Coop

Agent fees. Good or bad addition to the game?

66 posts in this topic

[quote name='dking']I just added 900million to Reals transfer budget, and I can't offer more than 8million in agent fees. I offered a 50% of the profit to the player sell on clause (maximum), 2.75million for team of the year (maximum), 275k in appearance fees (maximum) and so on and so forth. The agent would not go below 12.75mill, apparently he no longer likes me because I wouldn't give into his ridiculous demands.

To say it's flawed is an understatement. This whole thread should be in the bugs forum.[/QUOTE]
That's shows me that it is even worse than I thought.

[quote name='safcrhys']You can make the game less enjoyable by adding more realistic things, I hate press conferences and dealing with agents to be honest.[/QUOTE]

It would be nice to have an option at the beginning of the game to play without these. Leaving press conferences to your Assistant Manager doesn't work.

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The agents get a cut of a player's regular salary too: so money that goes to the player will still partially go to them. They do like the lump sum that comes with a transfer, but that wouldn't de-rail a superstar move - negotiations often break down, yes, but that's over wage demands: an agent who ruins a contract negotiation over his agent fee is so clearly self-interested that he's going to get fired, or cut out of the deal,
whereas, an agent who persuades his client that they should hold out for higher wages appears to be looking after his client even if he's just as much trying to boost his own commission.

Agent fees should be there to keep agents friendly to you so that
1. If you and another club are competing for a player, and both match his wage demands, the agent will favour you
2. The agent will not offer the player around to other clubs too much, and not be too much of a jackass come contract renewal time.

But if you are offering a player everything he wants, [B]you should be able to sign him[/B]. You should just be potentially storing up problems for yourself down the road, when your agent might persuade his client to put in a transfer request or not to renew his contract unless for a huge pay rise.

Agents shouldn't be getting more than 15% of any deal, really, unless it's a good player going in a fire sale or on a free (Kewell's agent made several million in what was only a £7m transfer to Liverpool - but Kewell was worth more than that, if Leed's hadn't been broke), and generally they should be getting maybe 5-10%

[url]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-united/5514365/Cristiano-Ronaldo-transfer-who-are-footballs-super-agents.html[/url]
This article claims that C.Ronaldo's agent made £5m off his transfer - the biggest transfer of all time. That's 6.25% of the 80m.

And the mangelito link ([url]http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...em/9244286.stm[/url]) suggest that no club should have to pay out more than a few million a year, unless they're on a major spending spree: the biggest figure mentioned is 12.8m for Man City's whole 2009 spree- that's less than dking is getting quoted for a single transfer.

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People only don't want agents because on occasion it doesn't work in their favour

If the agents helped them buy every world class player in the world then the people complaining would be the ones who actually understnad that it doesnt work that easy

To the guy complaining that he could sign Torres because the 15 mil agent fee even at Madrid, think, would any board in the world allow such a mad fee to be paid to the agent regardless of transfer budget but on principal?

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[quote name='Masterstroke']People only don't want agents because on occasion it doesn't work in their favour

If the agents helped them buy every world class player in the world then the people complaining would be the ones who actually understnad that it doesnt work that easy

To the guy complaining that he could sign Torres because the 15 mil agent fee even at Madrid, think, would any board in the world allow such a mad fee to be paid to the agent regardless of transfer budget but on principal?[/QUOTE]

Tell us then - what is one good, fun thing that comes as a result of having agents in the game, that we wouldn't have if the game didn't have agents?

If there isn't any, then is it really a good idea for a [b]game[/b] to have this feature?

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[quote name='Masterstroke']People only don't want agents because on occasion it doesn't work in their favour

If the agents helped them buy every world class player in the world then the people complaining would be the ones who actually understnad that it doesnt work that easy

To the guy complaining that he could sign Torres because the 15 mil agent fee even at Madrid, think, would any board in the world allow such a mad fee to be paid to the agent regardless of transfer budget but on principal?
[/QUOTE]

Did you read anything that I posted? Seriously, read the post again. You're trying to argue with me, yet if you had read my post properly, you would see that you're actually proving what I said and agreeing with me.

The point was that the fees are ridiculous and the richest club in the world wont pay it/cant pay it so IT'S BROKEN, it means that that player can't move clubs again because of an agent. Or do you think this is realistic and should be kept in the game? Or maybe it's just me sulking because the transfer isn't working in my favour. :rolleyes:

This has absolutely nothing to do with agents working with, or against people. Agents are broken, and the evidence is pretty damning after what I did with Real, and you agreed with me, inadvertently. :thup:

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Just had it again. £1.7M fee (not a listed player), and the agent won't take less than £575K, plus £100K+ signing fee. It just is not realistic.

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[quote name='x42bn6']Tell us then - what is one good, fun thing that comes as a result of having agents in the game, that we wouldn't have if the game didn't have agents?

If there isn't any, then is it really a good idea for a [b]game[/b] to have this feature?[/QUOTE]

i personally find the real time negotiating much more fun than it was before, the added bonuses are good for getting a lower wage although i guess they could have been added anyway, i think they make things a bit more realistic, some of the fee's the agents look for could be looked at but again it can be a very usefull tool for getting someone in on a lower wage. Its a first time addition but i think with a bit more work it will be really good. The offering players thing is something i really like, i find quite a few brilliant young plaers through that feature.

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I hate them when I'm dealing with youngsters, I often have to pay agents more than I pay for the player for them to accept. Drives me nuts.

Spent on Agent Fees: £58M :(

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[quote name='milnerpoint']i personally find the real time negotiating much more fun than it was before, the added bonuses are good for getting a lower wage although i guess they could have been added anyway, i think they make things a bit more realistic, some of the fee's the agents look for could be looked at but again it can be a very usefull tool for getting someone in on a lower wage. Its a first time addition but i think with a bit more work it will be really good. The offering players thing is something i really like, i find quite a few brilliant young plaers through that feature.[/QUOTE]

According to the time value of money, it's not necessarily cheaper to have a higher signing-on bonus and lower wages, in the same way that you must pay "more" over 48 months than up front.

In other words, it's not always useful to reduce wages by spending more now, because they are roughly going to be equivalent anyway.

I personally don't think this really justifies an agent - SI could easily just have increased transfer fees by around 10% to get roughly the same effect without agents, which would basically have the same effect. If you want to pay more up front, this is equivalent to a higher signing-on bonus and lower wages without an agent.

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as i say i far prefer the real time negotiations, i have had no issues with agents really, i like the addition although it could do with tweaking a bit, if they just reduced some of the fee's the big players agents ask for then it would be a very good addition to the game, that really seems to be the only real issue with them at the moment, something thats easily changed.

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It's a good addition in theory, but contract negotiations (not just agent fees, but negotiations in general) could do with a hell of a lot of tweaking because the new system has highlighted some serious flaws with the whole thing. I doubt much (if any) tweaking will be done for the final patch, but it's something that really needs fixing for FM12.

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i would like there to be a conversation involved in the negotiations, you could offer a wage or a certain bonus and explain why, or there could be an option for offering a longer contact or higher wage based on performances or development again done through a conversation in the game. It could also work for explaining a wage drop for older players or if the club is in financial trouble.

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[quote name='milnerpoint']as i say i far prefer the real time negotiations, i have had no issues with agents really, i like the addition although it could do with tweaking a bit, if they just reduced some of the fee's the big players agents ask for then it would be a very good addition to the game, that really seems to be the only real issue with them at the moment, something thats easily changed.[/QUOTE]

You can have real-time negotiations without agents, though.

It's just that the most-fun scenario with agents is where you encounter no issues with agents at all, which happens to be the situation where the game has no agents.

I don't really see why "frustration" is fun.

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[quote name='x42bn6']You can have real-time negotiations without agents, though.

It's just that the most-fun scenario with agents is where you encounter no issues with agents at all, which happens to be the situation where the game has no agents.

I don't really see why "frustration" is fun.[/QUOTE]

but in reality agents exist and are a big part of contract negotiations, so they should be in the game i think.

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[quote name='milnerpoint']but in reality agents exist and are a big part of contract negotiations, so they should be in the game i think.[/QUOTE]

I don't agree with that sentiment.

It's a game at the end of the day and a feature that frustrates more players on average is clearly a bad feature.

It's an obstacle, not a feature. SI need to pretty much redo agents to turn it into a feature. But then again, they need to redo the whole transfer system anyway...

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[quote name='x42bn6']I don't agree with that sentiment.

It's a game at the end of the day and a feature that frustrates more players on average is clearly a bad feature.

It's an obstacle, not a feature. SI need to pretty much redo agents to turn it into a feature. But then again, they need to redo the whole transfer system anyway...[/QUOTE]

There's a game on the XBox Kinect thing, it's a simulation, RPG type thing. An early quest has you go to the forest to collect a hat a guy dropped. You have to lift your foot up and down for thirty minutes to simulate the walk back to the forest, find the hat, then simulate the thirty minute walk back again. It's very realistic but you probably haven't heard of it as it's so thoroughly unpopular....

Any simulation game is first and foremost a game. You are, of course, completely right. There's a plethora of real life, and far more important aspects of football, not in the game but the ultimate standard has to be does it enhance the enjoyment/entertainment/challenge of the "game". If it doesn't (and personally I can't see how having randomly huge amounts of money assigned out of your budget in a way that is beyond your control can be in anyway a good thing from a gameplay perspective), then it is, as you say, a bad feature.

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It should be an option that can be turned on or off. I play MLS exclusively, and the league doesn't negotiate agent fees seperately from the player's contract. In American sports, to the best of my knowledge, an agent works on commission; he gets a pre-arranged share of the contract in return for his services.

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