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PaulC

Official FM2011 Match Engine Feedback Thread

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Has anybody ever seen a player score a goal like Wayne Rooney did against Man City?

I know they are very rare, but I've never seen one yet on FM11, so I'm just wondering if they are possible on the FM11 match engine?

I have a striker who has the ppm 'attempts overhead kicks' He's now 31 and I can't remember ever seeing him attempt one.

Although I never play with the full match highlights, just extended or key, so I could have missed him trying to do one.

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tbh your answer frustrated me .. sound like Arsen Wenger .. is everyone else fault just not me or my system.

yes sure the guy could had improved his case with some tactical and motivation strategies.

let us be realistic .. i played with Crystal palace who are fighting against relegation and we lost 2-1 in very very close game with top of the league and moral collapsed even though am in top half of league.. even if i have must stupid assistant manager he can't make that worst IRL .. yes we can twick and play around it.. but are we searching realism or just how to win games in FM cheating the system?

what bloody player rating (with no goal or assist) had to do with Tactics!/Motivation/Fitness !!? he is referring that game rate players highly if they have assist or goals .. i can understand if you told him, yes IRL many TV panels that is how rate players, which is ok as explanation .. but to give Tactics!/Motivation/Fitness as an answer is just made reading your comments irritating, unhelpful and repetitive.

there is difference between winning games in FM and aiming realism, i don't think you grasped that really from the guy Qs

FM is best game in market, but no where near perfection yet

The guy's Q's were, essentially, saying that it was impossible to get any of those things to work properly in FM11... if that was the case then nobody would be able to... I don't think that everybody is having the same issues therefore it must be, not might be, but MUST be something that HE is doing wrong...

My answers were short for a reason... I could have expanded on them all and basically told the guy how to play the game but I really didn't fancy writing a half-dozen pages of text...

>> what bloody player rating (with no goal or assist) had to do with Tactics!/Motivation/Fitness !!?

Well... if the tactics are wrong then the player isn't going to get a good rating... I had a terrible time in FM09 trying to figure out why, even in a 5-0 win, my right centre-mid would never get above a 6... then I reduced forward runs to sometimes instead of often and he got a hat-trick next match and subsequently that position regularly scored high ratings - i.e. it was my TACTICS!

again, if a player isn't fully fit and you have him closing down often/whole pitch or making lots of forward runs eventually his condition is going to deteriorate enough to cause him to make mistakes, be tired, not close down quickly enough... etc which will lead to him getting a poor rating...

and as for motivation, if you haven't yet figured out that saying the wrong thing to a player will cause him to have an 'off-day' then you must have been lucky enough to not have said the wrong thing.. wtg :thup:

I do not, repeat not, have any of the problems that the original poster said he was having and blaming the game for the cause... If the game was the cause, I would be...

The only problem he raises that I am experiencing is the headers from crosses but only my strikers seem unable to score with a header, the rest of my players do so I don't have the problem of nobody scoring headers from crosses - I DO think the striker issue is a bug, but ONLY the strikers...

as for your issue with morale collapsing after a narrow defeat... I can only assume that you (or your assistant) had suggested publicly that you would win the game, and perhaps even win it comfortably... if you narrowly lose a game that you are expected to lose it doesn't destroy morale (or at least it doesn't destroy my team's morale)

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Has anybody ever seen a player score a goal like Wayne Rooney did against Man City?

I know they are very rare, but I've never seen one yet on FM11, so I'm just wondering if they are possible on the FM11 match engine?

I have a striker who has the ppm 'attempts overhead kicks' He's now 31 and I can't remember ever seeing him attempt one.

Although I never play with the full match highlights, just extended or key, so I could have missed him trying to do one.

I saw AI score it FWIW.

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Bumping this to see people's opinion on what they would like to be improved for FM 2012 as I find ME to be the most important part of the game. :)

I want to see central defenders stop scoring 20 goals per season. I had a defender who scored 200 goals during his career with my team. I say it again, a defender had over 200 goals in his career.

I complained about this months ago (and several other bugs), posted pictures to prove it and was disappointed to see it wasnt fixed in the latest patch. Match engine is broken.

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The guy's Q's were, essentially, saying that it was impossible to get any of those things to work properly in FM11... if that was the case then nobody would be able to... I don't think that everybody is having the same issues therefore it must be, not might be, but MUST be something that HE is doing wrong...

My answers were short for a reason... I could have expanded on them all and basically told the guy how to play the game but I really didn't fancy writing a half-dozen pages of text...

>> what bloody player rating (with no goal or assist) had to do with Tactics!/Motivation/Fitness !!?

Well... if the tactics are wrong then the player isn't going to get a good rating... I had a terrible time in FM09 trying to figure out why, even in a 5-0 win, my right centre-mid would never get above a 6... then I reduced forward runs to sometimes instead of often and he got a hat-trick next match and subsequently that position regularly scored high ratings - i.e. it was my TACTICS!

again, if a player isn't fully fit and you have him closing down often/whole pitch or making lots of forward runs eventually his condition is going to deteriorate enough to cause him to make mistakes, be tired, not close down quickly enough... etc which will lead to him getting a poor rating...

and as for motivation, if you haven't yet figured out that saying the wrong thing to a player will cause him to have an 'off-day' then you must have been lucky enough to not have said the wrong thing.. wtg :thup:

I do not, repeat not, have any of the problems that the original poster said he was having and blaming the game for the cause... If the game was the cause, I would be...

The only problem he raises that I am experiencing is the headers from crosses but only my strikers seem unable to score with a header, the rest of my players do so I don't have the problem of nobody scoring headers from crosses - I DO think the striker issue is a bug, but ONLY the strikers...

as for your issue with morale collapsing after a narrow defeat... I can only assume that you (or your assistant) had suggested publicly that you would win the game, and perhaps even win it comfortably... if you narrowly lose a game that you are expected to lose it doesn't destroy morale (or at least it doesn't destroy my team's morale)

sure player shine when tactic is spot on, when he is fit, ..etc

but honestly, i seen in real life, players rated MOM when the tactic was not spot on and team playing badly, and without this player, the team could had been collapsed

i read here recently that one of UTD ex players saying that Sir Alex is not that into tactics .. he fire up his team, which is why team play well, so is not all about tactics.

i expect players to shine even when tactic is wrong, when his team play badly, sure it can't be often, but it happens .. the guy was just asking why it never happen for him.

your example is not relevant tbh, sure you improved the player by asking him not to run often, but again his rate improved because he was scoring, the guy is talking about the link between scoring/assist and rating.

and sorry, i never told to my crystal palace players i expect them to win, if you check people who are tactically experienced here and did many guides, and here is what they say "The major morale boosting / confidence device is winning/losing matches. Press conferences and team talks fundamentally exist to exert expectations / reduce pressure on the squad, not to shift morale. "

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/258767-How-To-Play-FM-A-%28Very%29-Short-Guide-to-Confidence-and-Match-Expectations-Management

then going to another one, to score a header from a cross? you answered tactic !! comn.. are you telling me if i have beckham and drogba in my team but have bad tactic, dorgba will never be able to score at least one header !!

then what about GK rating ? Tactic is not only reason? tbh most GK shines when team is bad and thus had opportunity to save the day for them and some even get 8 when save about 20 goal even when he let 3 in, i seen that many times with reporters quoting "without him it could have been worst".. tbh GK is less player effected by tactics .. if his team playing well and are not letting opposition team having chances he will often get 6 or 7 IRL as he has less saves to do.

and yes the defending AI is not prefect.. sometimes they do run like headless chicken, but SI working on that and improving it every year .. meanwhile SI did great job in match AI. but again nothing is perfect

3 man defense dosn't really work that well tbh, as my Wing back sit too much back even when asking them to play more higher go forward and attacking, you can see that when team get the ball, my wing backs don't run forward even when asked to do all the time, so we lose men numbers in mid and when losing the ball in mid they are still back and that shift the team back and great cap in mid, and causing me to lose the game, tbh FM match AI favor more standard 442 and similar formations, the rest you need lots of twicking till have a close chance to win games like 442 ans similar tactics .. this is due to some flaws in AI, which make some tactics work better in the game.

then sure a manager who get his team talk wrong can really still win sometimes, is shouldn't be like a robot feature, IRL sometimes it happens and your team win even after bad team talk, yes it is not as often, but it can. if you have players with good determination and leadership they can take things in their hand and surprise everyone

regarding other points .. I agree with you

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I want to see central defenders stop scoring 20 goals per season. I had a defender who scored 200 goals during his career with my team. I say it again, a defender had over 200 goals in his career.

I complained about this months ago (and several other bugs), posted pictures to prove it and was disappointed to see it wasnt fixed in the latest patch. Match engine is broken.

11.3 has the best ME for me so far ever, but of course it can get better. Your defenders will only score that amount of goals if you use corner exploit which you obviously use.

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sure player shine when tactic is spot on, when he is fit, ..etc

but honestly, i seen in real life, players rated MOM when the tactic was not spot on and team playing badly, and without this player, the team could had been collapsed

i read here recently that one of UTD ex players saying that Sir Alex is not that into tactics .. he fire up his team, which is why team play well, so is not all about tactics.

i expect players to shine even when tactic is wrong, when his team play badly, sure it can't be often, but it happens .. the guy was just asking why it never happen for him.

your example is not relevant tbh, sure you improved the player by asking him not to run often, but again his rate improved because he was scoring, the guy is talking about the link between scoring/assist and rating.

and sorry, i never told to my crystal palace players i expect them to win, if you check people who are tactically experienced here and did many guides, and here is what they say "The major morale boosting / confidence device is winning/losing matches. Press conferences and team talks fundamentally exist to exert expectations / reduce pressure on the squad, not to shift morale. "

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/258767-How-To-Play-FM-A-%28Very%29-Short-Guide-to-Confidence-and-Match-Expectations-Management

then going to another one, to score a header from a cross? you answered tactic !! comn.. are you telling me if i have beckham and drogba in my team but have bad tactic, dorgba will never be able to score at least one header !!

then what about GK rating ? Tactic is not only reason? tbh most GK shines when team is bad and thus had opportunity to save the day for them and some even get 8 when save about 20 goal even when he let 3 in, i seen that many times with reporters quoting "without him it could have been worst".. tbh GK is less player effected by tactics .. if his team playing well and are not letting opposition team having chances he will often get 6 or 7 IRL as he has less saves to do.

and yes the defending AI is not prefect.. sometimes they do run like headless chicken, but SI working on that and improving it every year .. meanwhile SI did great job in match AI. but again nothing is perfect

3 man defense dosn't really work that well tbh, as my Wing back sit too much back even when asking them to play more higher go forward and attacking, you can see that when team get the ball, my wing backs don't run forward even when asked to do all the time, so we lose men numbers in mid and when losing the ball in mid they are still back and that shift the team back and great cap in mid, and causing me to lose the game, tbh FM match AI favor more standard 442 and similar formations, the rest you need lots of twicking till have a close chance to win games like 442 ans similar tactics .. this is due to some flaws in AI, which make some tactics work better in the game.

then sure a manager who get his team talk wrong can really still win sometimes, is shouldn't be like a robot feature, IRL sometimes it happens and your team win even after bad team talk, yes it is not as often, but it can. if you have players with good determination and leadership they can take things in their hand and surprise everyone

regarding other points .. I agree with you

You've misunderstood everything I said...

my example was perfectly relevant as I couldn't get my rCM to play well no matter what I did, no matter which player played the position, no matter the opposition, the team-talk, the media-hype or any other factor... the only thing that was causing the poor ratings was the tactical instruction to make forward runs often... by reducing it to sometimes it allowed the player in that position to play a good game and get a good rating... i.e. I fixed the problem by changing the tactic - the fact he scored a hat-trick was irrelevant, what is relevant is the fact that from then on that position has consistently yielded good performances/ratings ever since (I still use the same tactic as I did in FM09 albeit with a few more tweaks since it's creation).

>> "Press conferences and team talks fundamentally exist to exert expectations / reduce pressure on the squad, not to shift morale."

exert expectations = you tell the press (and by extension the players) what you expect the result to be...

e.g. (not perfect but the general gist is correct)

"I'll be expecting us to take the game" = We WILL win 100% no doubt (losing this game will damage morale badly)

"I'm confident as long as we stick to our game plan" = I think we'll win (losing this game will also damage morale but not as badly as above)

"I'd rather focus on the game than needlessly discuss it" = It could go either way (losing this game is unlikely to damage morale, winning will improve it)

"I think it'll be a struggle but if we play well we'll come out on top" = We might lose (losing will not damage morale - winning will improve morale)

"It's unlikely we'll get any sort of result" = We're gonna get stuffed... (losing narrowly could actually improve morale.. winning this game will massively improve morale)

The match-odds generally reflect the stance that you should take (and the one that the players expect you to take). If you get them right (and the subsequent team-talk matches what you said in the press conference) then you will win more games than you lose and your squad's morale will not "plummet"...

so the team-talk.. well if I say "we'll get stuffed" then my team-talk has to be "pressure is off" as anything else ADDS pressure to an already tough game... similarly if I say "we'll win easily" then the only team-talk I can give is "I expect a win" as anything else REDUCES the pressure (of course, if your team perform badly under pressure saying either thing would probably be a bad thing even if you are 1/100 favourites...)

Your 3man defence/wing-backs issue is your tactics... simple but true :thup:

My GK get decentish ratings... they're not that great to be fair so I don't expect miracles but they do what I expect and don't often get poor ratings, just average will do for me though...

the "run around like a headless chicken" refers to the 3D view not properly representing what is happening in the match engine - i.e. it is a misunderstanding of how the game works/portrays itself rather than an error in the ME

Beckham and Drogba? It appears that in FM 11's ME Drogba will not score a headed goal from a cross in open play regardless of who crosses it - lots of people are having the same issue, there is even a thread about it, so it's "probably" a fault in the ME..

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Still getting way too many goals from corners. I'm getting one a game, either for me or against me. I'm not using any kind of 'corner exploit' yet still my defenders are getting 10-20 goals a season and I'm still conceding a lot despite having my tallest players mark their tallest.

I know goals from corners are scored but nowhere near the amount that FM suggests, it's ruining the experience for me.

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Still getting way too many goals from corners. I'm getting one a game, either for me or against me. I'm not using any kind of 'corner exploit' yet still my defenders are getting 10-20 goals a season and I'm still conceding a lot despite having my tallest players mark their tallest.

I know goals from corners are scored but nowhere near the amount that FM suggests, it's ruining the experience for me.

If your defenders are getting 10-20 goals a season from corners/wide freekicks than you are using an exploit. It might not be intentional but you are still using it.

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If your defenders are getting 10-20 goals a season from corners/wide freekicks than you are using an exploit. It might not be intentional but you are still using it.

What is this exploit then? And why are my opponents scoring far too many goals from set pieces? Does the AI use an exploit too?

How do these things get past testing? Absolutely incredible.

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What is this exploit then? And why are my opponents scoring far too many goals from set pieces? Does the AI use an exploit too?

How do these things get past testing? Absolutely incredible.

The main one is having a big strong defender on "Attack Far Post" orders with corners aimed there. You can used mix corners and swop round where players are to get a much more realistic level of goals.

I believe the AI can use it but its fairly rare that the AI teams get the right mix to move into exploit territory.

As for testing there has been some sort of corner exploit in FM for years, each time SI think they have fixed it another one appears. Totally fixing it is not exactly as simple as you seem to think.

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The main one is having a big strong defender on "Attack Far Post" orders with corners aimed there. You can used mix corners and swop round where players are to get a much more realistic level of goals.

I believe the AI can use it but its fairly rare that the AI teams get the right mix to move into exploit territory.

As for testing there has been some sort of corner exploit in FM for years, each time SI think they have fixed it another one appears. Totally fixing it is not exactly as simple as you seem to think.

It's not just that though is it? I'm sick and tired of the 3D match engine being so unrealistic.

My newest pet peeve is the 'thick defender' syndrome. Ball over the top, my defender and their attack runs after it, my defender gets their first but does he pass it back to the keeper? Put it out for a throw? no, he dribbles about a yard and then waits for the attacker to take the ball off him.

I've been forced to resort to just commentary so I might as well just go back and play CM03-04.

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Both near and far post corners rack an unrealistic amount of goals, i think that maybe the accuracy from the corner delivery needs to be toned down.. it's not an exploit like the one last season, it's just the game engine being unbalanced on that department.

I've also had matches where i conceded 3 goals from corners alone.

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It's not just that though is it? I'm sick and tired of the 3D match engine being so unrealistic.

My newest pet peeve is the 'thick defender' syndrome. Ball over the top, my defender and their attack runs after it, my defender gets their first but does he pass it back to the keeper? Put it out for a throw? no, he dribbles about a yard and then waits for the attacker to take the ball off him.

I've been forced to resort to just commentary so I might as well just go back and play CM03-04.

I can honestly say I've never seen that in FM11 so its either extremely rare or linked to your players/tactics.

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I can honestly say I've never seen that in FM11 so its either extremely rare or linked to your players/tactics.

How the hell could that be linked to tactics? I've had it happen to me at every club from BSN up to League 1. This also includes defenders who have played way below their skill level in terms of lagues.

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You've misunderstood everything I said...

my example was perfectly relevant as I couldn't get my rCM to play well no matter what I did, no matter which player played the position, no matter the opposition, the team-talk, the media-hype or any other factor... the only thing that was causing the poor ratings was the tactical instruction to make forward runs often... by reducing it to sometimes it allowed the player in that position to play a good game and get a good rating... i.e. I fixed the problem by changing the tactic - the fact he scored a hat-trick was irrelevant, what is relevant is the fact that from then on that position has consistently yielded good performances/ratings ever since (I still use the same tactic as I did in FM09 albeit with a few more tweaks since it's creation).

>> "Press conferences and team talks fundamentally exist to exert expectations / reduce pressure on the squad, not to shift morale."

exert expectations = you tell the press (and by extension the players) what you expect the result to be...

e.g. (not perfect but the general gist is correct)

"I'll be expecting us to take the game" = We WILL win 100% no doubt (losing this game will damage morale badly)

"I'm confident as long as we stick to our game plan" = I think we'll win (losing this game will also damage morale but not as badly as above)

"I'd rather focus on the game than needlessly discuss it" = It could go either way (losing this game is unlikely to damage morale, winning will improve it)

"I think it'll be a struggle but if we play well we'll come out on top" = We might lose (losing will not damage morale - winning will improve morale)

"It's unlikely we'll get any sort of result" = We're gonna get stuffed... (losing narrowly could actually improve morale.. winning this game will massively improve morale)

The match-odds generally reflect the stance that you should take (and the one that the players expect you to take). If you get them right (and the subsequent team-talk matches what you said in the press conference) then you will win more games than you lose and your squad's morale will not "plummet"...

so the team-talk.. well if I say "we'll get stuffed" then my team-talk has to be "pressure is off" as anything else ADDS pressure to an already tough game... similarly if I say "we'll win easily" then the only team-talk I can give is "I expect a win" as anything else REDUCES the pressure (of course, if your team perform badly under pressure saying either thing would probably be a bad thing even if you are 1/100 favourites...)

Your 3man defence/wing-backs issue is your tactics... simple but true :thup:

My GK get decentish ratings... they're not that great to be fair so I don't expect miracles but they do what I expect and don't often get poor ratings, just average will do for me though...

the "run around like a headless chicken" refers to the 3D view not properly representing what is happening in the match engine - i.e. it is a misunderstanding of how the game works/portrays itself rather than an error in the ME

Beckham and Drogba? It appears that in FM 11's ME Drogba will not score a headed goal from a cross in open play regardless of who crosses it - lots of people are having the same issue, there is even a thread about it, so it's "probably" a fault in the ME..

waw that is long

ok first have to thank you for the time you spend on it

let us agree on something first

- FM is not prefect .. (so as the tactic, instructions and team talk play a part in some of what the guy experienced, so dose the unrealism of AI sometimes in the game dose play a part )

- wining games X realism are 2 different things (every game has its own AI holes which could have an exaggerated effect compared to IRL , but you are asking the guy to improve his wining so he don't face the problem he is talking about)

now about your example, ok i see your point, but do you agree that some players shine even without good talk or good tactic IRL?

regarding confidence and moral, that is our difference, what we are saying is that the impact is exaggerated a bit, you can't ask the guy to keep wining so he avoid that. as winning/losing is what effect that, what your advice was ,.. keep winning, motivate them, don't put pressure .. etc.. that is totally different subject. we are taking about a game lost effect.. Sir Alex todl media UTD is able to beat Chelsea and LIV and get aa the 6 points but he lost both games at that week but team never suffered

for my 3 men back !! how on hell it is my tactic !! is my wing backs not attacking, they are attacking minded, wing backs by nature, ask them to go forward, more freedom/ less foredoom/ i tried everything .. tell me what to do and I already tired it ? my wing back set too much at the back , 532 is used alot in countries like Egypt who win Africa cup of nations 3 consecutive times using this tactic.. and wing backs are often go too high .. in FM is just too defensive because of wing back are reluctant to go up, while in Egypt is much more attacking. go to tactic/training section and you will see all suggested winning formation involve 4 at the back .. I did lots of patch on AI match for a different game, and i spend long time analyzing players movement in FM as i have the experience and I watch the full 90 min

regarding GK rating, are you still telling me that it is always had to do with your tactic !!? any a team with bad tactic with GK saving 20 goals .. is that tactic too?

about defending AI, that is not only about lack of animation .. that AI issues has been highlighted mate in many guides done by expert in tactic/training section . and even SI admit they are improving AI defending not every game only but at every patch, it is on going thing and they are doing great job tbh. best AI.. but sure not complete yet.. read some nice feed back about AI here

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/258788-How-to-Play-FM-A-%28Very%29-Short-Guide-to-Understanding-the-Match-Engine-and-Manager-AI

what am saying is not always about tactic, team talk, ..etc.

mate, there are still issues with the AI

you need to encourage people who point them out, remember diagnostic is half step for curing

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I have read all of the above and respect wwfan for his devotion to the game and his support he has offered but the bottom line is this game is no longer fun. I am 31 years old and have played the games since CM96 onwards. I used to love that you could either get into detail with the game or just have a plug and play experience. These days it has morphed into a ridiculous series of mistakes and become as complex as a system for predicting the stock market. I am afraid that FM2011 is the last game I will be buying from SI as really dont have the time or the patience anymore.

Regarding the games shortcomings always being blamed on tactics, as well as developing my own and trying in different saves all of the top tactics, I have had little consistent results. I have had teams that have been bedded in for 3 years, all morale is very good, the training is fine, everyone is happy and then just out of no where the team falls to **** and the results go out the window. No changes made, just how it is. Dont tell me the AI has learned the tactics or I have done something wrong. What is wrong is the programming and the likes of super keepers getting 9.4 and wingers that have play an average of 6.2 all season suddenly having 3 assists and a goal against you.

As I said this is meant to be a game and it seems that the only people these days that get any enjoyment out of the game are people that see very little daylight, people that send hours looking at hundreds of variables before the next game. Sorry I am not one of those people, to xbox I go,see ya SI xx

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waw that is long

ok first have to thank you for the time you spend on it

let us agree on something first

- FM is not prefect .. (so as the tactic, instructions and team talk play a part in some of what the guy experienced, so dose the unrealism of AI sometimes in the game dose play a part )

- wining games X realism are 2 different things (every game has its own AI holes which could have an exaggerated effect compared to IRL , but you are asking the guy to improve his wining so he don't face the problem he is talking about)

now about your example, ok i see your point, but do you agree that some players shine even without good talk or good tactic IRL?

regarding confidence and moral, that is our difference, what we are saying is that the impact is exaggerated a bit, you can't ask the guy to keep wining so he avoid that. as winning/losing is what effect that, what your advice was ,.. keep winning, motivate them, don't put pressure .. etc.. that is totally different subject. we are taking about a game lost effect.. Sir Alex todl media UTD is able to beat Chelsea and LIV and get aa the 6 points but he lost both games at that week but team never suffered

for my 3 men back !! how on hell it is my tactic !! is my wing backs not attacking, they are attacking minded, wing backs by nature, ask them to go forward, more freedom/ less foredoom/ i tried everything .. tell me what to do and I already tired it ? my wing back set too much at the back , 532 is used alot in countries like Egypt who win Africa cup of nations 3 consecutive times using this tactic.. and wing backs are often go too high .. in FM is just too defensive because of wing back are reluctant to go up, while in Egypt is much more attacking. go to tactic/training section and you will see all suggested winning formation involve 4 at the back .. I did lots of patch on AI match for a different game, and i spend long time analyzing players movement in FM as i have the experience and I watch the full 90 min

regarding GK rating, are you still telling me that it is always had to do with your tactic !!? any a team with bad tactic with GK saving 20 goals .. is that tactic too?

about defending AI, that is not only about lack of animation .. that AI issues has been highlighted mate in many guides done by expert in tactic/training section . and even SI admit they are improving AI defending not every game only but at every patch, it is on going thing and they are doing great job tbh. best AI.. but sure not complete yet.. read some nice feed back about AI here

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/258788-How-to-Play-FM-A-%28Very%29-Short-Guide-to-Understanding-the-Match-Engine-and-Manager-AI

what am saying is not always about tactic, team talk, ..etc.

mate, there are still issues with the AI

you need to encourage people who point them out, remember diagnostic is half step for curing

First let me apologise for the late reply, I've had computer problems since my last post in this thread and have only just seen your post.

I tried to show in my example why the effects are like they are, the info I put in parentheses is the effect of a win or a defeat v the expectation level.

If you say that you "think it'll be a struggle but if we play well we'll come out on top" when your team are massive underdogs, it's NOT what your players want to hear! They want to hear you tell the media that it's going to be an incredibly tough match, that the opposition are way better than you in all areas of the pitch and that your players are going to be totally out-classed. Why? Because that's what the bookies, media and fans (and players) already believe - sure you might have confidence in your players to win the match but they want to know that you realise how difficult this game is going to be for them! They know already that you have belief in their ability, it's not about that, it's not what you think/believe they can do or want them to do, it's what you expect them to do that counts and expecting "too much" will undoubtedly backfire.

I use wing-backs in an experimental formation that I'm still tinkering with and they get forward all the time, I'm actually concerned that they get forward too much and leave too much space in behind. I rarely visit the tactics forum so can't comment on the "suggested" tactics but my experimental formation has only TWO centre-backs yet, for the main, is pretty solid defensively - I get more CS with it than my trusty 4-4-2 (first created for FM09) that much is for sure.

The GK saving 20 shots is most likely a fault with the attacking tactic, not the keeper's

I don't deny that the ME defending and the AI intelligence isn't perfect, far from it, but the "headless chicken" comments usually refer to mis-representative animations not ME faults. I say usually because there are still problems in the ME, I too watch the full 90 and analyse player movement (and passing, closing down, positioning, etc...) trying to find the flaws in my tactic first and foremost but invariably noticing flaws in the ME and it's animations . I personally think that many people blame the ME for their own failings rather than doing like you and I and analysing their tactic over the full 90 minutes and seeing the flaws in that first. I also think that many truly minor issues are blown-up out of all proportion as regards their impact on the overall playability of the game.

Fleeting back to a question you asked earlier...

do you agree that some players shine even without good talk or good tactic IRL?

Yes... but how much of that is them being told to "do their own thing" (ala maximum creative freedom/free role) ?

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