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Quickfire Questions and Answers Thread (Tactic and Training Questions Only)

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Cool, thanks.

That gives me inspiration and strength to try it in an old save i have from FM08 :D

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Can anyone elucidate why a wingback (a) can only close down less or much less than the team (the TI is set to close down much more) ??? why can't he close down sometimes (like the team) ????... it seems the question suits any player.

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Hey, I'm looking for some clarification. While playing with Ajax I noticed center mid Nemanja Gudelj has the PPM "Static Target Man". Does it reflects his play only if he plays as a forward or does it actually affects his actions as a center mid? If so how?

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Hey, I'm looking for some clarification. While playing with Ajax I noticed center mid Nemanja Gudelj has the PPM "Static Target Man". Does it reflects his play only if he plays as a forward or does it actually affects his actions as a center mid? If so how?

It means he doesn't move around much when your side has possession, so he'd expect the ball being accurately played to him. Rather than him running onto balls or chasing them down etc. It can be good or bad on midfielders depending on how you play.

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Hello Cleon, I am trying to use my striker as a target man, but I do not want my defenders just playing it long, any tips on how to do this? I use a single striker in a 4-3-3.

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It means he doesn't move around much when your side has possession, so he'd expect the ball being accurately played to him. Rather than him running onto balls or chasing them down etc. It can be good or bad on midfielders depending on how you play.

Interesting, thanks for the help. Will defenitely check how it plays.

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Can anyone elucidate why a wingback (a) can only close down less or much less than the team (the TI is set to close down much more) ??? why can't he close down sometimes (like the team) ????... it seems the question suits any player.

anyone ?

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anyone ?

A wingback on attack is set to close down sometimes already. Then you have the option to change that to less or much less. So not sure what you're asking here?

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Interesting, thanks for the help. Will defenitely check how it plays.

It was in the game last year but has been renamed this year. It used to be 'Penalty Box Player'.

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Hello Cleon, I am trying to use my striker as a target man, but I do not want my defenders just playing it long, any tips on how to do this? I use a single striker in a 4-3-3.

I am no Cleon, but the answer to your question as far as I know is that you can't avoid this problem. In some ways, it works as it should. The guy is a target for passes, so they will lump it forward to him whenever it is practical (or not, even) to do so. But, I don't like to use it much because it gives away the ball too much for my taste. The one time I had some success with it was as a target man support with players nearby to receive the flickons or passes and such.

I think that to get what you want you can't really use target man role as it stands. Better to probably use him as an advanced forward and get crosses into the box where he will be. That might be one way to achieving this.

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A wingback on attack is set to close down sometimes already. Then you have the option to change that to less or much less. So not sure what you're asking here?

The issue is that "sometimes" is not in the PI, not even as hard-coded, the only two options are close down less or much less. Wouldn't it be more clarifying if we could see that he's already set to close down sometimes ?

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The issue is that "sometimes" is not in the PI, not even as hard-coded, the only two options are close down less or much less. Wouldn't it be more clarifying if we could see that he's already set to close down sometimes ?

You can already see him as this though.

fEyzbPh.png

And that's with the TI of close down much more active.

So I've still no idea what you are on about.

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Stupid question #6346254

If I ask players to aim crosses at a target man, but don't employ one, what happens?

Ta

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Stupid question #6346254

If I ask players to aim crosses at a target man, but don't employ one, what happens?

Ta

Nothing because you don't have one.

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Nothing because you don't have one.

Suspected so, thanks.

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You can already see him as this though.

And that's with the TI of close down much more active.

So I've still no idea what you are on about.

Thanks for the screenshot, I do not remember what I had set, but I had some TI to close down more and the winback PI didn't have the option to close down like the team. But right now, I'm looking at the False 9 and he can't close down like the team, only less or much less.

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Thank you Dr. Hook, think I have managed to do it somewhat. I use a DLF(s), but this keeps him too low for my liking, what I am aiming for is a striker who will play high up, but keeps it simple when in possession. Just a passing outlet for the rest of the team, and when he has released the ball, looks for new space, or gets into the box. Think I will try a Defensive Forward. The thing with a DF is that my team seems to lump it up towards him, mutch like with a TM =(

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I'm playing a 442 on a counter mentality will a midfield pairing of CM-D and CM-S be too weak defensively?

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I am an American guy who has been playing FM for 4 years now, each year getting the new game. However, these previous years I have just shopped around here and other forums for tactics to use. I just don't understand formations, roles, instructions enough to create my own tactic. But I have hoping to change that this year.

I have also had the wrong mentality this whole time. With american football, typically, if you want to score a lot and pass a lot, you put your QB in shotgun and give him 4 or so wide receivers every play. So, I used that mentality with soccer. If I want to score I a lot, then that means I must deploy a formation that has multiple strikers and attacking mids, right? But that is wrong, isn't it? Having 3 guys up front doesn't necessarily mean I am setting myself up to score a lot, does it? You can have one guy up front and play pretty conservatively and still dominate the scoreboard, right?

Anyways, here is a question I have. I am doing some research on formations and found an article about the 4-4-2 and how it died out because the "lack of traditional targetmen and a severe lack of classic No. 7s and No. 11s."

What do they mean by that? What do they mean by the classic No. 7 and No. 11?

Thanks!

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I am an American guy who has been playing FM for 4 years now, each year getting the new game. However, these previous years I have just shopped around here and other forums for tactics to use. I just don't understand formations, roles, instructions enough to create my own tactic. But I have hoping to change that this year.

I have also had the wrong mentality this whole time. With american football, typically, if you want to score a lot and pass a lot, you put your QB in shotgun and give him 4 or so wide receivers every play. So, I used that mentality with soccer. If I want to score I a lot, then that means I must deploy a formation that has multiple strikers and attacking mids, right? But that is wrong, isn't it? Having 3 guys up front doesn't necessarily mean I am setting myself up to score a lot, does it? You can have one guy up front and play pretty conservatively and still dominate the scoreboard, right?

Anyways, here is a question I have. I am doing some research on formations and found an article about the 4-4-2 and how it died out because the "lack of traditional targetmen and a severe lack of classic No. 7s and No. 11s."

What do they mean by that? What do they mean by the classic No. 7 and No. 11?

Thanks!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squad_number_%28association_football%29

Number 7 & 11 are generally referred to as traditional wingers.

If you want to learn football (or soccer) I would read this: http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/423054-Lines-and-Diamonds-The-Tactician-s-Handbook-for-Football-Manager-2015

It's written for FM15 but it explain a lot of general concepts also!

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Still on 15 but guess this applies to 16 as well anyway. Still after a year struggling with any sort of consistency from an AM role and have been thinking about the PI "moves into channels". Can I assume that if you want your AM to be more of a creator then it's best not to have the PI "move into channels" active? The reason I ask is that technically that suggests he will then move into the channels between CB and FB where as if you want him to stay in "the hole" and pick out passes himself that's the last place you want him to be moving to. However I guess also it depends on what roles your striker(s) have. Two deep lying strikers you may want the AM getting beyond them so "MIC" would be a good thing. But generally if you want him picking out your CF or AF with passes you just want him in that hole? Also if he is peeling away and moving into channels you will need a creator of some sort behind him because if say you play with an AM and two forwards all pulling into the channels they are all technically running away from the ball. Am I correct or totally wrong?

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Thank you Dr. Hook, think I have managed to do it somewhat. I use a DLF(s), but this keeps him too low for my liking, what I am aiming for is a striker who will play high up, but keeps it simple when in possession. Just a passing outlet for the rest of the team, and when he has released the ball, looks for new space, or gets into the box. Think I will try a Defensive Forward. The thing with a DF is that my team seems to lump it up towards him, mutch like with a TM =(

The team don't lump it towards a DF because he's not set up like a TM. If you are seeing this then it's another issue causing it and seems like a lack of movement/options. The role you want pretty much describes a DLF on attack.

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Still on 15 but guess this applies to 16 as well anyway. Still after a year struggling with any sort of consistency from an AM role and have been thinking about the PI "moves into channels". Can I assume that if you want your AM to be more of a creator then it's best not to have the PI "move into channels" active? The reason I ask is that technically that suggests he will then move into the channels between CB and FB where as if you want him to stay in "the hole" and pick out passes himself that's the last place you want him to be moving to. However I guess also it depends on what roles your striker(s) have. Two deep lying strikers you may want the AM getting beyond them so "MIC" would be a good thing. But generally if you want him picking out your CF or AF with passes you just want him in that hole? Also if he is peeling away and moving into channels you will need a creator of some sort behind him because if say you play with an AM and two forwards all pulling into the channels they are all technically running away from the ball. Am I correct or totally wrong?

Correct. If you have a creator and he's got people in front of him running away from goal or not in dangerous positions then what's the point of using a creator? If the creator isn't in the best place to be creative and supply the attacking players with the ball then what's the point of him? You need to find the balance for what you've created.

I linked you two threads recently that was focused on a creator and another one that spoke about creating goalscorers.

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I still don't get you. Paul Scholes largely played exclusively in the middle vertical third of the pitch. He was renowned for exceptional long range passing to the flanks, but those are not crosses, they are passes into space in FM terms. Show me some regular footage of Scholes making a lung-busting run out wide and putting a cross in.

Why does it have to be a lung-busting run followed by a cross though? I can't speak about Scholes, but Xavi would on occasion cross a ball and surprise the opposition - check: 2009 UCL Final the cross for Messi's goal:D

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Correct. If you have a creator and he's got people in front of him running away from goal or not in dangerous positions then what's the point of using a creator? If the creator isn't in the best place to be creative and supply the attacking players with the ball then what's the point of him? You need to find the balance for what you've created.

I linked you two threads recently that was focused on a creator and another one that spoke about creating goalscorers.

Cleon, what about a playmaker who has the PPM "moves into channels", like Ozil? What negative and/or positive does that bring? How may that play into a decision what role to give him, along with the roles of the players around him?

I'm asking specifically because for FM16 I'm thinking of experimenting creating a tactic (with Arsenal) based around the playmaking abilities of Ozil and goalscoring abilities of players around him. I want to use him at his best/most natural position as AMC, with STC in front and 2 MCs behind him. Still haven't decided if I want to/should use AMRL, MRL or combination of one of each (ex: AML and MR). In addition, he also has "comes deep to get the ball" as you may be aware....and I'm wondering what would happen if I made him learn "gets into opposition area" (can I even make him learn that?...don't know) or some other forward moving PPM? In other words, to give him an "arsenal" (no pun intended) of PPMs and freedom to choose based on his attributes (which are great, of course) and of course role/duty to execute his playmaking ability.

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Cleon, what about a playmaker who has the PPM "moves into channels", like Ozil? What negative and/or positive does that bring? How may that play into a decision what role to give him, along with the roles of the players around him?

I'm asking specifically because for FM16 I'm thinking of experimenting creating a tactic (with Arsenal) based around the playmaking abilities of Ozil and goalscoring abilities of players around him. I want to use him at his best/most natural position as AMC, with STC in front and 2 MCs behind him. Still haven't decided if I want to/should use AMRL, MRL or combination of one of each (ex: AML and MR). In addition, he also has "comes deep to get the ball" as you may be aware....and I'm wondering what would happen if I made him learn "gets into opposition area" (can I even make him learn that?...don't know) or some other forward moving PPM? In other words, to give him an "arsenal" (no pun intended) of PPMs and freedom to choose based on his attributes (which are great, of course) and of course role/duty to execute his playmaking ability.

I think it'll be fine. Moves into channels is a good PPM for a playmaker because it means he is roaming about creating and finding space. But if your creator is roaming about then the players infront of him or the players he will be playing in need to be more static if not he might not have anyone to aim for. So in short if the playmaker roams (talking AMC only here btw) then the attackers shouldn't really be roaming as much as this can mean you have no-one who is a goal threat. I think Ozil drifting around with a Giroud type up front and a Sanchez/Walcott running inside would work well. I actually think something based around that would bring the best out of all four of those players.

Teaching him gets into the oppositions area is a good idea too, it adds to the things he can do. He's also very intelligent so it should add another level to his play and possibly make him more of a goal threat. Actually this I wrote the other month might be useful for deciding what to do with Ozil and how to get him scoring and creating a lot;

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/427810-Meet-The-Attacking-Midfield-Playmaker

It might give you a different idea on how to utilise him while having him as the focal point.

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I think it'll be fine. Moves into channels is a good PPM for a playmaker because it means he is roaming about creating and finding space. But if your creator is roaming about then the players infront of him or the players he will be playing in need to be more static if not he might not have anyone to aim for. So in short if the playmaker roams (talking AMC only here btw) then the attackers shouldn't really be roaming as much as this can mean you have no-one who is a goal threat. I think Ozil drifting around with a Giroud type up front and a Sanchez/Walcott running inside would work well. I actually think something based around that would bring the best out of all four of those players.

Teaching him gets into the oppositions area is a good idea too, it adds to the things he can do. He's also very intelligent so it should add another level to his play and possibly make him more of a goal threat. Actually this I wrote the other month might be useful for deciding what to do with Ozil and how to get him scoring and creating a lot;

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/427810-Meet-The-Attacking-Midfield-Playmaker

It might give you a different idea on how to utilise him while having him as the focal point.

Yes, I read your article as I always do even if I don't comment or add anything to the discussions. I enjoyed this one as I did the one about the DLP a few years ago. Actually the article you linked is what inspired me to create something like that once FM16 was released (at least the Beta). I've always been a fan and admirer of Ozil, even as Barca fan when he played for Real Madrid. I think he is the best natural advanced/attacking playmaker since Zidane.

In your article you went from using a Trequartista to using an regular AM-A....I understand why and can see the effects. However, I'm not sure how I can use that to help me with my decision what role to give Ozil. Of course, the role I choose for him will have knock on effect on other roles and vice versa I guess. I'm ruling out Support Duty roles for him because I want him focused on attacking, creating chances and being closer to goal to score himself on occasion. Then there is also the fact that I have to balance the duties and distribute them appropriately so it all works together. If my AMC is on Attack, most likely the AML will be also, which means one of STC or AMR has to be on Support (I may be able to get away with using ST on Attack and MR on Attack). Can a trio of IF-A/T-A/W-A work behind a DLF-S? Would the DLF be enough of a goal threat? What if the DLF is on Attack and the Winger is on Support? What if the Winger is on Attack but from the MR position? I could use WM-A from ML and W-A from MR with a Poacher or DLF-A up front.

So many things to figure out.....I know one of my MCs will be a CM-D for sure....the other one....DLP perhaps

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Correct. If you have a creator and he's got people in front of him running away from goal or not in dangerous positions then what's the point of using a creator? If the creator isn't in the best place to be creative and supply the attacking players with the ball then what's the point of him? You need to find the balance for what you've created.

Thanks Cleon. So if I were to play a

DLF S-------------CF A

---------AM A/S------

what PI "move into channels" wise would you use on them? I got the idea months ago with Rashidi's 4312 but he uses a DLF S---F9---AM and all use MIC which I can understand because all three obviously combine with little short passes for him and I suspect his F9 and AM score a few with his DLF being an assist maker.

I use the set up I have because Valencia regularly bags 30 odd goals a season but have always had trouble getting much out of the DLF or consistency out of the AM. Sakho bags goals when Valencia is out at CF but does very little at DLF. I've tried him at every other role but to no avail. So I'd appreciate your advice on PI's for those three roles.

I linked you two threads recently that was focused on a creator and another one that spoke about creating goalscorers.

Did you? Where abouts was this?

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I need help here regarding to SS (shadow striker) on FM 16.

I'm using 4-2(dm's)-3-1. the DMS's are half back and regista. usually i'm using the AMC as trequartista, but I have a good young player who's good at SS. when im using him as SS, I feel he playing exactly as trequartista. moving around a lot, staying as AMC position and barely Threatening the goal.

I tried to play with F9, DLF, DLP in front of him but nothing...

I'm interested to see and hear how you using the SS... thanks

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I would really like to understand this (although I made a mistake with my former noob question about the wing-back), but I have an IF that has an option to close down less or much less, the same for an AP with attack duty, the same for an AP with support suty, the same for the False 9. Why can't these guys close down like the team (meaning, the team instruction) ??? :eek:

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Two questions.. firstly my CM-D in a 451 (flat) shape Standard Flexible had close down more as a default? Not sure why but then when I give him the PI Close down less it says he has both close down more and close down less as PIs? Which is confusing and not sure which he listens to?

And secondly the training is different.. If I pick someone to train as an Inside Forward for example I assume they will be focusing on all the attributes recommended for a good inside forward? Is there any way to check this or see what attributes they are focusing on? Also can I select how heavy they are focusing on the role like in FM15 where I would have someone training under Inside Forward under a heavy intensity?? Can't find out where.. Thanks

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Having som problem with Harry Kane, hes scores but. Well, not as much as i would want! Hes scored 10 in 24(3), so its not that bad. He isnt gettin in to good positions around the box. Been tryin with different types of setups

4-2-3-1, flexible, control and changing depending on opposition. IF i use fluid, how does that differ to flexible? The main things?

CF(S)

Winger(A) - Ap-(s) - IF(A)

dlp(s) - CM(d)

I have been changing alot, but this is what i use right now. I have batshuyai(sp?) and its the same problem with him

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Having som problem with Harry Kane, hes scores but. Well, not as much as i would want! Hes scored 10 in 24(3), so its not that bad. He isnt gettin in to good positions around the box. Been tryin with different types of setups

4-2-3-1, flexible, control and changing depending on opposition. IF i use fluid, how does that differ to flexible? The main things?

CF(S)

Winger(A) - Ap-(s) - IF(A)

dlp(s) - CM(d)

I have been changing alot, but this is what i use right now. I have batshuyai(sp?) and its the same problem with him

Does he still has shoot from distance ppm in FM 16? If he does, I suggest giving him the DF(S) or DLF(S) role instead. Players(especially strikers) with shoot from distance ppm and rwb often normally just shoot alot more from the outside.

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Never been a fan of 2 playmakers in the side. So I'd never go with a DLP and an AP but that's a personal preference. It just doesn't seem as effective as a single playmaker.

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away games, any tactics for this, rather fed up of this version after version.

Depends on what is happening to you obviously, but the usual answer is that if you are a strong team on a winning streak, teams shut up shop and if you roll on with attacking strategies you will just get frustrated. A bit of individual brilliance will still work, or a great long shot, but often what happens is you are trying to get the ball into a tightly packed area and your attackers are not finding space. In these cases (and if this is not you, I apologize) you have to dial it back a bit and stretch the play in both width and depth. You have to pull the defense apart somehow. This can be as simple as adopting a more conservative strategy, or changing roles that drop deeper or play wider. Anything that gets the defense moving to create openings.

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I'm interested to see and hear how you using the SS... thanks

I'm using a SS at time with a 4-2-3-1 with two CMs. I have DLF (S) in front of him, and he gets forward all the time, and scores a good bit 6 in 12, though the DLF is more of a goal scoring threat. He does resemble the Treq at times, but I see a lot more forward penentration than you are noticing. I think a key is to have space ahead, so your F needs to be dropping off or going wide to open up room for the SS. If you notice his default position is a lot close to the striker than the standard AMC. DId you try the DLK of support? If so, you might try getting him to move out wide into channels.

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I'm using a SS at time with a 4-2-3-1 with two CMs. I have DLF (S) in front of him, and he gets forward all the time, and scores a good bit 6 in 12, though the DLF is more of a goal scoring threat. He does resemble the Treq at times, but I see a lot more forward penentration than you are noticing. I think a key is to have space ahead, so your F needs to be dropping off or going wide to open up room for the SS. If you notice his default position is a lot close to the striker than the standard AMC. DId you try the DLK of support? If so, you might try getting him to move out wide into channels.

Dr. Hook can you help ? Thanks :)

I would really like to understand this (although I made a mistake with my former noob question about the wing-back), but I have an IF that has an option to close down less or much less, the same for an AP with attack duty, the same for an AP with support suty, the same for the False 9. Why can't these guys close down like the team (meaning, the team instruction) ???

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Dr. Hook can you help ? Thanks :)

I would really like to understand this (although I made a mistake with my former noob question about the wing-back), but I have an IF that has an option to close down less or much less, the same for an AP with attack duty, the same for an AP with support suty, the same for the False 9. Why can't these guys close down like the team (meaning, the team instruction) ???

I am not really sure what you are asking here. I have two IFs in my setup and they both have closing down the same as the team setting. That is where they defaulted to for me. Maybe a screen shot would help show what you mean?

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I know it is ME issue being resolved, but is there a way to at least reduce number of goals conceded by crosses? (until the next update)

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I know it is ME issue being resolved, but is there a way to at least reduce number of goals conceded by crosses? (until the next update)

Defending generally is being tightened, but there isn't specifically an issue relating to crosses. The system you use is, in my opinion, a bigger factor than any perceived ME issue here.

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Well you can't defend against crosses on first post. I tried closing down opposition wide players, specifically mark them, but nothing helped. I concede most of my goals through crosses (and so does a lot of people I know). I use flat 4-5-1 with FB - support on both sides, and W - attack on both sides. As they are in the MRL strata I don't want to put them to DW or to lower their mentality.

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Well you can't defend against crosses on first post. I tried closing down opposition wide players, specifically mark them, but nothing helped. I concede most of my goals through crosses (and so does a lot of people I know). I use flat 4-5-1 with FB - support on both sides, and W - attack on both sides. As they are in the MRL strata I don't want to put them to DW or to lower their mentality.

Best thing to do is log some examples in the Bugs Section then. That's the most proactive way of helping to fix the issue (if there is one).

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/437124-Reporting-a-Match-Engine-Problem

http://community.sigames.com/forumdisplay.php/505-Match-Engine-Issues

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I am not really sure what you are asking here. I have two IFs in my setup and they both have closing down the same as the team setting. That is where they defaulted to for me. Maybe a screen shot would help show what you mean?

I could post a screenshot, but the game is in portuguese so I'm not sure it would help.

My close down TI is set to Much More, so "sometimes" would be the maximum PI the players would have (as "sometimes" being equal to close down like the team does), but the only PI options are less and much less.

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I could post a screenshot, but the game is in portuguese so I'm not sure it would help.

My close down TI is set to Much More, so "sometimes" would be the maximum PI the players would have (as "sometimes" being equal to close down like the team does), but the only PI options are less and much less.

Okay, so basically your team is at the max closing down, so there is nowhere more to close down for those players. They are already at the max, so of course the only options for them are less closing down.

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Okay, so basically your team is at the max closing down, so there is nowhere more to close down for those players. They are already at the max, so of course the only options for them are less closing down.

Yes, but shouldn't the players have their PI set to sometimes, since this one equals the TI ?

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Playing a high line / counter attack system seems 'counter' productive...

Is there a way to make it work?

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After a bit of feedback on my tactic.

I'm trying to 'learn the art' of tactics, I am playing FMT16 on the Beta because my impression is that there is no issue with tactical familiarity. This is the tactic I am playing:

Club%20Estudiantes%20de%20La%20Plata_%20%20Overview-2_zpsyhztn1e8.png

The idea is that the CMs stay deep, and with the ball the wide midfielders find space between the opposition defence and midfield to link the midfield and attack. The wing backs should come forward in support, but only if it is right to do so and only one at a time. The Defensive Forward is to help out when the opposition plays a midfield 3 by challenging the deeper midfielders. I have a Control strategy to avoid getting pulled apart on the counter. At the moment the tactic is reasonably defensively solid but I am struggling a bit with penetration up front. My main issues are:

1. Very ponderous play from the front 2. I know that a Control strategy will lead to slower buildup play, and that is OK in midfield but there are many times in a match where one of the FCs willl recieve the ball and take 2 or 3 touches, allowing the defennce to reorganise. This is a problem because my lack of bodies up front means I need to take advantage of any gaps the opposition leave. I dont want to play Attacking because I think it would leave me too open, and Counter causes the 2 MCs to sit too deep. Are my roles wrong?

2. The DfF is there to assist with an opposing DM but in Argentina 442 is quite common. I cant get him to drop off the back line into the space enough with any other role, and it makes us too shallow up front.

3. The wide playmakers are trying too many slide rule passes in behind. What I'd like is for more movement from the front 2 to create depth rather than just trying through balls, and they also tend to ignore the WBs overlapping.

I'm not doing terribly, but as someone that really struggles with tactics I would appreciate any comments or suggestions anyone has. Also, I am using the Challenges on FMT as a tactical sandbox, as it throws me straight in the middle of a season and I dont have to worry about tactical familiarity. Is this a good idea or are there any other methods people use to play around with experimental tactics?

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Daivdnio- you should open a separate thread with this otherwise it will get lost in here and/or cluttered up with all kinds of other questions.

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