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The 2012-2013 Manchester United Thread: Thank you, Sir Alex


ddidiodion

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Owen Hargreaves, non?

SAF buys (or uses) ball winners in a deeper, more holding role, in certain games to add support to the defence but he almost never uses players in the way of a holder. This allows them to still move higher up the pitch as the play dictates whereas a true holding midfielder wouldn't.

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SAF buys (or uses) ball winners in a deeper, more holding role, in certain games to add support to the defence but he almost never uses players in the way of a holder. This allows them to still move higher up the pitch as the play dictates whereas a true holding midfielder wouldn't.

Probably why we're so over exposed between the defense and midfield all the time.

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I agree. Even when he plays the Carrick-Scholes combo deep, both are allowed a flexibility to move forward.

What I think the team needs - and is what Hargreaves might have become - is someone who is naturally able to do both jobs and so can turn the sitting/roaming higher switch in their play on and off depending on the game situation. It all comes back to the way SAF doesn't have a set tactical framework. If he stuck to the 4-2-3-1, we could have the "double-pivot" which allows the ball winners to get forward and even in a 4-3-3 there can be a ball winner, a ball carrier and the creative guy with the winner and carrier acting as their own partnership. But since he keeps going back to a 4-4-2 ish base, there's no mindset there of NOT going forward from our ball winners.

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rumours from the transfer thread that fulham have rejected a bid from us for dembele.

I havent seen too much of him but i always thought he was more of an attacking midfielder than anything else. he looked alright in one game i saw last season but nothing special.

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rumours from the transfer thread that fulham have rejected a bid from us for dembele.

I havent seen too much of him but i always thought he was more of an attacking midfielder than anything else. he looked alright in one game i saw last season but nothing special.

He played quite a bit as a more standard central midfielder for Fulham at times. He is very versatile and very good as I have said before.

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I disagree. He is mobile, a great retainer of the ball and can beat a man and provide a spark on the attack which is pretty much what we need. I don't think we will buy him but if we do then he will be a good addition.

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I agree. Even when he plays the Carrick-Scholes combo deep, both are allowed a flexibility to move forward.

What I think the team needs - and is what Hargreaves might have become - is someone who is naturally able to do both jobs and so can turn the sitting/roaming higher switch in their play on and off depending on the game situation. It all comes back to the way SAF doesn't have a set tactical framework. If he stuck to the 4-2-3-1, we could have the "double-pivot" which allows the ball winners to get forward and even in a 4-3-3 there can be a ball winner, a ball carrier and the creative guy with the winner and carrier acting as their own partnership. But since he keeps going back to a 4-4-2 ish base, there's no mindset there of NOT going forward from our ball winners.

or two of the above and a holder, which is where I think we're lacking - not that we need a holder to start every game, but to give us the tactical flexibility in certain situations.

Discounting Scholes and Giggs for a moment due to the tactical tweaks necessary to incorporate them successfully, and Fletcher for obvious reasons, at present we're going into this season with the following midfielders, in order of attacking inclination - Kagawa; Anderson; Cleverley; Carrick. In any midfield three Carrick has to be the designated holder, despite the adverse affects this has had on his game at times in the past, with Cleverley and/or Anderson as box-to-box runners and Kagawa or Anderson as the playmaker. If Carrick's absent for whatever reason we're pretty much down to hoping the Ando/Cleverley dovetail from early last season provides sufficient defensive cover, which it didn't seem to at the time.

By signing a genuine holding midfielder/anchorman/midfield screener/whatever we would not only have a specialist for Carrick's holding role (and a replacement in the event he's injured), but we also have the option of either including Carrick in a role that, while more advanced for him personally, still includes a stronger defensive element, as something of a holder/box-to-box hybrid that his natural game seems to lend itself to.

You could do alot worse than signing Cabaye.

Cabaye would be a cracking all round option, but I think he'd cost a pretty packet at the mo. Recently came out pleading with the board to retain their better players so not sure how keen he'd be to move in any case.

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Don't think Cabaye imposes himself enough on games playing in a deeper role personally (purely from his time at Newcastle and a few internationals), he's been a much better player when given freedom to advance and do the creative stuff.

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His stats from last season are out of this world - I think it's more that he goes about his business quietly enough that it isn't noticed next to the more bombastic Tiote.

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or two of the above and a holder, which is where I think we're lacking - not that we need a holder to start every game, but to give us the tactical flexibility in certain situations.

Discounting Scholes and Giggs for a moment due to the tactical tweaks necessary to incorporate them successfully, and Fletcher for obvious reasons, at present we're going into this season with the following midfielders, in order of attacking inclination - Kagawa; Anderson; Cleverley; Carrick. In any midfield three Carrick has to be the designated holder, despite the adverse affects this has had on his game at times in the past, with Cleverley and/or Anderson as box-to-box runners and Kagawa or Anderson as the playmaker. If Carrick's absent for whatever reason we're pretty much down to hoping the Ando/Cleverley dovetail from early last season provides sufficient defensive cover, which it didn't seem to at the time.

By signing a genuine holding midfielder/anchorman/midfield screener/whatever we would not only have a specialist for Carrick's holding role (and a replacement in the event he's injured), but we also have the option of either including Carrick in a role that, while more advanced for him personally, still includes a stronger defensive element, as something of a holder/box-to-box hybrid that his natural game seems to lend itself to.

I actually hate to see Carrick as our main defensive option so I'm definitely in the camp of bringing in a genuine holder plus ball winner. The team has plenty of attacking options further up field which means there won't be a weakness if there's a stronger base in midfield. I think it's even worse than just adverse affects on Carrick's game, I think it stifles him to the point he becomes non-existent on the pitch at times. He can certainly do the job but he needs that creative, almost defensive Regista, brief so that if he forgets his defensive responsibilities for a few minutes we're covered. Scholes seems to have been playing deeper not just because of his legs but also so he can cover for Carrick's attacking movement.

So yeah, for me it's forget all about Snjeider, Modric et al and bring in some strong, technically good midfielders. Turn them into Barca-type midfield Liberos is SAF wants to but just make sure they know how to sit when they need to.

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I just the DHL advert that has man utd in it. who is the player who kicks the ball in brazil? Do they even play for us as I dont think i've ever seen him before!

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Park is officially gone now then. A great servant to the club but for 5M nobody is complaining, good luck to him.

I really hope we move quickly in signing a new CM and LB now though as the squad is tiny.

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I just the DHL advert that has man utd in it. who is the player who kicks the ball in brazil? Do they even play for us as I dont think i've ever seen him before!

I take it you aren't talking about Chicarito?

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I take it you aren't talking about Chicarito?

No, the boy mobbed by his mates on a Brazilian beach.

I think he was deliberately chosen because he looks a bit like Neymar ;)

Definitely not a player on our books.

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The more I read into the Park transfer as the media talk about it, the more I absolutely love Park and wish him all the best.

My judgement had been a little bit clouded due to his lesser impact in games this last season, but he gave us many great years and hopefully he can finish his career on a high with QPR who look to be doing good things.

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Sad to see him go as he's a good player (despite a poor last season), but it's the right decision. Would have been even tougher for him to get games now with the arrival of Kagawa, and nigh impossible if we have another bloke coming into the midfield puzzle. Great player, and if the 5m figure is correct I'm in two minds over it. If it's 2.5m up front it's not fantastic money by any means, and Park is easily worth 5m.

Wish him the best of luck (36 of 38 games ofc) in QPR. He has served the club well and scored a ton of important goals. Just read 27 goals in 205 matches. That is pretty good for a midfielder (waves to Carrick).

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Sources saying we've put in a bid of 30mil for Lucas Moura. :eek:

Attacking CM without the playmaking skills of Ganzo, yes?

Makes absolutely no sense unless United are truly getting rid of the 2-man midfield.

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I watched a video of him earlier and he's immense to be fair, think Ronaldo when he was very raw, that's him.

And in the video he was always coming in from the right, which if he is a RW I don't see why we'd buy.

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Looks like he enjoys coming in on his left foot which means SAF could switch him to the left and play him almost as a left wing Ronaldo (that is playing on his strongest side but still capable of cutting in and scoring goals). If, and I think it's a big if, the bid is a legit one then it allows for Valencia to be rotated out to keep him fresh/against opposition where his wide-play isn't successful and still not lose anything on the left wing. Nani and Lucas could theoretically alternate wings.

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Just seen the news about Lucas Moura, what a signing that would be.

That video of him is brilliant, the lad has got some great skills with the ball and appears to be very strong nd could handle the Premier League no problem imo

ESPN Soccernet are reporting it here:

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story/_/id/1123694/manchester-united-close-in-on-lucas-moura-deal?cc=5739

Lets just hope Barca, Real, Chelsea and City wont put in a bid.

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Just seen the news about Lucas Moura, what a signing that would be.

That video of him is brilliant, the lad has got some great skills with the ball and appears to be very strong nd could handle the Premier League no problem imo

ESPN Soccernet are reporting it here:

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story/_/id/1123694/manchester-united-close-in-on-lucas-moura-deal?cc=5739

Lets just hope Barca, Real, Chelsea and City wont put in a bid.

Not a single quote or indication United are even interested in the bloke from that article. Just some general quotes from him about being open to play in Europe. Name out of a hat game, again, I suspect.

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Just seen the news about Lucas Moura, what a signing that would be.

That video of him is brilliant, the lad has got some great skills with the ball and appears to be very strong nd could handle the Premier League no problem imo

ESPN Soccernet are reporting it here:

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story/_/id/1123694/manchester-united-close-in-on-lucas-moura-deal?cc=5739

Lets just hope Barca, Real, Chelsea and City wont put in a bid.

Oh no!!!

Craig might have just found his replacement infatuation for Hazard.

Time to wee all over this one as early as possible.....WE ARE NOT PAYING 30MIL FOR LUCAS MOURA.

My name is Icon...enthusiasm killer.

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http://www.manutd.com/en/News-And-Features/Exclusive-Interviews/2012/Jun/larnell-cole-exclusive-interview.aspx

I know it's an exaggerated stereotype of Scholes, but couldn't help but laugh out at this line.

Paul Scholes has certainly been effusive in his praise of your talents..

I don’t want to get too big-headed but it’s nice when you hear it from him. Obviously, he’s such a good player and for him to say stuff like that is good for your confidence. When he was coaching with us, he never held back and went flying into tackles. It was good to learn from him and he carries on talking to us now even though he’s in the first team.

:lol:

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