How to Play FM: A Twelve Step Guide

[petergoddard]

Any ideas would be welcome

I like possession and usualy I don't have problems having it around 65-70% or even more but I'am always looking for improvements so my set up is

LGK - s

WB - automatic

CD - cover

CD - defend

WB - support

HB - defend

AP - support

AP - attack

IF (right side) - support

IF (lef side) - attack

AF - attack

Strategy / Style: attack / very fluid

Team Instructions: shorter passing, retain possession, play from defence, work ball into box, more crossing, drill crossing, play narrower, closedown more, more pressing, shorter tempo

I had to set crossings because players went to the line and either they would loose the ball or eventually have a corner.

Biggest problems seems to be against teams playing 4231, I just can't maneged to control the match.

[yonko]

petergoddard,

Is the AMC in a 4231 giving you problems when playing against such formation? If yes, I'd suggest changing your HB to DM. Also, change your STC from AF to DLF support and try changing the AP support to DLP support. You can try using "Be more disciplined" shout and you could change your Strategy to Control.

[petergoddard]

petergoddard,

Is the AMC in a 4231 giving you problems when playing against such formation? If yes, I'd suggest changing your HB to DM. Also, change your STC from AF to DLF support and try changing the AP support to DLP support. You can try using "Be more disciplined" shout and you could change your Strategy to Control.

Thanks. As for the STC I have done that but it's with an attack duty instead of support, because I have already one of the IF's supporting... but I will also give it a try.

Not specially the AMC but in general I can't control the match, i.e., against any other tactic I am in control with great possession but against any 4231 the match is very 50-50, last one I managed to win 1-0 but I could easily have lost it... forgot to mention that as for team instructions I have also Get Stuck In and the defence line is the highest possible (not sure how to name the instruction in english) but I think I can unset any defence line instruction because with an attack strategy the defence line will be high by default.

Although my tactical set is a 451 / 433 the team behaves like a 343, as the HB drops deeper alongside the CDs, WB's set higher next to the AP's and the IF's and DLF making an advance third line. I think it replicates very well some ideas of Pep when managing Barcelona. But man, these 4231 are killing me!!!

[petergoddard]

The second problem is that my DLF is very inactive in the match, few passes, even fewer shots (the same happened when using an AF role)

[yonko]

Use a supporting duty for your STC. It will make him connect better with your midfield, especially if he has "comes deep" PPM. Use Control instead of Attacking, but keep the D-line high. Be careful with using lower tempo because the opposition might be pressing you too hard and thus dispossessing your players of the ball. Does any of your midfield players have "dictates tempo" PPM? In fact, what kind of PPMs your midfielders have? PPMs play an important role in keeping possession....as much as tactical roles/instructions.

[petergoddard]

Use a supporting duty for your STC. It will make him connect better with your midfield, especially if he has "comes deep" PPM. Use Control instead of Attacking, but keep the D-line high. Be careful with using lower tempo because the opposition might be pressing you too hard and thus dispossessing your players of the ball. Does any of your midfield players have "dictates tempo" PPM? In fact, what kind of PPMs your midfielders have? PPMs play an important role in keeping possession....as much as tactical roles/instructions.

I'm working on the ppm's because is something I think its vital to achieve any kind of style we want to introduce... but it takes time to have the ppm's (that's why I never share tactics). I like all my players to play short and simple and give my midfielders double / verticle ppm's (comes deeper / move forward), also dictates tempo... but this takes several months.

Ok, I'm going through with the support duty for the DLF. I tried the Control strategy, I had to give up and choose a more risky strategy like Attack because I was not creating enough ccc's and key passes. The logic here was a kind of "well, maybe it's easier to set a more risky strategy but with possession instructions rather than a possession strategy with more risky instructions to score goals" Still have doubts with this logic Nevertheless I could give it a shot once mor with Control, do you think a higher tempo would suit better a Control strategy ? Something like Control / a little higher tempo, Attack / a little lower tempo.

Also, I guess with a DLF / Support maybe its better use both IF's / attack instead of one attack and other support ???

[yonko]

With Very Fluid mentality the roles and duties make less difference in your case. So play the IFs however it suits the players.

If you want more (effective) possession then use Control strategy with the following starting shouts:

- short passing

- work ball into box

- play out of defense

- much higher D-line

- hassle opponents

- use tighter marking

- use offside trap

Save "retain possession" for extreme situations only! Add higher or lower tempo as needed and based on what you see happening (watch on comprehensive highlights!). Plus if one or both of your APs has "dictates tempo" as PPM, then they will set the tempo for your team to some extent anyway. There are a few shouts that I'd recommend to be used as Plan B or C:

- higher/lower and much higher/much lower tempo

- be more expressive/be more disciplined

- play wider + exploit the middle/play narrower + exploit the flanks

- roam from positions/stick to positions

- pass into space

You can use any combination of shouts as alternative to tweak on a game to game basis. For example, you can use lower tempo with stick to positions and be more disciplined to control possession more. Or you can try the opposite to be more adventurous. Of course you can add Counter mentality to the former or Attacking mentality to the latter to enhance the effect. I personally have come to the decision to stay away from "retain possession" shout because I don't like the behavior of my players then. In addition I don't find it necessary to use in order to get high % possession or higher pass completion rate. Even without it I manage to get 60-70% possession and around 90% pass completion for my midfield.

[petergoddard]

With Very Fluid mentality the roles and duties make less difference in your case. So play the IFs however it suits the players.

If you want more (effective) possession then use Control strategy with the following starting shouts:

- short passing

- work ball into box

- play out of defense

- much higher D-line

- hassle opponents

- use tighter marking

- use offside trap

Save "retain possession" for extreme situations only! Add higher or lower tempo as needed and based on what you see happening (watch on comprehensive highlights!). Plus if one or both of your APs has "dictates tempo" as PPM, then they will set the tempo for your team to some extent anyway. There are a few shouts that I'd recommend to be used as Plan B or C:

- higher/lower and much higher/much lower tempo

- be more expressive/be more disciplined

- play wider + exploit the middle/play narrower + exploit the flanks

- roam from positions/stick to positions

- pass into space

You can use any combination of shouts as alternative to tweak on a game to game basis. For example, you can use lower tempo with stick to positions and be more disciplined to control possession more. Or you can try the opposite to be more adventurous. Of course you can add Counter mentality to the former or Attacking mentality to the latter to enhance the effect. I personally have come to the decision to stay away from "retain possession" shout because I don't like the behavior of my players then. In addition I don't find it necessary to use in order to get high % possession or higher pass completion rate. Even without it I manage to get 60-70% possession and around 90% pass completion for my midfield.

Thanks Yonko. Great tips.

i have to say that I felt the same thing with fm13 when using the retain possession shout, used it a few times and I didn't like the behaviour of my players and that's exactly the point.... I felt I didn't need it because most of time I had that same amount of possession.

I will have to watch closely what the 4231 does that rips off my control of the match because my HB closes down the opponent AMC, so it's not the AMC doing the damage.

[RickyKaka22]

What team instructions you suggest me to use for a 4-1-2-1-2 formation? gk-2 cd-2 wb-bwm-bbm-dlp-ap-dlp-af

[petergoddard]

What team instructions you suggest me to use for a 4-1-2-1-2 formation? gk-2 cd-2 wb-bwm-bbm-dlp-ap-dlp-af

That depends how you want your team to play

[yonko]

No problem, you're welcome.

Yeah, I feel like "retain possession" is making the players dwell on the ball too much, holding it and it only enhances the already strange behavior of wide players near the sideline/goal line. To me it's like an extreme time wasting shout. On top of that, it makes the opposition aggressively tackle your players, causing injuries and/or lost of possession. I like to keep possession but keep the ball moving in all directions. That's what tiki-taka is about. I see much better ball movement without that shout.

What team are you using, btw? Barcelona?

[RickyKaka22]

@petergoddard possesion football, but the important is that the tactic is a winning tactic

[yonko]

What team instructions you suggest me to use for a 4-1-2-1-2 formation? gk-2 cd-2 wb-bwm-bbm-dlp-ap-dlp-af

@petergoddard possesion football, but the important is that the tactic is a winning tactic

What are your mentality, fluidity and role duties?

You can use these general shouts:

- short passing

- work ball into box

- play out of defense

- much higher D-line

- hassle opponents

- use tighter marking

- use offside trap

Make sure that your DLF plays on the same side as your DLP and the AF plays on the same side as your BBM.

[RickyKaka22]

What are your mentality, fluidity and role duties?

You can use these general shouts:

- short passing

- work ball into box

- play out of defense

- much higher D-line

- hassle opponents

- use tighter marking

- use offside trap

Make sure that your DLF plays on the same side as your DLP and the AF plays on the same side as your BBM.

Control,balanced. wbs = attack, cds= defence, anchor man/bwm= defend, bbm= support,dlp=support,ap=attack,dlp=support,af= attack

[petergoddard]

No problem, you're welcome.

Yeah, I feel like "retain possession" is making the players dwell on the ball too much, holding it and it only enhances the already strange behavior of wide players near the sideline/goal line. To me it's like an extreme time wasting shout. On top of that, it makes the opposition aggressively tackle your players, causing injuries and/or lost of possession. I like to keep possession but keep the ball moving in all directions. That's what tiki-taka is about. I see much better ball movement without that shout.

What team are you using, btw? Barcelona?

Indeed. I'm not certain but I think retain possession increases time wasting and players can be caught in possession. It works ok against weaker teams but it would be very risky to use retain possession against strong ones.

I'm using FC Porto, it's a strong team and well suited to possession.

Right now I'm above 70% possession, creating key passes and scoring but I think this is going to work in Portuguese League and against weaker teams in Champions League. So the real question is how to keep possession above 60% against the strong teams of Champions League ???

[yonko]

Indeed. I'm not certain but I think retain possession increases time wasting and players can be caught in possession. It works ok against weaker teams but it would be very risky to use retain possession against strong ones.

I'm using FC Porto, it's a strong team and well suited to possession.

Right now I'm above 70% possession, creating key passes and scoring but I think this is going to work in Portuguese League and against weaker teams in Champions League. So the real question is how to keep possession above 60% against the strong teams of Champions League ???

Against the strong sides in the CL the problem is mostly in the away games. I personally choose to only change my mentality from Control to Counter and stick to using the default general shouts I normally use as a starting point. Then as the game is going I make adjustments if necessary. But my priority against the big sides is to get good result with better possession than the opposition. My goal is not necessarily to get 60% + possession. I win the possession battle but it's below 60%.

I play as Barcelona, so my task is easier than yours with Porto. I'm still in the first season with the default squad. I played vs Man United and Chelsea so far in the knockout rounds. I won 2-1 away at Man United and lost 1-2 away at Chelsea, but I had 58% and 56% possession respectively. I went through both and I'm now up against Bayern M in the semi-final, which should be an interesting test. I also played in La Liga against Real M away and drew 0-0 but still won the possession game with 57%.

For the home games I don't have any problems.

[petergoddard]

Against the strong sides in the CL the problem is mostly in the away games. I personally choose to only change my mentality from Control to Counter and stick to using the default general shouts I normally use as a starting point. Then as the game is going I make adjustments if necessary. But my priority against the big sides is to get good result with better possession than the opposition. My goal is not necessarily to get 60% + possession. I win the possession battle but it's below 60%.

I play as Barcelona, so my task is easier than yours with Porto. I'm still in the first season with the default squad. I played vs Man United and Chelsea so far in the knockout rounds. I won 2-1 away at Man United and lost 1-2 away at Chelsea, but I had 58% and 56% possession respectively. I went through both and I'm now up against Bayern M in the semi-final, which should be an interesting test. I also played in La Liga against Real M away and drew 0-0 but still won the possession game with 57%.

For the home games I don't have any problems.

Yes you have Yonko, yes you have, a lot easier :-)

I always read a lot several threads here, from Cleon, WWFan, etc, etc, and I know that particularly WWFan argues that the best option for possession should be Counter in order to our defense line sets deeper and having more space to pass the ball. But the thing is, the more our defense line is deeper, the more the opponent can press higher, if one team retreats the other advances, the more space my team gives, more space the opponent occupies. It's a matter of balance and that's why I have always chose either Control or Attack.

Upgrading those 56-58% possession to 65% or more is the holy graal of possession managers :-)

[yonko]

Control mentality is fine for home games. Use Counter for away games vs big teams. Having possession means also winning the ball from the opposition. On FM it's hard to combine a high pressing compact defense with spread out attack that has depth and width. So we have to improvise and use what the game offers to us as far as instructions. Some things from real life can be replicated and others can't be. I've accepted long ago that the ME will never be as sophisticated as it needs to be in order to 100% replicate Barca's possession style. But it's getting better and I can somewhat stil mimic some of that style in FM.

Anyway, I have some interesting screenshots from my clash with Bayern M, which I will post later when I get home. I outplayed them and won both games. It may give you some good tips on how to play against other big teams.

[petergoddard]

I've posted on stupid question thread because I'm concerned with the best combination about hassle, close down and mark tighter (without specifying a player to mark), my idea is to have always and wherever the ball is 2 or 3 players pressing the opponent with the ball. This, if possible, should help recovering the ball a lot faster and increasing possession because, as you say, possession is also how to defend.

Congratulations with your match against Munchen and let's see those screenshots :-)

[petergoddard]

Oh... and I have found a lot easier set an attack strategy with possession instructions, I'm around 75% possession in the portuguese league and scoring (13 goals in 3 matches), although I'm still working on a Control plan B. I'm giving a go to your Counter idea in away matches against strong teams in Champions League.

[yonko]

75% possession in the Portuguese league.....and 13 goals in 3 matches......talk about having it easier.

So you use Attacking mentality and "retain possession"?

[petergoddard]

I have abandoned the retain possession instruction, although I have noticed a little decrease in possession between 3 and 5 points. I'm trying to understand the costs and benefits of keeping it or abandoned it.

Bah, the portuguese league is too easy, my concern is the major matches in champions league :-)

[yonko]

Here are few screenshots from my clash with Bayern, as promised:

1st Leg match stats:

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1st Leg action zones:

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1st Leg Barca passing stats:

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1st Leg Bayern passing stats:

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I used my standard tactic, which is:

Control/Balanced + shorter passing, work ball into box, play out of defense, much higher D-line, hassle opponents, use tighter marking, use offside trap

----------------SK(D)--------------

WB(A)---CD(D)---CD(D)---WB(A)

----------------DM(D)--------------

----------DLP(S)---AP(A)----------

IF(A)--------------------------IF(A)

-----------------F9(S)--------------

For this game I specifically added Higher Tempo and Play Wider, because I wanted to stretch their defense and avoid going through their DM (Martinez). I went up 2-0 but then got lazy, didn't adjust and Robben punished me. When Sanchez scored and made it 3-1, I began using "be more disciplined" shout. Then after going 4-1 (Sanchez again) I killed the game with "retain possession" for the last few minutes.

Next post will be for the 2nd leg.

[yonko]

These are the screens from the 2nd leg:

Match stats:

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Action zones:

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Barca passing stats:

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Bayern passing stats:

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The action zones screen shows that I got outplayed a little in midfield, but that is only because Guardiola switched to 4-4-2 in the second half until they scored (crossing from the left and Mandzukic headed it in over Puyol) and they switched right back to 4-3-3. I was leading 2-0 at the time.

This is what I used:

Counter/Balanced + same shouts as before plus higher tempo and play wider. WBs, IFs and AP on support duty. Once I was up 2-0, I went with "be more disciplined" again. When they changed to 4-4-2, I removed "play wider" and changed my DM to HB.

In the CL final I'll be facing Man City, they use 4-2-3-1 which will make it interesting battle.

[petergoddard]

66% against Bayern is great... and a win 4-1 even better :-)

Did you noticed why you had only 51% in the 2nd leg ?

I use

Sk (s)

Right WB (auto)

CD (cover)

CD (defend)

Left WB (support)

HB

right AP (support)

left AP (attack)

right IF (support)

left IF (attack)

DLF (support)

Shorter Passing, Play from Defence, Work Ball into box, Drill crossing, Much Higher D-Line, Play Narrower, Roam from Positions, Hassle Opponents, Tighter Marking, Slower Tempo (Attacking / Very Fluid). I like the HB dropping deeper next to the CD's allowing WB to be very offensive and CD's covering them. Although it's a 433 / 451 the team sets in the pitch like a 343. The ideia is to have a lot of movement (normaly I eliminate team instructions as my players have more ppm's), reduce space between lines... I don't know yet is more risky passing should be reduce to enhance more passing to feet and wait for the space for a killer pass.

What do you think about these roles and duties ???

curiously, these are my results

away matches: 3-1; 6-1; 5-0; 4-1

home matches: 1-0; 0-0; 1-0 :confused: same tactic, same instructions

[yonko]

66% against Bayern is great... and a win 4-1 even better :-)

Did you noticed why you had only 51% in the 2nd leg ?

I use

Sk (s)

Right WB (auto)

CD (cover)

CD (defend)

Left WB (support)

HB

right AP (support)

left AP (attack)

right IF (support)

left IF (attack)

DLF (support)

Shorter Passing, Play from Defence, Work Ball into box, Drill crossing, Much Higher D-Line, Play Narrower, Roam from Positions, Hassle Opponents, Tighter Marking, Slower Tempo (Attacking / Very Fluid). I like the HB dropping deeper next to the CD's allowing WB to be very offensive and CD's covering them. Although it's a 433 / 451 the team sets in the pitch like a 343. The ideia is to have a lot of movement (normaly I eliminate team instructions as my players have more ppm's), reduce space between lines... I don't know yet is more risky passing should be reduce to enhance more passing to feet and wait for the space for a killer pass.

What do you think about these roles and duties ???

curiously, these are my results

away matches: 3-1; 6-1; 5-0; 4-1

home matches: 1-0; 0-0; 1-0 :confused: same tactic, same instructions

I had only 51% possession in the 2nd leg because I had trouble winning the ball back. I was playing deeper by using Counter, they switched to 4-4-2 (that makes it harder to win the ball) and Bayern is a team that is also good at keeping the ball. I found it normal under those circumstances to have this little possession. But if you look at other stats I controlled the game nevertheless.

As far as your set up, I think you are going to have problems against better teams because in defense with a HB dropping deeper, you have no DLP to connect the play. Using 2 APs may work against weaker teams, but you will need to change one of them against the big teams. I'd also expect you will have problems with instructions like Roam from Positions and Lower Tempo. If you reduce risky passes your players won't be able to play killer passes. You'll have to strike the right balance in your set up, because if you are too adventurous or too passive you will get punished by the big teams.

[petergoddard]

I had only 51% possession in the 2nd leg because I had trouble winning the ball back. I was playing deeper by using Counter, they switched to 4-4-2 (that makes it harder to win the ball) and Bayern is a team that is also good at keeping the ball. I found it normal under those circumstances to have this little possession. But if you look at other stats I controlled the game nevertheless.

As far as your set up, I think you are going to have problems against better teams because in defense with a HB dropping deeper, you have no DLP to connect the play. Using 2 APs may work against weaker teams, but you will need to change one of them against the big teams. I'd also expect you will have problems with instructions like Roam from Positions and Lower Tempo. If you reduce risky passes your players won't be able to play killer passes. You'll have to strike the right balance in your set up, because if you are too adventurous or too passive you will get punished by the big teams.

Indeed, I'm aware of the risk using these two AP but I'm hopeful that having drop deeper ppm will some how compensate. Normaly I would use a DM (defend) and DLP (support) but these two hold the ball and I'm afraid they might be caught in possession, then I rebember that Pep's 433 worked like a 343 and its what I'm trying to replicate. Nevertheless, it might be a more secure option against big teams to use the DLP (support) instead of the AP (support)... curiously, I've been noticed that this system (433 acting like a 343) works well against teams playing 442: the HB dropping deeper gives a numeric advantage against the 2 opponent strikers, the 2 creative midfielders equalize the 2 opponent midfielders and having the supporting IF it's also 3 against 2.

As far I have been reading, against big teams we need a higher tempo so I guess in these matches I'll just eliminate the lower tempo instruction and set none... and maybe also set none for roam / stick positions.

[Codename47]

I haven't played FM14 yet, but I do plan on getting it very soon, as soon as I get my new PC.

On all the other versions, I did notice, with some frequency, that the opposition could field 75-80% conditioned players, not 1 or 2, but sometimes nearly a whole team at times....and win they did, verses your fully fit and rotated WC squad.

Has this aspect changed?

[StewartJRobertson]

I have been playing FM since Domark years. I am decent at the game if not fantastic.

This thread just completely opened my eyes to at least three things I had never previously considered when creating tactics.

This is an outstanding thread. Thank you so much for your help. Just reading the OP makes me want to go and try this stuff out in game.

[wwfan]

I have been playing FM since Domark years. I am decent at the game if not fantastic.

This thread just completely opened my eyes to at least three things I had never previously considered when creating tactics.

This is an outstanding thread. Thank you so much for your help. Just reading the OP makes me want to go and try this stuff out in game.

Thanks. Hope it helps.

[wwfan]

I haven't played FM14 yet, but I do plan on getting it very soon, as soon as I get my new PC.

On all the other versions, I did notice, with some frequency, that the opposition could field 75-80% conditioned players, not 1 or 2, but sometimes nearly a whole team at times....and win they did, verses your fully fit and rotated WC squad.

Has this aspect changed?

Don't focus on one element so much. At times, a lower fitness team might win, but it will be for other reasons than fitness. However, most of the time, a better, fitter team will run rings around a weaker, less fit team. You can't just think better fitness = win. That doesn't do any justice to the complexity of the game of football or FM.

[Thengil]

I was about to give up on 14.2 since nothing I did tactics-wise worked after the update - I tried for three seasons to replicate the form that brought my Rot-Weiss Essen to the Europa League, getting myself relegated and then failing to get promoted even though I had the best players in the 2.Bundesliga by far. But then I read the opening post of this thread and created a simple 4-4-1-1 with Counter attacking, Retain Possession, Pass Into Space and Run At Defence with NO "special" roles what so ever. The only individual instruction I used was to get the goalkeeper to distribute to my defenders, that was it. And lo and behold, we've won 10 of the 11 games since I instituted the change. Thank you for your ideas!

The tactic:

GK - Keeper

DR - Fullback (S)

DCs - CD (D)

DL - Fullback (S)

MR - Winger (A)

MRC - CM (s)

MLC - CM (d)

ML - Wide Midfielder (A)

AMC - AM (A)

SC - AF (A)

[TottenhamFan101]

Wow... I just can't thank you enough for this wwfan. This has helped me regain my enjoyment of FM.

[Luizinho]

One thing about FM tactically for me is striking a balance when building my tactics. I feel that every-time I create one for my team I have either been to passive with the role distribution or to aggressive. (ie. Not committing enough or committing too much). A recent example for me would be my latest project of trying to create an effective counter attack. Now I understand the basic principles. (ie. Luring the opponents onto you, then winning the ball back to enter a swift transition while the opponent is exposed). However I either find that I have given to many of my players defensive or support roles. This would be me thinking to much about keeping a deep defensive shape. Then finding my tactic very blunt in terms of attack/counter attack. Yet however I can be to focused on the counter attack element; and leave the tactic disjointed defensively.

Anyway, onto the question wwfan or anyone; what is the best way to strike the balance and stop yourself from thinking too much about a certain element of the tactic? I guess what I'm trying to say is that I struggle see how the roles play out in both aspects of the play. (Defence and Attack). Wish I could be more clear in what I'm trying to ask

[legskeattch]

Thanks for the information so far, it has been extremely helpful.

I am at Watford supporter, and loved how we played last season.

At home we played a possession based game, lots of short quick passing, no long balls what-so-ever (fluid/very fluid, control/attacking?)

The fluidity because everyone is following the same philosophy of short passing, and control/attacking for the short passing from the back, but more direct play in attack?

Away from home, we played very high tempo counter-attacking (Rigid, counter?)

Rigid for the quick transition and the counter for the longer balls from the back, but short passing in attack?

[ajh1977]

Have played football manager games since the original championship manager (91) I think and anco's player manager. Have always managed wolves and have always had great success, normally winning everything even using youngsters in league cup, but fm14 has me stumped! I've tried other people's tactics read the guides set out by wwfan Cleon etc, but just cannot get a tactic that I can stick with! In every other version I'd make a tactic and that was that but here it seems in order to have success I'm changing from week to week! I'm using version 14.3 should I update it? What was the reason it was patched?

[BigDPW]

wwfan - I have a dumb question. I am familiar with the team comparison page in prior versions of FM. Where is it in FM14? Was it removed? I can't seem to find it and noticed you mentioned it in the OP/Guide. Thanks for all of you work in this an other informative threads.

[deosays]

wwfan - I have a dumb question. I am familiar with the team comparison page in prior versions of FM. Where is it in FM14? Was it removed? I can't seem to find it and noticed you mentioned it in the OP/Guide. Thanks for all of you work in this an other informative threads.

Senior squad -> Report -> Comparison

[BigDPW]

Senior squad -> Report -> Comparison

Thank you!

[sneek]

wwfan: my interpretation of your first point in the 12-step guide is that a player consider to be for example world class and that have some hidden attributes and PPM,s could be given huge amount of creative freedom because then your giving him the freedom to do what he want on the pitch. So if i consider myself to be a poor manager with poor knowledge about the game and managing Barcelona i could use the Very fluid philosophi and probably have some succes just because of the players in the team?

Short summary. The easiest way to play FM14 should be to take controll over a world class team, set the philosophi to Very Fluid and just sign even better players?

[Chao Yang]

@Sneek:

Short answer would be yes, but if you don't have an at least semi-coherent tactical set up your team will still get ripped apart by more disciplined squads who may not be as technically gifted but more rigid and tactically set-up.

[sneek]

@Sneek:

Short answer would be yes, but if you don't have an at least semi-coherent tactical set up your team will still get ripped apart by more disciplined squads who may not be as technically gifted but more rigid and tactically set-up.

What do you meen by semi-coherent? My english isn´t that good either

[RTHerringbone]

What do you meen by semi-coherent? My english isn´t that good either

Probably means that the tactic still needs to be logical in order for such a basic approach to playing the game to work.

[sneek]

Probably means that the tactic still needs to be logical in order for such a basic approach to playing the game to work.

Ok. So a logical tactic for Barcelona would be a 4-5-1 do to their players and their preferd position?

Like this?

FBr - attack

FBl - support

CB;s - defend

DMC - defend

MCr - support

MCl - attack

AMR - Support

AML - attack

FC - Trequartísta

And maybe just add short passing, hassle opponent, very high defensive line.

Mentality - based on opposition

Philosofi - Very fluid

You think that would work?

[Sussex Hammer]

In FM14 (haven't bought it so interested), how many player instructions can you change without making shouts etc redundant? Reason I ask is this. In FM13 for instance the only real role suited to say a Kevin Nolan seems to be an attacking midfielder. However you don't want him running with the ball, trying too many through balls, crossing too much or roaming too often due to his stats so it would require changing a lot of his instructions which has a knock on effect as if you do that with quite a few players it obviously becomes a totally different tactic!!

This is what has always bothered me about roles and duties. You obviously can't expect say a Joey O'Brien to do the same things as a Leighton Baines even though you can play them both as supporting full backs. So do the added new roles help or as I say if you change to many instructions from default does it make shouts etc redundant?

[landskill]

Looking at the team comparison of my Preston North End team we are top 5 for Decisions, First Touch, Passing and Team Work but we are 18th for stamina, 21st for pace and acceleration. As a result I have opted Retain Possession, stand off Opponents and Lower Tempo for my Team Instructions on a counter mentality. The idea is to drop into position when we loose possession, not dive in and make the opposition struggle to get through us without tiring my poor stamina squad. On top of this I have some great headers of the ball up front (2nd) and good movement, unfortunately poor creativity (14th). Would it be counter productive to add Hit Early Crosses and Float Crosses to take advantage of my strikers and make up for my lack of creativity?

[Northernpilgrim]

I have read through the twelve step guide, and many of the comments following, but the area that has me foxed most is the shouts. Could someone please take a look at the two attached versions of my tactic, and suggest shouts that could be implemented to make them more effective?

http://www.mediafire.com/download/1ci4c5d2wh2rxas/4231%20Home.tac

http://www.mediafire.com/download/libirigf39g6sra/4231%20Away.tac

Any help gratefully appreciated, thankyou

[Motcha]

These advise have done nothing for me unfortunately. Neither in terms of improving results or performances. The fact is. Asking the engine to play shorter passing does not lead to playing shorter passing. In any case I didn't find anything useful in this post.

[chris138]

thanks very much wwfan. I have used your guide and my own tactics have gotten me Wigan promoted using an attacking 532 formation. I currently have 102 points with 3 games left and trying to beat Readings record of 106 points.

It was a slow start, with cup games in Europe and the domestic as well, but I am currently on a 32 match unbeaten run, trying to beat Readings 33 match run!

I have been lost in the last few installments of FM, with your help I am now enjoying the game more than ever!

[wwfan]

I was about to give up on 14.2 since nothing I did tactics-wise worked after the update - I tried for three seasons to replicate the form that brought my Rot-Weiss Essen to the Europa League, getting myself relegated and then failing to get promoted even though I had the best players in the 2.Bundesliga by far. But then I read the opening post of this thread and created a simple 4-4-1-1 with Counter attacking, Retain Possession, Pass Into Space and Run At Defence with NO "special" roles what so ever. The only individual instruction I used was to get the goalkeeper to distribute to my defenders, that was it. And lo and behold, we've won 10 of the 11 games since I instituted the change. Thank you for your ideas!

The tactic:

GK - Keeper

DR - Fullback (S)

DCs - CD (D)

DL - Fullback (S)

MR - Winger (A)

MRC - CM (s)

MLC - CM (d)

ML - Wide Midfielder (A)

AMC - AM (A)

SC - AF (A)

Glad you are having fun.

Wow... I just can't thank you enough for this wwfan. This has helped me regain my enjoyment of FM.

Likewise.

Anyway, onto the question wwfan or anyone; what is the best way to strike the balance and stop yourself from thinking too much about a certain element of the tactic? I guess what I'm trying to say is that I struggle see how the roles play out in both aspects of the play. (Defence and Attack). Wish I could be more clear in what I'm trying to ask

I think the best way is probably to focus more about the holistic of a strategy than specific roles. You need to think about role and duty combos and how they all fit together so space can be exploited and defended. You then need to work out how you want to change things in Plan A isn't working. I tend to develop shout sets to change things up. Cleon switches between mentalities.

Thanks for the information so far, it has been extremely helpful.

I am at Watford supporter, and loved how we played last season.

At home we played a possession based game, lots of short quick passing, no long balls what-so-ever (fluid/very fluid, control/attacking?)

The fluidity because everyone is following the same philosophy of short passing, and control/attacking for the short passing from the back, but more direct play in attack?

Away from home, we played very high tempo counter-attacking (Rigid, counter?)

Rigid for the quick transition and the counter for the longer balls from the back, but short passing in attack?

You are more likely to micro-control passing length with a very rigid mentality as players are less likely to deviate from their instructions. My own preference is to stick with a preferred philosophy home and away and just use TIs to change things up.

Have played football manager games since the original championship manager (91) I think and anco's player manager. Have always managed wolves and have always had great success, normally winning everything even using youngsters in league cup, but fm14 has me stumped! I've tried other people's tactics read the guides set out by wwfan Cleon etc, but just cannot get a tactic that I can stick with! In every other version I'd make a tactic and that was that but here it seems in order to have success I'm changing from week to week! I'm using version 14.3 should I update it? What was the reason it was patched?

It gets patched because their are bugs and exploits that get discovered and fixed. I think your problem might be the desire to stick with a tactic rather than develop a basic shape that works and then slightly shift it to deal with certain match situations. It's always been unrealistic that a team could be ultra successful without ever changing anything to take account of the quality of opposition, weather and pitch conditions, formation shape and basic issues of form.

In FM14 (haven't bought it so interested), how many player instructions can you change without making shouts etc redundant? Reason I ask is this. In FM13 for instance the only real role suited to say a Kevin Nolan seems to be an attacking midfielder. However you don't want him running with the ball, trying too many through balls, crossing too much or roaming too often due to his stats so it would require changing a lot of his instructions which has a knock on effect as if you do that with quite a few players it obviously becomes a totally different tactic!!

This is what has always bothered me about roles and duties. You obviously can't expect say a Joey O'Brien to do the same things as a Leighton Baines even though you can play them both as supporting full backs. So do the added new roles help or as I say if you change to many instructions from default does it make shouts etc redundant?

The PIs can tailor every role to the specific player to an extent not previously possible.

These advise have done nothing for me unfortunately. Neither in terms of improving results or performances. The fact is. Asking the engine to play shorter passing does not lead to playing shorter passing. In any case I didn't find anything useful in this post.

I'm sorry you found it unhelpful.

thanks very much wwfan. I have used your guide and my own tactics have gotten me Wigan promoted using an attacking 532 formation. I currently have 102 points with 3 games left and trying to beat Readings record of 106 points.

It was a slow start, with cup games in Europe and the domestic as well, but I am currently on a 32 match unbeaten run, trying to beat Readings 33 match run!

I have been lost in the last few installments of FM, with your help I am now enjoying the game more than ever!

Glad you have regained your enjoyment.