Liverpool Thread 2011/12

[crouchaldinho]

Bring back Rafa!

[Daaaaave]

joke stateside: stevie nicol is available. sacked by the ne revolution last season. knows liverpool AND boston.

[foofighter23]

big word for AVB now, according to an 'itk'. he's available and was wanted by fsg first time round and his odds have been dropping all week.

not convinced, but he's a better bet than the PL managers we've been linked to.

[dustygator]

big word for AVB now, according to an 'itk'. he's available and was wanted by fsg first time round and his odds have been dropping all week.

not convinced, but he's a better bet than the PL managers we've been linked to.

If we get AVB, it has to be for the long haul. With time and money I'd think he could definitely build us up to challenge for the title.

[football_master_94]

Rafa loves players who are in his side, doesnt talk to the ones who arent. His man management skills are awful at best. His best signings were no brainers bar Reina. Trying to replace the class Alonso with the clogger Barry? Paying £7m for Pennant and he leaves on a free 3 years later? Genius that one.

75% of the players at Valencia hated Rafa. Not quite that % at Liverpool but there would have been quite a few who disliked the man.

Flying in the league, Rafa opens his big gob about Fergie and then we throw it away.

And Liverpool fans want this guy back??

You do realise that you guys dropped more points leading upto the fact 'rant' than after it

[dking]

The best option forward is probably Rafa.

Though I'd still prefer him over the last two managers we've had.

[dudester]

I mean from a reliable source. I wouldn't believe whelan if he told me the sun was coming up in the east tomorrow.

What if it was from Ian Ayre?

http://www.espn.co.uk/football/sport/story/151181.html?CMP=OTC-RSS

[VamPook]

[Select_screen_name:]

Aquaman

[VamPook]

I want Rafa out but with the club looking for new owners who will appoint a new manager, who will want to come with their future uncertain and no money for transfers and where will the money to pay off Rafa come from?

I shudder to think where we will end up now - the fallout from this will be huge. I can see him walking straight into the Inter Milan job whilst we end up with Mark Hughes or Alan Curbishley. Any decent manager with an ounce of sense wouldn't come near us until these owners are gone.

Dark, dark days ahead I am afraid.

can't wait to see the reaction of people who wanted rafa out next year when mark hughes or someone similar turns up and turns liverpool into a lower mid table team

****ing ridiculous if true, but i did get the impression rafa was gonna go if he didnt get a transfer budget. trouble is he'll walk str8 into the next best management job in europe while we'll appoint aomeone who would never have the pedigree to walk into another top job in football and will surely be only someone we can afford, namely sammy lee or worse ffs.

well done H&G, well ****ing done!

ssn just said rafas agent refusing to comment which doesnt look good.

the only light i can take from this is that the rumours that torres and gerrard wanted to go if rafa didnt was true. if not and either or both go then im off to support st helens rugby club....

The **** has well and truly hit the fan.

Next season could possibly be the most important the club has ever had and probably will for ages, if things go wrong then like I said in the other thread god knows what will happen to the club.

Nothing stopping Hodgson, Fulham probably won't go any higher/get any better than last season, he's got a record of not spending big, gets a lot out of players, I don't see him being a massive let down for the likes of Torres and Gerrard either.

Also, Liverpool are still a big name, are in the UEFA Cup and could possibly get back into the Champions League if this mess is sorted out, 2 years, 3 years ...Hodgson definitely wants to manage England too and Capello will be there (hopefully) until at least 2012 .. Roy could be sitting pretty at a top side, hopefully improving them come then ... makes sense for him imo

O'Neil's got a top chairman, moaned about money available last season (apparently) depends whether he thinks he can take Villa into the top 4, I think not when he refuses to change his side They always tail off come the end of the season.

Never know, still a big name club

Official confirmation Rafa is gone

SCrewed up.

gutted really, dark dark times ahead now i think.

Bit stunned, bit gutted. Happened really quick.

Well we're ******.

imo, no point even talking about any foreign managers. gerrard wants some local pud to kiss his ass and set up another english clique locker room where everyone takes turns bowing to him and carra. next step: sign danny murphy

R.I.P. Liverpool Football Club

15th March 1892 - 3rd June 2010

tbf we don't need a world class manager to get back into the CL, there were obvious problems that Benitez was having this season and a new manager with a new perspective might be refreshing for the players. You need to look at the positives of a new manager, regardless of reputation.

Hopefully we won't have someone whp falls in love with Lucas and if Aquilani can stay fit our squad will be a lot stronger. You also don't know how well any new manager will act in the transfer market and how good they are at motivating the players and grinding out good results.

Despite the weaknesses in our squad i think its still fair to say that we still have a better side than Tottenham who had a great season. If our new manager can influence a positive change in the players attitude we can have a good season and we won't need any new players to qualify for the CL. Without new players its unlikely we will win anything but all we need next season is a bit of stability and if we recover we can build a side that can win trophies.

Rafa had been instrumental in trying to rebuild the club from bottom to top in terms of the playing staff. He had restructured the academy and brought in Rodolpho Borrell from Barca and Frank McParland came back to run it. He had brought in a new doctor from Australia this summer to improve medical facilities, and he had re-organised the reserves system to improve the links with the academy and make the transition smoother. What happens to all of that work now?

I don't think you can blame anyone who feels a sense of impending doom at the club, all fingers now point towards us selling top players to balance the books and bringing in some patsy to manage us whilst the board get busy asset stripping to pay down debt. The next boss will have to put up with his best and highest earning players being moved on whilst getting a pittance to replace them. The clubs ambitions on the pitch will now be heading toward mid-table safety and a guarantee of the 40mill TV money that comes with Premier League football rather than winning trophies etc.

Anyone wanting Hiddink, Van Gaal, Rijkaard etc is simply living in fantasy land. We will get a british manager who has experience of working on a shoe string budget and had relevant domestic success, possibly even european success. The men that jump out are Hodgson and O'Neill, and I don't think O'Neill would take it. That leaves us with Hodgson to steady the ship while we pay some debt off - marvellous!

Stay away from McLeish, thank you.

Ding-dong the witch is dead! Now we just need to sell up.

Seriously, about time too. Thanks and good bye rafa.

So much doom and gloom in here, its all speculation and hear say. I'm actually quite excited about the next few months, with a certain amount of trepidation as well. The bottom line is, nobody knows what is going to happen to the club in the coming months.

Whats with all the crying about flag burning? who gives a **** if a few idiots want to do that, it will solve nothing and will soon go away (like the yanks, we hope).

can't really be bothered righting a massive post on rafa again. said how disappointed i was with him enough in this thread to go over it all again. the decline was too severe to lump most of the blame on backroom stuff and its an easy get out to explain last season, he failed spectacularly in every competition and failed to motivate the team, aswell as showing a worrying lack of flexibility in his tactics when it was most needed.

would've liked him to stay and try and leave on a better season and circumstances but if i'm honest i couldn't see next season being a whole lot different. just think it was time for him to move on and the club to take a fresh approach at things and i for one am excited at a new manager coming in with new ideas.

big thumbs up for rafa's time here and the success he brought and i wish him well.

Do you realise how much of an idiot you actually sound lol. To even think that the people of Liverpool and the club aren't linked is laughable. I'm not saying this just about Liverpool but every club. The community surrounding the club will rub off on it and generate certain types of atmosphere. Out of interest what attracted you to the club? I am not delusional in any way shape or form, I don't think we have a divine right to win everything due to our history. If we did by some chance turn out like another Leeds I would still follow the club all over the country but can't help to think that you would forget about it all together. You are the problem with our club not me, sitting on your computer slating everything about the club generates nothing but a bad atmosphere amongst fans. Whilst actually going to the match singing on the terraces and getting behind the team (not at all having a go at people who dont go I understand how hard it is as I am at uni in Leicester so have missed many games due to travel costs etc) is what Liverpool football club is all about. Not some idiot from the other side of the world having a go at the local support.

The brilliant irony of richardsons first sentence

This is what I don't understand about this thread, I disagree with the majority so I am automatically an idiot. I like coming on here because of the difference of opinions, it's refreshing as the other forums I go on people tend to agree with each other on most things whilst I enjoy that people on here have many different opinions on the club. Even if they are as pathetic as Daaaaave's lol.

I think the situation the club is in right now with the ownership etc, its either going to be a caretaker or someone on a short term deal (one or two seasons) that we need. The club isn't stable enough yet to roll out new "5 year plans" as we don't know who will be owning the club in 6 months time.

Dalglish should probably be the first port of call, but its not clear if he would fancy a return to full time management having been out of it for 9 or 10 seasons (similar situation to when Keegan returned to Newcastle) I wouldn't want him to take the job if he felt pressured into it, only if he was absolutely sure he fancied it. After that the best option I can think of would be Roy Hodgson - an experienced, claming influence who knows the league, has european experience and is used to working within financial constraints.

Ok so just as a quick poll in here, who are the Liverpool fans in this thread wanting as our next manager?

My vote is with Roy Hodgson btw.

Roy too would be good

If it is who we think then it would have to be Dalglish for now. If it is who we want then I would love Hiddink or Van Gaal

In that case...yep i agree with you and Dan on Hodgson.

I'd be happy with Hodgson. He seems to be able to create a team mentality that is greater than the sum of it's parts and that's what we need for a few seasons, especially if the asset stripping starts.

It is difficult though as, as a club, we've a history of trying to be very forward looking with our managers and putting people in place who the fans believed could progress the club over a number of years. I don't think we're in a position to do that now. We need experience and someone capable with the basics for the short term. I'm not expecting success just enough to hold out against further decline before (fingers crossed) there is a brigher future with different owners.

I think an issue that is as big as the potential superstars leaving is how this will affect the youth program/routes to the first team that so much work has gone into over the Rafa reign. Of course, it's always been there but Rafa made it much higher profile with his battle for control and his recruitement of youngsters from all over the world.

As much as I love Robbie I think Harry Redknapp would be a very poor choice as manager. I know most on here don't really give a **** about the boycott of the sun etc (don't want to start that debate up again) but I think I am right in saying he is in their latest advert (the ***** one with venables singing). I know that everyone I have spoken to about it would be outraged if he was hired even more so if the advert were to be played whilst he were in charge. I also don't think he is that great a manager, even though I don't particularly want him I would rather have Hodgson, at least Hodgson is old school and would take the job very seriously and would have seen first hand what our club is capable of.

I do honestly believe Gerrard is off this summer. When we were talking to Callaghan over the weekend he almost let it slip. Don't see how you can say Torres isn't a fan of Rafa either he owes him a lot. Someone asked him who he thought was Liverpools greatest ever player and he said Gerrard and started explaining why. Then he nearly said when he leaves and then changed it to if when he realised. Then he came over to our table to have a chat with us and we were asking if Gerrard was off and he wouldn't give us a straight answer and just said how good he has been for the club for so long etc. Everything he said indicated he is leaving.

He was also dropping hints that Dalglish really wants the job and a lot of people fancy him for it who are connected to the club.

Think Torres owes Rafa a lot nobody else was willing to match the price we payed and it was a massive risk at the time which has really worked for the club.

So bored.

Really gotta laugh at Kopite/06richardson though

[Emersonlfc]

awesome bit of play that.

[niggle]

im laughing more at the clown who said stay away from McLeish

[paperclips]

im laughing more at the clown who said stay away from McLeish

What a good warning

[dking]

It's no secret that I wanted Rafa out, and I don't really want him back, but in hindsight I'd have kept him over the last two managers. Who wouldn't?

And I wish somebody would quote me on the things I've got right (not much I know)!

Also, you have way too much time on your hands, VamPook.

[VamPook]

I crashed after dinner and stupidly woke up for some reason.... 5.20am now

[VamPook]

I just wanted to look back and see how many of us actually wanted Rafa out... but I really couldn't find much.

I mean, I'm sure there would have been people during certain match threads etc etc that would have said something... but when his announcement of his departure was posted, there certainly weren't celebrations in the thread... unlike this page of this thread

[cyclonus1010]

You do realise that you guys dropped more points leading upto the fact 'rant' than after it

Jan 10 Stoke 0-0 Liverpool

Jan 19 Liverpool 1-1 Everton

Jan 28 Wigan 1-1 Liverpool

Feb 1 Liverpool 2-0 Chelsea

Feb 7 Portsmouth 2-3 Liverpool

Feb 22 Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City

Feb 28 Middlesbrough 2-0 Liverpool.

Bet your life that Fergie used Rafa's rant in the Utd dressing room as an incentive, not that Utd ever need one. Utd pretty much won every game during that dodgy period we had above.

Psychology at both clubs changed after the rant.

[foofighter23]

If we get AVB, it has to be for the long haul. With time and money I'd think he could definitely build us up to challenge for the title.

its still a risk though imo. if our players respond to him then we have a chance and he'd also need to get backed in the transfer market.

collymore just said earlier something which ive been saying for ages. what would you want for a manager? youd want a banker right? someone who is as close to lets say, 100% as you can get, someone you can absolutely rely on. the closer you get to that target, the less you have to worry, right?

avb has won in a portuguese league thats not very good. if you can go a whole season unbeaten but yet not even make it out the group stage of the CL then it says a lot about the class difference in portugal and he struggled at a chelsea side with plenty of capable players that RDM got more from in less time. like i said im not convinced and rafa is a much better bet overall, but ive also heard there is 0% chance of that happening aswell.

[Select_screen_name:]

Jan 10 Stoke 0-0 Liverpool

Jan 19 Liverpool 1-1 Everton

Jan 28 Wigan 1-1 Liverpool

Feb 1 Liverpool 2-0 Chelsea

Feb 7 Portsmouth 2-3 Liverpool

Feb 22 Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City

Feb 28 Middlesbrough 2-0 Liverpool.

Bet your life that Fergie used Rafa's rant in the Utd dressing room as an incentive, not that Utd ever need one. Utd pretty much won every game during that dodgy period we had above.

Psychology at both clubs changed after the rant.

No it never. Players aren't 12 years old who read and live of rubbish printed in papers.

[Kopite]

I'd take AVB but he wouldn't fit in with our owners. He would need a lot of time but I'd be confident he would get us back in the top 4 at least given time. However, the actions of our owners show that they lack patience and feel that one full season is enough to turn a club around. They probably don't realise that they have taken the club even further back now.

[Select_screen_name:]

The problem with turning the club around is that we took the wrong turn in the end, and ended up being worse than last year. We had the same problems all season and it was never fixed. By a way of playing staff, training or tactics.

If he showed progression, I've no doubt he'd still be in charge.

[Kopite]

He did show progression. Three trips to Wembley including a cup win and a much better style of football.

For me it's certain players who should have been shipped on not the manager. Downing, Adam etc should have been sold on. Can't just sack managers and hope that fixes everything.

[PoolFan]

Jan 10 Stoke 0-0 Liverpool

Jan 19 Liverpool 1-1 Everton

Jan 28 Wigan 1-1 Liverpool

Feb 1 Liverpool 2-0 Chelsea

Feb 7 Portsmouth 2-3 Liverpool

Feb 22 Liverpool 1-1 Manchester City

Feb 28 Middlesbrough 2-0 Liverpool.

Bet your life that Fergie used Rafa's rant in the Utd dressing room as an incentive, not that Utd ever need one. Utd pretty much won every game during that dodgy period we had above.

Psychology at both clubs changed after the rant.

That's such a load of nonsense. If there's one thing I hate it's this BS about 'mind games'. We had it this season as well and it's complete and utter rubbish.

[CaptainPlanet]

That Jep lad should post more often.

[VamPook]

Certain players which the manager chose and spent gamillions on?

[benkeat]

did you say that when hodgson was sacked? sometimes it's better to get rid if it's clear you're not going in the right direction. i'm all for patience, if it's the right man.

[PoolFan]

He did show progression. Three trips to Wembley including a cup win and a much better style of football.

For me it's certain players who should have been shipped on not the manager. Downing, Adam etc should have been sold on. Can't just sack managers and hope that fixes everything.

It's easy to say that though but if I had invested 90 million in a team and seen how poorly that money had been spent then yeah i'd be looking to get some heads. This along with the admirable but flawed way in which he went about the whole Suarez thing must have had a effect on the owners. We haven't even talked about the football yet, which saw some amazingly inept performances.

As sad as the whole sacking is because you know KD would have given blood for the club, in my opinion he seemed way out of his depth in modern day football. What happened at Newcastle/Celtic? Beyond that you are looking at one success 20 years ago, if you are looking for people of that era then why not appoint howard wilkinson, he won it with Leeds around about the same time.

Liverpool as a club need to be dragged into modern football, we need stability and a long term plan that capitalizes upon the worldwide fanbase.

[VamPook]

Much better style of football compared to Hodgson?

Tough job that

[Big Geordie]

Posted this in the Dalglish thread - just incase anyone missed it.

[DeafParrot]

He did show progression. Three trips to Wembley including a cup win and a much better style of football.

For me it's certain players who should have been shipped on not the manager. Downing, Adam etc should have been sold on. Can't just sack managers and hope that fixes everything.

The cups don't mean what they used to. The league and qualification for the Champions league, like it or not, is everything. Kenny had us in decent shape in December on that front, and we were absolutely dreadful for the rest of the season. It wasn't a blip, it was consistently bad. The buck stops with the manager at the end of the day. He's the one who brought all these players to the club, for massive transfer fees, and most of them aren't up to it.

[Kopite]

But this is the same mentality that got Rafa sacked. One bad season and you're out. Clearly people have very short memories. It gets you nowhere.

[Insipidus]

Rafa got sacked because of his extremely poor relationship with the owners. His last season was a contributing factor, but it wasnt the reason per se.

[foofighter23]

He did show progression. Three trips to Wembley including a cup win and a much better style of football.

For me it's certain players who should have been shipped on not the manager. Downing, Adam etc should have been sold on. Can't just sack managers and hope that fixes everything.

but downing and adam were his signings and he chose to stick with them while leaving kuyt, bellamy and maxi on the bench.

our worst league season in 55 years tells me all i need to know. rafa got us top 4 with semis/finals aswell along the way and with less money than kenny had.

[PoolFan]

But this is the same mentality that got Rafa sacked. One bad season and you're out. Clearly people have very short memories. It gets you nowhere.

No Rafa got sacked because he was arguing with Hicks and Gillet about money that was promised for transfers that wasn't there. I'm all for giving people a chance but there has to be some sort of way to measure progression. From everything I read FSG wanted CL football hence the big outlay on transfers from them. We came NOWHERE near what was expected and Kenny has paid the price for that, if we had finished 5th and only a few points of even fourth then yeah you can say that he deserved another year to try and make it happen.

[benkeat]

But this is the same mentality that got Rafa sacked. One bad season and you're out. Clearly people have very short memories. It gets you nowhere.

One bad season is in fact all of Kenny's seasons though isn't it? If he'd progressed for 3-4 years and then had a blip, you'd say fair enough. Give him a year. But when the vast majority of a tenure is poor you have to start wondering when it's going to start looking good?

It's unfortunate, and I think he did a lot of good work here. And I think there's half decent foundations being left behind. But he's not the man for the job so there's no point wasting any more time than we already have.

[benkeat]

No Rafa got sacked because he was arguing with Hicks and Gillet about money that was promised for transfers that wasn't there. I'm all for giving people a chance but there has to be some sort of way to measure progression. From everything I read FSG wanted CL football hence the big outlay on transfers from them. We came NOWHERE near what was expected and Kenny has paid the price for that, if we had finished 5th and only a few points of even fourth then yeah you can say that he deserved another year to try and make it happen.

Yeah that's true. CL football was very clearly the club target at the start of the year and we have spectacularly failed to achieve it, despite no shortage of resources to do so. Can't really look past that tbh.

[CaptainPlanet]

AVB looking extremely likely at the moment.

[paperclips]

AVB looking extremely likely at the moment.

How is it?

[bridgekings]

quicker you appoint him quicker we can stop paying him

[PoolFan]

quicker you appoint him quicker we can stop paying him

I was going to ask about that, what is the deal with him and Chelsea. I heard crazy talk of him getting a 15 million payoff, is that only if he doesn't accept another job in the next few years? Makes me wonder if the guy will even want to manage when he can sit back and collect money for doing nothing.

[Emersonlfc]

See Sterling is back on twitter today. New account. Kenny most likely had him barred

[Rebs]

Think there are some articulate and intelligent liverpool fans on here who realise that Rafa is not the answer...he's had his day. Definitely time for a new manager. Would love to see Liverpool get back to their best, and challenging at the top with Man Utd (and I am not a Liverpool fan - get a young, hungry, attack-minding manager who wants to be at a club for a good 10 years...you'll be laughing)

[Daaaaave]

Originally Posted by Daaaaave

imo, no point even talking about any foreign managers. gerrard wants some local pud to kiss his ass and set up another english clique locker room where everyone takes turns bowing to him and carra. next step: sign danny murphy

anyone want to tell me I was wrong?

[PoolFan]

Personally I would like to see one of the following:

1. Rafa

2. Jürgen Klopp

3. AVB (Still very unsure, but Chelsea at the time seemed an impossible job)

4. Marcelo Bielsa

I think that's basically it honestly, I am not sure how feasible those names are but we need someone with a vision and a plan for the club.

[foofighter23]

anyone want to tell me I was wrong?

tell us something we didnt know

but seriously, why dont you just get your **** out and wave it about a bit more;)

[SRL88]

I think the owners know what they are doing. They know that the next manager they appoint must be here for the long haul so they know they must get it right.

[Daaaaave]

tell us something we didnt know

but seriously, why dont you just get your **** out and wave it about a bit more;)

well, tbf, I did get the danny murphy part wrong.

it was paul konchesky.

[Daaaaave]

Personally I would like to see one of the following:

1. Rafa

2. Jürgen Klopp

3. AVB (Still very unsure, but Chelsea at the time seemed an impossible job)

4. Marcelo Bielsa

I think that's basically it honestly, I am not sure how feasible those names are but we need someone with a vision and a plan for the club.

if you're going to stick bielsa and klopp in there you might as well include deschamps as well

[Rebs]

No way Bielsa...no way Klopp...maybe the others though!

[Select_screen_name:]

Biesla is a ****ing mental who shouldn't be near management.