Poll on Steam activation

[pentagrammer]

Don't like it at all.

I really looked forward seeing all the changes in FM12 but I might stick to FM11 now:thup:

[The Welsh Lad]

I'm going to have to think long and hard about this. I did by GTA San Andreas for the PC to find out what it was like from the PS2. I didn't like the fact then I had to intsall all their parafanalia before I could play the game. Lets just say the game is now gathering dust on my shelf.

Whilst obviously people can get access to an internet connection via intenet cafes, libraries because some places don't allow to download onto their systems, if you don't know what to do then its going to be a frustrating time and if something does go wrong with steam, you wont be able to play the game.

[SSGTroyer]

I don't want it there, period! Ever! I don't care how many people defend the application, it is not something that is going to ever see my computer...

You've said that, without ever giving a valid reason why...though your next paragraph leads me to believe you're might be paranoid about having your computer hooked up to the internet in any kind of "background" way. At least, you seem to be okay opening your CPU to the Wild Wascaly World to post on forums.

Sorry, I'm just trying to find some rationale to your fear of Steam that doesn't invole some form of phobia...

[djvandyke]

You've said that, without ever giving a valid reason why...though your next paragraph leads me to believe you're might be paranoid about having your computer hooked up to the internet in any kind of "background" way. At least, you seem to be okay opening your CPU to the Wild Wascaly World to post on forums.

Sorry, I'm just trying to find some rationale to your fear of Steam that doesn't invole some form of phobia...

He doesn’t have to justify not wanting to install third party adware to his computer.

[englandmanager]

You've said that, without ever giving a valid reason why...though your next paragraph leads me to believe you're might be paranoid about having your computer hooked up to the internet in any kind of "background" way. At least, you seem to be okay opening your CPU to the Wild Wascaly World to post on forums.

Sorry, I'm just trying to find some rationale to your fear of Steam that doesn't invole some form of phobia...

he clearly avoided my valid question as to how it is percieved to be intrusive, he's clearly just a paranoid guy with no valid reasons

[GaIatasaray_35]

You guys are overreacting to Steam.

Steam is a marvelous product.

[Wakers]

You guys are overreacting to Steam.

Steam is a marvelous product.

No it isn't. It's decent.

[milnerpoint]

He doesn’t have to justify not wanting to install third party adware to his computer.

your right he doesnt have to justify anything, but why not add to the discussion? He clearly feels strongly about this, so why not explain why, otherwise it looks like unwarranted paranoia, which people are trying to help ease.

[Dune297]

You guys are overreacting to Steam.

Steam is a marvelous product.

This. 1000x this.

[Lazaru5]

he clearly avoided my valid question as to how it is percieved to be intrusive, he's clearly just a paranoid guy with no valid reasons

My paranoia is based on experience, I installed steam to activate FM09... and regretted it big-time. I bought my current PC with the intention of it being future-proof for FM (As it's the only game I play), and now I'm told I have to have a piece of software I will not install again in order to play the only game I play...

I don't need to go into any further detail.. I've used Steam to play FM once before, and I didn't like the experience... I won't be doing it again *shrugs*

[milnerpoint]

No it isn't. It's decent.

I personally find it a fantastic thing.

[philly_flyer10]

I wont install either steam or itunes, even for free giveaways so if this is the only way to activate it then its not worth buying.

[milnerpoint]

My paranoia is based on experience, I installed steam to activate FM09... and regretted it big-time. I bought my current PC with the intention of it being future-proof for FM (As it's the only game I play), and now I'm told I have to have a piece of software I will not install again in order to play the only game I play...

I don't need to go into any further detail.. I've used Steam to play FM once before, and I didn't like the experience... I won't be doing it again *shrugs*

But why, what was wrong when you installed FM09? Keep in mind that was also two years ago, steam has moved on a lot since then.

[englandmanager]

No it isn't. It's decent.

wakers do you always use your own opinion to answer for everyone?

i find it amazing, quick updates, very fast downloads (the fastest i've found online), low resources and pre-orders that let you pre-install and have your game ready for 12.01am on release day whilst others are running to tesco's and joining queues

that's my opinion, i don't answer for everyone else though like you do wakers

[Ackter]

I like Steam.

However I wouldn't install iTunes if I hadn't already done so years ago - the changes in their EULA are horrible now. I've not updated iTunes in over a year because of it.

[stevie_G_32201]

wakers do you always use your own opinion to answer for everyone?

i find it amazing, quick updates, very fast downloads (the fastest i've found online), low resources and pre-orders that let you pre-install and have your game ready for 12.01am on release day whilst others are running to tesco's and joining queues

that's my opinion, i don't answer for everyone else though like you do wakers

I do believe it was playable at approx 11:45 last year the day before too.

[englandmanager]

I do believe it was playable at approx 11:45 last year the day before too.

yes due to peer pressure, haha

[SSGTroyer]

He doesn’t have to justify not wanting to install third party adware to his computer.

"Adware"...please...you're trying to equate an occasional popup ad when exiting an app with Comet Cursor, Cydoor, and Zango. While technically, that occasional popup ad brings Steam into the broadest definition of the term, Steam is nothing like those hideous apps which most decent anti-malware suites will block.

[Smurf]

I wont install either steam or itunes, even for free giveaways so if this is the only way to activate it then its not worth buying.

In my opinion, that's a ridiculous attitude, no offence intended towards you. Fair enough you don't need iTunes to buy music or listen to music.

But Steam is a small application that allows you to play FM. It costs nothing, it's non-intrusive.

How about you try it for a week and if you don't like it you can uninstall it? If you have any questions on how to use it, or to uninstall it just ask.

[philly_flyer10]

I like Steam.

However I wouldn't install iTunes if I hadn't already done so years ago - the changes in their EULA are horrible now. I've not updated iTunes in over a year because of it.

Same goes for steam, theyve wrongly banned accounts in the past and theres no UK law to help you out. You can lose access to all your games just because they say so. I dont even think buying elsewhere and activating it on steam will help you out here.

[Wakers]

wakers do you always use your own opinion to answer for everyone?

i find it amazing, quick updates, very fast downloads (the fastest i've found online), low resources and pre-orders that let you pre-install and have your game ready for 12.01am on release day whilst others are running to tesco's and joining queues

that's my opinion, i don't answer for everyone else though like you do wakers

Oh, I'm very sorry, I did not mean to say that I was speaking on behalf of everyone. Oh wait, I didn't.

Steam is brilliant until you have a problem with it, in which case it quickly becomes less and less brilliant. If you were to take an overall look at the way Steam works, it really isn't the God send that a lot people make it out to be. Like everything, it has good things, it has brilliant things, but it also has very poor components which balance out.

[philly_flyer10]

In my opinion, that's a ridiculous attitude, no offence intended towards you. Fair enough you don't need iTunes to buy music or listen to music.

But Steam is a small application that allows you to play FM. It costs nothing, it's non-intrusive.

How about you try it for a week and if you don't like it you can uninstall it? If you have any questions on how to use it, or to uninstall it just ask.

I refuse to use it at all because of the companies, behaviour. Same goes for companies like apple, I wouldnt use a product even if it was given to me.

EAs origin is even worse, that scans your computer and reports back to them and you cant opt out of it.

I didnt install it when they were giving away Portal for free so Im not going to have it for FM.

Same goes for starforce, the worst system ever that even damages hardware, trackmania was free and came with that and I wouldnt touch that.

[Smurf]

That's very strange attitude to have. It seems like you're paranoid about it.

Fact is, you install steam. You install the game. Register the game through steam. Unplug your internet. Leave steam running in the background and FM will play just fine.

Close steam and FM won't run. But if you're already running steam you can shut down Steam or go to Offline mode and continue playing the game.

No reporting is done by Steam. You've got a touch of Paranoia.

Did you know that everytime you go to a new web page it can be recorded by the previous website you were on? Say if you were to go from here to BBC to Sky news, this very website would be able to track to you 3 or 4 websites after you've left here. And you can't turn that off either. That's exactly how adverts are targeted to your internet browser. Based on your frequency to visit certain sites. Visit BBC sport regularly and your google ads will feature sport related topics.

This is the digital age. Nothing you do online, even right now as you read or type a reply here, is not recorded and transmitted somewhere. There's little robots scouring code and taking your information and reporting back to databases to feed you adverts related to what you are looking at on the internet.

[Ackter]

...

iTunes is one step away from agreeing to sign over your first born son

Steam isn't quite that bad...

[djvandyke]

Only ever purchase on Steam if you understand that you are not buying a product.

You are paying them for the privilege of playing their game, this privilege is not guaranteed and can be withdrawn at any time without good reason.

If you have a problem you are likely to be ignored or treated like scum.

[Wakers]

That's very strange attitude to have. It seems like you're paranoid about it.

Fact is, you install steam. You install the game. Register the game through steam. Unplug your internet. Leave steam running in the background and FM will play just fine.

Close steam and FM won't run. But if you're already running steam you can shut down Steam or go to Offline mode and continue playing the game.

No reporting is done by Steam. You've got a touch of Paranoia.

Did you know that everytime you go to a new web page it can be recorded by the previous website you were on? Say if you were to go from here to BBC to Sky news, this very website would be able to track to you 3 or 4 websites after you've left here. And you can't turn that off either. That's exactly how adverts are targeted to your internet browser. Based on your frequency to visit certain sites. Visit BBC sport regularly and your google ads will feature sport related topics.

This is the digital age. Nothing you do online, even right now as you read or type a reply here, is not recorded and transmitted somewhere. There's little robots scouring code and taking your information and reporting back to databases to feed you adverts related to what you are looking at on the internet.

Just something to note here: A great many people have problems with Steam's offline mode. It personally stopped me from being able to play Civ V for two weeks while I was on holiday with no available internet (well, there was, but I'm not paying £1 per mb!). It's not a reliable solution.

Also, if you buy a game on Steam - you don't own the game. You are given temporary access to the game as long as Steam deem fit. Meaning (and obviously, they don't do this all the time, but they have the power to) they can stop you from playing any game that you have in your games library.

[Ackter]

Only ever purchase on Steam if you understand that you are not buying a product.

You are paying for them privilege of playing their game, this privilege is not guaranteed and can be withdrawn at any time without good reason.

If you have a problem you are likely to be ignored or treated like scum.

That's technically true of all games - when you buy a game you're paying for the license to use it, not for the game itself.

[philly_flyer10]

I never said steam scans and reports back, I just said EA is even worse. i disagree with a company having the power to stop you playing your whole catalogue of games.

My browser is safe using ghostery and webpolicy which blocks all requests to other sites, no reporting to 3rd parties and no ads at all.

I havent seen an ad in years.

This site uses/reports to:

siresearch.com

googleapis.com

clicksmilies.com

omniture.com

[philly_flyer10]

That's technically true of all games - when you buy a game you're paying for the license to use it, not for the game itself.

How are they going to stop you playing a non internet activated game?

Also, even if they could stop you, they would only stop that one game, steam can and does stop you from playing your whole collection, often hundreds or even thousands of pounds and you have no comeback.

I dont see why anyone would give a company that power and for you to lose all your purchase rights.

[Smurf]

Just something to note here: A great many people have problems with Steam's offline mode. It personally stopped me from being able to play Civ V for two weeks while I was on holiday with no available internet (well, there was, but I'm not paying £1 per mb!). It's not a reliable solution.

Also, if you buy a game on Steam - you don't own the game. You are given temporary access to the game as long as Steam deem fit. Meaning (and obviously, they don't do this all the time, but they have the power to) they can stop you from playing any game that you have in your games library.

Most EULAs stipulate you only have a license to use the software, you never actually own it.

SI or SEGA could deem you violation of the EULA and terminate your license if they wanted to or it was fit.

Any issues with Steam discontinuing your license should be brought up with steam.

If you do buy online make sure you save all the emails regarding receipts, also the statement from the bank with regards to the cash transfer to Steam.

If you have documentation to backup that you bought it, Steam should reinstate your software.

Although a lot of people seem to be thinking you have to BUY through Steam. You don't, you can buy it in the shop. You just have to ACTIVATE through Steam.

Once activated, whether bought online or in-store, you can launch FM and quit Steam and it will play fine.

If you want to relaunch FM - then start up Steam - launch FM - quit steam.

It's not rocket surgery, it's brain science.

[Quacky]

I was going to buy in on steam anyway...

These "I hate steam" threads pop up each year from people who clearly don't use steam for anything else so its a little hassle and they have no idea how to use it, its a system that has been working perfectly fine for several years now.

[Lazaru5]

That's very strange attitude to have. It seems like you're paranoid about it.

Fact is, you install steam. You install the game. Register the game through steam. Unplug your internet. Leave steam running in the background and FM will play just fine.

Close steam and FM won't run. But if you're already running steam you can shut down Steam or go to Offline mode and continue playing the game.

No reporting is done by Steam. You've got a touch of Paranoia.

Did you know that everytime you go to a new web page it can be recorded by the previous website you were on? Say if you were to go from here to BBC to Sky news, this very website would be able to track to you 3 or 4 websites after you've left here. And you can't turn that off either. That's exactly how adverts are targeted to your internet browser. Based on your frequency to visit certain sites. Visit BBC sport regularly and your google ads will feature sport related topics.

This is the digital age. Nothing you do online, even right now as you read or type a reply here, is not recorded and transmitted somewhere. There's little robots scouring code and taking your information and reporting back to databases to feed you adverts related to what you are looking at on the internet.

Yes you can... it's called "block cookies" which I do on pretty much every website I visit, there are exceptions, obviously, but my browser makes selecting them easy as pie. I have websites of my own that plant a nice little tracking cookie onto your hard-drive just so's I can be nosey (cos I don't actually care where you came from or where you go when you leave as long as you visit my site(s) ). Unscrupulous people (read Sega/Steam/EA/Whoever) would use this information to target you with specific advertisements related to your browsing history...

[djvandyke]

That's technically true of all games - when you buy a game you're paying for the license to use it, not for the game itself.

If you purchase a real copy the man in the shop can not just come round your flat and take your game away on a whim.

[djvandyke]

I was going to buy in on steam anyway...

These "I hate steam" threads pop up each year from people who clearly don't use steam for anything else so its a little hassle and they have no idea how to use it, its a system that has been working perfectly fine for several years now.

Not true, I use Steam.

[lhinchliffe]

Hmm, such a shame that I won't get to play the full game as I refuse to have third party software forced upon me. I don't use steam and don't plan to anytime soon. Thankfully I have a good fm11 save.

[stevie_G_32201]

If you purchase a real copy the man in the shop can not just come round your flat and take your game away on a whim.

Irrelevant, its the same with DVD's and such.

[Smurf]

Blocking cookies doesn't stop that.

[Lazaru5]

Most EULAs stipulate you only have a license to use the software, you never actually own it.

SI or SEGA could deem you violation of the EULA and terminate your license if they wanted to or it was fit.

Any issues with Steam discontinuing your license should be brought up with steam.

If you do buy online make sure you save all the emails regarding receipts, also the statement from the bank with regards to the cash transfer to Steam.

If you have documentation to backup that you bought it, Steam should reinstate your software.

Although a lot of people seem to be thinking you have to BUY through Steam. You don't, you can buy it in the shop. You just have to ACTIVATE through Steam.

Once activated, whether bought online or in-store, you can launch FM and quit Steam and it will play fine.

If you want to relaunch FM - then start up Steam - launch FM - quit steam.

It's not rocket surgery, it's brain science.

Massive misinformation there Eugene, you can't "quit Steam" whilst playing FM12, it will close FM too... you need to have Steam running to play it!

[Wakers]

Most EULAs stipulate you only have a license to use the software, you never actually own it.

SI or SEGA could deem you violation of the EULA and terminate your license if they wanted to or it was fit.

Any issues with Steam discontinuing your license should be brought up with steam.

If you do buy online make sure you save all the emails regarding receipts, also the statement from the bank with regards to the cash transfer to Steam.

If you have documentation to backup that you bought it, Steam should reinstate your software.

Although a lot of people seem to be thinking you have to BUY through Steam. You don't, you can buy it in the shop. You just have to ACTIVATE through Steam.

Once activated, whether bought online or in-store, you can launch FM and quit Steam and it will play fine.

If you want to relaunch FM - then start up Steam - launch FM - quit steam.

It's not rocket surgery, it's brain science.

Yes, but if you only have the DVD then they can't remotely stop you from using it. And they won't send out anyone to take it away from you either.

Also, I just tested something that you stated about having steam open and playing a game. I just launched Civ V, closed steam - it warned me that CIV V would close too if I quit Steam. So you can't do that.

[repton]

As a paying customer i reserve the right to decide myself what goes onto my pc/mac and quite frankly whether steam is great or crap totally disinterests me. I do not like being dictated to especially when i am parting with my hard earned cash and as such this will be the first in the fm series that i have not bought. Sad day for consumer choice but i will most definitely not be purchasing fm12.

[philly_flyer10]

Most EULAs stipulate you only have a license to use the software, you never actually own it.

SI or SEGA could deem you violation of the EULA and terminate your license if they wanted to or it was fit.

Any issues with Steam discontinuing your license should be brought up with steam.

Sega/SI are a UK company so you have consumer rights and they couldnt do that without a very good reason.

Steam is a US company that you have zero rights with, they can and do wrongly ban accounts with no comeback, the often wont even tell you why your account was banned.

You will get banned if you are hacked and you will lose every game you have. People have also been wrongly banned with a faulty cheat check.

[Bertie BG]

I never said steam scans and reports back, I just said EA is even worse. i disagree with a company having the power to stop you playing your whole catalogue of games.

My browser is safe using ghostery and webpolicy which blocks all requests to other sites, no reporting to 3rd parties and no ads at all.

I havent seen an ad in years.

This site uses/reports to:

siresearch.com

googleapis.com

clicksmilies.com

omniture.com

Just so you know.. two of those (googleapis and omniture) are for web analytics which we (and noone else) use to track traffic. Siresearch.com is another forum that we run and the fourth "clicksmilies" looks to be a plugin for the smilies, fair enough don't know what that's for personally, but I would imagine that the only thing it's reporting is whether it's smilies are being used or not (if anything at all).

I personally prefer my ads to be targeted as then they might be relevant to me and not just completely irrelevant things I'm not interested in but that's irrelevant to this conversation. Each to their own though

[Lazaru5]

Blocking cookies doesn't stop that.

not quite... but it will stop people 3 sites down the line seeing that I was visiting the BBC sport site two hours ago. I can see where people come from and where they go, what they click on my site (and what they don't), where they spend the longest amount of time and when they leave immediately and all this is through the use of cookies and tracking scripts that are run "without your knowledge" (supposedly). At least I know that by blocking scripts, cookies, etc etc that my security isn't compromised...

I don't intend to waste all the care I take in protecting myself by installing a piece of software I don't need or want just to be able to play a game. I value my privacy too much

[philly_flyer10]

Blocking cookies doesn't stop that.

Im not just doing that. They stop all 3rd party requests.

[markyosullivan]

This is a good idea to stop illegal copies of the game.

About Steam

I seriously don't know why people are moaning about this, all you have to do is activate the game on steam, once its activated you can play the game with the disc without using steam iirc. Also you can disable steam from starting up when your PC loads, so it wont slow down the start up process.

[Smurf]

I don't intend to waste all the care I take in protecting myself by installing a piece of software I don't need or want just to be able to play a game. I value my privacy too much

Your privacy is not being invaded by using Steam! You're privacy is invaded when you use the internet though. You might stop somethings, but not them all. Most of those things are inhibitors, in that it stops pop-ups, but it's very hard to stop them tracking or analysing where you have gone after you've left that site.

Don't suppose you use mobile internet, wifi, mobile phone, or send emails then?

[hugo_rune]

I approve. SEGA and SI have a right to ensure their product is protected. Steam activation is a technique that they believe is effective and needed for combating piracy, and it's their responsibility to make that judgement, not ours. As a paying customer I respect the fact that they have a right to make these decisions.

And the reality is that in 2011, if you don't have an internet connection, you're probably Amish, you have the misfortune to be a subsistence farmer in a developing country, or you're in the more troubled parts of the third world.

Regarding Steam, I'd add that it's a very standard form of copy protection that is becoming increasingly more common throughout the industry. The whinging about it, for whatever motive, really is getting old. Just face facts, the times when you'd download all your games from a BBS, install the hack, and play away, are gone - the industry's matured, the protection technology's gotten better, and that's led to far lower rates of piracy across the industry, more investment in development, and hence better games and more bang for the back for the genuine customers. Even if we're fickle and don't always acknowledge it.

[0gris]

It's true, however unlike facebook the scripts dont report your browsing habits as liberally. Google for example uses them to put ads you're more likely to look at(whether that is a good or a bad thing, it's up to you). As for STEAM, i've never actually seen a valid reason as to why people dont want to use it. You could always start it up in offline mode if you value your privacy that much(oh and it does no data tracking whatsoever on top of that, the only thing it asks you is to complete a survey which you can opt out of easily).

[Smurf]

Sega/SI are a UK company so you have consumer rights and they couldnt do that without a very good reason.

Steam is a US company that you have zero rights with, they can and do wrongly ban accounts with no comeback, the often wont even tell you why your account was banned.

You will get banned if you are hacked and you will lose every game you have. People have also been wrongly banned with a faulty cheat check.

You need to bring that up with Steam. Email first. Then email again if no reply. If not then find a contact number for support in your country.

There's also pen and paper, envelopes and stamps from the local post office.

(sorry that sounded a bit smart arsed, but I'm serious)

[Wakers]

You need to bring that up with Steam. Email first. Then email again if no reply. If not then find a contact number for support in your country.

There's also pen and paper, envelopes and stamps from the local post office.

(sorry that sounded a bit smart arsed, but I'm serious)

Steam don't have phone support. They also don't have an address available for written support. If you write to them it will likely just be met with an email in return or a letter sent back stating that you have to use the online ticket system.