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Stuart Warren

Match Engine Update 13.2.1 - ME 1325 Constructive feedback here please

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I have not downloaded this patch yet and quite frankly regardless of whether or not it is any good I take my hat off to you guys for trying your best to get something out on xmas eve for your customers. This is showing that you actually care about your customers, so I commend you for that. Not many companies would work to the bone to get an update out on xmas! Have a lovely xmas to all of you at SI Towers!

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Good to see such a quick update from SI. Although it has wrecked my tactic completely - played 3 against weaker opposition since the update and lost 3 - conceded 83 shots against. Will have to work on something else before I am sacked!!

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why do you delete negative comments? whats wrong with you guys, u ask for feedback and i told you that the new ME sucks, no matter which tactic applied i concede way too much...

Saying the ME sucks is not constructive, therefore not wanted

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Thanks for updating, I only got the game a few days ago and was dissapointed to see the results the way they were.

I even got beat at home to Man City 8-0 playing as Liverpool.

So will start a new game and see how it goes.

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Number of shots seems about right, but I (league runners up last year) just got beat 8-1 by West Ham (currently bottom and until now winless). My guys couldn't seem to pass the ball and the Hammers played like Brazil all game - Collins even got a Scholes volley from a corner / cross type goals. Collins!

Back to the tactics drawing board for me I guess, but hard to credit that a team of inferior players with poor morale can walk all over a Champions League team because the tactic needs retuning.

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why do you delete negative comments? whats wrong with you guys, u ask for feedback and i told you that the new ME sucks, no matter which tactic applied i concede way too much...

Constructive feedback.

Saying it 'sucks' is not constructive. They need to hear from you in considerate detail the issues you encounter.

Anyhow, well done SI on getting a hotfix out on Christmas Eve.

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why do you delete negative comments? whats wrong with you guys, u ask for feedback and i told you that the new ME sucks, no matter which tactic applied i concede way too much...

I'm yet to concede on the new patch.

They probably delete your comments because they aren't constructive. I might be wrong though.

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Here's hoping....

Good timing for the update as i was just loading up 2012 and noticed it downloading.

I'm sure the fans will want a repeat of a Jose Enrique wonder goal where he ran the length of the field diagonally to score, but hopefully they won't get it thanks to this update!

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why do you delete negative comments? whats wrong with you guys, u ask for feedback and i told you that the new ME sucks, no matter which tactic applied i concede way too much...

Because it's a constructive* feedback thread.

*Communication which alerts an individual to an area in which something could be improved upon. Constructive feedback is not criticism.

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I thank SI for taking the time to put out a new patch on Christmas eve :D

But it still seems like there are loads of shots every game 30-40 overall plus ive found my players are more prone to taking long shots when they have no chance at all of scoring. I've tried work ball in to the box and set the players who are doing it to long shots rarely but they seem to be doing it still even when there are good passing opportunities available.

Im not normally one to moan and usually just get on with it but every time i get a good game going with a decent tactic we are getting patches which as said above change the goalposts which is getting pretty annoying tbh.

But as i said i do appreciate SI doing what they are doing as i doubt any other big developer would do the same :)

I think the average (depending on what league) should be around 20/30 shots overall. Just looking at this weekends games and we had the following:

Swansea v United - 33 shots

Chelsea v Villa - 31 shots

Liverpool v Fulham - 29 shots

Tottenham v Stoke - 25 shots (21 to Spurs)

Wigan v Arsenal - 23 shots

Southampton v Sunderland 23 shots

Newcastle v QPR - 23 shots

West Brom v Norwich - 22 shots

West Ham v Everton - 21 shots

This is, however, a lot better that what I understand to be before, where there were as many as 50/60 per game.

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Because it's a constructive* feedback thread.

*Communication which alerts an individual to an area in which something could be improved upon. Constructive feedback is not criticism.

We don't mind criticism either but it needs to be half sensible and have a point and of course the purpose of this thread is for people to point up actual problems not just say "it sucks" or "why wasn't this noticed" etc.

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hi and cheers for the new patch on Christmas Eve.

here is my humble 5 cents:

- still way to many shots attempts per game, not really so realistic. i play matches where BOTH sides fire 15-20 shots each. chelsea shot 20 at Villa yesterday and scored 8. no way did Villa shoot back 15 at chelsea.

- wingers holding their pieces around mid line while action is taking place within penalty area. they do not contribute to defending at all.

- penalties given far to often. i played 5 games and had 3 penalties for and 5(!) against.

- is it me or is the number fouls and therefore yellow (and thus red) cards still high? it is not unusual a match ends up with 16/12 fouls commited and 6-8 yellow cards given. now a game like that in the Prem L, or any league would be on the verge of scandalous. whereas this happens almost every match in FM13

these are just few "suggestions".

I am not taking a dig or trying to be disrespectful, i just find these issues, well, issues. and i cannot accept some people saying it is only down to team talks and tactics.

cheers and Merry Christmas to you all

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hi and cheers for the new patch on Christmas Eve.

here is my humble 5 cents:

- still way to many shots attempts per game, not really so realistic. i play matches where BOTH sides fire 15-20 shots each. chelsea shot 20 at Villa yesterday and scored 8. no way did Villa shoot back 15 at chelsea.

- wingers holding their pieces around mid line while action is taking place within penalty area. they do not contribute to defending at all.

- penalties given far to often. i played 5 games and had 3 penalties for and 5(!) against.

- is it me or is the number fouls and therefore yellow (and thus red) cards still high? it is not unusual a match ends up with 16/12 fouls commited and 6-8 yellow cards given. now a game like that in the Prem L, or any league would be on the verge of scandalous. whereas this happens almost every match in FM13

these are just few "suggestions".

I am not taking a dig or trying to be disrespectful, i just find these issues, well, issues. and i cannot accept some people saying it is only down to team talks and tactics.

cheers and Merry Christmas to you all

Did you catch the Swansea v United game? United had 19 shots to Swansea's 15. For every scenario for, there's an against. On average I think shots per game need to fall to between 20-30 of course there will be some with just 10-20 and the odd one with more than 30.

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Guys, regardless of the fixes (I haven't played it yet) I would like to tell you how much I appreciate you guys pushing out a fix on this holiday date.

I can't imagine the effort and stress that went into this to get this out on time.

I really appreciate the trouble.

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- is it me or is the number fouls and therefore yellow (and thus red) cards still high? it is not unusual a match ends up with 16/12 fouls commited and 6-8 yellow cards given. now a game like that in the Prem L, or any league would be on the verge of scandalous. whereas this happens almost every match in FM13

Much the opposite, I noticed that I don't get yellows anymore? I have players who spend most of the match "looking aggressive", yet I get maybe 1-2 yellows a match max. I finish many matches entirely uncarded.

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So, I'm guessing FM2013 is all about getting feedback, like an alpha version of FM2014... except we paid for this.

It's the end of December and the game is, for the above mentioned reasons, still unplayable.

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Because it's a constructive* feedback thread.

*Communication which alerts an individual to an area in which something could be improved upon. Constructive feedback is not criticism.

Where are allow to post our frustrations/dissapointments about this FM ?! In which topic??

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I think that this is the best version so far.

The only re-occurring issue I've seen over about 10 games is that players "play the ball forward" (that's the quote from the commentary) by hoofing it off the field for no reason.

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Where are allow to post our frustrations/dissapointments about this FM ?! In which topic??

To your therapist?

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It's hard to see but this is just stupid. Firstly the ball is curled in straight at the keeper, the keeper then dives straight up and palms the ball in the back of the net. The commentator then says that Rhodes has completed his hat-trick even tho the ball didn't touch him (he was on back post) then the goal is disallowed claiming Borini pushed perch (given by the linesman who is miles away compared to the referee) which is just a load of rubbish. Also long shots are still ruining the game for me. My team passes the ball around, dominates team but it just completely incapable of scoring many goals due to most shots being from miles out. I know this is only a quick fix but the change is that players aren't running as much as previously. Still, the game is terrible and i would love to have been able to save this money to go towards Download Festival in June. To have so many patches and for the game to still be this bad is terrible.

[video=youtube;wg_518FyOGU]

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Where are allow to post our frustrations/dissapointments about this FM ?! In which topic??

In the feedback thread for whichever version you are playing. Constructive criticism is welcomed

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So, I'm guessing FM2013 is all about getting feedback, like an alpha version of FM2014... except we paid for this.

It's the end of December and the game is, for the above mentioned reasons, still unplayable.

It isn't unplayable as i spent about 2 hours on it this afternoon.

Where are allow to post our frustrations/dissapointments about this FM ?! In which topic??

In here of course as long as its constructive.

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Just beat Norwich 8-0 and Man United just beat them 7-1. Norwich are 6th in the Premier League.

Overall so far, the patch seems to have lessened the amount of crazy scoring games. Does seem to be a very large amount of shots still though.

Good patch so far imo. Merry Christmas.

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I'm utterly exhausted :D

- If closing down is too low, the fullback will allow the opposition winger to travel into the penalty area. If I then increase the closing down, the fullback will track the opposition player all the way across the defence into the centre of the pitch, leaving a hole for an opposition player to move into.

- I'm still seeing players - both mine and opposition - run straight past players as if they aren't there. Yes, this doesn't happen as much but that's because players aren't dribbling as much.

- Centre backs are willing to travel miles from their position to cover for fullbacks. This can lead to 2 or 3 players chasing after the player with the ball, leaving massive gaps in defence

- I've also noticed that if players have followed an opposition player to the point when they're out of position, when the opposition player relinquishes the ball to a team mate, my player won't look to get back into position and pass over the defensive responsibility to a team mate who's "area" the opposition player is in. Instead, they seem to pause and almost contemplate following the ball.

It really doesn't look very good tbh. I haven't played this version (FM13) until the last few days so I can't comment on what the other patches were like. Whilst I hate seeing the usual "superkeeper" or "the game is flawed" comments, I have to say these issues are making the game not very enjoyable.

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Only just turned it on , here are the shot stats from the latest round of CL matches

PSG 22 - 21 R.Madrid (2-2)

Torino 10 - 25 Man City (1-4)

Schalke 19 - 17 FC Twente (1-0)

Shaktar 9 - 27 Barcelona (1-5)

Capital 1 Cup Final

Chelsea 15 - 22 Man Utd (3-1)

Runs seem down , shots on goal still seems pretty high though.

Side note, if people are going to post videos, at least do it in a decent resolution, you can barely see what is going on in the 360p videos.

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I've got to ask. How many people who play so called Tika-Taka football actually create a good amount of chances for your striker? This has been a frustration of mine for a while now. I'm getting 20 shots a game but it's only because of the excessive amount of long shots. It seems slow, patient build up means that it's harder to create good opportunities despite having some of the best creative players in the game (Gotze, Wilshire,Henrikson, Hamsik) My team is dominating most games but the shots are either from stupid long shots or come from headers which never seem to go in. It makes no sense to me.

I think the amount of long shots also explains why keepers still get a decent rating even tho they are useless and make a mistake. There are so many long shots that they go down as saves made which improve their rating

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Just had a game where the only highlight was a sending off. Never known that on any previous version of football manager, though the game was against Stoke! Liverpool 19 shots - Stoke 15

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I've got to ask. How many people who play so called Tika-Taka football actually create a good amount of chances for your striker? This has been a frustration of mine for a while now. I'm getting 20 shots a game but it's only because of the excessive amount of long shots. It seems slow, patient build up means that it's harder to create good opportunities despite having some of the best creative players in the game (Gotze, Wilshire,Henrikson, Hamsik) My team is dominating most games but the shots are either from stupid long shots or come from headers which never seem to go in. It makes no sense to me.

I think the amount of long shots also explains why keepers still get a decent rating even tho they are useless and make a mistake. There are so many long shots that they go down as saves made which improve their rating

This is a tactical question and should really be in the tactics forum. A lot could determine this, some people create tika-taka tactics without fully understanding them. It's one thing to retain possession and pass to feet, it's quite another to actually play through the defence of the opposition and fashion chances for the strikers.

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still lot of long shots because they didn't fix it, they only reduced the number of goals per game, thanks for the hotfix but it is unfinished.

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Just had a game where the only highlight was a sending off. Never known that on any previous version of football manager, though the game was against Stoke! Liverpool 19 shots - Stoke 15

Key highlights are now just goal action, if you want the same as key highlight in previous versions you have now to chose extended highlights.

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After a full season running 5 leagues on full detail, here are the top highest scoring games for each league:

Bundesliga: Bayern 6 - 2 Dusseldorf

La Liga: Real Sociedad 5 - 4 Barcelona

Ligue 1: Lille 6 - 2 Nancy

Premier League: Arsenal 6 - 2 Fulham

Serie A: Atalanta 6 - 3 Lazio

In each case, these are equal to or less than the highest scoring games from the actual 2011/12 season for this league. Moreover, looking at individual fixtures for the various clubs involved, these results are rare instances.

Below, I've listed the number of matches in which the eventual league winner for each league scored more than 4 goals in a league fixture:

Bayern - 2

Juventus - 1

Manchester City - 3

PSG - 0

Real Madrid - 3

Compared to real results in the 2011/12 season:

Dortmund - 5

Juventus - 1

Manchester City - 4

Montpellier - 1

Real Madrid - 8

So overall, scorelines are looking much more realistic.

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I do not even know where to start ...

Before this patch, as wingers that go beyond that and always a focus on de-energisation striker or midfielder in the worst case. Following a good first season with West Ham United (4th), the second season is a nightmare without changing and adjusting my tactics. The other teams bite into the ball, constantly fighting to recover and produce the game Mine are spectators, find and tap of 5.4, 4.8, etc..

So new patch, and tested a game out of my bases, I lost 0-5 with five goals on corners, the same scenario. Center, a bit rejected, a strike off the surface despite covering two players who are where? And the final five goals. Was more patches, the more it destroys the game I feel.

Merry Christmas anyway.

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Key highlights are now just goal action, if you want the same as key highlight in previous versions you have now to chose extended highlights.
Cheers! Sorted now.

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Whenever i get a highlight of a chance at goal after it goes off it seems to replay it again, I have had a look at the settings and i cant see how to stop this from happening.

I have only noticed this on the 2d classic view, has anyone else noticed this happening

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This is a tactical question and should really be in the tactics forum. A lot could determine this, some people create tika-taka tactics without fully understanding them. It's one thing to retain possession and pass to feet, it's quite another to actually play through the defence of the opposition and fashion chances for the strikers.

Same tactics as before these previous 2 updates where i then had a season as top scorers in the league and top defense and finished un-beaten. It's nothing to do with my tactics it's just the way the match engine has changes. If seriously had enough of having to build tactics around the match engine. It's just completely wrong

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Same tactics as before these previous 2 updates where i then had a season as top scorers in the league and top defense and finished un-beaten. It's nothing to do with my tactics it's just the way the match engine has changes. If seriously had enough of having to build tactics around the match engine. It's just completely wrong

So what do you suggest? that they dont try to fix things?

The aim here surely is to get the match engine right, not get it to make a person's set up work.

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Seems much better to me, my trouble some left winger has gone from averaging 19 dribbles a game to 5/6 a game. Still too many shots i think overall, but the goal ratio seems fine so it can be lived with. Dont see any real issues with keepers like some are saying. Still a few instances of quick wingers being overpowered tho, i watched an England national match and Sterling went to town on the opp, but since i dont play the top divisions i dont think ill come across many instances of that. As always i havent had to change much, a couple of changes to the shouts im now using and thats it. Overall, thumbs up so far.

Incredible that you got this out on xmas eve, i downed tools for the year a week ago! Have a good xmas guys.

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Same tactics as before these previous 2 updates where i then had a season as top scorers in the league and top defense and finished un-beaten.

What team were you playing with? Even with top teams it isn't often that a team should be able to go a whole season unbeaten.

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Overall for a hotfix, its quite a bit better. Longshots seem a tad high, and probably a few too many shots per game. But overall a good place to leave it till another major update. In the longer term, collective pressing, and better tracking of the wide players needs to be looked at, possibly some better decision making in the final third too?

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Overall for a hotfix, its quite a bit better. Longshots seem a tad high, and probably a few too many shots per game. But overall a good place to leave it till another major update. In the longer term, collective pressing, and better tracking of the wide players needs to be looked at, possibly some better decision making in the final third too?

Id say that was spot on, its clearly still not perfect by any means, but until there is time to work on it more this seems to be a good place for them to leave it. I think the tracking of wingers becomes hard as now they seem to want to drift in field more, which in terms means there is a moment where they are not being picked up by the full back or the centre back, by the time either reacts the winger can be past them.

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Whenever i get a highlight of a chance at goal after it goes off it seems to replay it again, I have had a look at the settings and i cant see how to stop this from happening.

I have only noticed this on the 2d classic view, has anyone else noticed this happening

I've fixed it now, I had it on highlights instead of goals so it was replaying all the highlights...

Silly me

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Id say that was spot on, its clearly still not perfect by any means, but until there is time to work on it more this seems to be a good place for them to leave it. I think the tracking of wingers becomes hard as now they seem to want to drift in field more, which in terms means there is a moment where they are not being picked up by the full back or the centre back, by the time either reacts the winger can be past them.

There is some excellent intelligent attacking play, but I don't think the defending has caught up with it yet, for me that would be the focus, not far off having an excellent match engine if they get that right.

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Im not sure why people are praising SI so highly. They basically released a beta FM and charged 30 quid for it. This update shouldn't even be necessary.
So, I'm guessing FM2013 is all about getting feedback, like an alpha version of FM2014... except we paid for this.

It's the end of December and the game is, for the above mentioned reasons, still unplayable.

Agreed.

It's almost like they make a whole new ME just so they can put it on the back of the box and so Miles can say it at the press conferences for the game. "It's the best one yet, we've got a whole new fantastic ME!"

It's ridiculous. Maybe someone should finally realise that customers want a good game. They don't care about new MEs, they care about getting a good ME that is realistic and works. Not a new one every year that ends up ruining the whole game for the whole year.

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