David Kempshall

A Message On Football Manager 2012 Activation

4,165 posts in this topic

If you can't access the internet at all then you can't play the game unfortunately. However, if you can go an internet cafe, or a friends house or find a temporary solution where you can access the internet for a short while to install Steam and active your game then you can play offline on your computer from then on.

Thats the point im making, i used to be in this boat myself, never had the internet at all i would be very annoyed if i went to the local game shop, bought fm 2012 and couldnt play it because i never had the internet.Also even more annoyed when i tried to take it back and they wouldnt accept it as its been opened.

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I would appreciate it if everyone stopped hiding behind the piracy excuse.

I appreciate that Steam makes it incredibly easy to push out updates, and to keep graphics drivers up to date, but it does nothing against piracy - if anything it will drive a new section of potential or existing customers towards it. Steam has several advantages, but it also has a lot of disadvantages which are far too easily swept under the carpet.

That and forcing someone who's purchased the game to install third party software is not a good way to treat customers. It should be an option, it should not be mandatory.

Again, Steam does nothing against piracy, so I struggle to believe that is the actual reason for this decision.

Wakers - apologies if you struggle to believe this, but we can 100% say that it is te actual reason.

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We obviously cannot release specific facts and figures but we wouldn't be making this decision blindly if Steam did absolutely nothing against piracy.

This is a key part of the problem for some people, if the decision has been made because Steam does prevent piracy then from a corporate point a view I would want to advertise these figures from the highest point as it would confirm one of the major USP's of this system, with neither party willing to publically state how their sales figures have increased then I'm afraid many people, myself included, are inclined to consider the claims as utter rubbish.

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Good question, I'm not 100% sure but I am trying to find out. Thanks.

How can you not know?

apart from the fact that the industry is doing it's best to stop the second hand market, of course. so tbh i dount it was even an afterthought when this cynical decision was made

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How can you not know?

He can not know because not everybody in the company is expert on every single aspect of everything we do. That's why he's off to ask the people who are :)

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As long as I'm not forced to play the game through Steam I can deal with that.

Activating through steam will surely force you to play it through steam?

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Good question, I'm not 100% sure but I am trying to find out. Thanks.

No, you can't trade games in your steam account.

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So the argument goes:

Pirating is difficult via steam

therefore

pirates don't use steam

therefore

to play our game, they will not only have to buy steam, but they will also be buying our game.

Seems illogical to me. Either steam is fine for pirates, or you're asking an awful lot of people who for whatever reason didn't pay for the game in the first place.

And on the other end of the scale, you're pissing off your real customers. :thdn: poor form.

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I'm not really happy about using a 3rd party software but I'll try it out since I want to play the game. For those who are complaining about being "forced" to install a third party software, it's only an extension of having to download plug-ins to make sure a program runs smoothly and while it's not a great result, it is what it is.

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I wasn't part of the decision making on this so don't know what was weighed up but it would be a pretty safe bet that the decision would not have been made if they didn't think it would have a positive impact on combating piracy and therefore increasing the numbers buying our game legally.

There's a lot of people saying that Steam doesn't make any difference in combating piracy, have you got figures to prove that?

Figures? No. Why? Because each game is different. If we look at Deus Ex 3 for example, that game had a massive fanbase from the first 2 games. People would buy that because they'd been waiting years for it, regardless of how early it became available. I would guess (by the way, it's hard to get figures when everyone says "obviously we can't release figures") that yearly titles such as FM, Fifa etc etc suffer more from piracy than bigger releases.

The thing that you should look at is how quickly games are available on torrent sites that have steam activation as the only way to activate the game.

Steam is still DRM (speaking of DX3), and that is still something that a lot of people have a big problem with.

Actually, you can now trade games within steam - however I think this applies to digital downloads only at the moment.

The basic point is - pirates will get around Steam very quickly. I still get this sense that games companies are clinging to the old '1 pirated version is a 1 lost sale.'

So if pirates get around steam, then what exactly is the point of it? All it does is annoy people who wouldn't consider pirating the game in the first place.

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No, you can't trade games in your steam account.

This is indeed the case.

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Thats the point im making, i used to be in this boat myself, never had the internet at all i would be very annoyed if i went to the local game shop, bought fm 2012 and couldnt play it because i never had the internet.Also even more annoyed when i tried to take it back and they wouldnt accept it as its been opened.

The box will clearly state you need the internet and steam to play, so really it would be the fault of the person buying the game if that happened.

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you will never stop piracy,steam wont stop it,there will be a crack on the internet in the first week that the game is out.you wont need to activate it then.so why use steam its not going to stop the f k r s who do this.

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Either steam is fine for pirates, or you're asking an awful lot of people who for whatever reason didn't pay for the game in the first place.

And on the other end of the scale, you're pissing off your real customers. (n) poor form.

The fact is, there's no such thing as real customers.

if based on this decision the game sells 100,000 more copies, it doesn't matter to the people in charge if 200,000 customers who have been loyal to the game for 15 years stopped buying it

this is hilariously bad stuff

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The box will clearly state you need the internet and steam to play, so really it would be the fault of the person buying the game if that happened.

The main point is being forced to not play the game over a lack of internet connection.

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I am afraid sega you have just lost a customer. I don't want to be forced to install a program on my pc/mac that i do not want and on that basis this will be the first fm since its inception that i will not purchase.

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The fact is' date=' there's no such thing as real customers.

if based on this decision the game sells 100,000 more copies, it doesn't matter to the people in charge if 200,000 customers who have been loyal to the game for 15 years stopped buying it

this is hilariously bad stuff[/quote']

Your missing the point.

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Another one signed up to whinge!

Not happy with this at all, admittedly I haven`t bought a new FM since 09, as I prefer to spend time on older versions than buy the latest one of the shelf.

But this year I was planning to get FM12, I was ready to move up and embrace all the new features, however time consuming they may be, I was going to get stuck in regardless.

But now I have to go through Steam to get it to work, I give up. I try to keep my PC away from the internet (where I can) to avoid any nasties, and I tend to download any files I need

on my other PC and move them across to my gaming PC on a USB stick, which has worked well for me on all the older versions, and I was looking to continue doing things this way.

I have no interest in trying to obtain a pirated copy of the game, it`s either a brand new, fresh out of the box and official game that I can install and play on the day or nothing for me.

For all the older versions that I can play without my PC ever seeing an internet connection, I thank you immensely from the very depths of my heart. And it is those I shall go back

and play and appreciate more than I have ever done, as I can just play without anything telling me I have to go here, there or anywhere before I can begin.

Everything used to be so simple, now it`s just cluttered up because too many outside influences want to stick their fingers in the pie. Well I am no longer hungry if this is the new recipe.

Cheers again :-)

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:(

You really are cutting off your nose to spite your face, you clearly enjoy FM, you wont win anything by taking your stance, the only person who will suffer is you, this is happening no matter what anyone on here says, either get with it or your going to miss out on a game many of you have enjoyed for the best part of 10 years. All because you dont really know much about a program you need to unlock the game. Your Xbox and PS3 will take more info from you than steam does, but no one cares that much, i have had steam for as long as its been around, never had my account hacked, never had any issues at all in anyway, i leave it signed in at all times and to unless you have the same password for your steam account and email account the chances of being hacked are slim to none. Its no more unsafe than any application anyone uses online.

I think you are wrong. For every honest person who sadly won't be playing FM12, how many not so honest or miffed people do you think will seek out a cracked copy? This action is more likely to see an increase in pirated copy ownership in my opinion.

Damn it all, I was about to bite the bullet on agents, and move up from FM10. :mad::(

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Really can not understand all the hate towards Steam.

Maybe look at it like this:

"What can I get you ?"

"Ummm, I'll have some chips and,...err.. hamburger with the lot thanks, umm but no onions"

"No worries," (writing and speaking aloud) "Chips, and haamm... burgg...gerr with the lot, "

"Yep, great,.. but with no onions"

"But a hamburger with the lot, comes with onions"

"Yes, but I don't want any onions"

"But it comes with onions"

"Yep, got that bit mate, but I don't want any onions, actually, I don't like onions"

"How about..... I just put the onions to the side, next to the chips"

"No,... I don't want any onions"

"But.. they.. could just.. sit next to the chips, and you... could... maybe... just ignore them"

"NO... I DON'T want any onions,I DON'T like onions"

"The onions are free you know,"

"LOOK... NO F**KING ONIONS, YOU GOT IT.......friggin' peanut"

Well thats the gist basically

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How about this

If you have never installed Steam and you don't want to install steam well meet half way

How about you try it for a week and if you don't like it you can uninstall it? If you have any questions on how to use it, or to uninstall it just ask.

But if you're just not installing it because of irrational fears that it's a memory hog, slows down your computer, it's spying on you or anything like that, I can confirm that none of that is true.

Try it. You might actually like it. And if you don't uninstall it.

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you will never stop piracy,steam wont stop it,there will be a crack on the internet in the first week that the game is out.you wont need to activate it then.so why use steam its not going to stop the f k r s who do this.

It may not stop them, but i'm sure it will make their job a little more difficult from last year FM2011. So if you look at thing from this point of view (like SI/SEGA are) this is a way to stop piracy! Its not perfect... but it's better then nothing!

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The fact is' date=' there's no such thing as real customers.

if based on this decision the game sells 100,000 more copies, it doesn't matter to the people in charge if 200,000 customers who have been loyal to the game for 15 years stopped buying it

this is hilariously bad stuff[/quote']

The real rustomers he mentioned were the people who paid for the current game not the people who have played them all. So yes, you did miss the point.

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Don't understand what problems people have with Steam. Though i suppose software can affect everyone differently. Don't agree with this change however but it wont stop me buying it since i use steam anyway. Really does make patching the game easier for one thing(and has also saved games that would've been corrupted-due to computer ****ing up, without steam).

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:(

I think you are wrong. For every honest person who sadly won't be playing FM12, how many not so honest or miffed people do you think will seek out a cracked copy? This action is more likely to see an increase in pirated copy ownership in my opinion.

Damn it all, I was about to bite the bullet on agents, and move up from FM10. :mad::(

They won't download Steam but they certainly will download µTorrent so they can torrent it... Torrenting requires third party software as well.

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Do Not want it and i think %90 of the FM community are with me in saying that as this thread proves. i am NOT a fan of fifa manager but ea really are making a lot of effort to improve that game to overtake this and they already have the fifa match engine to use. i would be very careful with irritating and annoying your loyal fan base because they won't stay loyal for much longer.

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The main point is being forced to not play the game over a lack of internet connection.

you cant use an Ipod unless you have the internet and use Itunes, i dont see anyone kicking up a huge fuss over that.

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you cant use an Ipod unless you have the internet and use Itunes, i dont see anyone kicking up a huge fuss over that.

Im sorry, are we on an apple forum?

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They won't download Steam but they certainly will download µTorrent so they can torrent it... Torrenting requires third party software as well.

That's missing the point. And it's technically not correct, it depends on what you want to use to download the torrent. Opera for instance does this without any other software needed.

If someone wants to pirate a game, they won't mind installing something that helps them do it.

If someone just wants to play a game that they've bought, they might mind having to sign up to an online service and all of the registration, potentially security issues and possible service disruptions that come with it.

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I always install the game through steam anyway so it makes no difference to me.

Steam uses next to no resources nowadays, can be set offline, is very minimalist so it doesnt get in the way, has fun achievements, allows you to chat with friends ingame using steam community (if online).

I see no negatives to steam tbh unless i didnt have an internet connection at least once to activate the game.

Anyone who hasnt used steam in the last year should just try it out now to see how unintrusive it is and how little resources it now uses compared to years ago.

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Figures? No. Why? Because each game is different. If we look at Deus Ex 3 for example, that game had a massive fanbase from the first 2 games. People would buy that because they'd been waiting years for it, regardless of how early it became available. I would guess (by the way, it's hard to get figures when everyone says "obviously we can't release figures") that yearly titles such as FM, Fifa etc etc suffer more from piracy than bigger releases.

You're right, every game is different. Asking for figures either way is pointless because this is the first time that this would be being done on this particular game so we just won't know exact figures of if it's worked until it's released.

The research done by the guys at SEGA think it will have a positive impact and so it's happening. It really is a war against piracy (and piracy, whatever some people will have you think, really is risking destroying creative industries, not just gaming) and this is FM's next move in attempting to combat it.

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you cant use an Ipod unless you have the internet and use Itunes, i dont see anyone kicking up a huge fuss over that.

That would be because people who don't want to use iTunes buy a different product.

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Good point made further up that I haven't seen an answer for. What if you want to re-sell your game on Ebay or the like when FM13 comes out? I often sell my old games for a few quid, I take it as it will be already registered there will no longer be the option to do that?

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How about this

If you have never installed Steam and you don't want to install steam well meet half way

How about you try it for a week and if you don't like it you can uninstall it? If you have any questions on how to use it, or to uninstall it just ask.

But if you're just not installing it because of irrational fears that it's a memory hog, slows down your computer, it's spying on you or anything like that, I can confirm that none of that is true.

Try it. You might actually like it. And if you don't uninstall it.

I've installed Steam, in the past, for FM09... (as I keep saying, only game and all that...) and it is because I've used it in the past that I won't use it again!

If we could play FM12 without Steam I'd quite happily pay double what you monkeys that will buy it with Steam, it's not about piracy to me, it's about being forced to use something I don't like nor want to use despite me paying hard-earned cash for it! I should have the choice... the only choice I have is install steam and play the game or don't install steam and don't play the game... it will be the latter :(

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Do Not want it and i think %90 of the FM community are with me in saying that as this thread proves. i am NOT a fan of fifa manager but ea really are making a lot of effort to improve that game to overtake this and they already have the fifa match engine to use. i would be very careful with irritating and annoying your loyal fan base because they won't stay loyal for much longer.

Because less than 40% is equal to 90%.

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Maybe look at it like this:

"What can I get you ?"

"Ummm, I'll have some chips and,...err.. hamburger with the lot thanks, umm but no onions"

"No worries," (writing and speaking aloud) "Chips, and haamm... burgg...gerr with the lot, "

"Yep, great,.. but with no onions"

"But a hamburger with the lot, comes with onions"

"Yes, but I don't want any onions"

"But it comes with onions"

"Yep, got that bit mate, but I don't want any onions, actually, I don't like onions"

"How about..... I just put the onions to the side, next to the chips"

"No,... I don't want any onions"

"But.. they.. could just.. sit next to the chips, and you... could... maybe... just ignore them"

"NO... I DON'T want any onions,I DON'T like onions"

"The onions are free you know,"

"LOOK... NO F**KING ONIONS, YOU GOT IT.......friggin' peanut"

Well thats the gist basically

Sounds more like buying a Windows PC and getting Windows Defender hard wired into the OS.

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You're right, every game is different. Asking for figures either way is pointless because this is the first time that this would be being done on this particular game so we just won't know exact figures of if it's worked until it's released.

The research done by the guys at SEGA think it will have a positive impact and so it's happening. It really is a war against piracy (and piracy, whatever some people will have you think, really is risking destroying creative industries, not just gaming) and this is FM's next move in attempting to combat it.

But is it also a step towards moving the game to a solely digital release in the future?

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:(

I think you are wrong. For every honest person who sadly won't be playing FM12, how many not so honest or miffed people do you think will seek out a cracked copy? This action is more likely to see an increase in pirated copy ownership in my opinion.

Damn it all, I was about to bite the bullet on agents, and move up from FM10. :mad::(

Any more than usual? I dont think so. People who steal games will always try and carry on doing that, this will not force people into underground game dealing, or force more people towards torrent sites unless they are already inclined that way. I actually think they will sell more copies in the long run, steam and applications like it are the way forward for gaming, there is no going back on that, it will never be like it was 5/6 years ago.

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It may not stop them, but i'm sure it will make their job a little more difficult from last year FM2011. So if you look at thing from this point of view (like SI/SEGA are) this is a way to stop piracy! Its not perfect... but it's better then nothing!

I'll bookmark this thread & post the first FM12 torrent link when it becomes available, £5 says I find one before the game can be activated on Steam.

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Maybe look at it like this:

"What can I get you ?"

"Ummm, I'll have some chips and,...err.. hamburger with the lot thanks, umm but no onions"

"No worries," (writing and speaking aloud) "Chips, and haamm... burgg...gerr with the lot, "

"Yep, great,.. but with no onions"

"But a hamburger with the lot, comes with onions"

"Yes, but I don't want any onions"

"But it comes with onions"

"Yep, got that bit mate, but I don't want any onions, actually, I don't like onions"

"How about..... I just put the onions to the side, next to the chips"

"No,... I don't want any onions"

"But.. they.. could just.. sit next to the chips, and you... could... maybe... just ignore them"

"NO... I DON'T want any onions,I DON'T like onions"

"The onions are free you know,"

"LOOK... NO F**KING ONIONS, YOU GOT IT.......friggin' peanut"

Well thats the gist basically

You use itunes at all? Or do you refuse to use that because you don't like onions?

Steam is great, if you have a PC good enough to run FM then the small usage of Steam wont affect it. It's never been intrusive for me, what is everyone's problem?

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I welcome steam with open arms.. Been using it for many many years and very rarely do I encounter any problems.

Install the bloody program and thats it.. how is that annoying to anyone? - most of you happily install winamp, vlc, winzip etc in order to use some other programs/media or something like that.. why do you not require mp3, movies and such come with their own built-in player? - Why is it such a big problem to install steam when you probably have 20-30 others "not needed" programs on your pc?

I really dont get how it is such a big problem.. Annoying? I guess.. if you're not used to use Steam, but so annoying that you will boycott FM? - insanity IMO

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Sounds more like buying a Windows PC and getting Windows Defender hard wired into the OS.

How, exactly? Windows Defender is not only part of the OS itself, but it is optional. Steam is not part of the FM application and it is not optional. So really, it's nothing like buying a PC.

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That would be because people who don't want to use iTunes buy a different product.

Its the same thing tho, you want to buy a new SI product you have to use steam, you want to buy a new Ipod you have to use Itunes. There is always a choice in there.

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I think that everyone needs to remember that if there was no piracy in the world then there'd be no need for the measures discussed. If you'd spent years working on something wouldn't you do all you could to protect it from someone trying to steal it? Steam is great IMO, and it doesn't require an internet connection past the first time you activate FM so I don't really see the problem.

At the end of the day - like the lad from SEGA said - less piracy = more people having to buy the game = more money for development = better FM13/14/15, I, for one am more than happy to go through Steam if that's what it takes.

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They won't download Steam but they certainly will download µTorrent so they can torrent it... Torrenting requires third party software as well.

the point being you actually make the decision to use utorrent,vuze etc. You dont get a chance to choose whether to use steam for FM12.

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I welcome steam with open arms.. Been using it for many many years and very rarely do I encounter any problems.

Install the bloody program and thats it.. how is that annoying to anyone? - most of you happily install winamp, vlc, winzip etc in order to use some other programs/media or something like that.. why do you not require mp3, movies and such come with their own built-in player? - Why is it such a big problem to install steam when you probably have 20-30 others "not needed" programs on your pc?

I really dont get how it is such a big problem.. Annoying? I guess.. if you're not used to use Steam, but so annoying that you will boycott FM? - insanity IMO

Yes, but people new to Steam need to be aware of a) there is the potential of having accounts hacked and being unrecoverable (the same as any other online service) and b) that steam does not have a customer support system that would be deemed appropriate in most EU countries.

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I welcome steam with open arms.. Been using it for many many years and very rarely do I encounter any problems.

Install the bloody program and thats it.. how is that annoying to anyone? - most of you happily install winamp, vlc, winzip etc in order to use some other programs/media or something like that.. why do you not require mp3, movies and such come with their own built-in player? - Why is it such a big problem to install steam when you probably have 20-30 others "not needed" programs on your pc?

I really dont get how it is such a big problem.. Annoying? I guess.. if you're not used to use Steam, but so annoying that you will boycott FM? - insanity IMO

Ok, I'll install Steam the day they make it Open Source, deal?

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I'll bookmark this thread & post the first FM12 torrent link when it becomes available, £5 says I find one before the game can be activated on Steam.

That would get you a ban from this forum. However, please do email it to piracy (at) sigames.com

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