A Message On Football Manager 2012 Activation

[Keyzer Soze]

Perhaps when you make some software and 40 million people steal it, you might be a bit more sympathetic to SI's plight.

On the spot Eugene!

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

It's been an interesting thread, my only problem with it is that people aren't content to state their position/argument once or at least in context to other posts and then move on. i.e. it could have been 35 pages shorter and still achieved the same:)

Both sides have grasped at illogic too often to prove the unprovable, the actual proof lies in the future.

I resent some of the motives ascribed to Sega/SI, profit has to be in the equation of course (nothing wrong with that) but the abiding aim at SI Towers is , and always has been to assure the long term future of the game.

They will have taken this decision with that uppermost in their minds.

I find some of the logic used to object to Steam prehistoric and I say that in the confident knowledge that I'm the oldest person to post in this thread so far

Seriously?, have you noted how old i am? ;-)

I keep visiting to see what Steam issues others are having (as I had several only at the weekend). I dont do this so I can troll, I do it so I can be prepared for Oct 21. I assure the forum, no one is hoping for a troublefree activation on 21st Oct more than me, though I accept tens of thousands will want the same ojective as much as I do. However every time someone with no Steam issues posts without consideration to others that Steam is great (hardly ever "my Steam experience has been great, I cannnot speak for others") I have to respond with balance. Just I guess as pro-Steamers do to the "Steam is the antichrist - im out of here!" posts.

Off topic but relevant, I have a passing interest in model railways, just recapturing my youth, and somethimes buy magazines for that "hobby". Every now and again a furious poster will reply in the letters columns that some tiny detail on a new model is slightly incorrect.They will be quite vitriolic sometimes. This reminds me of the responses to many issues raised in the FM Forums. Passion is not very helpful when misdirected, but I am always touched by how passionate the FM Community are about all manner of FM issues. The day a potentially conroversial thread passes by with little notice is the day SI and us the players need really worry about, and I cannot see that day coming soon.

God bless the double edged sword!

[Smurf]

And when you have 2 children, give them 1 copy of the latest "toy" to share, and then have to deal with the tantrums and fall out as they both want to play at the same time, you will realise the nonsense of the "Piracy" arguement as presented. Now days £30-£40 is a very small outlay for something that gives so many hours enjoyment (less than a seat to a Premiership match?), pirated copies are in the vast majority held by those who would not pay the price for the game regardless (for various reasons it would be unfair for me to judge). I do not present this as a "fact" but it would seem a logical conclusion from a common sense consideration of common knowledge about piracy habits of gamers.

I'd be sympathetic to a family who had to steal food to feed them. Not steal a computer game to keep them "entertained".

You were never supposed to install the game on two computers and have two people play it at the same time. Sure you can have 1 steam account for both. And they can both have their own saves and play at different times. There is the option to password protect the games.

That's the way you were supposed to do it. The game was sold to you with good faith that you'd abide by the EULA, and people blatantly flaunted it.

Now it's harder for some people, impossible for others, to blatantly abuse the system that was sold to you in good faith.

If you don't understand that then there's nothing else I can say.

[Kriss]

Off topic but relevant, I have a passing interest in model railways, just recapturing my youth, and somethimes buy magazines for that "hobby". Every now and again a furious poster will reply in the letters columns that some tiny detail on a new model is slightly incorrect.They will be quite vitriolic sometimes. This reminds me of the responses to many issues raised in the FM Forums. Passion is not very helpful when misdirected, but I am always touched by how passionate the FM Community are about all manner of FM issues. The day a potentially conroversial thread passes by with little notice is the day SI and us the players need really worry about, and I cannot see that day coming soon.

God bless the double edged sword!

As a Beta tester on Railroad Tycoons 2 & 3 I empathise with that:D here's a link you might enjoyhttp://hawkdawg.com/forums/

Railroad Tycoon 1 is a freebie on Steam and 2,3 & Sid Meiers Railroads are available in a package (£10 the lot I think)

Welcome to my other world:)

[pigfacemonkeyman]

I've heard nothing so I've prodded where I'm able to prod, we're approaching the time when the forums are reorganised for FM12 so it could be they're waiting for that, hope to hear something definitive soon.

Thanks inspector prod.

[pigfacemonkeyman]

It's been an interesting thread, my only problem with it is that people aren't content to state their position/argument once or at least in context to other posts and then move on. i.e. it could have been 35 pages shorter and still achieved the same:)

Both sides have grasped at illogic too often to prove the unprovable, the actual proof lies in the future.

I resent some of the motives ascribed to Sega/SI, profit has to be in the equation of course (nothing wrong with that) but the abiding aim at SI Towers is , and always has been to assure the long term future of the game.

They will have taken this decision with that uppermost in their minds.

I find some of the logic used to object to Steam prehistoric and I say that in the confident knowledge that I'm the oldest person to post in this thread so far

'Age does not a wise man make, young Kriss Skywalker!'

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

I'd be sympathetic to a family who had to steal food to feed them. Not steal a computer game to keep them "entertained".

You were never supposed to install the game on two computers and have two people play it at the same time. Sure you can have 1 steam account for both. And they can both have their own saves and play at different times. There is the option to password protect the games.

That's the way you were supposed to do it. The game was sold to you with good faith that you'd abide by the EULA, and people blatantly flaunted it.

Now it's harder for some people, impossible for others, to blatantly abuse the system that was sold to you in good faith.

If you don't understand that then there's nothing else I can say.

Actually you misunderstood. My point was that it is easier for parents to spend the extra for an additional game copy than the alternatives (presuming most parents do discourage thieving) unless they cannot afford it at all in which case any amount of DRM is not going to put the price of the extra game into their familly budget anyway.

I dont understand why you couldnt grasp that though?

PS Pease try to remember, you are anti piracy, I am also anti piracy - no caveats.

[Smurf]

What you're saying doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever, that's why I'm "not grasping it".

On the flipside, I don't know why you don't grasp what I'm saying.

We seem to be on the same side, as you say you're anti-piracy too.

All I know is that you need Steam to play FM12. I want to play FM12. So I'll use the Steam that's been forced on us (I've had Steam for years anyway, so not really forced on me at all, I use it anyway). I can't say I've had any issues with Steam. I'm sympathetic towards that do. But I still insist there's plenty of time to get Steam working and get their noggins around how Steam works and how to get it to work on their system.

Steam will either be a raging success or a raging failure. I hope it's the former.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

As a Beta tester on Railroad Tycoons 2 & 3 I empathise with that:D here's a link you might enjoyhttp://hawkdawg.com/forums/

Railroad Tycoon 1 is a freebie on Steam and 2,3 & Sid Meiers Railroads are available in a package (£10 the lot I think)

Welcome to my other world:)

Already have them, plus Sim City, Sim City 2 etc etc (even have Amiga copies in the garage - I will buy duplicate copies for alternatives platforms - jack Sparrow I am not). Add to that every FM & SI Cm (except "Italia") and Sim Tower. Anyone remember Treble Champions on the Amiga? (& Spectrum).

Serously for uber geeks like me the benefits of Steam are not non existant, they just completely missed the boat by several years :-)

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

What you're saying doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever, that's why I'm "not grasping it".

On the flipside, I don't know why you don't grasp what I'm saying.

We seem to be on the same side, as you say you're anti-piracy too.

All I know is that you need Steam to play FM12. I want to play FM12. So I'll use the Steam that's been forced on us (I've had Steam for years anyway, so not really forced on me at all, I use it anyway). I can't say I've had any issues with Steam. I'm sympathetic towards that do. But I still insist there's plenty of time to get Steam working and get their noggins around how Steam works and how to get it to work on their system.

Steam will either be a raging success or a raging failure. I hope it's the former.

<drawing a line in the sand>

Agree totally (with some concerns as previously detailed).

[bieritarier]

Steam will not prevent piracy - I guess that has been mentioned about a million times in this thread already.. Steam has been cracked a long time ago, and SEGA knows that.

There is only one reason for using Steam, which is to prevent the resale of used copies.

I know some software companies think this is theft as they're not making money from resales, but I still see it as my right to sell stuff I no longer want to use.

I've never sold a PC game since I play them for too long to ever get enough back to make it worth the hassle. Still, I'd much rather have companies admit what the real reason behind the STEAM decision is rather than referring to piracy. Face it, there is no way to stop piracy, since it has always been easier to crack copy protection than it is to develop it.

the steam decision won't affect me personally, as I don'T sell games and use STEAM for years now. I can understand why other people think about pirating a game they can't resell since many people can only afford to buy new games when they either buy used copies (which is perfectly legal!) or are able to sell their copies once they no longer want them (perfectly legal as well)...

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Already have them, plus Sim City, Sim City 2 etc etc (even have Amiga copies in the garage - I will buy duplicate copies for alternatives platforms - jack Sparrow I am not). Add to that every FM & SI Cm (except "Italia") and Sim Tower. Anyone remember Treble Champions on the Amiga? (& Spectrum).

Serously for uber geeks like me the benefits of Steam are not non existant, they just completely missed the boat by several years :-)

I will just add if Steam can offer me a version of Battle isle 1914-1918 that actually works on Windows I will be on the road to becoming a Steam fanboi !

[milnerpoint]

you boys should just have your own thread

[Smurf]

I know some software companies think this is theft as they're not making money from resales, but I still see it as my right to sell stuff I no longer want to use.

I think you can still resell the boxed version - as long as you deactivate your copy on Steam. And that you return all the software, discs and manuals, plus box to the store. And remove any information or software installed by the game via installation.

This is pretty standard for most EULA.

If you buy on Steam - I'm not sure what the options are for reselling? I don't buy games through Steam so I don't know how that works.

[Smurf]

you boys should just have your own thread

At least they're not on about cars, upgraded to trains.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Steam will not prevent piracy - I guess that has been mentioned about a million times in this thread already.. Steam has been cracked a long time ago, and SEGA knows that.

There is only one reason for using Steam, which is to prevent the resale of used copies.

I know some software companies think this is theft as they're not making money from resales, but I still see it as my right to sell stuff I no longer want to use.

I've never sold a PC game since I play them for too long to ever get enough back to make it worth the hassle. Still, I'd much rather have companies admit what the real reason behind the STEAM decision is rather than referring to piracy. Face it, there is no way to stop piracy, since it has always been easier to crack copy protection than it is to develop it.

the steam decision won't affect me personally, as I don'T sell games and use STEAM for years now. I can understand why other people think about pirating a game they can't resell since many people can only afford to buy new games when they either buy used copies (which is perfectly legal!) or are able to sell their copies once they no longer want them (perfectly legal as well)...

I will not comment on this opinion but the FM'ers I know do not sell the old games, they do keep the boxes lined up on a shelf. So am not sure the 2nd hand market would be considered a big deal for FM though SEga may see it as essential for their whole product range as a standard measure. In really imporatant ways FM is not like most other games.

[Kriss]

I will just add if Steam can offer me a version of Battle isle 1914-1918 that actually works on Windows I will be on the road to becoming a Steam fanboi !

This is the best I can come up with and it doesn't require you to abandon Steam phobia:D http://ip-70-38-122-100.static.privatedns.com/en/gamecard/battle_isle_platinum

[pigfacemonkeyman]

'Piracy' <> Playing FM/Visiting FM Forums on Company time, comparable? Discuss.

[Smurf]

And the real reason for Steam, since you asked, is to delay piracy - not prevent it.

I've covered this so many times in this thread.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Thanks, that link may well come in useful someday soon.

[milnerpoint]

'Piracy' <> Playing FM/Visiting FM Forums on Company time, comparable? Discuss.

yeah its clearly identical, next?

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

This is the best I can come up with and it doesn't require you to abandon Steam phobia:D http://ip-70-38-122-100.static.privatedns.com/en/gamecard/battle_isle_platinum

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeessssssssssssssssssssssssss! You da man! LOL

I knew all those wasted hours in this thread were for a reason. If FM12 activtion goes wrong guess what I'ii be doing on 21st Oct.

Seriously, thanks. been searching for that for about 10 years, even downloaded an emulator version which fell over constantaly so fingers crossed for this little fella.

PS I infract you for going off topic repeatedly ;-)

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

'Piracy' <> Playing FM/Visiting FM Forums on Company time, comparable? Discuss.

LOL. Im never playing Trumps with you!

[milnerpoint]

At least they're not on about cars, upgraded to trains.

maybe they should stay on track with the thread........

ill get my coat.

[bieritarier]

I think you can still resell the boxed version - as long as you deactivate your copy on Steam. And that you return all the software, discs and manuals, plus box to the store. And remove any information or software installed by the game via installation.

This is pretty standard for most EULA.

If you buy on Steam - I'm not sure what the options are for reselling? I don't buy games through Steam so I don't know how that works.

Please show me how to do it. I possess many games I activated on Steam, quite a few are actually boxed copies. Once the game is mapped to an account you can't change that - if you show me how I stand corrected.

I will not comment on this opinion but the FM'ers I know do not sell the old games, they do keep the boxes lined up on a shelf. So am not sure the 2nd hand market would be considered a big deal for FM though SEga may see it as essential for their whole product range as a standard measure. In really imporatant ways FM is not like most other games.

well, I have seen quite a lot of copies on ebay in recent years, must be me though. You are active on the forums, you are "hardcore FMer", but face it, the majority is not. They play the game for a month, then lose interest, and a fair share will then sell it. I would agree the percentage is probably lower than it is for shooters, but donT you think SEGA doesn't see it as a problem.

And someone made the comment about delaying piracy - I'm not following the scene but last time I checked STEAM protected games were also cracked and available pre-release (ok, maybe not a week but just 6 days, I give you that...).

[Smurf]

I'm not entirely sure on the details. As I said, it's the way it is for other software I use, and I suspected it was the the same for buying the disc version of FM. But I've never done this myself for FM.

[ppbrover]

Ok,I havw read all the pages on this subject,So NEIL BROCK after i give my reaction will you please answer my one question at the end?

I don't like steam but I do use it but only to activate games and if this stops piracy then good,only time will tell.

Now the question,can you at SI make it possible in FM12 and also maybe FM11 to give an option where players can be blocked from being selected for international duties?This would allow young teams to be protected from tiredness ect.thanks.

[Scab]

Steamworks games cannot be resold. The key code is permanently attached to whichever Steam account it gets registered to.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

I think you can still resell the boxed version - as long as you deactivate your copy on Steam. And that you return all the software, discs and manuals, plus box to the store. And remove any information or software installed by the game via installation.

This is pretty standard for most EULA.

If you buy on Steam - I'm not sure what the options are for reselling? I don't buy games through Steam so I don't know how that works.

If that is right it destroys one anti Steam arguement, which actually I aplaud.

[Smurf]

Again - I'm not 100% certain. I'm going off other software that I buy. And that's pretty much the EULA. I buy a lot of software for professional reasons, and I stick to the EULA.

I'm not 100% sure. I can't find any info on this.

[pigfacemonkeyman]

yeah its clearly identical, next?

Interesting point of view, I take it you participate in neither then?

[milnerpoint]

Interesting point of view, I take it you participate in neither then?

of course not, im pretty much the reincarnation of Jesus, i am not allowed to break any commandments.

"tho shall not steal"

what does this have to do with steam?

[pigfacemonkeyman]

of course not, im pretty much the reincarnation of Jesus, i am not allowed to break any commandments.

"tho shall not steal"

what does this have to do with steam?

What does Steam have to do with SI/SEGA's activation decision?

[milnerpoint]

What does Steam have to do with SI/SEGA's activation decision?

maybe the fact they chose steam as their activation method..........have you not been paying attention?

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Again - I'm not 100% certain. I'm going off other software that I buy. And that's pretty much the EULA. I buy a lot of software for professional reasons, and I stick to the EULA.

I'm not 100% sure. I can't find any info on this.

Shouldnt be a major issue anyway. I buy a £25k car, I consider resale/devaluation. I buy a £35 PC game (which I know will be £10 retail within a year) - I dont consider "re-sale" too much.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

of course not, im pretty much the reincarnation of Jesus, i am not allowed to break any commandments.

"tho shall not steal"

what does this have to do with steam?

I believe fast reliable Broadband is rare in Nazereth and since Pontious Pilot's Gaming Stable went into Receivership, I suspect if the only way our Lord could lead Beitar Jerusalem to European glory was via a cracked copy of the game - I fear this may be his temptation too far... ;-)

[milnerpoint]

I believe fast reliable Broadband is rare in Nazereth and since Pontious Pilot's Gaming Stable went into Receivership, I suspect if the only way our Lord could lead Beitar Jerusalem to European glory was via a cracked copy of the game - I fear this may be his temptation to far... ;-)

pft its blasphemy to even suggest the holy one would be involved in pirating

if his cracked copy had the magical win button then you might be right................

[pigfacemonkeyman]

maybe the fact they chose steam as their activation method..........have you not been paying attention?

Does your attention not span beyond one post? Let me refresh your memory;

'Piracy' <> Playing FM/Visiting FM Forums on Company time, comparable? Discuss.

yeah its clearly identical, next?

Interesting point of view, I take it you participate in neither then?

of course not, im pretty much the reincarnation of Jesus, i am not allowed to break any commandments.

"tho shall not steal"

what does this have to do with steam?

What does Steam have to do with SI/SEGA's activation decision?

maybe the fact they chose steam as their activation method..........have you not been paying attention?

The only reason given for this decision is to combat piracy. I would hope that anyone who plays FM during worktime, or visits FM forums during worktime, would look to themselves if considering banging on about piracy.

[milnerpoint]

hahahahahahahahahahaha brilliant

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

pft its blasphemy to even suggest the holy one would be involved in pirating

if his cracked copy had the magical win button then you might be right................

wwfan to play Moses perhaps :-)

[milnerpoint]

wwfan to play Moses perhaps :-)

hahahahaha wwfan leading the boys! Kriss is prob old enough that he could play the role of god

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

hahahahaha wwfan leading the boys! Kriss is prob old enough that he could play the role of god

Commandment #4: Remember the defensive line, keep it linked to mentality.

Is Deuteronomy something to do with "rule of two"?. Just asking....

[milnerpoint]

Commandment #4: Remember the defensive line, keep it linked to mentality.

Is Deuteronomy something to do with "rule of two"?. Just asking....

Commandment #7 - tho shall not play through balls through the middle for the whole game.....

i have no idea to be honest, my knowledge of religion stretches to about as much as i have posted in this thread

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Commandment #7 - tho shall not play through balls through the middle for the whole game.....

i have no idea to be honest, my knowledge of religion stretches to about as much as i have posted in this thread

Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's Cruyff.

[x42bn6]

Perhaps when you make some software and 40 million people steal it, you might be a bit more sympathetic to SI's plight.

Piracy is not theft! It's piracy.

It doesn't matter if a million people pirate FM, or if a billion people pirate it - SI don't make less money if more people pirate, since anything times zero is zero. The number who pirate actually doesn't mean much.

Strictly speaking, pirates buy more, so a billion pirates might actually be better...

Developers get angry at a lack of control, rather than the actual piracy. The software is being distributed on terms they didn't agree with. This is why the games industry gets so worked-up over the second-hand market, too.

Piracy can't be stopped, so in a lot of ways it is pointless to spend so much time and effort fighting it.

[Kriss]

As FM is our religion I can't knock the most recent round of analogies:D so I'll probably just infract the first poster on every new page, this will either slow this thread down or appeal immensely to the inveterate gamblers;)

[bieritarier]

Shouldnt be a major issue anyway. I buy a £25k car, I consider resale/devaluation. I buy a £35 PC game (which I know will be £10 retail within a year) - I dont consider "re-sale" too much.

You don't. Others do. 10 quid may not be a lot of money for you. It might be for others.

What developers and publishers do not get is that someone who buys a used game in most cases is not willing to pay or even able to afford the retail price anyway. And people who sell the game could in some cases not afford another game if they didn't. Or afford something else. In an economy there is x amount of money available to spend. You spend more on product one, product 2's Sales suffer. I appreciate that the software industry, like everyone else, wants to get the "best deal" for their products. Once they start turning laws upside down and preventing something completely legal from happening (second hand sales) it becomes ugly.

It gets worse since software companies do not properly inform their customer base of all the consequences steamworks brings. The right for re-sale is a pretty basic one that is taken away. Maybe not for you. Certainly not for me. But just because I don'T wanna make use of it does not mean it can and should just be silently taken away from everbody.

You started the comparision to cars. they are more expensive, but that'S an argument that won'T count since expensive is relative to your income. I'm dead sure you would not buy a car that through any measure can only be used/driven by yourself, effeticely preventing you from selling the car.

SW companies have mentioned a ton of reasons for why PC games should be treated differently. I cant see why games, or anything else, should be actually treated differently. And if it is, I expect every customer to be informed about this properly before buying the product.

It's more about the dynamics stuff like this can create (worst case scenario is to completely prohibit second hand, which again would kill a whole industry, think about eBay, your local second hand dealer etc.). Why would the SW industry be worth more protection than any other industry, and why should we just accept that this industry wants to prevent something that is legal?

[Loversleaper]

This whole buying and selling thing is something that the consumer won't quite understand, if it is the case the you are buying a license to play the game then we need to have a clear-cut guideline that everyone understands because it's all quite confusing.

We can start out with when we go into the local gamming store and we say:

You - "Hello, I would like to buy a copy of FM"

Clerk - "Hey look, pal. You are not buying anything, you are just someone who we give the permission to if you want to play our game. Now, fork over your cash..."

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

You don't. Others do. 10 quid may not be a lot of money for you. It might be for others.

What developers and publishers do not get is that someone who buys a used game in most cases is not willing to pay or even able to afford the retail price anyway. And people who sell the game could in some cases not afford another game if they didn't. Or afford something else. In an economy there is x amount of money available to spend. You spend more on product one, product 2's Sales suffer. I appreciate that the software industry, like everyone else, wants to get the "best deal" for their products. Once they start turning laws upside down and preventing something completely legal from happening (second hand sales) it becomes ugly.

It gets worse since software companies do not properly inform their customer base of all the consequences steamworks brings. The right for re-sale is a pretty basic one that is taken away. Maybe not for you. Certainly not for me. But just because I don'T wanna make use of it does not mean it can and should just be silently taken away from everbody.

You started the comparision to cars. they are more expensive, but that'S an argument that won'T count since expensive is relative to your income. I'm dead sure you would not buy a car that through any measure can only be used/driven by yourself, effeticely preventing you from selling the car.

SW companies have mentioned a ton of reasons for why PC games, or anything else, should be treated differently. And if it is, I expect every customer to be informed about this properly before buying the product.

It's more about the dynamics stuff like this can create (worst case scenario is to completely prohibit second hand, which again would kill a whole industry, think about eBay, your local second hand dealer etc.). Why would the SW industry be worth more protection than any other industry, and why should we just accept that this industry wants to prevent something that is legal?

In no way was I suggesting £10 is not a significant sum, though to some it may be. The point was £10 retail means second hand sell on would be what £3-£4 only? For what it is worth I wish I did have £25k free for a new car, though I need a new kitchen more. If I did buy a car though I would not be the only licensed driver, my partner would be able to drive it too - if that is acceptable to the manufacturers!

Maybe what we the Customers and the retailers seem to battle with is this new rules for a relatively new industry situation. Am not saying SI/Sega are not entitled to do what they can to protect business but such measures dont work if applied to cars, clothing etc so for us to make such associations probably doesnt really help our own understanding.

[pele10]

The reason I can't buy FM12 is, I buy the game boxed in the shop SI tell me I've got to download steam, then steam says it wont run with the programs I have installed on my computer (hence the list of programs you need to uninstall or stop before using steam)

The following applications have been known to cause issues with Steam and playing games:

Anti-Virus Applications - Any Anti-Virus program could potentially block Steam and Steam game access, especially when not properly configured for use with Steam. Please make sure that Steam and all Steam games are listed as exceptions in these programs. If the issue persists, please try disabling or temporarily uninstalling the program to test the issue.

• Avast!
  
• AVG Anti-virus *
  
• BitDefender
  
• F-Secure
  
• Iobit Advanced System Care *
  
• Kaspersky Anti-virus
  
• McAfee Anti-virus
  
• Nod32 Anti-virus *
  
• Norton/Symantec Anti-virus
  
• Panda Anti-virus
  
• Threatfire
  
• Trend Micro
  
• VIGuard Anti-virus
  

Anti-Spyware Applications

• Ad Aware
  
• CA Pest Patrol
  
• PC Tools Spyware Doctor with AntiVirus (may need to disable Full-Screen detection in the Advanced settings)
  
• Spybot Search & Destroy
  
• Spycatcher Express
  
• Spyware Terminator
  
• Webroot Spy Sweeper *
  

Firewall/Security Applications

• CA Internet Security Suite
  
• Comodo (With Portal 2 running the firewall in Defense+ in training mode allows the game to run)
  
• CYBERsitter
  
• ESET Smart Security
  
• Netlimiter
  
• McAfee Personal Firewall
  
• Nvidia Network Access Manager/Firewall *
  
• Nvidia ForceWare Intelligent Application Manager
  
• Outpost Firewall (Disabling System Guard under Proactive Protection allows Portal 2 to run)
  
• Panda Internet Security
  
• Peer Guardian
  
• PeerBlock
  
• Tiny Personal Firewall
  
• Verizon Internet Security Suite
  
• Zone Alarm
  
• Constant Guard by Comcast
  
• Online Armor
  

Other Applications

• IOBit Advance System Care
  
• Airfoil
  
• Alcohol 120%
  
• AOLacsd.exe (AOL connection driver)
  
• ATI Hotkey Poller
  
• ATI Tray Tools
  
• BitTorrent/uTorrent (all clients)
  
• Creative Software (Alchemy, MediaSource 5 on Asus G60VX models specifcally)
  
• Catalyst AI
  
• Daemon Tools
  
• Download Accelerators (all clients)
  
• EVGA Precision
  
• Garfield Daily Desktop Comic
  
• GhostSurf 2007
  
• Google Toolbar, Google Updater
  
• GSC
  
• Hamachi
  
• HotSpot Shield
  
• K-Lite Codec Pack
  
• LimeWire, BearShare or other Peer 2 Peer applications
  
• LogMeIn
  
• Microsoft Screen Magnifier in Windows 7 (magnify.exe - may cause in-game cursor issues)
  
• MSI Afterburner
  
• nProtect GameGuard *
  
• PC Time Limit
  
• Skype
  
• Slysoft AnyDVD
  
• StarDock KeepSafe
  
• SteamWatch
  
• iolo System Mechanic
  
• TeamSpeak (can lead to mic issues)
  
• Total Recorder
  
• Tuneup WinStyler Theme Service
  
• UPEK Protector Suite
  
• Ventrilo (can lead to mic issues)
  
• VirtuaGirl 2
  
• Western Digital Backup Anywhere
  
• Whitesmoke Translator (may cause the Source engine to crash)
  
• WindowBlinds
  
• Xfire
  

* We recommend that applications listed in bold with a ( * ) symbol are fully uninstalled from your system if disabling them does not resolve the issue