Tyler42

I want to return this broken product.

146 posts in this topic

I honestly want to sit down and have a talk with the people that were testing the transfer system, morale formula and the new interaction feature, and ask what the hell were they doing.

The transfer system was supposedly "completely" overhauled in FM09... Then what can you call this? Ronaldo leaving R.Madrid cause he had a hissy fit with the manager, players worth well over 10mill pounds being released on free transfers and World Class clubs buying no name 28'yr+ olds only to be thrown into the reserve team.

What were the testers doing? Too busy seeing if the animation in the ME was correct? Get your priorities right SI.

And this awful "Instant drop from Superb to Very Low for no apparent reason" feature has sure proved to be a stupid one. I feel like I got a striker that has periods, one day he's flyin' high with his Superb morale, the next weeks hes just down to Very Low for reasons unknown. I've read around the forums and some say its because the managers keep commenting on the specific player about how "hes the greatest thread" or w/e, thus making him feel pressured and insecure.

Also the media likes to tell me the same stuff over, and over, and over, and over again! Manager X is about to be sacked if he does not win this game! Next week: Manager X is about to be sacked if he does not win this game! Next week: Manager X is about to be sacked if he does not win this game! and maybe 10 times more just incase i didnt notice it the first 4 times. Sure I want to be up-to-date on rumors but this is obviously over the top. This is an easy to spot bug and yet it gets through the final release, patch 11.1 AND 11.1.1, HELLO?

And last but not least, the new interaction system! You can choose from about 5 different ways to say the same crap, but only 1 of the 5 will actually be the "correct" one. If you pick wrong your player might want to be transfer listed, but no worries you cant even offload players for free in FM11 so hes staying until his contract runs out, and if your unlucky another 10 players will back him up and want to be listed too.

Ive bought FM2005, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, but it stops here. Let it be known SI, that I'm probably not the only loyal costumer that you managed to loose with this dreadful game.

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For me, if I found anything the most annoying it would have to be the red cards. Does anyone else get an absurd amount of these? I'm talking about red cards for being the 'last man' when theres about 3 other defenders within spiting distance? It's especially annoying when they're going down the flanks aswell! I've never seen that in real life. And also the frankly s h i t e amount of penalties conceded from crosses! I've seen plenty of games of football, and only on a very very very very very rare occassion would someone be awarded a penalty from that situation? What are my players doing? Just elbowing people in the face?

My favourite one when it comes to refereeing though is when the opposition has the ball in the middle of the park (or whereever) and a player from the other team comes over and the most menial of challenges is committed, with the player maybe doing the 'stumble' animation. And then, it's a red card.

I know the ME is supposed to be a REPRESENTATION of what is going on, but my god. You think it would be atleast half decent?

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Agree with OP- glad I havent bought it this year, knowing full well that once again the game would arrive in a dreadful state. It wont change- SI have a cashcow and quite clearly know so, it amazes me that reviews praise FM11 to the high heavens even though major portions of the game are broken. Releasing it in this state is a disgrace- a shame so many blindly buy it, perhaps if they didnt then SI might not deem it acceptable to sell a game that wont be finished for 2-3 months.

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this is definetly a problem the worst being the percentage of CCC's that are put away. S.I have made a good game but there is far too many bugs in it.

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Another whine thread! There will always be certain bugs in a game of this size, some more apparent than others but you have to remember as this game is realeased yearly there isnt enough time to simply weed out the bugs before SEGAs cut off time. If it was only si involed in the whole process then I dont think the game would even be released yet as they have already released 2 patches in a month to iron out bugs that they couldnt fix before the deadline.

Also if you dont like it dont play it simple.

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I will not go as far as to boycott the game in the future but agree with the points that ruin the game so far....

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Another whine thread! There will always be certain bugs in a game of this size, some more apparent than others but you have to remember as this game is realeased yearly there isnt enough time to simply weed out the bugs before SEGAs cut off time. If it was only si involed in the whole process then I dont think the game would even be released yet as they have already released 2 patches in a month to iron out bugs that they couldnt fix before the deadline.

Also if you dont like it dont play it simple.

Yeah I guess you could call it that, but you will rarely see me "whine" about computer games in general. Trust me, im doing good with my team in-game, its just these and more bugs that make the game boring. A Manager Simulator game with a broken transfer system? You do the math.

And sure you can go with the "Dont like dont play" crap, but I paid $40 for this, so I feel like I can express my disappointed in this purchase.

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Another whine thread! There will always be certain bugs in a game of this size, some more apparent than others but you have to remember as this game is realeased yearly there isnt enough time to simply weed out the bugs before SEGAs cut off time. If it was only si involed in the whole process then I dont think the game would even be released yet as they have already released 2 patches in a month to iron out bugs that they couldnt fix before the deadline.

Also if you dont like it dont play it simple.

His point are valid though. As you say, there will always be bugs, but on this occasion, there are far too many of them.

Moreover, on your last point, I agree, which is why I'm not playing the game at the moment, but having said that, if you have paid for the game you should be able to express your opinion as well.

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Agree. This game is totally broken, very annoying, dreadful and stupid. Sega is gonna lose many loyal costumers for this. You are surely not the only one.

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I think the OP was correct. After 1 patch and 1 hotfix released , the game is supposed to be in complete condition. I don.t know what the beta testers are doing. Currently we're acting like beta testers EVERY YEAR ! I understand that every computer is different and you can't test on every version of PC and MAC's but still FM players who buys this expensive and complex game would like a bit more complete game. I can't understand how SI makes the same mistake over and over again. EVERY YEAR THE SAME.

ps. The game is totally playable, I'm not insulting anyone or any party involved in making or defending this game. I'm just venting my little bit of frustration out.

FM 11 is totally better than FiFA Manager crap and Chap. Man. games.

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So funny to see the lack of reactions to these gamebreaking bugs from the SI-team on the forums. Just before the game came out they were bombarding us with hype-posts all over the forums, but when a staggering amount of bugs are discovered by the community these SI-guys are nowhere to be seen.

I hope they're too busy making a patch.

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I would rather they didn't release the game till 2011 and just work on it more. It's so frustrating every year to have the same issues. The Match Engine is never any good till months after release, and this years is the worst ever. I do seriously doubt the amount of testing that goes into these games. Lets take the Penalty misses as an example. How can testers, play the game, and not see this happening? There has to be a reason. Either they aren't very smart when it comes to Football or there seriously is no testing going on of real life games. Imagine you are a tester, you get a copy of the game and play one season. All of us would have a list of 10+ problems. Who knows maybe the testers did spot all the problems but SI are complacent. They know we will all buy it anyway, and I always will. But we deserve better!

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Considering most of us are waiting for the patch, What was the timeline for the patches last year. Something before Christmas and then one in Feb. Correct? I know it won't be exactly the same frame but it will give a little insight. Anyone remember?

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Wait for 11.3 before saying the game is broken. The same thing happens year after year, there are lots ogf bugs, but the game become playable after the last patch from late February/early March.

Last year, I thought 10.1 was a joke and didn't play a single save with that version. I didn't touch 10.2 either. But 10.3 was and still is for me the best version of the game ever. Still playing a long-term save on 10.3, I'm in year 2030 right now and I will continue playing that save forever.

So have patience before saying that the game is completely broken. I'm sure lots of bugs will be fixed on the last patch.

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The die hard gamers eventually will refuse to buy the game until the .3 patch is released, ever since Sega came on board the 'bleed as much money out of this game as you can' has become the norm.

Lets go back to when 2 brothers invented this game in their bedroom, give us the excitement back and the real evolution of this game rather than new features every year that break the game.

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instead of adding new "features" which doesn't work properly anway, SI should fix the existing features. fm2011 is by far the worst fm i've ever played.. (since fm2006)

why?

- amount of red cards (mostly after goal kicks without any reason)

- amount of owngoals

- totally messed up transfer AI (superstars like c. ronaldo are sold under market value / i can't get rid of players / teams like bayern munich forget to buy a goalkeeper, so the AMC plays in goal)

- my team needs an average of 3 times as much CCCs to score than the opposite, although i have the best strikers in my league

- player interaction/morale system appears to be random

just a few things which came across my mind spontaneously, there are even more flawed things...

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Wait for 11.3 before saying the game is broken. The same thing happens year after year, there are lots ogf bugs, but the game become playable after the last patch from late February/early March.

Last year, I thought 10.1 was a joke and didn't play a single save with that version. I didn't touch 10.2 either. But 10.3 was and still is for me the best version of the game ever. Still playing a long-term save on 10.3, I'm in year 2030 right now and I will continue playing that save forever.

So have patience before saying that the game is completely broken. I'm sure lots of bugs will be fixed on the last patch.

But the way it goes for year is completely wrong don't you agree? We are just so stupid we got fooled year after year and SI keeps getting away with that.

It's like buying a new car at the dealer. "Hey it drives great but you have to buy new wheels because the ones on it now are square".

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Do you have any evidence to support that?

You're kidding right?

I mean I could throw up a poll "Are you waiting for the patch urgently? Yes or No?" but it's pointless given how unanimous it would be.

Fact is, the game is like this every single year. I'm actually not blaming SI exactly because they have 12 months to develop a game of massive intricacy. However, I do blame the BETA testers who, in SI's own words on a thread a few days back, basically register as testers then don't give any feedback; they simply use it as a way of playing the new game early.

"Well the one thing I say about open Beta's, and I have plenty of experience of them, is that there are massive drawbacks to them.

First they use up resources and time, not a big deal if you're getting lots of good feedback... BUT

Many people can't be bothered to give feedback, instead they just use the Beta as a chance to get some free gaming in.

Second

We run a Beta, anyone can apply for a spot on it you just have to look for the thread and when it comes iand send in your application, but as I said before many people don't bother giving feedback, there are some that do and we're always thankful for them, but as for extending the program, it's harder and more time consuming to administrate then you'd imagine."

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/237530-Official-FM-2011.1.1-quot-Hot-Fix-quot-Feedback-Thread?p=6121006&viewfull=1#post6121006

The only criticism I can make of SI is the fact they release a game every year, because financially I believe they have to. It'd make a lot more sense to release the game every two years and continue to provide updates for the previous incarnation of the title. Perhaps even a paid update of £9.99 for the following September after the transfer window shuts which would have amended transfers, budgets, staff etc.

Personally I'm probably looking at sitting out the FM series till FM2013 when FM11 is properly patched and fixed, as that will get me a good 18 months of proper gaming in instead of the 9 months we currently get when .3 is released circa-January.

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Wait for 11.3 before saying the game is broken. The same thing happens year after year, there are lots ogf bugs, but the game become playable after the last patch from late February/early March.

Last year, I thought 10.1 was a joke and didn't play a single save with that version. I didn't touch 10.2 either. But 10.3 was and still is for me the best version of the game ever. Still playing a long-term save on 10.3, I'm in year 2030 right now and I will continue playing that save forever.

So have patience before saying that the game is completely broken. I'm sure lots of bugs will be fixed on the last patch.

Dude, SI (or SEGA) might as well release the full game during the timeline the 3rd patch was released. But they prefer to release a poorly done game on ~OCT-NOV and release a 3 patches every year(excluding hotfixes). SI (or SEGA) knows that we're dumb enough to go and buy the game but also report to them bugs that are in the game. If they're are really beta testers for FM 11, how could they miss out the obvious bug. Spanish yellow card bug. There's only 2 possible scenario in this:

a) SI are unaware of the bug which means there's no beta testers for this game.

b) SI are aware of this bug but they released it anyway because they know we(us) will act as a tester for this game and they will fix it on the release day patch.

Q.Tell me how SI didn't know about the Spanish card bug? Explain.

This kind of problem not only happened this year but also previous years. EVERY YEAR SAME PROBLEM.

My recommendation (as the above poster)

release the game every two years and continue to provide updates for the previous incarnation of the title. Perhaps even a paid update of £9.99 for the following September after the transfer window shuts which would have amended transfers, budgets, staff etc.

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Da Ja Vue people, every year it's always the same, game gets released, patch released on first day, second patch released December and the third late Jan early Feb and in between the same old posts with the same old cliche.

Cmon people you have been buying the product long enough to know what to expect.

The way i look at it as long as the game is playable for which it is and you can play a football game, for which you can the other issues are minor, until there fixed.

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The game is infuriating and don't know how people can defend this broken product, fanboys maybe.

Yes the game always has problems but this time out a few of them are major ones that ruin the realism and playability of it.

If I owned this product and the testers had missed such glaring errors I would sack them as they obviously aren't very good at what they do.

Good news is their WILL be a patch released again, bad news is it probably won't be for a month or more.

SI need to find a better way to test the games before releasing it, maybe release a one season demo, get feedback then release the game when they are fixed, yes their will stil be problems, no-one expects a game to be perfect but this year has been a disgrace.

Personally I think SI should release a new game every 2 years and in between new games just do an official data update and tweak the things already in the game, they keep releasing new things in the game when the current things still need working on.

Maybe they could release the early product to everyone on the forums and let everyone be testers as it is us forum members they find everything, yes it means people will get a game way early but it will be so bug ridden no-one is going to just keep that game and not buy the real game.

*Edit, just saw someone has posted about releasing it every 2 years, completely agree.

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I agree completely with all the points made above, especially with FM 2011 full of the worst bugs, compared to previous games. But almost everybody still buys up this crap every November, right? Instead of complaining about it, why don't you take some responsibility for being impatient and buying it, knowing that it's an incomplete product? If everybody stops buying in November, maybe SEGA will reconsider and give SI more time to develop the game.

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wish they'd just fix the bugs ASAP and not make us wait months for a finished game. It seems the culture of game companies currently, it seems its now accepted that games will have big bugs on release and will only be of the quality it should be on release, months later.

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The game is infuriating and don't know how people can defend this broken product, fanboys maybe.

Yes the game always has problems but this time out a few of them are major ones that ruin the realism and playability of it.

Don't assume that someone who defends the game is doing so out of sheer fanboyism. I'm on record as having not enjoyed FM09 and FM10 (despite being a mod, I'm still allowed to not like the game), while loving FM08. Now, I'm loving FM11. Due to the Spanish League suspensions bug (which was bad I agree), I've pursued other careers and have really enjoyed it so far. Maybe, just maybe, the bugs you talk of aren't affecting everyone and so they're defending FM11 accordingly.

So, I'll defend FM11 and tell you that for me it's infinitely playable (as the hours played stat on Steam would appear to suggest), and refute any suggestions you may have that I'm a fanboy (calling someone a fanboy such a laaaazy argument fwiw).

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Don't assume that someone who defends the game is doing so out of sheer fanboyism. I'm on record as having not enjoyed FM09 and FM10 (despite being a mod, I'm still allowed to not like the game), while loving FM08. Now, I'm loving FM11. Due to the Spanish League suspensions bug (which was bad I agree), I've pursued other careers and have really enjoyed it so far. Maybe, just maybe, the bugs you talk of aren't affecting everyone and so they're defending FM11 accordingly.

So, I'll defend FM11 and tell you that for me it's infinitely playable (as the hours played stat on Steam would appear to suggest), and refute any suggestions you may have that I'm a fanboy (calling someone a fanboy such a laaaazy argument fwiw).

+ 1, though i liked FM10, hated FM09

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GillsMan, fair enough, BUT, my point is just because you are enjoying it the way you play doesn't make it okay, the game should be enjoyed however anyone plays it and for this version that is not the case, you should not have to play a game in a certain way to enjoy it because of the bug ridden release.

Even if I was enjoying it I wouldnt defend it because I know many aren't and that's not right, a game shouldnt be released and then find out you have to play a certain way for it to be enjoyed.

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GillsMan, fair enough, BUT, my point is just because you are enjoying it the way you play doesn't make it okay, the game should be enjoyed however anyone plays it and for this version that is not the case, you should not have to play a game in a certain way to enjoy it because of the bug ridden release.

Even if I was enjoying it I wouldnt defend it because I know many aren't and that's not right, a game shouldnt be released and then find out you have to play a certain way for it to be enjoyed.

I see the point you're making and fwiw I've deleted posts from users saying "well it's working perfectly for me" in a thread where people are having particular issues with a part of FM. I think it's just that FM will always be played differently by different people and that's to be expected. Not everyone is going to be pleased all of the time, as different people have different philosophies. I think it's important we all remember that so we don't have "this game is completely broken it's unplayable" posts and we also don't have "this game is perfect, there are no issues whatsoever" posts either. There's a happy medium to be had.

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I'm a massive fanboy, bought every edition since 93-94.

I've never moaned before, last year I had no issues while others were calling the game broken.

This game is a complete disaster. I feel like an unpaid tester. The game should be finished and tested before October, then at the end of September the last thing that is done is the data editing for transfers and the game could be ready to go on October 1st. I do not buy into the fact that SI want to rush out a game - its not rushed out, it comes out well after the season has started. People wait patiently for a couple of months, then the game is out and it isn't even finished.

Name one other big game with this many problems? A piece of software woul NEVER get released with the sort of glaring errors that FM 2011 has.

The stupidest thing is that SI could use hundreds, or thousands of testers from this community but they don't. In 2 hours of gameplay I could easily pick up many of the problems this game went live with. Hell, I could even have spotted things that have somehow got past a release day patch and a hotfix!

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I'm a massive fanboy, bought every edition since 93-94.

I've never moaned before, last year I had no issues while others were calling the game broken.

This game is a complete disaster. I feel like an unpaid tester. The game should be finished and tested before October, then at the end of September the last thing that is done is the data editing for transfers and the game could be ready to go on October 1st. I do not buy into the fact that SI want to rush out a game - its not rushed out, it comes out well after the season has started. People wait patiently for a couple of months, then the game is out and it isn't even finished.

Name one other big game with this many problems? A piece of software woul NEVER get released with the sort of glaring errors that FM 2011 has.

The stupidest thing is that SI could use hundreds, or thousands of testers from this community but they don't. In 2 hours of gameplay I could easily pick up many of the problems this game went live with. Hell, I could even have spotted things that have somehow got past a release day patch and a hotfix!

actually, a few years back they did use lots of beta testers, and the feedback they got was very poor or none at all, and in fact beta copies ended up on the internet.

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.

A piece of software woul NEVER get released with the sort of glaring errors that FM 2011 has.

What about every version of windows for the past ten years? More bugs in one of those than in every single version of FM todate i would say.

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I'm a massive fanboy, bought every edition since 93-94.

I've never moaned before, last year I had no issues while others were calling the game broken.

This game is a complete disaster. I feel like an unpaid tester. The game should be finished and tested before October, then at the end of September the last thing that is done is the data editing for transfers and the game could be ready to go on October 1st. I do not buy into the fact that SI want to rush out a game - its not rushed out, it comes out well after the season has started. People wait patiently for a couple of months, then the game is out and it isn't even finished.

Name one other big game with this many problems? A piece of software woul NEVER get released with the sort of glaring errors that FM 2011 has.

The stupidest thing is that SI could use hundreds, or thousands of testers from this community but they don't. In 2 hours of gameplay I could easily pick up many of the problems this game went live with. Hell, I could even have spotted things that have somehow got past a release day patch and a hotfix!

Call of Duty: Black Ops which was released a couple of weeks ago, the performance issues on the PC version are unbelievable. I'm not defending SI as I also bought COD:BO and am frustrated with both after spending ~£75 on the two games.

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The transfers issue is causing problems for me in my Blyth carrer game.

Having got them up to playoffs in League 2 in only four seasons, no one wants my players - expect to bleed them off me for free transfers, the wage budget is out of hand even to compete in the league on free transfers. To add to that I have no operating budget, on the way to getting into debt problems, a stadium that holds 4400 and regularly sells out 90% occupancy, with no prosepect of being able to generate extra revenue through getting a bigger stadium because of the bank balance.

I'm enjoying the game, but I'm left wondering whether I should just a) wait for a tycoon to take me over, b) cheat and give myself £500k to play with in FMRTE or c) quit a save I've achieved tons with to go to a bigger club.

Until you can feel like you can generate some income through transfers and at least give yourself a little lee-way those are the only options avilable to me.

I don't want the game any easier, I just would like to feel like I'm making small progress by being able to sell a couple of players for some money.

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I see the point you're making and fwiw I've deleted posts from users saying "well it's working perfectly for me" in a thread where people are having particular issues with a part of FM. I think it's just that FM will always be played differently by different people and that's to be expected. Not everyone is going to be pleased all of the time, as different people have different philosophies. I think it's important we all remember that so we don't have "this game is completely broken it's unplayable" posts and we also don't have "this game is perfect, there are no issues whatsoever" posts either. There's a happy medium to be had.

Have to disagree on this to an extent.

Given a core aspect of the gameplay mechanism is broken (the transfer system from top to bottom), then in most respects this will be defined as "completely broken" as it impacts on every other aspect of the game. You can't control your finances, you can't progress through divisions properly due to aforementioned financial problems, you have teams selling star players for buttons etc. etc.

Technically, the game isn't unplayable as it still loads up and performs it's function. But honestly, saying there's a "happy medium" here is very, very misleading. This isn't something affecting only boxed copies of the game or only Steam; it's affecting all. It's part of the code.

Maybe, just maybe, the bugs you talk of aren't affecting everyone and so they're defending FM11 accordingly.

As such the above statement isn't true. They HAVE to affect everyone as they share the same code. The only exception will be the people who never gain promotion, or people who maintain their current squad by and large and don't check the AI activity, as well as blatantly disregarding four red cards a game etc.

I'll defend the potential of FM11 to the hilt - only an idiot wouldn't recognise how outstanding this game will be in February/March. Problem is, we have to wait until February/March!

For now, I really don't believe you can defend the indefensible. As a Moderator and as such someone with a degree of affiliation to SI, I understand you want to defend the product and deny an inferior product has been publicly released but... let's face it, the release version (and even the hotfixed version) of FM11 was not ready for retail, simple as that.

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"Well the one thing I say about open Beta's, and I have plenty of experience of them, is that there are massive drawbacks to them.

First they use up resources and time, not a big deal if you're getting lots of good feedback... BUT

Many people can't be bothered to give feedback, instead they just use the Beta as a chance to get some free gaming in.

^ An important quote, I think. It's these beta testers, who we'll never know, who fail to identify such horrendous flaws. Just how *one* tester couldn't have drawn attention to what is arguably the worst transfer market system in any football simulation game for over 10 years is beyond me. Same goes for the Spanish cards bug. Considering how the majority of FM-ers noticed such things within a couple of days, I'd say it speaks volumes about these so-called "testers". I just hope that the transfer market issue is something that can be fixed in a patch. We don't know how complex it is for that to get an overhaul in its coding. I'm sure we'd all agree that something resembling the market on 10.3 would be ideal. Until then, that happens to be the version of the game a lot of people have gone back to for the time being, myself included. Hopefully 11.2 will change that, but I'm not building my hopes up too much due to the mammoth of a task that SI have been left with. Good luck to them, I hope they can pull it off.

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What about every version of windows for the past ten years? More bugs in one of those than in every single version of FM todate i would say.

Why are people still sticking up for this game, it's broken it doesn't do what it says on the tin (case). Windows is a lot more complex than a football manager game and Microsoft are a lot quicker at releasing patches. People should just say it's not fair to release a game so full of bugs, SI definitely didn't find a carpet big enough to sweep all the problems under. I won't be buying next years version for 29.99 off steam I'll be paying 9.99 off amazon in March. I suppose we should be saying thanks to SI because now we're all going to save £20 a year buying this tripe.

If this was any other company heads would roll for releasing something totally unrealistic to life and 'broken', it's funny how SI are being really quiet on the forums and waiting for this to blow over they know they have messed up and they're all too chicken to come out and admit it.

I don't mind the bugs from last year's ME, or the fact that for that last 5 FMs the AI have been buying players and putting them in the reserves but this year SI have made a mockery of our intelligence thinking that we'd be happy buying a game that isn't finished and isn't true to life,

All I want now is an apology

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Have to disagree on this to an extent.

Given a core aspect of the gameplay mechanism is broken (the transfer system from top to bottom), then in most respects this will be defined as "completely broken" as it impacts on every other aspect of the game. You can't control your finances, you can't progress through divisions properly due to aforementioned financial problems, you have teams selling star players for buttons etc. etc.

But I'm progressing through the leagues fine, and the financial model seems to be as challenging/rewarding as in other versions. I'm not saying there isn't a problem, I'm saying that you can't assume that everyone is affected by it to the same degree.

Technically, the game isn't unplayable as it still loads up and performs it's function. But honestly, saying there's a "happy medium" here is very, very misleading. This isn't something affecting only boxed copies of the game or only Steam; it's affecting all. It's part of the code. As such the above statement isn't true. They HAVE to affect everyone as they share the same code. The only exception will be the people who never gain promotion, or people who maintain their current squad by and large and don't check the AI activity, as well as blatantly disregarding four red cards a game etc.

Because people play the game in different ways, they will be affected by different bugs. Perhaps because I haven't been managing in the EPL, I haven't been affected by the transfer bug. Of course, if there is such a problem and it's affecting those who play in the top leagues, then that's a big issue, but what I'm saying is that the game isn't unplayable for everyone, and far from it.

For now, I really don't believe you can defend the indefensible. As a Moderator and as such someone with a degree of affiliation to SI, I understand you want to defend the product and deny an inferior product has been publicly released but... let's face it, the release version (and even the hotfixed version) of FM11 was not ready for retail, simple as that.
I have no affiliation to SI particularly - they don't pay me, in fact I often wonder why I do the moderating! And I've certainly spoken my mind about FM in the past (as I said, I'm on record as having hated FM09, and not particularly enjoyed FM10), so I like to think that I'm fairly impartial about FM - at least I'm open-minded. I do like FM11 though, I'm really enjoying, as are countless people.

Not saying there aren't issues, but it's certainly enjoyed by a lot of people atm. And the forums seem much more calm than FM09 which attracted all kinds of opprobrium (activation issues, tactics, injuries, etc).

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Why are people still sticking up for this game, it's broken it doesn't do what it says on the tin (case). Windows is a lot more complex than a football manager game and Microsoft are a lot quicker at releasing patches. People should just say it's not fair to release a game so full of bugs, SI definitely didn't find a carpet big enough to sweep all the problems under. I won't be buying next years version for 29.99 off steam I'll be paying 9.99 off amazon in March. I suppose we should be saying thanks to SI because now we're all going to save £20 a year buying this tripe.

If this was any other company heads would roll for releasing something totally unrealistic to life and 'broken', it's funny how SI are being really quiet on the forums and waiting for this to blow over they know they have messed up and they're all too chicken to come out and admit it.

I don't mind the bugs from last year's ME, or the fact that for that last 5 FMs the AI have been buying players and putting them in the reserves but this year SI have made a mockery of our intelligence thinking that we'd be happy buying a game that isn't finished and isn't true to life,

All I want now is an apology

You're comparing Windows and Microsoft, with their huge resources, with FM and SI, who don't have the resources of Microsoft?

Also, you don't mind bugs, but can't stand FM11 because you think it's bugged to hell and clearly uplayable? That doesn't make a lot of sense. It's also not unplayable because I have spent 4 days on the my current save and haven't run into any problems (okay one crash - but I'd saved). Sure there are bugs that make the game less enjoyable for some but this version of FM is infinitely better than last years.

Come back when you've thought about what you're going to say.

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No I was referring to the guy before me who compared it to Windows...........And I said I haven't minded the bugs from other years but this one destroys the game for me.

<Snip>

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Why are people still sticking up for this game, it's broken it doesn't do what it says on the tin (case). Windows is a lot more complex than a football manager game and Microsoft are a lot quicker at releasing patches. People should just say it's not fair to release a game so full of bugs, SI definitely didn't find a carpet big enough to sweep all the problems under. I won't be buying next years version for 29.99 off steam I'll be paying 9.99 off amazon in March. I suppose we should be saying thanks to SI because now we're all going to save £20 a year buying this tripe.

If this was any other company heads would roll for releasing something totally unrealistic to life and 'broken', it's funny how SI are being really quiet on the forums and waiting for this to blow over they know they have messed up and they're all too chicken to come out and admit it.

I don't mind the bugs from last year's ME, or the fact that for that last 5 FMs the AI have been buying players and putting them in the reserves but this year SI have made a mockery of our intelligence thinking that we'd be happy buying a game that isn't finished and isn't true to life,

All I want now is an apology

What does it say on the box that it doesnt deliver? As far as i can see it does "exactly whats on the tin" it delivers a simulation of football management, not an exact copy of real life, just a simulation.

i would have said a patch on the day of release was pretty dam quick, releasing it before the game was out would have been a tad pointless.

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GillsMan, fair enough, BUT, my point is just because you are enjoying it the way you play doesn't make it okay, the game should be enjoyed however anyone plays it and for this version that is not the case, you should not have to play a game in a certain way to enjoy it because of the bug ridden release.

Even if I was enjoying it I wouldnt defend it because I know many aren't and that's not right, a game shouldnt be released and then find out you have to play a certain way for it to be enjoyed.

So because I like vanilla but you dont like chocolate I should say that all ice cream is crap?

I'm playing in the Championship. I've not seen any transfer issues. I'd admit I've a player I can't get rid of on a free but he's only an average player on good wages. I've not seen the Spanish card issue, I had 3 players sent of 2010/11 season and now nearly finishing 2011/12 I've had one player sent off. I won 11 straight games in a row season 2 and am 3rd. I finished 8th last year. I've missed 2 penalties out 11. My players get upset and morale gets low if i lose 3 games in a row. I've bought one player, the rest have all been free transfers because my club has no money. my wage budget 2010/11 was 295k/month, its now 245k/month, thing are getting worse financially for me. Some clear cut chances are missed but I see this on TV regularly.

My point is that because of the league I'm managing in I dont see these issues, even if they are major issues. beecause you manage a top side in the premier or la liga and have seen these issues shouldn't make everyone say the game is crap. Perhaps LLM haven't seen these issues either but are still enjoying the game in th lower leagues

I'm clearly disappointed that these issues do exist and I'm disappointed that if I do get promoted or offered a top team role that I'll encounter these issues. I'm no fanboy but I enjoy this series of games and have bought since the original CM game came out on the Amiga

I hope this explains why everyone doesn't jump on the slate SI/SEGA bandwagon simply because they've not seen these issues. The best way to act positively is to raise these as issues in the bug forum if not raised already and upload relevant saves and pkms etc. If you want change you'll need act positively. If it helps I've already sent SI a view of how to improve external testing. perhaps this will be consider and perhaps it will help improve FMxx's quality

SI - clearly you aware of the key issues now and no doubt are looking to patch these key one by end of December. However is it worth inviting some key people from the forums to a workshop to :

a) help understand the testing process and help understand key issues frustrations with 2011

b) consider some workshops to help understand features that are unpopular and features we'd like improve or even new

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No I was referring to the guy before me who compared it to Windows...........And I said I haven't minded the bugs from other years but this one destroys the game for me.

Come back when you've pulled ur head out of SI's a***.

I don't mind people posting about why they don't like the game, but the second you start abusing someone is when there's a problem tbh. Please moderate your tone.

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I don't mind people posting about why they don't like the game, but the second you start abusing someone is when there's a problem tbh. Please moderate your tone.

I got offended by the other guy telling me to come back when I know what I'm talking about......

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I've played this series since it was released back in the days of Dos. I boycotted FM09 due to the intrusive data collection but returned with FM10 due to a welcome change in attitude towards that collection.

I was late to the party with FM10 and didn't get it till after patch 3. I have to admit that on the whole I have really enjoyed it; the press conferences were repetative to say the least.

When I heard that 11 had received a big overhaul in the press conferences I decided to purchase it. I played for about 10 hours before putting the CD back in the sleeve and confining it to the cupboard until patch 3 is released.

I agree very much with the OP. Whilst not game breaking, they are of sufficiant annoyance that I find it unacceptable; I'm now back playing FM10.

What does it say for SI/Sega as a company when people continually post, 'well it never works properly before the March patch'?

This will be the last time I ever buy an FM game before the 3rd patch. As the saying goes, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me". I've been fooled more than twice now with an early purchase. I shall now leave with my head bowed and thoroughly ashamed.

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Hmm. Firstly, I agree that the game does have bugs but what game doesn't? There are companies far bigger than SI (no offence intended) producing, testing and releasing games which also contain bugs and glitches despite the massive following and profits made from previous games.

I think you just have to accept that no game is ever perfect. Why? Because if it was it would never be released - you would have to constantly test the product through all the possibilities, changes (like hardware) and patch where necessary. It would be an endless cycle of improvements while the public twiddle their thumbs or indeed get bored and play something else instead.

I'm afraid competition on the market and expectancy rule over everything else. We all expect an FM release every year and SI deliver that to a competitive standard. If there are bugs, report them and they will do their best to fix it. I'm no 'fanboy', I just accept the reality that human error, bugs and glitches will be evident throughout the gaming industry - no matter what game you play. Either live with it or don’t purchase the product after trying out the demo. Simples?

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This is the first version I haven't bought since CM2, I miss it and would love to get, but I absolutely hated the demo, the player interaction alone was enough to put me off getting the game.

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Great post, OP.

Don't get me wrong. I'm a huge fan of FM, and I think there have been some great new features and improvements for FM11, but there are just too many bugs to make the game enjoyable. The transfer system and morale makes an otherwise brilliant game nearly unplayable. This is disappointing.

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We all expect an FM release every year and SI deliver that to a competitive standard. If there are bugs, report them and they will do their best to fix it. I'm no 'fanboy', I just accept the reality that human error, bugs and glitches will be evident throughout the gaming industry - no matter what game you play. Either live with it or don’t purchase the product after trying out the demo. Simples?

And this is why they do release the game at the same time every year; there are too many of us who are prepared to accept a sub-standard game. As I said above, I am as guilty of buying the game at release, but not again. I'll wait for patch 3 and hope it's ready then.

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I think SI should release the patch more frequently. The current patching plan ( 3 patches per game) is complete idiocracy . Or they could make 1 game 2 years policy(monthly patches/hotfixes). This would allow for more extensive research and testing. I'm also aware that the pricing would go up but its better to play a complete game with higher price rather than tinkering with yearly half baked cake.

I'm aware that SI is not as big as other game developing companies, and FM series is their only leading releases each year but for the sake of the loyal customers they should increase productivity in their side.

I'm tired of being used as tester for each FM releases and I'm sure all of us are. Even now we have to wait more than a month to get the next patch and hope that the bugs that we encounter are solved in the new patch. If not then wait until 11.3 . Even then there's no guarantee that it will be solved. If the bug is not even solved in the last patch then.....OH WELL....Here Comes FM 12. The new FM fever kicks in.

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