Quickfire Questions and Answers Thread (Tactic and Training Questions Only)

[HUNT3R]

1 hour ago, poobington said:

I know it's quite late, with FM20 on the horizon, but I finally have made a tactic which creates great attacking football, but on the defensive side can be quite inconsistent. Can anyone give me some advice on how to shore things up defensively speaking?

 

 

This is a quickfire question answer section. Questions like yours are better off as separate threads. 

[Johnny Ace]

 I caught myself reading tactical reports on Bleacher Report so I thought I'll give in & ask here 

The 4-5-1 is the bane of my life at the minute, my 4-2-3-1 set-ups manage to win but it can be ugly & who wants to play ugly football?

Is there a formation that the 4-5-1 struggles against?

I've been toying with 4-4-2 diamonds & 4-3-1-2's with good results, I'm just wondering if I'm on the right track?

I came up against Arsenal in Europe & they came out with a 5-4-1 2DM, I switched to the 4-3-1-2 & came out 4-0 winners, I just prefer using players in AML/R strata 

 

[lferreira]

10 hours ago, Johnny Ace said:

 I caught myself reading tactical reports on Bleacher Report so I thought I'll give in & ask here 

The 4-5-1 is the bane of my life at the minute, my 4-2-3-1 set-ups manage to win but it can be ugly & who wants to play ugly football?

Is there a formation that the 4-5-1 struggles against?

I've been toying with 4-4-2 diamonds & 4-3-1-2's with good results, I'm just wondering if I'm on the right track?

I came up against Arsenal in Europe & they came out with a 5-4-1 2DM, I switched to the 4-3-1-2 & came out 4-0 winners, I just prefer using players in AML/R strata 

 

A well set up 4-4-2 can give it quite some trouble, especially on the counter.

Edited October 30, 2019 by lferreira

[Johnny Ace]

1 hour ago, lferreira said:

A well set up 4-4-2 can give it quite some trouble, especially on the counter.

There's zero chance of playing counter, there's nothing to counter 

[mikcheck]

Hello. I've read that training a player to improve his weaker foot makes him spend his PA. Is that true? If it is, I believe that its the same for FM17 version? Thanks.

[herne79]

46 minutes ago, mikcheck said:

Hello. I've read that training a player to improve his weaker foot makes him spend his PA. Is that true? If it is, I believe that its the same for FM17 version? Thanks.

Yes and no, and certainly not as much as some people think (PA is never actually "spent" anyway).

Training the Trait does nothing to CA/PA.  All it does (if successfully learnt) is give the player the ability to start improving his weaker foot - only once the Trait is learned does the weaker foot start to improve.  That improvement can then start to increase CA.

However, a player cannot improve their weaker foot beyond "Reasonable".  Thus any CA uplift is quite limited in scope and completely redundant if the player learning the Trait is already at (or beyond) Reasonable anyway.

[PJay]

Q: When do players do their individual training? If i have sessions that don't include individual roles, how much of an effect does the individual training have on a players attributes vs the team training.

[mikcheck]

9 horas atrás, herne79 disse:

Yes and no, and certainly not as much as some people think (PA is never actually "spent" anyway).

Training the Trait does nothing to CA/PA.  All it does (if successfully learnt) is give the player the ability to start improving his weaker foot - only once the Trait is learned does the weaker foot start to improve.  That improvement can then start to increase CA.

However, a player cannot improve their weaker foot beyond "Reasonable".  Thus any CA uplift is quite limited in scope and completely redundant if the player learning the Trait is already at (or beyond) Reasonable anyway.

Thanks.

Well, if it's not possible to go beyond reasonable, then it's pointless for me.

[herne79]

4 minutes ago, mikcheck said:

Thanks.

Well, if it's not possible to go beyond reasonable, then it's pointless for me.

Would be nice to know that in game, perhaps even not allowing players who are already at Reasonable to be able to learn the Trait.

[emil_sbn]

Is mentoring removed from the game, I cant find it or have they moved it so I just cant find it?

[gxL2o62DcgGQ2RNW]

25 minutes ago, emil_sbn said:

Is mentoring removed from the game, I cant find it or have they moved it so I just cant find it?

Click Training, then Mentoring.

[emil_sbn]

1 hour ago, gxL2o62DcgGQ2RNW said:

Click Training, then Mentoring.

Thanks!👍

[Marabak]

How important is a scout report of "doesn't enjoy big matches"? In the past, I've passed on players who have this trait, but I'm wondering whether it actually has much of an effect, or can even be removed with general squad personalities or mentoring etc. The reason I ask this time is that there is a great, reasonably priced GK I can get that will be a replacement for my current aging one, but this is the only downside that I think is worth considering.

[zlatanera]

On 03/11/2019 at 19:51, Marabak said:

How important is a scout report of "doesn't enjoy big matches"? In the past, I've passed on players who have this trait, but I'm wondering whether it actually has much of an effect, or can even be removed with general squad personalities or mentoring etc. The reason I ask this time is that there is a great, reasonably priced GK I can get that will be a replacement for my current aging one, but this is the only downside that I think is worth considering.

I think a few good performances in "big matches" can remove it. I remember on an FM18 save Giovanni Simeone had it yet only seemed to turn up in the "big" games i.e. (as Fiorentina) Juventus, Bologna, Empoli etc.

[TheGrahamF]

Is anticipation purely an attribute for attacking or should it be taken into consideration with defenders alongside positioning?

[HUNT3R]

1 hour ago, TheGrahamF said:

Is anticipation purely an attribute for attacking or should it be taken into consideration with defenders alongside positioning?

If you look at the manual's description, it's something that is useful for any player.

Quote

How well a player can predict and react to an event. If a player has a high attribute here he can read the game well and react to situations quicker than others. It also has a significant effect on a player’s awareness and whether they identify space for themselves to play in as well as reacting to signs of danger created by the opponent

 

[WhiteRose74]

When I look at Position suitability for an AM (L) the circle for Inverted Winger is fully Green. Exactly same attributes for same role as M (L) and yet the circle is now 1/2 orange and rating is unconvincing.... Why? And should I ignore it?

[Experienced Defender]

47 minutes ago, WhiteRose74 said:

When I look at Position suitability for an AM (L) the circle for Inverted Winger is fully Green. Exactly same attributes for same role as M (L) and yet the circle is now 1/2 orange and rating is unconvincing.... Why? And should I ignore it?

I'll avoid telling you to literally "ignore" it, but basically take the "role suitability" suggested by the game as secondary (and potentially misleading). Instead, look primarily at a player's attributes, traits (and in some cases footedness) to determine if he would be suitable to play a particular role. And if a player has the right attributes for an IW, then he clearly can play the role in both MR/L and AMR/L position.

[gandrasch]

My team (inter with lukaku and martinez) only has a 9% shots conversion rate. This feels incredibly low. The shot to shot on target is 45 which seems fine to me. Only every fifth shot on target is a goal. 

[Psycho.]

Can you train a player to become fully two-footed? Whenever I train a player who has already somewhat developed his weaker foot, my trainers advise against it. But I want my player to develop his weaker foot further and become two-footed.

[herne79]

1 hour ago, Psycho. said:

Can you train a player to become fully two-footed? Whenever I train a player who has already somewhat developed his weaker foot, my trainers advise against it. But I want my player to develop his weaker foot further and become two-footed.

No.  You cannot train a player past "Reasonable".  Only newgens "born" with it or existing real players identified by Researchers can be fully two footed.

[Fritz13]

1. I’ve just seen the first youth intake and it’s my DOF who is introducing them and commenting on his influence.

historically it’s been the HOYD so has this changed?

or have I set this myself in error?

 

2. I seem to have mucked up the default view on the tactics screen (right hand side) which showed the players in position order as default but then the team positions at the top 

[swansongs]

10 hours ago, Fritz13 said:

1. I’ve just seen the first youth intake and it’s my DOF who is introducing them and commenting on his influence.

historically it’s been the HOYD so has this changed?

or have I set this myself in error?

I had this and searched for ages trying to find how to fixed it as I paid my new HOYD a lot of money to apparently do nothing, but couldn't find the button. I'm sure there used to be one in previous years.

[jeaku14]

To select multiple players on a list (eg. to scout multiple players with one click) I used to hold shift, then press the first player, and the last player, and all the ones in between would be selected.

On FM20 this doesn't work, so I have to click on each player individually to select multiple.

Has this changed for FM20? I'm playing on a Mac btw.

Thanks!

[Bakiano]

Just a random question, when you select in TI press more urgent and when you see in some PIs less pressing, does it mean they will press the opponent but not so much like other players that have standard pressing in their PIs or it mean they will just press less?

[kandersson]

A couple of questions about player traits that actually got me thinking since were known as PPM's:

- Plays one-twos:  do I ideally need two players with this trait to maximize the effect of this, i.e. the one who starts the one-two and the one that makes the final pass? Are there other complementary traits that can help seeing this more often? For example, I think comes deep to get ball should help initiating the one-two, but gets into opposition area (contrasting to the former trait) or tries to beat offside also make sense once the move has started.

- Gets Forward Whenever Possible vs Gets Into Opposition Area: what's the difference, really? On-line manual says the first ''Increases the frequency with which a player makes forward runs, adjusting for team mentality'', while the other one ''Mostly governs how often a player makes forward runs but can be overridden by Player Instructions.''. Is this the main difference? Mentality vs PI's?

[koimes]

https://community.sigames.com/faq/football-manager-2018/156_gameplay/scouting/

This FAQ mentions that scouting packages increase the number of players shown in your player searches but the club's scouting range determines which countries the scouts are able to scout. How can I find my club's scouting range? The FAQ mentions that this is on the  club’s Board page within the Scouting panel, but I cannot find that in 2020?

[herne79]

23 hours ago, Bakiano said:

Just a random question, when you select in TI press more urgent and when you see in some PIs less pressing, does it mean they will press the opponent but not so much like other players that have standard pressing in their PIs or it mean they will just press less?

It means they'll just press less.  The TI sets the starting point (actually Mentality does but lets stick with TIs vs PIs) the PI then adjusts from that starting point rather than just ignoring the TI.

10 hours ago, kandersson said:

A couple of questions about player traits that actually got me thinking since were known as PPM's:

- Plays one-twos:  do I ideally need two players with this trait to maximize the effect of this, i.e. the one who starts the one-two and the one that makes the final pass? Are there other complementary traits that can help seeing this more often? For example, I think comes deep to get ball should help initiating the one-two, but gets into opposition area (contrasting to the former trait) or tries to beat offside also make sense once the move has started.

- Gets Forward Whenever Possible vs Gets Into Opposition Area: what's the difference, really? On-line manual says the first ''Increases the frequency with which a player makes forward runs, adjusting for team mentality'', while the other one ''Mostly governs how often a player makes forward runs but can be overridden by Player Instructions.''. Is this the main difference? Mentality vs PI's?

1) Ideally yes but Off the Ball Movements and Acceleration are going to be important too.

2) The former is mainly for deeper players such as fullbacks or perhaps attacking midfielders.  The latter mainly for more advanced players such as strikers or attacking midfielders / wingers (eg., Raumdeuters) who you want to be more of a goal threat.

1 hour ago, koimes said:

https://community.sigames.com/faq/football-manager-2018/156_gameplay/scouting/

This FAQ mentions that scouting packages increase the number of players shown in your player searches but the club's scouting range determines which countries the scouts are able to scout. How can I find my club's scouting range? The FAQ mentions that this is on the  club’s Board page within the Scouting panel, but I cannot find that in 2020?

This thread is for Tactics or Training questions.  You're best off asking in the General Discussion forum.

[Bakiano]

41 minutes ago, herne79 said:

It means they'll just press less.  The TI sets the starting point (actually Mentality does but lets stick with TIs vs PIs) the PI then adjusts from that starting point rather than just ignoring the TI.

Okay, thanks for the answer. 

[isignedupfornorealreason]

Anyone having success replicating the IF back in the MR/L areas?

I've always gone with a WM/A, set up in that area, and I see him getting into the box as a second striker with regularity. However, I'm not seeing any of the impressive runs with the ball as I used to do in previous FM's. I'm wondering if this might be a knock on from my shifting the second striker down into AM position, but I thought I'd ask and see if anyone else is having luck with the role?

[Gee_Simpson]

I know certain shapes are better than others for playing a possession game, but could the 4312/442 diamond work with using a possession approach? 

Edited November 13, 2019 by Gee_Simpson

[herne79]

29 minutes ago, Gee_Simpson said:

I know certain shapes are better than others for playing a possession game, but could the 4312/442 diamond work with using a possession approach? 

No reason why not .  Just keep those fullbacks under control so they don't cross at every given opportunity.

[Gee_Simpson]

20 minutes ago, herne79 said:

No reason why not .  Just keep those fullbacks under control so they don't cross at every given opportunity.

Thanks.

I'm thinking WB (s) will be ideal for the fullbacks considering they are the ones who provide most of the width, and on this duty they shouldn't cross so much. I would imagine FB (s) is too conservative for a diamond. 

[Fritz13]

Just asked this on Rashid’s thread forgetting that I should have asked it here 

What are the pros/cons for adding reserve and youth team players to the first team squad training units?

 

 

[herne79]

2 hours ago, Gee_Simpson said:

Thanks.

I'm thinking WB (s) will be ideal for the fullbacks considering they are the ones who provide most of the width, and on this duty they shouldn't cross so much. I would imagine FB (s) is too conservative for a diamond. 

Pay attention to the fullback's Traits too.

1 hour ago, Fritz13 said:

Just asked this on Rashid’s thread forgetting that I should have asked it here 

What are the pros/cons for adding reserve and youth team players to the first team squad training units?

•  

If you do this, just bear in mind they'll be training with the first team's program, which is geared towards when the first team matches are played.  That won't be the same as when youth / reserve matches are played.  In other words, keep an extra eye on how those players are developing.

[BrickCommo23]

Hi all,

This might be a slightly stupid/odd question but here goes.

I am managing Arsenal (it's literally ALL Unai's fault I have bought this game) and I want to create a really positive (with and without the ball), mobile, quick and strong side. My formation is a standard 4231. 

As a result of the characteristics I want to create, I've just defaulted to 'Much Higher Line of Engagement' and 'Much Higher Defensive Line' and 'very urgent' pressing. 

Overall, the tactic is working well but better teams are able to switch the ball relatively quickly, break the press and be in on my back four. Now, I know this is completely *the* trade off with high pressing systems but I wondered...

Is it possible to compact the pitch (when defending) by dropping the line of engagement back to standard and the defensive line to either 'higher' or 'standard' but then keep pressing as 'very urgent'? 

Or does dropping the lines back essentially make you quite passive without the ball and actually a 'counter attacking' team as a result? 

As we all are, I am just trying to find a happy balance but wondering if there is more than one way to aggressively press but also remaining compact and difficult to beat.

Hope that makes sense!

Thank you

 

[Gee_Simpson]

2 hours ago, BrickCommo23 said:

Hi all,

This might be a slightly stupid/odd question but here goes.

I am managing Arsenal (it's literally ALL Unai's fault I have bought this game) and I want to create a really positive (with and without the ball), mobile, quick and strong side. My formation is a standard 4231. 

As a result of the characteristics I want to create, I've just defaulted to 'Much Higher Line of Engagement' and 'Much Higher Defensive Line' and 'very urgent' pressing. 

Overall, the tactic is working well but better teams are able to switch the ball relatively quickly, break the press and be in on my back four. Now, I know this is completely *the* trade off with high pressing systems but I wondered...

Is it possible to compact the pitch (when defending) by dropping the line of engagement back to standard and the defensive line to either 'higher' or 'standard' but then keep pressing as 'very urgent'? 

Or does dropping the lines back essentially make you quite passive without the ball and actually a 'counter attacking' team as a result? 

As we all are, I am just trying to find a happy balance but wondering if there is more than one way to aggressively press but also remaining compact and difficult to beat.

Hope that makes sense!

Thank you

 

I'm not an expert but I have learned quite a lot about the 4231 thanks to @Experienced Defender 

It's fine to drop the LOE to make yourself more compact defensively when using the 4231 as it has no DM cover so you want to make yourself compact defensively. If you are using a positive mentality (I'm assuming this is the mentality you chose?) your press will already be quite  aggressive without any other TI's as your mentality has an impact on these settings. You are absolutely on the tight track here with your thinking, 'standard' LOE and 'much higher' or even just 'higher' with 'very urgent' should work. I would maybe even recommend dropping the 'very urgent' to just 'urgent' because as I mentioned before, 'positive' is already quite an aggressive mentality so 'very urgent' is a little OTT.  

Edited November 14, 2019 by Gee_Simpson

[Gee_Simpson]

3 hours ago, herne79 said:

Pay attention to the fullback's Traits too.

Thanks. If I run into any more problems with this shape I will create a thread 

[FrazT]

FM 20- Team Selection Advice.  This appears before every game, but appears just to recommend the same players every game.  Does it ever react to form, condition or any other factors that managers would normally use to rotate their squad?

[warlock]

4 hours ago, FrazT said:

FM 20- Team Selection Advice.  This appears before every game, but appears just to recommend the same players every game

That's odd - I'm seeing frequent recommendations to rotate in players to improve their fitness or because they've done well in training. Might be one of those 'better AssMan, better advice' things?

[herne79]

4 hours ago, FrazT said:

FM 20- Team Selection Advice.  This appears before every game, but appears just to recommend the same players every game.  Does it ever react to form, condition or any other factors that managers would normally use to rotate their squad?

Honestly I didn't even know that was a thing.

[FrazT]

4 minutes ago, warlock said:

That's odd - I'm seeing frequent recommendations to rotate in players to improve their fitness or because they've done well in training. Might be one of those 'better AssMan, better advice' things?

That is entirely possible- thanks

[Hovis Dexter]

I use the Team Selection Advice option before every match and find it very useful - an excellent addition to the game IMO

[Bakiano]

13 minutes ago, Hovis Dexter said:

I use the Team Selection Advice option before every match and find it very useful - an excellent addition to the game IMO

I have the same opinion. When I must select the team on matchday, I do maybe just some changes.

[Dalehero]

I want to make space behind the opposition's defence by bringing them out to attack me. I'm playing a deep defensive line with a back four and two holding midfielders in a 4231, are there any key TIs which are really important to make this work?

[herne79]

14 minutes ago, Dalehero said:

I want to make space behind the opposition's defence by bringing them out to attack me. I'm playing a deep defensive line with a back four and two holding midfielders in a 4231, are there any key TIs which are really important to make this work?

Rather than TIs I'd start with formation and player roles/duties.  With the regular 4231 of 1 striker and 3 players at AMC/L/R, you have 4 players positioned high up the pitch, so why would the opposition's defence come out and leave space behind?  Think about your advanced players dropping deep to hopefully bring opposition defenders out - and then think about how you can attack the space the defence is leaving in behind them.

[ChrisCo]

I've been struggling a bit with this year's iteration of FM, although this was pre-Beta 20.1, I was sacked in under 3 months by Werder Bremen trying to implement high-pressing, attacking football. My worst performance on FM in over 15 years of playing!

I am looking to start a new game soon, eyeing up AS Roma and looking to implement some effective counter-attacking football this time. This is not a strategy I have pursued before, but I have done a fair amount of reading of the resources on this forum and have a fairly good idea of how to implement it. 

My question is, when you are a strong team in a league and want to play counter-attacking football, how do you implement this against poorer teams who will be looking to sit back and soak up pressure themselves? 

[BrickCommo23]

11 hours ago, Gee_Simpson said:

I'm not an expert but I have learned quite a lot about the 4231 thanks to @Experienced Defender 

It's fine to drop the LOE to make yourself more compact defensively when using the 4231 as it has no DM cover so you want to make yourself compact defensively. If you are using a positive mentality (I'm assuming this is the mentality you chose?) your press will already be quite  aggressive without any other TI's as your mentality has an impact on these settings. You are absolutely on the tight track here with your thinking, 'standard' LOE and 'much higher' or even just 'higher' with 'very urgent' should work. I would maybe even recommend dropping the 'very urgent' to just 'urgent' because as I mentioned before, 'positive' is already quite an aggressive mentality so 'very urgent' is a little OTT.  

Hi, thank you for the reply. 

I'm on either positive or attacking (at work - going off memory) so from your explanation I can probably afford to drop both options a little and still remain difficult to beat.

I've also noticed that dropping David Luiz helps in that regard too!!

[herne79]

1 hour ago, ChrisCo said:

My question is, when you are a strong team in a league and want to play counter-attacking football, how do you implement this against poorer teams who will be looking to sit back and soak up pressure themselves?

I'll answer that with another question (bad form I know ).  Why - as a strong team - would you want to play counter attacking football against poorer teams who look to sit back?  You can't counter attack a team who just sit deep, the whole point of counter attacking is to draw teams out so that they over extend before hitting them on the break, which poor teams who sit deep are very unlikely to do.

[ChrisCo]

1 hour ago, herne79 said:

I'll answer that with another question (bad form I know ).  Why - as a strong team - would you want to play counter attacking football against poorer teams who look to sit back?  You can't counter attack a team who just sit deep, the whole point of counter attacking is to draw teams out so that they over extend before hitting them on the break, which poor teams who sit deep are very unlikely to do.

Fair question, I guess what I am looking for more fundamentally is an effective direct playing style, it is not something I have been able to successfully implement in the last couple of FMs. I have had to use tika-taka/vertical tika-taka to have any success, I get frustrated at the endless recycling of the ball just to fizzle out with a poor attempt from range. I want to implement meaningful direct vertical passing to breakdown teams, but not quite route one. I guess Atletico Madrid's style might be best equated to what I am after.