastle outshot Reading by 16 to 7 and had 56% of possession, they lost 2-1. The OPTA analyst suggests that Reading deserved to win, for they had the two best chances in the match with a 49% and 69% probability of conversion, compared to Newcastle's best chance, which had a 34% probability. In actuality, Reading won because they scored from a 17% probability chance. Across the match the data suggested Reading should score 1.6 goals and Newcastle 1.4, so the 2-1 result was a fair one. Whereas FM doesn't yet have that level of analysis, an educated subjective eye on the match analysis screen should be a good substitute.

Possession: Thanks to OPTA stats and The Guardian, we have exact knowledge of how often a team wins when having more possession (57%) and more shots (71%). Even if you always dominate the shot count, over a 60 match season you should expect to fail to win circa 18 times. Obviously, you will win some matches very easily. The key to being good at FM is not those matches, but reducing this 30-40% figure to one that will ensure you win some trophies.

Basically, if you are winning roughly 7 out of 10 matches across all your seasons when you have more shots and are converting between 40 and 50% of your CCCs, then there's no issue here. There is, of course, more to football than possession and shot counts, which you need to take on board to move beyond your current analytical approach.

Now that is a good post and I take your points, however I would say that.

1 I always try and pick strikers that are more complete forwards, my results pre the update bear that out, remember I have won league two by a substantial margin 17 points in fact and scored 93 goals.

2 While my CCCs are only just above those of my opponents in those 14 matches I had twice as many half chances I would suggest that in real life some of those would be converted and consequently I would have won more games.

3 playing in league two my guess would be that my opponents have no better strikers than I have, yet in those 14 games their CCC rate was almost the same as mine but with far less shooting opportunities.

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does OPTA say that most games result in 60% + possession, 37 shots at goal, 30 of them on target, for 0 goals ?

Because that is what happens. Game after Game.

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Now that is a good post and I take your points, however I would say that.

1 I always try and pick strikers that are more complete forwards, my results pre the update bear that out, remember I have won league two by a substantial margin 17 points in fact and scored 93 goals.

2 While my CCCs are only just above those of my opponents in those 14 matches I had twice as many half chances I would suggest that in real life some of those would be converted and consequently I would have won more games.

3 playing in league two my guess would be that my opponents have no better strikers than I have, yet in those 14 games their CCC rate was almost the same as mine but with far less shooting opportunities.

I am not defending the game here, because with the imbalances that SI has already recognized we cannot take the realism of the engine at face value, but what all the "defenders/apologists" of the game are trying to get across is that the Shot/at goal/ccc conversion rate (both for and against) is a tactical issue and may in fact work rather well despite the ME's flaws. However, what 23 pages of feedback and discussion has showed, if we look critically at them, is that most of the critique indicate a loss of immersion and/or helplessness to cope with what is seen in the match engine.

I feel that SI should at this point not dismiss the criticism as a) lack of understanding of the game/football or b) a bedding-in period to new functionalities and a more challenging AI/ME. It might be that, but it could also be flaws in the game causing this. The fact that there are documented imbalances in the game currently suggests the latter.

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Really love this years edition by the way. Started my first save three days ago, got sacked in March haha. But I deserved it, 9th place with Man United, pfff.

But great game. Seems to run very smoothly. Interaction is much better this year. The only little criticism I would have is that I don't like the fact that they have simplified the Board Confidence screen. I've always used that as the ultimate way to check how I am performing as a manager. Maybe it's just a case of me not being able to find it, but is has become less detailed. Which is a shame.

But other than that, great edition.

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How do I get a loan report?

Right-click a loaned out player and there it should say "Get match reports" somewhere. When a player gets loaned out and you get a message confirming that, there is also a "get match reports" button. Furthermore, your assistant should give you timely loan reports in which all your loaned out players are reported on.

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Have posted a lot of bugs and pkm's to SI for making the ME a lot better but any news how you guys doing so far? Any ETA yet? Can we expect an patch this month? Tactics are working now for me but defending is still a pain in my ass

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I am not defending the game here, because with the imbalances that SI has already recognized we cannot take the realism of the engine at face value, but what all the "defenders/apologists" of the game are trying to get across is that the Shot/at goal/ccc conversion rate (both for and against) is a tactical issue and may in fact work rather well despite the ME's flaws. However, what 23 pages of feedback and discussion has showed, if we look critically at them, is that most of the critique indicate a loss of immersion and/or helplessness to cope with what is seen in the match engine.

I feel that SI should at this point not dismiss the criticism as a) lack of understanding of the game/football or b) a bedding-in period to new functionalities and a more challenging AI/ME. It might be that, but it could also be flaws in the game causing this. The fact that there are documented imbalances in the game currently suggests the latter.

Indeed and I think you may well be right, overall I like the game, I certainly don’t think it’s a turkey and the more realism the better as far as I’m concerned. The point of my posts has been to point out where I feel the ME is not quite right. There are far too many shots, players make too many sliding tackles and don’t press the play enough, instructing players to get tight is a bit of a disaster if the ME doesn’t allow them to do so, the ratings are out and the analysis should be helping managers to see how to make corrections to improve match performance, whether that’s by indicating how to tighten up tactically or by indicating where the team needs to be strengthened, I’m not convinced it’s doing this.

CCCs is a in case of point, watching the game lots of shots going in, while GKs appear to be superman clones able to leap from one side of the goal to the other to save a well struck shot from six yards on a regular basis doesn’t fill you with confidence that the CCCs are being calculated correctly, for most players of the game if you can’t make head or tail of the analysis or its not instructive enough then all you are left with is the evidence of your own eyes, it’s a fiendishly difficult thing for the developers to get right and some people would be wise to remember that, the developers certainly have my sympathy, the coding is immensely complex and changes in one place have a knock on effect..

As I indicated in an earlier post, mostly what separates the good teams from the bad is the quality of their players, technically, mentally and physically, tactics are second to that. Tactics come far more into play with equally, matched teams or a lesser team looking for a result against a team with a stronger group of players, the best managers are those that can combine the right tactics and players, knowing when to stick with a plan and when to change it and how big those changes need to be. At the highest level its more about acquiring the players that can play the style or styles that you want your team to play, further down the leagues its more about picking the tactics that suit the players at your disposal, it’s not much good trying to play a system that requires a false nine forward if you don’t have a forward with the mental and technical skills required for the job.

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Have posted in the bug section but not sure if its a bug or not but....

I changed Eastbourne Borough to have a super rich chairman with a higher reputation ( 5000 ) and I put them in Skrill Premier

Despite this and a transfer budget of £3m + wages of £50,000 they are signing players who cannot get into conference north/south sides

Surely with the increased reputation - I appointed myself as manager and chairman wanted high profile signings and they had a list of players who wanted to come - they should be living up to it?

Also just hit the first transfer deadline day and they have suddenly signed 5 league one players but by the next window they are signing players not getting into conference south sides

Its almost like they are waiting until transfer deadline day and then the AI is signing a number of players to fit with the high profile signings requirement but it is odd

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i dont know what should i say to my team after the match.

6 clear -cut chance 24shot no goal. all attackers has low marks because they can not goal from the chance.

however, they can not score because of engine, but not their form, not their real performance. I should sat they have no luck? Or I should say they are poor performance. I don't know. I'm confuse.

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Still can't find it.

Transfer centre > transfers targets > right hand side of that screen you can ask your assistant.

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Often I have players on the flanks make a good run with ball and get few defenders on themselves and then lay a nice rolling pass to the top of the box where my 2 CM's wait with a very good look at the goal, they shoot from 20 yards with no block,no defender near them but they could not hit the barn door if they life dependent on it. I'm not even crying for goals, just shoot the ball on target FFS!!

Anyway too many shots, too many CCC' missed...the game does not even count every CCC as a CCC I noticed..player running solo with the ball,only the gk in front,he (of course) misses and it is not regarded like a CCC. I mean,if it is not CCC ,I don't know what is.

Great game, just sort out this ridicilous number of shots per game.

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Is the too many shots issue confined to the top leagues, I wonder? I did see a higher than normal shot count when I played half a season at Sunderland, whereas my saves at Stirling and Lowestoft have much more realistic figures for shots on goal.

For example, my last game at Lowestoft (and my own shot attempts in this example is slightly higher than normal due to the tactic I played for this game, it's normally between 8-12 attempts per game)...

JKwW1hY.jpg

...and my last game at Sunderland...

tUQWfri.jpg

As much as Chelsea were dominant, 40 attempts on goal is a bit excessive, and they only won 2-0 (So the AI sometimes can't score either!).

I realise that's only two snapshots, but they are fairly consistent with each save.

Is it because of quicker, better players that more shots on goal are peppered in during a game, whereas the 'diddy' players struggle to get the ball forward more, hence not as many shots? It's a tricky one for the Devs to sort, I'd imagine, as there will be various negative knock on effects if it's tinkered with too much.

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I m getting mostly normal shoot number for my game but I think one of the problem with the m.e is to get a normal number of shots, we have to use stuff like shoot less, work ball into box etc... people who dont use those seem to get a higher number of shots, and I dont think I ever heard of people using shoot on sight + shoot more often as default starting instruction for their team.

I think the m.e should be rebalanced to associate most high count of shoot with those so that people actually use them if they actually want high shoot numbers, without instruction they would get mostly normal shoot count and with the shoot less and work ball into box they would have mostly lower than normal shoot numbers, of course that would depend on the opposition and its tactic as well but they should try to move the balance there.

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Well, I have been playing the serie since 1998. But for the first time I have felt that there seems to be something wrong with ME after 3D . Have not played Beta, started a game yesterday. For the first 6 competitive matches Won every single home game but lost all away games with scores like 5-4 6-4 and 3-2. That might be a tactical failure but for 3 away games total 6 penalties awarded against me, 2 for each match.!!

Kind of absurd is not it? Anybody experiencing the same thing? Or is it just me who is in the verge of punching the monitor ?

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I set up a few players to be available for the reserves. Now I can't undo it? Anyone know how? Thanks

Playing FMC.

Just do the opposite. When you click on the 'available for reserves' section, you'll see a tick next to the option you've chosen (45,60,or 90mins), just click on the tick and it'll disappear.

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A rather excessive amount of red cards every week when you look at the fixtures played. I take it others are seeing this as well?

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:eek::eek:Just wondering if anyone is having as many issues with injuries at the moment as I am? Day off work so thought I'd give the game another go... in charge of the mighty Royals, and despite starting the season relatively well (3 wins, 1 draw without conceding but most recently a shocking 4-1 loss to then bottom of the table and seemingly forever my bogey team Yeovil) and injuries have now gotten completely out of control (perhaps leading to the most recent defeat)... Of my 23 first team players nine have been ruled out over the opening five games of season, two needing specialist treatment (the old 3-4 month jobs we all love :p) and the others averaging a month to six weeks out... Federici, Gorkss, Williams, Hal Kanu, Karacan, Guthrie, McCleary, Pogrebynak and Baird have all been ruled out; that on top of starting the game with Leigetwood and Roberts having long term injuries... Training is about average really, perhaps on a little low side (keep getting complaints of not working the elder statesmen hard enough despite there being no need to do so), rest days a plenty, no intense focus, evenly spread out... and yet players are dropping like flies!

Scared to step outside my flat just in case I break a leg.

Paul Robinsons dog will no doubt run riot in my training ground before long...

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iv played the game for years now, since championship manager and this is the 1st time i find it near unplayable.

playing as liverpool v Chelsea went 1-0 up early but after that it went all Chelsea

was playing 4-1-2-2-1 changed to 4-1-4-1 to try and get a foot in the game then they scored

then they got a free kick too the left of my box. they had 2 men standing over it, no wall set up for me and all of my guys were in box. the 2 just tapped it to each other and ran straight in and scored. that well f***** me off

thought id try 4-2-3-1 to give forward more support and maybe that would get me a foot hold in the game. complete opposite

had the back 4 , the 2 then set as ball winning md and deep-laying playmaker on def but mata ran a mock. lost 6-1 mainly after i changed to 4-2-3-1 with a bucket load of shots against

is it just me or does 4-2-3-1 not work at all in this game you just get over run when in real life alot of top teams play it

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That's a lot of extreme changes for a single match against a very good team. I'm not surprised Chelsea won 6-1. Too many drastic changes can be counter-productive, which is what I think happened, and Chelsea are very. very good.

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That's a lot of extreme changes for a single match against a very good team. I'm not surprised Chelsea won 6-1.

I'm surprised they only scored 6 :D

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Dear SI - Is there a chance that by the end of the week we will see a new update? Please reply.

This is important because when playing the current version, you will need to make an appointment with a psychologist.

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Dear SI - Is there a chance that by the end of the week we will see a new update? Please reply.

This is important because when playing the current version, you will need to make an appointment with a psychologist.

Fair play, that is actually very funny :)

ps No date set yet.

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Dear PaulC - I'm glad you laugh. I'm with you for almost 20 years. Going mad when I can not play!

Good man! While I totally disagree with the idea that you "cannot play", I promise we are working hard to deliver a ME update with plenty of improvements.

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