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Quickfire Questions and Answers Thread (Tactic and Training Questions Only)


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4 hours ago, HUNT3R said:

This is what Individual training does. It focuses on an individual attribute. So if you choose a role that already has the attribute covered, it now gets more focus. You can know this in-game because the player's workload increases when setting individual training.

Thanks @HUNT3R, just wanted to make sure I wasn't wasting this feature by choosing attributes already being covered in the positional training.

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5 hours ago, HUNT3R said:

Lowering tempo won't alter risk taking. That's what mentality does on a broad scale. You can alter specific decisions more with some PIs and TIs like more/less risky passes etc.

Lowering tempo just encourages players to hold onto the ball a little more before making a decision. It'll mean that they have a little more time to decide, so a little less likely to rush compared to before. It could help, if tempo is the issue. Just make sure that they have other options. If the options are there, but they're rushing, then a tempo adjustment could help them take the time to evaluate options better.

If tempo doesn't do the trick, there's more to it. PPMs, a poor attribute (composure, decisions) or even your instructions could all affect the choice to shoot when you don't want them to.

Thanks for the response @HUNT3R , the tempo changed occurred me as i have a very young team and the mental atributes you described are yet to fully develop. I think my problem is a mix between of players having poor mentals and sometimes not having good options wich forces them to make bad choices (shooting from range, etc) but i guess its an issue related to my role selection that its causing  lack of penetration and movement in the final third of the pitch.

Edited by forlegaizen
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Am I the only one that have started conceding a hole lot of goals from crosses to the far post? don't know if it was changed with the update yesterday, but it started when the previous update came out 

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1 minute ago, DKB said:

Am I the only one that have started conceding a hole lot of goals from crosses to the far post? don't know if it was changed with the update yesterday, but it started when the previous update came out 

There was definitely no update to the ME in 17.3 or yesterday's 17.3.1

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Just now, HUNT3R said:

There was definitely no update to the ME in 17.3 or yesterday's 17.3.1

Didn't have them before the 17.3 update, and it doesn't matter what game I load, so it is not about the opposition adjusting to the tactic/s that I use. Going with ultra defensive full backs in a 442 seems to cool it down, but more attacking than that a cross comes in an a players comes into the far post putting it in. Doesn't matter if I play a 3 or 4 man back line 

seen it mentioned on other forums as well

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31 minutes ago, DKB said:

Didn't have them before the 17.3 update, and it doesn't matter what game I load, so it is not about the opposition adjusting to the tactic/s that I use. Going with ultra defensive full backs in a 442 seems to cool it down, but more attacking than that a cross comes in an a players comes into the far post putting it in. Doesn't matter if I play a 3 or 4 man back line 

seen it mentioned on other forums as well

As @HUNT3R says, there have been no ME changes.

If you think you have found a new issue, please raise it in the ME Bugs forum along with example pkms for SI to look into.  https://community.sigames.com/forum/515-match-engine-issues/

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How do I avoid taking goals on the counter after a free kick in my favour? I'm having a load of problems with my free kicks always being too short (not getting it past the first defender despite instructions to hit it to the far post), it being headed away, my players all being static while my opponents burst forward and hit me on the counter, often resulting in a goal. The lack of options on attacking free kicks also doesn't give me the chance to, like with corners, put someone outside the box. This is driving me insane and has caused me to actually quit and restart several games which I hate doing. I don't mind losing, even if I'm the better team, but I hate losing because of goals like the above where I don't have anything to prevent them except keeping my entire team back..

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11 minutes ago, KlaaZ said:

How do I avoid taking goals on the counter after a free kick in my favour? I'm having a load of problems with my free kicks always being too short (not getting it past the first defender despite instructions to hit it to the far post), it being headed away, my players all being static while my opponents burst forward and hit me on the counter, often resulting in a goal. The lack of options on attacking free kicks also doesn't give me the chance to, like with corners, put someone outside the box. This is driving me insane and has caused me to actually quit and restart several games which I hate doing. I don't mind losing, even if I'm the better team, but I hate losing because of goals like the above where I don't have anything to prevent them except keeping my entire team back..

How many men do you keep back?

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1 minute ago, KlaaZ said:

Generally at least two, plus and one additional for each player the opposition keeps forward (so that I'm never one on one). Problem's mostly the free kick quality and the transition afterwards.

That's strange as I also keep two back and never seem to get hit on the counter at free kicks but have been stung a few times from corners. I may be wrong here but aren't the default set ups for free kicks the same as whatever you set for corners? For example, it's same defender that attacks the near post at both free kicks and corners. Maybe you are over thinking things

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One thing that I will never understand is how players on much weaker side (read: low rep) "forget" about obvious football. I hate the dwelling on the ball when there are 4 obvious passing options. You can set whatever tempo and mentality and PI you want, and they still will not respond. Oh, and the defenders... they have the "plays shorter passes", all PIs are set to favor shorter passing, they have passing options and they still boot it up the field. Always happens whenever I play a much higher rep side or the other way around if I play against a low rep team.

Has anyone got a way to stop / mitigate these?

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How does Advanced Playmaker change the playing style of the team? For example, in my team, AML and AMR are the best players and I want them to be very involved in the play. Would that go against using an Advanced Playmaker in the AMC slot? I'm asking this since we know that Playmakers tend to be "ball magnets" more than other roles and I'm wondering if my team will force the play through the middle because of that.

Thanks!

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A slightly silly question.

 

my tactics familiarity is already at max. Is there any benefit of doing maximum match training on teamwork? i.e 2 full days of teamwork

will it add to team performance on the pitch  regardless of what we logically understand how training should be? Has anyone tested this out?

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2 hours ago, chubbchubb said:

A slightly silly question.

 

my tactics familiarity is already at max. Is there any benefit of doing maximum match training on teamwork? i.e 2 full days of teamwork

will it add to team performance on the pitch  regardless of what we logically understand how training should be? Has anyone tested this out?

Match Preparation for Tactics and Teamwork are two separate things, so if tactical familiarity is at max (or not) setting match prep to Teamwork will still have an effect.

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On 09/03/2017 at 18:11, MeMyself2k13 said:

How does Advanced Playmaker change the playing style of the team? For example, in my team, AML and AMR are the best players and I want them to be very involved in the play. Would that go against using an Advanced Playmaker in the AMC slot? I'm asking this since we know that Playmakers tend to be "ball magnets" more than other roles and I'm wondering if my team will force the play through the middle because of that.

Thanks!

I have my AMC and AMR as advanced playmakers and I find that it works quite well for me. I also have a DR playing as an attacking wingback so I still have a wide option on the right.

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Just wondering what are some PPMs for inverted wing backs and shadow strikers? Atm I have my IWB cut in from whatever wing they're at, and I usually try and train a player with a strong right foot as a left IWB, and a strong left foot as a right IWB


I've no idea what PPMs would be best for a shadow striker or even a roaming playmaker?

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Hi, is it possible to emulate the raumdeuter role from the wide midlefielder position, as i play in a 442 i dont want to move the WM to an AML. I tried giving him similiar instructions but some are unavaible such as move into channels.

Did someone ever managed to do it?

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19 minutes ago, forlegaizen said:

Hi, is it possible to emulate the raumdeuter role from the wide midlefielder position, as i play in a 442 i dont want to move the WM to an AML. I tried giving him similiar instructions but some are unavaible such as move into channels.

Did someone ever managed to do it?

Make the player/s you are going to play learn move into channels.

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A question on team talks. Every time I praise my players for a win, without fail, the team talk feedback from my AssMan says they "let the feedback go to their head", i.e they'll become complacent for the next game.

How do you avoid this? If morale is already high, is there even any benefit to praising wins or should I just say nothing? Is giving pats on the back something that should only be done when morale isn't the best? Saying nothing is also a problem as players then become upset because they expected some positive feedback if they had a really good game.

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5 hours ago, bar333 said:

A question on team talks. Every time I praise my players for a win, without fail, the team talk feedback from my AssMan says they "let the feedback go to their head", i.e they'll become complacent for the next game.

How do you avoid this? If morale is already high, is there even any benefit to praising wins or should I just say nothing? Is giving pats on the back something that should only be done when morale isn't the best? Saying nothing is also a problem as players then become upset because they expected some positive feedback if they had a really good game.

They won't necessarily become complacent for the next match.  But whether they do or not you can still be assertive with them when you get to the next match and demand a performance.  "I expect nothing but a win" can help focus.

Also remember to mix up team talks.  Repetition also leads to players switching off.

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During one of those staff meetings, I got informed that a certain player of mine now possess a higher potential ability than he used to. 

How does that make sense? I thought that potential ability can't change. 

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Just now, Rummy said:

During one of those staff meetings, I got informed that a certain player of mine now possess a higher potential ability than he used to. 

How does that make sense? I thought that potential ability can't change. 

Actual PA cannot change, unless it's because of very serious injuries, which can see it drop. What you're referring to is just staff opinion.

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I got some problems against team which park the bus. My player camping at the edge of the opposition area without space to make some run into the area to reach a killer pass. I'm playing with Control and Very Fluid setting. Will lower mentality or decrease fluidity help to create more space? 

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Alright so asking this in here mainly because I'm stuck at work and can't just experiment myself.

 

Managing Lokomotiv Moscow. Had a successful first season and am now in the Champions League. I’ve been using the same basic tactic I’ve used for most of FM17 and am just looking to tweak. It’s a 4-1-4-1 based off of Ozil-to-the-Arsenal’s work on the site here. It works quite well and plays some lovely football. Its pretty defensively sound. I don't want to give up that defensively solidity but I'm just trying to see if there are ways to add new elements to the attack without going away from the basic solid shape.

 

Formation: 4-1-4-1

Team Shape: Very Fluid

Mentality: Counter

Team Instructions: Very High Defensive Line, Close Down Much More, Offside Trap, Prevent Short GK Distribution, Short Passing, Play out of Defence, and sometimes Pass Into Space

 

GK - GK-Defend

LB – Wing Back - Support

CD – Central Defender - Defend

CD – Ball Playing Defender

RB – Winger Back – Attack

DM – Defensive Midfield - Support

LW – Wide Midfielder - Attack

MC – Deep Lying Playmaker - Support

MC – Central Midfielder - Attack

RW – Wide Playmaker - Support

ST – Complete Striker – Support

 

In the first season, I was using the two wingers as Winger – Support but that was partly because of the players I had. I also used Full Back – Support rather than wingbacks. I was able to transform the team more than expected after the first season. I signed Nemanja Maksimovic (can play either CM role) and Bruno Zuchilini (either CM role or the DM). Being Russian, Miranchuk is one of my primary CMs and he is doing surprisingly well in either CM role. I have a couple of DMs who are a bit limited, which is part of my concern. I also added Nemaja Mihajlovic (from Partizan, can pay on either wing in a variety of roles), Vyacheslav Karavayev (very well rounded right back), Roman Shishkin (loan return), and Dmitry Poloz ( striker from Rostov). The squad feels more much dynamic now and I’m starting to toy around with the different roles. If the game was in front me, I would probably just do some role comparisons.

 

I originally had more conservative roles, but I feel like changes the roles can make things more dynamic without actually switching up the base tactic much. Been drawn into a relatively tough Champions League group so I do have some difficult matches coming up. I haven’t seen overt issues I want/need to deal with, so its more about what could change with switching up the roles.

 

So some questions I’ve been mulling….

 

Balance – does the mix of attack and support roles listed above look unbalanced? I was heavy on Support before, but with a couple more attack duties, I’m tempted to switch something to Defensive. Either the DM or DLP role can be made Defensive with sacrificing too much, I expect.

 

Anchor Man – I’ve used anchor man a few times in some tougher matches. Given the relatively limited skills of several of my DM options, it makes sense. But with using the DM (either Support or Defensive), I find he gets the ball a lot, acting as an outlet for the ball to move forward up the playmaker. As an AM, I wonder if he will be bypassed more, and that could limit the passing options for the defensive line, possibly turning the ball over in bad spots.

 

DLP - so I've been using him on Support mostly, but how much does the role change if I switch to defensive?

 

Roaming Playmaker – again stealing from Ozil-to-the-Arsenal, but I’ve wanted to try a DM as a Roaming Playmaker for a while. But since I don’t really have an ideal player, I keep meaning to try the DLP in the CM spot as a Roaming Playmaker. The two players I use there have solid physicals (for the level). How much would he roam? With the other CM on Attack, would I be possibly be leaving my middle exposed too much?

 

CM-Attack – I used a CM-Support in this spot for a while, and tried them on Attack, suddenly getting a lot more goals from midfield. With the DLP and DM, I don’t find their tendency to get forward exposes too much. How much different would a Box to Box be? I’ve wondered if that might provide a bit more defensive solidity.

 

WP and CWB – so I’ve just started using a Wide Playmaker on the right and the results have been nice but its only been a couple of matches. But I haven’t really noticed yet how static they are in terms of defensive shape. With the two rightbacks I have, I’m tempted to try a Complete Wing Back on the right, but will a Wide Playmaker on Support cover enough or would I probably have to switch him to a Wide Midfielder?

 

I might get to try to answer these myself before anyone has a chance to, but I figured it couldn’t hurt to ask. Any thoughts appreciated. 

 

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12 hours ago, max787 said:

For a goalkeeper, what is the difference between kicking and passing? And when does each attribute come into play?

 

47 minutes ago, samuelawachie said:

@max787 I think one has to do with distance whilst the other is accuracy? 

The best place to get an understanding of what player attributes do is the Online Manual found at the top of this forum - the tab just below the SI logo.  Hit that, then FM17, scroll down to Players, then scroll down again to the Attributes section.

Here's what it says for goalkeeper kicking:

"The physical capability of a goalkeeper to kick the ball – this purely defines the distance he can reach with a kick from hand or from the ground. His Passing rating will define how accurate his kicks are."

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1 hour ago, samuelawachie said:

@max787 I think one has to do with distance whilst the other is accuracy? 

 

24 minutes ago, herne79 said:

 

The best place to get an understanding of what player attributes do is the Online Manual found at the top of this forum - the tab just below the SI logo.  Hit that, then FM17, scroll down to Players, then scroll down again to the Attributes section.

Here's what it says for goalkeeper kicking:

"The physical capability of a goalkeeper to kick the ball – this purely defines the distance he can reach with a kick from hand or from the ground. His Passing rating will define how accurate his kicks are."

 

Thanks Herne and Samuel.

 

So, if you play with a sweeper keeper who mainly distributes to his back line then is the kicking attribute largely irrelevant since he's mostly playing short passes in order to retain possession?

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18 hours ago, Bigpapa42 said:

Roaming Playmaker – again stealing from Ozil-to-the-Arsenal, but I’ve wanted to try a DM as a Roaming Playmaker for a while. But since I don’t really have an ideal player, I keep meaning to try the DLP in the CM spot as a Roaming Playmaker. The two players I use there have solid physicals (for the level). How much would he roam? With the other CM on Attack, would I be possibly be leaving my middle exposed too much?

 

CM-Attack – I used a CM-Support in this spot for a while, and tried them on Attack, suddenly getting a lot more goals from midfield. With the DLP and DM, I don’t find their tendency to get forward exposes too much. How much different would a Box to Box be? I’ve wondered if that might provide a bit more defensive solidity.

 

So I experimented some last night. Main change was flipping the DLP-S in the left MC spot to a Roaming Playmaker. Although the main player isn't a pure creator (Miranchuk), I've come to expect match ratings of at least 8.0 and a minimum of 100 passes completed. And that's not just against the weaker Russian teams - its against CSKA, Spartak, and Zenit, as well as in Champions League. I haven't switched the other CM role and I may experiment with the Anchor Man role next. I considered putting the RB to Complete Wing Back, but as a Wing Back Attack, he's also average close to 8.0 and getting almost an assist per league match, so yeah, gonna leave it as is lol

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46 minutes ago, max787 said:

So, if you play with a sweeper keeper who mainly distributes to his back line then is the kicking attribute largely irrelevant since he's mostly playing short passes in order to retain possession?

Essentially, you are correct, but just keep in mind, as you've noted, that no matter how you have your distribution, he will still take long kicks at times. Some causes for this are a counter attack, using a target man, the more risky passes TI, more direct passing TI, or if the opponent is playing a high block against you and trying to prevent the short distribution or more generally covering your outlets. I don't typically privilege the kicking attribute either, but it can be helpful so my view is get it if you can :)

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Is leadership actually useful during matches? The online manual describes it like this:

"Leadership is the player’s ability to affect events or other players. Players with high Leadership will be influential on the pitch and team-mates will tend to rally around these players."

So how exactly would leadership be beneficial in matches? What does "being influential" and a "rally point" mean exactly?

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18 hours ago, bambos04 said:

Does a fluid team shape increase or decrease the gap between the flat lines of a 442 rather than a flexible one? Thank you :) 

As you become more Fluid, your vertical gaps between the lines decrease.

53 minutes ago, ppl_unicode said:

Probably was asked before - What does the term "player responsibility" mean regarding team shape , and how does it translate into the game engine? Thanks.

I'm not 100% sure what precisely you are asking here.  When Team Shape becomes more fluid, players become more likely to deviate away from your tactical instructions (they have greater creative freedom) and transitions become more pronounced.  Does that answer your question?

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8 minutes ago, herne79 said:

I'm not 100% sure what precisely you are asking here.  When Team Shape becomes more fluid, players become more likely to deviate away from your tactical instructions (they have greater creative freedom) and transitions become more pronounced.  Does that answer your question?

Thanks, I was referring to the term "responsibilty" as it's described in the specific team shape guides. For example: "Structured" - "Central defenders are responsible only for the defensive phase. The full backs and more defensive midfielders are reponsible for both defensive and transion phase...". What does it mean in terms of their behaviour on different duties?

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11 minutes ago, ppl_unicode said:

Thanks, I was referring to the term "responsibilty" as it's described in the specific team shape guides. For example: "Structured" - "Central defenders are responsible only for the defensive phase. The full backs and more defensive midfielders are reponsible for both defensive and transion phase...". What does it mean in terms of their behaviour on different duties?

Ahh I see :thup:.

Possibly one of the simplest ways to see the effect is to create a basic tactic with lets say a Wingback support (hopefully not a bad example!), and set Team Shape to Highly Structured.  Go to the Wingbacks' player instruction screen and look at the Blue "mentality" bar at the top.  Then, without doing anything else, head back to Team Shape and change it to Very Fluid.  Go back to the wingback's screen and see how the mentality bar has changed.  Now do the same for lets say a Complete Forward.

In essence, those individual mentality bars will become more aligned across roles as you become more Fluid (attackers mentality reduce, defenders mentality increase) and further apart as you become more structured.  So in Structured systems, Defenders, as you mention above, become more focused (more responsible if you like) on defending whereas attackers become more focused (more responsible) on attacking.

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6 minutes ago, herne79 said:

So in Structured systems, Defenders, as you mention above, become more focused (more responsible if you like) on defending whereas attackers become more focused (more responsible) on attacking.

So this is nothing more (not that its not important) than a change in their risk factor in relation to their position. The responsibilty issue confused me, since it hints that a wb/a won't be involved in attacks while on highly-structured.  

Thanks for explaining.

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5 hours ago, ppl_unicode said:

So this is nothing more (not that its not important) than a change in their risk factor in relation to their position. The responsibilty issue confused me, since it hints that a wb/a won't be involved in attacks while on highly-structured.  

Thanks for explaining.

Yeh I agree.  I find a helpful way to think about things is that player roles and duties define player behaviour, other tactical settings then modify that behaviour.

So in the case of the wb/a you mention, it will always have an attacking focus regardless of tactical settings (such as team shape) because that's how the role is defined.  Changing Team Shape to highly structured won't stop that wingback from being "attack minded", it'll just modify that focus to an extent.

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I have 2 questions about PPM training. 

1. If i want to my player to develop his weaker foot, and my trainer tell me he cant do it, how often are the trainers wrong? Anyone succeded/not succeded with forcing the ppm training?

2. If i would force it and it doesnt work, does it still take up CA?

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5 hours ago, kaffekatten said:

I have 2 questions about PPM training. 

1. If i want to my player to develop his weaker foot, and my trainer tell me he cant do it, how often are the trainers wrong? Anyone succeded/not succeded with forcing the ppm training?

2. If i would force it and it doesnt work, does it still take up CA?

1. There is no guarantee or % chance of success for PPM training to succeed, whether your coaches recommend it or not.  I've had PPMs succeed when coaches tell me they won't, and fail when coaches think it's ok, and vice versa.  Personally I find the chance to succeed far outweighs the chance to fail, others mileage may vary.

2.  PPMs don't take up CA.  In the case of developing the weaker foot trait, learning the trait doesn't actually give you a player with a stronger weak foot.  The PPM gives the player the ability to develop his weaker foot over time once he has learned the trait.  Only once he starts developing his weaker foot following completion of learning the PPM will he start to eat into CA.

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I am managing in Papua New Guinea. I have an option of preseason lasting anywhere from 3 weeks to 13 weeks.

I typically select the time based on how quickly I can get my players into match shape, tactical familiarity etc. But it got me to thinking about training.

Would those extra weeks help with getting my youngsters trained up faster? Or do players gain more from games? In PNG my players aren't very good so I figure even a slight improvement might be a factor.

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Have had a look around for a few guides with no luck so will post in here...

When assigning a position/role schedule on the individual training page, does this help your chances of player development or hinder it?

Reason I'm asking is, I ran an experiment without assigning any individual training to my players for one save and then on another save I set everyone on an individual schedule - I used the same team for both seasons (Liverpool) so no difference in facilities etc.

The results from what I gathered was that in the season where no individual training was applied (default), it seemed my players developed much more quickly than on the other save where each player had their own individual schedule. Results were also alot better in the first save although that could just be coincidence.

Team training was the same throughout both saves with an average workload.

Is there any up to date training guides to assist with this as I know the training side of things have had an overhaul over the past few years? As stated above, had no joy finding any at all. Any help would be appreciated 👍

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Question about getting `full green piecharts` - does it matter ?

I play with 3 Complete Forwards, although only one is. I do not think and have been told it does not matter to to get full green, sometimes I have 2 segments red!, but they play well and score.

I have been watching virtually the whole match lately to try and analyse, but I am not sure after a half match where I changed the player roles.

I will be trying to buy 2 more Complete forwards to test, but wondered if anyone of you have tested / have a theory?

thanks

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52 minutes ago, nextqprmanager said:

Question about getting `full green piecharts` - does it matter ?

I play with 3 Complete Forwards, although only one is. I do not think and have been told it does not matter to to get full green, sometimes I have 2 segments red!, but they play well and score.

I have been watching virtually the whole match lately to try and analyse, but I am not sure after a half match where I changed the player roles.

I will be trying to buy 2 more Complete forwards to test, but wondered if anyone of you have tested / have a theory?

thanks

It doesn't really matter. The players attributes are the most important thing as they decide whether your player can pull off a certain role and instructions.

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I've seen a recent post somewhere (can't find it again though) which noted that enabling the TI of Exploit the Middle pushes central players further up the pitch (or something close to that).  Is that correct?  Or does it just look to make more attacks through the central area?

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22 hours ago, jstu9 said:

I am managing in Papua New Guinea. I have an option of preseason lasting anywhere from 3 weeks to 13 weeks.

I typically select the time based on how quickly I can get my players into match shape, tactical familiarity etc. But it got me to thinking about training.

Would those extra weeks help with getting my youngsters trained up faster? Or do players gain more from games? In PNG my players aren't very good so I figure even a slight improvement might be a factor.

The pre-season is for match fitness primarily, so take enough time to schedule 7-8 friendlies and you should be able to get most of them ready to go by season start.

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Questions about width. 

As far as I know, the "Play Wider" and "Play Narrower" TI's affect only The attacking phase, is that correct? 

And does "Play Wider" tell the players to focus their passing on the flanks, and "Play Narrower" tell them to focus passing in the middle? Because in the game loading screen I remember that it says something like "Play Narrower tells your team to play in central areas of the pitch" something like that. 

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