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Defensive Forwards

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I never use defensive forwards, but I want to try add a tactic that includes them. So here are my questions, do you use defensive forwards, in what formation, in what situations, and why?

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I only use it IF I have no subs left and trailing late on, I'll chuck a defender upfront 'Robert Huth' style and deploy him as a Defensive forward playing a more direct game.

Never worked though, just gave away alot of fouls.

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defensive forwards can be very useful but they need good tackling attributes, yet still a striker. unfortunately, there arent many in the game, so i dont use them. they need to be played with another striker to pass the ball to when they win it.

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A good way to use defensive forwards is if you want to press high up the pitch. If you play a 433 with 3 center mids (BTB,DLP,AP) and 3 Strikers all central with the two on the outside Defensive forwards and the most central striker as advanced forward. With the two DF's up there they tend to stop the team playing outwards from the back and forcing the long ball, also allow them a good amount of creative freedom as this will let them express themselves when you get the ball back rather than playing simple passes, i must stress you to make sure you have a good number of players pressing or else your strikers will be running around like headless chickens getting tired.

Good luck mate, keep me updated.

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I am glad I opened this thread, I naturally would have assumed that defensive forwards should be used in a rather strict and rigid formation. I guess I am taking the name too literal in my head.

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I assume that a strong striker that is both a good marker and tackler would work well if he was set to man mark or press the opponent's defenders. This would probably work best against the weakest link in the opponent's defense. If they have a player with poor ball playing attributes (technique, passing, decisions, etc.), a good defensive striker (strong, aggressive, tackling, marking) would be able to press him and exploit his mistakes.

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haven't seen a good defensive forward in FM for a loooong time

AI just doesn't use them, all the forwards that have tackling over 15 in my game in fm11 (which are 4 from 25000 players) are dual role DC/ST

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I also seem to have a hard finding a finding a striker with even decent attributes in marking and tackling. I guess if I started with an academy player and trained them properly I could mold someone to fit. Is everyone having this problem or am I simply not looking in the right places?

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You may not find a natural striker for this role, but have a look at a player like Alan Smith, and he would be perfect if he trained to become a pure striker. Kléber, Kevin Davies, Steve Howard, Brandao, Jonathan Walters and William Gros also looks like they could fill this role well. You may not find a striker that has excellent defensive attributes, but good attributes in most of these areas should do the trick. I have yet to test out this position myself.

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I have yet to test out this position myself.

This is the idea I get from most people, doesn't help that very few if any players have this as their 'preferred' position.

The advice is going to be very useful in trying to find the perfect player for this role that isn't better used in another fashion.

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I have always wondered about Defensive Forwards as I've been curious to try something in FM. I'm pretty sure, if my memory isn't playing tricks on me that a team in the early 90s would play an ostensibly defensive-minded player in the AMC position as a way of breaking up the oppositions play early. It may have been Barca, or maybe AC Milan.

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Does anyone have multiple season experience with using DFs in your tactics in FM? I am waiting for the patch before I start up my new save in which I will be using them.

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I used a defensive forward with a 3-4-3 with Athletic Bilbao.

Used Toquero as the defensive forward. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaizka_Toquero

Munaian as a trequarista and Llorente as target man attack.

Toquero really did well in the role, scoring 15 goals a season, and I finished 3rd in La Liga. In fact, I have finished 3rd in La Liga the next 2 seasons, before teams started to figure the 3-4-3 and I switched to a 4-3-3 with RW/LW and eventually won the league.

Entire team presses hard. The key is, like someone mentioned before, to keep the other teams defensive passing stats terrible then they just boot it long and you win it back easier. I would imagine this would work with a defensive forward in a 4-2-2-2 with 4 guys pressing up the other teams backline as well.

I think workrate & stamina is more important than tackling. Who cares if they tackle, the defense boots the ball up the field before they get there anyway. You just have to run after them.

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I haven't used the role in the tactics creator but in fm 09 when i was struggling with tactics i had a little read of solutions on this forum and in some guides and i ended up making a 4-4-2 with Kuyt playing like a defensive forward and he bagged 20 goals for me, outscoring Torres (admittedly these days that isn't too hard).

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Carlos Tevez can put in a decent shift as a defensive forward, I'm pretty sure. Like someone said, workrate & stamina matter more than tackling. Acceleration is a must too - Andy Carroll has good workrate and stamina, but the opponents could tiki-taka their way to their striker before he ran up to close them down :p

They work best in a tactic where you close down more or use the 'hassle opponents' shout, work better with another striker with them (someone fast, poacher/advanced forward), and the best thing to do is have at least one CM/DM with good heading to win the opponent's long ball hoofs.

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I have a MR/AMR/MC/AMC that I retrained as a ST because he was good in the air, who also had 11 marking and 13 tackling who uses DF quite well when he plays up there, DW out wide, and Playmaker when center-mid.

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I'm thinking that it really depends on how good your whole team is at pressing. Kuyt is a good example. If Liverpool didn't press so much he wouldn't be nearly as effective. Because strikers are naturally outnumbered by defenders in most phases of play, you have to be pressing high up the pitch to give them a chance of engaging 1-on-1 with a defender. Otherwise they'll run like they've left a naughty text on their GF's phone, but left it in their wife's purse. IIRC, this was a bit of a problem in FM10 with strikers defaulting to too much pressing and getting uselessly tired.

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This is an area that I am having trouble in, I can get my forwards to press quite nicely, but my midfield doesn't seem nearly as interested. I am lowering pass completion rates in the defense, forcing the long ball, but it doesn't do much good as the midfield isn't following up. Which makes my df's are running around everywhere for no constructive purpose.

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I don't have him set as a Defensive Forward, but at Charlton, one of my strikers (playing as an Advanced Forward) contributes a hell of a lot by chasing down defenders. He doesn't score as many goals or get as many assists as my other striker, but he forces a lot of bad passes, a lot of clearances, and his strength, workrate and tackling (19, 17 and 12 respectively) mean that when he does fully close down an opposition defender, he regularly manages to win the ball off them, often forcing the opposing player to the ground as well, which regularly leads to a goal one way or the other. To give an idea of how good a job he does, he's the only attacker in the league's player stats for tackling, with 3.41 tackles a game. His strength means he holds off a lot of weak tackles, too. Maybe I'll try him out as a defensive forward, see how he does? I'll post with an update if I do, but we might not be playing for another couple of days (it's a network game).

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I usually give my strikers high closing down. They do very well to win the ball high up the pitch.

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i could swear that there ist not ONE striker in the whole game that gets the role "Defensive Striker" as supposed to be the "best recommended tactical role", sadly

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Been using Defensive forwards the last 3 editions and they work great if you have runners going up to support the attack, particularly inside forwards. One of the best I had was Andy Carroll but you can use any striker with solid physical and mental state for the role, technical skills are less important.

Strength, acceleration, stamina, work rate, aggression...

I play 3-2-2-2-1 with the two wing backs supplying the crosses on the overlap allowing the inside forwards to cut inside and join the defensive forward. A lot of goals come from the defensive forward winning the ball or receiving the ball and holding it to distribute to the inside forwards as they run beyond the defense.

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Gives me a chance to talk about my flat lined 4-5-1 tactic with Jamie Vardy as a defensive forward. Working quite well if I do say myself :D

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Gives me a chance to talk about my flat lined 4-5-1 tactic with Jamie Vardy as a defensive forward. Working quite well if I do say myself :D

Haha!

The most impressive thing here would actually be if OP came back and told us he did the same four years ago!

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I play a defensive forward in my away 4-4-2 tactic, and it works great, but then I do have Jack Marriott at that position, quite possibly the best defensive forward in the lower leagues in England. Got close to 50 goals for me in the Vanarama North last season. Insanely good player. I think if you're going to use that role, it's REALLY important to have a player who's natural at it, as any time Marriott has been injured, any replacement has been pretty poor.

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Yea, I wouldn't have guess a defensive forward would be pressing higher but after reading the description I got the point. As someone else said, it's for pressing higher up. As I don't usually press high, defensive forwards are almost never in my tactic. I think a defensive forward makes more sense for big teams that don't need to counterattack. If you like counterattacks, then possible defensive forwards are not for you.

That's why I'd be very curious to see Neil's set-up as IRL Leicester thrive on counterattacks.

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I remember deciding that Robert Lewandowski was the perfect Defensive Forward in FM14 for some obscure reason. Managed a couple of 40+ goal seasons but how that worked so effectively in a 4-1-2-2-1 baffles me to this day.

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