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Neil Brock

Match Engine Update 13.2 - ME feedback here please.

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With the release of the latest update for Football Manager 2013, as always we're interested in hearing all your thoughts in regards to theMatch Engine , so please keep it all in here. Changelist is below.

Here are some other links you may find useful.

13.2 Released - http://community.sigames.com/showthr...l-Manager-2013

FM13 FAQ - http://www.sigames.com/faq/fm13.php

FM13 Bugs Forum - http://community.sigames.com/forumdisplay.php/291

All non-match engine feedback here please - http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/339003-*Official*-Football-Manager-2013-13.2-Constructive-non-ME-Feedback-Thread

Also please read this before posting - http://community.sigames.com/showthr...nd-Forum-Rules.

Thanks.

MATCH ENGINE (v 1324)

More improvements to on ball decision making and pass choice

Improved central midfielder starting position when team is in possession

Tweaked midfielder and attacker positions when team is defending

Fixed a couple of bugs causing players to fail to turn to face required direction properly

Improved facing direction of player marking opponent who is moving onto a pass

Fixed bug allowing players being able to partially "go through" other players to get ball without being penalised

Small tweaks to improve the way players move onto passes or loose balls

Reduced some instances of closing down of keeper when clearly illogical in context of player and his instructions

Cleaned up a few bugs that delayed retrieval of ball at set pieces or kick offs

A bunch of ball physics fixes mainly related to collisions and ball spin after bounce

Reduced slightly unrealistic ball to player deflections

More improvements to pass choice AI

Tweaks to run with ball and first touch AI

Reduced tackles that end in own goals

Some tweaks to basic central midfielder positions

Fixed some dodgy marking at mid pitch free kicks

Improved full back positioning when waiting for short keeper distribution

Improved near and far post corner aim point

Some further ball physics fixes and refinements

Fixed goal not always given if ball stops just over goal line

Fixed some rare instances of player collision avoidance failing

Further refinements to pass AI

Improved pass, shot or header accuracy logic

Further improvements to player reactions to the ball

Fixed defences staying to deep just after corner taken

Refined player positioning when defending free kicks from wide

Made players press more collectively and aggressively when required

Improved positioning of defenders against attackers running at pace

Refined tackling AI a bit

Improved facing direction while marking opponent around own area

Fixed some more keeper AI bugs

Improved collision avoidance AI slightly

Fine tuned ball trajectory chosen by player for kick, header etc.

Fine tuned kick and header accuracy logic

Fine-tuned pass and general on ball AI

Tuned long shot frequency and AI

Toned down pressing slightly in certain situations

Improved marking and engagement of ball player in wide areas

Tuned tackling AI further

Couple of small fixes to player reactions

Fixed some small player pathing anomalies

Fixed a couple of goalkeeper AI anomalies

Improved marking and engagement of ball player further

Fixed some instances of risky keeper distribution

Fine-tuned kick/header accuracy

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Will my current tactics be massively affected by this?

It really depends on your tactic. Some tactics will be more affected than others.

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I guess there's only one way to find out :D

I'm delighted by the change list though and can't wait to see the ME in action. Will give proper feedback later (when I get the time to play a few matches).

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Damn you releasing this when im stuck in work!

I timed it perfectly, just away to start a new season tonight :)

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Just started my next season yesterday on a new save so this is just in time, hope it doesn't disrupt my tactic much although if it improves the game generally that's a small price to pay.

There's no need to start a new game right? since there's no db changes. Will give some feedback later.

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First game vs Utd (I'm Spurs) : 18 shots for me 30 for them.

I was playing about as defensive as a Spurs side can get , hope it's not a sign of things to come.

Players decision making also seemed a little weird, especially defenders.

Will continue to monitor though.

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First game vs Utd (I'm Spurs) : 18 shots for me 30 for them.

I was playing about as defensive as a Spurs side can get , hope it's not a sign of things to come.

Players decision making also seemed a little weird, especially defenders.

Will continue to monitor though.

That's way above the average we have for shots at the moment according to our stats.

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I've had a game going (Liverpool - United), but got excited by the patch and alt-f4'd to update. Replayed it with the patch;

The amount of shots was the same (12-7)

The amount of long shots reduced (4-2)

Distance run increased (I seem to remember having 102-104 km usually, this game both team ran more than 125 km)

My keeper made 14 passes out of 33 despite having instruction to play it short

My defender conceded a penalty and his rating was 5.8 in the end, finally I'll see some defenders with low ratings.

My AM got a 8.4 rating despite not scoring or assisting, but he made 51 out of 56 passes, 9 tackles (more than my defenders) and 15 runs past opponents, must be my FM record.

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As always folks, please give it a good bashing before arriving at conclusions and don't expect to create a "wins every game" tactic but if you actually do then report it as a bug please :D

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Improved near and far post corner aim point

I already concede way too many near post corner goals. Hope this doesn't increase it.

Looking forward to seeing the feedback as won't get to play this now until Saturday. Have fun, guys.

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I'm seeing a bit of 'bunching' by my players in matches as they all move to close down a player, leaving other players open. Will continue playing and monitor.

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As always folks, please give it a good bashing before arriving at conclusions and don't expect to create a "wins every game" tactic but if you actually do then report it as a bug please :D

Not likely! And I won't be putting it up in the downloadable tactics section either! ;)

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Ok so first of all, some of this feedback might actually be related to how my tactics react to the new ME rather than general, i won't know until i play some more games especially since i'm on pre season and the tactics are not fluid yet.

Overall.. :thup: Will give + to what i think it's positive, - to negative and ? to i need more games to decide. :p

+Players seem to be way more aware of the ball and the opposition, they react way quicker and more realistic.

+Tackling is now a joy to watch, i was stressing about this before as i'm playing with newcastle and with Cabaye, Anita, Tioté, Ayew and Naingollan seeing such strong Midfield been ripped apart as giving me headaches.

+DM/D role no longer seems just another player on the pitch, tioté had an average of 6.9 through the last season, he nows does amazing tacklings and way more involved on the defense.

+Throw ins no longer give the opposition a throw in due to passing failure half the time.

+Players no longer press keepers like crazy when a pass is done back to the keeper.

+Keepers no longer seem to be nervous all the time, handling the ball more calmly being pressed.

+Players seem less prone to stupid passes and mistakes that give away possession.

+Keepers still do some weak crosses but it seems to only happen when they are being pressed which seems quite reasonable. (This might be due to the fact that i use a sweeper, plus his kick is not very good)

+CD's no longer think the ball is on fire, getting rid of it asap even tho' if it means giving possession away, they will now keep it and try to get a passing line.

+I no longer shake and tremble and close my eyes every time there's a corner against me :D

+Faults inside the area seem now more regularly to be offensive faults rather than defensive ones, this tells me defenders overall are now my conservative not doing insane penalties for nothing.

+KEEPERSSSSSSSSSSS :applause:

?Wingbacks seem crazy attacking but more than that selfish now. My wingbacks are now cutting inside from the midfield, running the whole pitch ignoring my IF's, overall they are well more involved in the game but it seems WB/A seems more useful now if you are not playing with wingers, otherwise you might see some selfish actions. (I got Corchia and Baines, don't get me wrong, it's actually beautiful to see, although strange).

?Seems that the CD rushes even more to press the opposition wingers even when my WB is already pressing close on him, i understand he'd do this if the WB then moved to the CD position, or if the WB couldn't recover his position, this is alarming me a bit as it seems that a player with the PPM "likes to change flanks" might be a killer here.

?I have had plenty success last season with a TM along with 2 IF's, managed to sell Cissé for 43M to juventus (couldn't think of a better team for him) and got my hands on Cavani, now, Cavani is not a regular TM but neither was Cissé and he did fine, although the TM role now seems more involved in plays he also seems to get rid of the ball quicker with short passes even if he's on an attack role, this seems to be fine but it seems a less attacking role more useful along with a second striker, might have to change my tactics here.

?AP/A role now seems to play on the flanks more often, nothing to be concerned about as he did some good plays doing this, still, he's doing it more often than i'd like.

-Lack of communication still between the keeper and the CD's, i keep seeing my CD's going for the ball in keepers area without any danger close, this on the previous versions led to plenty OG's which no longer seem to happen as while they don't communicate as much as i'd like, CD's seem more passive attacking the ball if the keeper is in position to get it.

Again, i can't stress enough, this feedback some of which tactic related might be my own truth due to my tactics, plus i haven't done enough games to be sure about some of the things here described, overall, i do think this forums will calm down massively after this patch as it's been simply a joy to watch so far.

Think i can now say, Good work SI :thup:

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I've played 3 games since the patch and have so far scored 17 goals and had 75 attempts at goal. They were all home games that I'd be expected to win, but even so....

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I've played 3 games since the patch and have so far scored 17 goals and had 75 attempts at goal. They were all home games that I'd be expected to win, but even so....

Your point... :rolleyes:

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I'm stuck at work right but im delighted this has come out a day before im off work until the 27! :) Perfect timing SI! Can't wait to get home! AHHH 6 more hours to go and another hour drive home...

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Your point... :rolleyes:

No, I'm going to let you put your brain to use and work it out yourself. I'll give you a clue. You might have to read up a few posts :rolleyes:

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Hi, maybe a stupid question...I'd like very much reading the feedback before pdating the game, and in the meantime play with 13.1.3...is it possible? have to put steam offline? or update is forced when launching the game?

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My 1st feeling about the ME :

The 1st thing I feel is now, players run with the ball too much. They keep the ball, run run run.. and run again. They have 2 or 3 oppenents on their back but nothing change, they run... for what result ? Often for nothing. They lose the ball with a poor pass and a very poor cross.

Crossing. this is the 2nd point : I do not use wingers, so this is not so important for me (only my wing back cross) but I can fell that from the AI : Players cross differently now. The ball is going very high ( I am sorry for my poor level in eglish) probably because they runed too much with the ball and are tired. the result : there is no danger at all for the keeper (but I agree to tell it can be a danger for an english GK because everything is dangerous for them :-p lol).

Before, the ME was too much BARCELONA kind (100000 passes), and now this is more CR7 kind (run with the ball).

I will be happy to choose myself that kind of thing. But the ME do it for me.

I will play more and if I feel I was wrong, I'll come back.

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Only a few games so far but there seems to be LOTS more shots and goals. Also, the running with the ball seems a bit ridiculous as previously mentioned. Many times a game I now get my AM players picking the ball up around the center circle and just blazing a trail into the opposition penalty area or diagonally wide to the byline. I am pleased to see much less of the hugely annoying tendency for players to dribble along the byline and slam it into the side netting when there are three players in the penalty area looking for a cutback.

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started a new save and played through a few friendlies and i'm liking it.

one major thing I've noticed is that free kicks are flying in, i can't remember my team scoring free kicks before the update, i thought it was down to my poor players, now i'm scoring one a game. cant decided if this is positive or negative.

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One thing I've noticed is that trajectory of crosses seems much more realistic now, I enjoy watching the ball flying into the area.

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Giving pep talk to 3 subs at once still changes players' reaction even if you talk to another one.

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Mostly looks solid so far but how can they not have fixed the issue with guys running down the goal line into the post and trying to score from an impossible angle? C'mon guys!!

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Just patched up to 13.2. Prior to the patch i was top of the prem with 32 games played.

Going into the first game as usual, playing Man City away so apply a slightly more defensive approach (which has been quite successful)

After 30 minutes Man city have had 27 shots and i am 5-0 down.

I end up losing 9-0 - they have a modest 48 attempts on goal.

Tactic suicide

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So I have played 10 matches and every match I have seen this from both teams..This game needs 100 patches.

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Lots of goals I agree. Also players running with the ball. Also my wing back Alba who is set to run with the ball often is doing crazy runs in the centre of pitch,cutting inside,taking shots..I mean he isfeking good at it but poor Sanchez on that left side is rarely included. But WB/R who is set to sometimes run with the ball doesn't do it so maybe it has something to do with that..

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Anyone else notice that everyone is run happy now ? FB/W/AM's are picking the ball up (for both sides) putting the head down and going on 5 man world cup dribbles ?

Think I might be done with this for a year, too many games to play to have to try to game the ME every time there is an update.

And Im using a logical , uncomplicated tactic before I get the usual reply.

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Mm

Way too many shots now and too much running with the ball.

Last round of premier league matches > 35 shots, 37 shots, 24, 32, 28, 18. The average in real life is c18 I believe.

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My thoughts after 3 matches....

There is no visual of what is actually going on in the match. I won 2 and lost one (8-0). But all i am seeing is chances coming from individuality. Whether that's a bit of brilliance or a mistake. I have my highlights set to 'extended' but i couldn't tell you why my tactic worked or didn't because everything was about a player doing something magical or terrible. It's been like this throughout this year. With the tactics you simply have to guess with your changes because i am finding it impossible to judge my tactics by what is going on in the match. It's just full of my team making mistakes when i lose and their team making mistakes when i win.

Also, pass choices on the ball are still terrible. There has been an obvious simple through ball right in front of them but then they will spread the ball outwide. There has been a simple 5 yard available but they chose to kick it long (even tho passing is set to short)

Next, i have a player set to stay at the edge of the area when defending corners but as soon as the corner has been taken he will turn around and run 5 yards towards his own goal for no apparent reason leaving the opposition player free (they are also extremely slow to react when a ball does drop outside the area where as the attacker will be there before the defender moves 5 yards)

Constantly 2 or 3 players closing down 1 man even if they are already marking someone which means players are left being un marked (marking is set man to man)

In my last game i saw my defender move away from the ball which was 2 yards infront of him to let an attacker 10 yards away from him run in and have a free shot

The jumping on this game has always wound me up. Players constantly just jump and will then drift in the air so they can head the ball

The angle defenders run at when a pacey attacker is dribbling at them constantly means it's easy for the attacker to get past (you will also see 2 or 3 players chasing the player and leaving massive gaps in the defense)

A through ball was just played right in front of my defender only for him to ignore it and run past it for the striker to tap the ball into the back of the net (cos the keeper had come out to close down the player who passed it)

My player knocks the ball ahead of him and a defender who is about 2 yards away from it decides to run the other way for my player to continue his run and then get a shot away

The keepers passing from open play is inconsistent. I have it set to short and sometimes he will do that and sometimes he will just poorly kick it up the field. The amount of pressure being put on him seems to have little influence

I have also set my CB to collect which he does and even tho he is free the goal kicks are going to my other defenders at times but mostly get kicked long

I don't expect the game to be perfect but in nearly every highlight i watch there are just blatant flaws in the match engine and the fact tactics show so little in the highlights you do see makes it extremely difficult to play the game

Some people have accepted and will continue to accept that this is just the way the game is but personally i will not accept it because when you pay so much for a game you expect it to be of a high standard. All the previous games comfortably reached that standard but this one is just terrible and a lot of work to be done and it looks like the decision to use this match engine has ruined the game

and before someone comments with 'it's your tactics' or 'look in the tactics forum for help' i'm having no problem with my tactics and i also replayed the spurs game (when i lost 8-0) and i won 3-1 despite making no changes at all. There is just no consistency with this game. you can find yourself beating Chelsea 4-1 one game and then the next losing 5-0 to Cardiff. You lose 8-0 to spurs, rage quit, play it again with no changes and win 3-1. I just can't make any sense out of this game. It all just seems to random

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Couldn't read back in the patch notes, but...

Is the issue of lack of interest in my players from other clubs fixed?

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For those concerned about the shot counts - http://www.soccerbythenumbers.com/2011/08/shots-and-goals-in-big-4-offensive.html

On average, teams across the four leagues took about 13 shots per match (12.96). Real Madrid led the top European leagues at almost 19 (18.9), followed by Inter, Dortmund, Chelsea, and Palermo. At the bottom end, we saw 3 English clubs, with Blackburn, Wolves, and Birmingham who were bottom in Europe at a measly 8.6 shots per match.

My first couple of games have looked good:

z4kmg.jpg

In regards to the ME:

Animations seem a lot smoother

Defending seems better

More coherent passing patterns

Better player movement

Quite a bit of dribbling, maybe too much

Lot more testing to be done

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My 3 post update matches ended 2-1, 4-1 and 2-0. Number of shots - 12, 18, 20. Seems good to me.

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Couldn't read back in the patch notes, but...

Is the issue of lack of interest in my players from other clubs fixed?

You need the non me thread

edit - Thanks Neil :D

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the last update mess up my team talks before the match,i talk to a player and another reacts. i can't play like that.

That's not a bug, that's intentional. For example, if you had a go at a player for a awful half, his mate in the dressing room may react in a different way (say he gets angry or wants to play better so his friends bad performance is overlooked).

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Whats up with defenders passing back to my keeper with strikers just waiting to intercept the ball. Conceded 4 goals like that in just 5 games

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Is anyone else noticing the slightly annoying thing just before a goal is scored?

The game basically freezes/pauses ever so slightly,I can tell when there is going to be a goal even before the ball crosses the line,this only happens before a goal and no other time.

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