FOOTBALL MANAGER 2009 - Graphics Speak Louder Than Words! . . . [Mock-ups Included]

[Ridleys]

With a few changes here and there I believe this skin could become very popular

[The Lambs]

Good informed first post, I certainly would welcome a prettier FM, if for no other reason than to stop the misses taking the mick out of my database game with the little dots that run around. Also known as the 80's graphics game.

Seriously, I do think the game would be refreshed from a graphics overhaul, several of my friends can't get into FM, because they can't get passed its looks and the overload of information. Getting some of this info over as graphics would help draw "those sort of players" in (i have no idea how to class them apart from that).

[Pricey85]

I really like some of these ideas, particularly the averaged scores for the mental, technical and physical attributes and the overview diagram on the same screen.

I don't think that these are purely asthetic ideas and as a previous poster mentioned it is such a change to see someone put a bit of leg work into their ideas. Great work.

[javier_83]

I'm impressed

the screens looks awesome!!

Ter, what do you like about this screens??

[Neji]

I'm sure you know we don't comment on what you might be able to see in future versions of the game until we release the information and screenshots ourselves.

I thought you may say that! I realised as soon as I posted that you wouldn't give anything away

[DeathReborn]

Originally posted by n0va:

I hate the default skin...

I use a skin called asesino and its very nice. I like a good looking skin with nice graphics and i got to admit fifa manager 08 in terms of graphics and new implementations are running ahead. The match engine and fake manager names are the huge negative but look at thier news reports ect..

What do we get each year? the same boring SITV's! Why cant SI take the time to develop a proper newspaper style that fifa have managed to do so well!

Also the media questions asked in that game have a great layout with the morale thing. Where in fm we get the same questions...same player reactions and same outcome...it needs revamped!

Halftime teamtalks should allow you to say more than one thing and so should fulltime...but we are very very limited to what we can or cannot say.

Hence why i will be working on a new media coverage pack once i have finished my soundpacks.

While I do like the current default skin (Steklo has better colours but crap layout) I would like to see perhaps the top 10 skins from the previous game added into the next release with any modifications needed to fit in any new buttonms/menus (permission from skin authors pending of course).

As for the media, if they won't revamp it at least put in a "turn off media" button to save us the hassle of ignoring it or repeating ad infinitum the same responses.

Perhaps for the team talks they need a choice of moods before the list of choices comes up. That way you'll get 5 or more good, horrified, delighted, pathetic etc style options to use.

Sayingf all that I like everything in the first post barring the player pictures on the tactics screen (i'd hate to see a 5 man midfield/defense with those mugs on there.

[jonahno6]

Can anyone make a skin of that?

[hufton]

I think the screens you posted are quite brilliant, but you rely a lot on pictures of the players. The obvious problem there being that a lot of players on the database don't have pictures so you end up with a screen full of silhouettes.

Its not so bad if you have the face packs, but if you're like me and manage random teams from obscure leagues then it would play a part, and without the actual player pics it wouldn't look good at all.

[Neji]

Originally posted by hufton:

I think the screens you posted are quite brilliant, but you rely a lot on pictures of the players. The obvious problem there being that a lot of players on the database don't have pictures so you end up with a screen full of silhouettes.

Its not so bad if you have the face packs, but if you're like me and manage random teams from obscure leagues then it would play a part, and without the actual player pics it wouldn't look good at all.

Thats a good point. How about having a shirt with a number on it for the players without a picture?

[n0va]

I am sure another solution for the tactics screen instead of player cut-outs can be found. How about some 3D icons that you can use? If you right click it lets you select options like:

Forward Run

Cross From

Cross To

ect...

Doesnt have to be player faces, im sure he was using it to get his point across.

[GillsMan]

I'm very pleased Ter saw these. Stan, I think the work you put into the graphical mock-ups was superb, superbly presented for starters, and the feedback to posts on the subject from Ter was spot-on.

My thoughts on Stan's ideas: I really, really like it. I don't agree that FM has nothing to do with graphics - and clearly those at SI have put the effort into the user interface. I'll hold my hands up and say that I hated the default FM08 skin at first, but I really, really like it now, and I can really see the hard work that obviously went into the design.

Stan, just one pointer: in some of your screenshots, you showed just the player's head in a box for the stats. Obviously, you'd need to incorporate their name into the mix as well for those players that don't have a facepack associated with them.

I really liked the Sky Sports style tactics screen, and the right-click suggestion.

I have to say, yours is the best thread in here for a looooong time.

[pouncer]

They are excellent must have taken ages!!

As many people have mentioned above, I think there are more important things to fix in FM first, but I reckon that sort of improvement graphic-wise would be brilliant.

Not on the scale of FIFA Manager - to me that is over the top graphics wise but a few pictures and changes in terms of what club you are etc would be very good.

Even something like when you look at the league table, the background colours are decked out in the colours of the holders

[NepentheZ]

Originally posted by Ter:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Which at least makes it better than the FM08 default skin that absolutely nobody likes

The FM 2008 default skin has been a big success actually </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I love the Default Skin.! I've tried out almost every skin, and after a few seasons gone back to the default.!

However, I love a lot proposed here by the OP, and adding the certain graphics would definitely make the game more enjoyable.

It's Your Graphics > It's Your Tactics any day

[PoopyPants]

I love them all

[Tim Madisun]

I think this is a great idea and fully support it.

Kudos for taking the time to present it well too

[lfcfannic]

Speechless. I'm absolutely speechless.

Those pics you made are fantastic. I know others may feel different, but if a game isn't aesthetically pleasing, I won't play it.

I also love the idea of more graphics because less text = less reading!

Absolutely brilliant!

[edwingray]

Think the ideas are generally good.

One small point though:

You write on the Overview screen something along the lines of "use more pictures for leading stats etc." This though would only work when the players are "real players". As soon as we are onto newgens, no-one will have a clue who they are, so text is necessary.

This of course applies to all aspects where you have replaced text with photos.

[Neyles]

Originally posted by edwingray:

This though would only work when the players are "real players". As soon as we are onto newgens, no-one will have a clue who they are, so text is necessary.

Good point. It makes long-term gaming problematic. But KUDOS to the OP for some awesome images.

[follow the blind]

i cant fathom why people dislike fm having a bit of style to it. I mean its an awesome guy but visually its so dull. Compare it to fifam 08, fifa manager is actually getting a bit better and it looks great, and even playing it over and over again it doesnt get as monotonous as fm jst because of these little graphic designs that dont "add" anything to the game. I dont see why it shouldnt be added, it doesnt take away anything from the game and if anything it adds to the experience and actually increases the longevity of the game.

Wow, thats a long post for me.

[Imperius]

I’d also like more stats post match that can be used for tactical feedback.

Presumably many events are modelled into the match calculation that don’t make it into the match stats screen.

Also, real world reviews of games might include: what sectors of the pitch did successful attacking moves start? Where were tackles won (rather than merely how many and by whom)? Successful passes – how many short/long etc? What led to attempts at goal: set piece, misplaced opposition pass, tackle won in last third of the pitch and so on. Effectiveness of opposition players: percentage of times the full back was beaten etc.

That sort of thing.

[madog308]

i love all your ideas. however dont like the tactics one you created. and i think the FIFA is too graphicy. how about when you go on the opposition instructions page it puts the two teams in formations on the same pitch, i.e ur half and their half. then have the ability to right click and drag a line to 'rough up' 'or tight mark' one of the oppositon players

[Wacks07]

this has probably been answered, but whats the deal with licenses with football manager?

as well as FM i play Pro Evo, yet neither of them ever manage to have a complete set of licenses particularly FM who seem to have everyone except the English Premier league? can anyone offer an explanation, or show me where i could find one.

[Wacks07]

Also, i really like those screen shots from StanPetrov, it would defiantly revamp the FM franchise, as well as offering something new to those who have played it

[something less annoying]

Obviously those mockups aren't perfect, but they definitely make a good point. FM08 looks absolutely awful, I can only play it with a user-created skin and some facepacks, and there's no excuse for it.

[Stomalomalus]

Im playing with the standard skin, and I see no problem. The game doesnt look nad, it just doesnt look amazing. I havnt so far been able to find a skin that I like though.

Stan, Are you gonna make that skin? It would be amazing if you did cos it is EXACTLY what Ive been looking for for years! Just didnt no what I was looking for until now

[HHUK]

I agree, I really like the face sizes you used. On FIFA the face sizes are HUGE and offputting, it feels like a kid's game.

The changes you've added look like they could be useful, not just flashy.

I fully support these.

[postal postie]

Originally posted by Wacks07:

this has probably been answered, but whats the deal with licenses with football manager?

as well as FM i play Pro Evo, yet neither of them ever manage to have a complete set of licenses particularly FM who seem to have everyone except the English Premier league? can anyone offer an explanation, or show me where i could find one.

find one? a liscense for SI?

[davhislop]

any chance we could download this skin for fm 08

[Chrisy177]

I think SI should seriously consider some of these suggestions. The interface could be developed SO much more (although I don't mind it as it is now). A few of your suggestions seem so obvious, such as using colour to separate the First Team from the subs.

And using average attributes would be very helpful, and background pictures would add loads to the game. You have obviously spent a lot of time on this, well done

[megafan2005]

some really good ideas but i think this should be included to

[Steve1977beyond]

Shortlist: Stopping everyone on your shortlist being linked with you every week. It's so annoying.

Pitch/Weather: Have different pitch styles and weather effects. eg. Snow lying on the pitch and playing with a yellow ball.

I'v had plenty of games on a snowy pitch with a retro Orange ball. Far better than a yellow ball.

Friendlies: When selecting a team to play a friendly against either a)Only show the teams that are available to play on the date you have selected OR b)Select a team to play and show the dates they are available on.

A neat suggestion cause its quite annoying organising friendlies and then the team isnt available or refuses. Then again, this is why I have my assistant do it.

World Cup Tree: For knockout stages show the progress in a tree based display. Something more exciting than displaying the same as league fixtures.

You can do this already I believe?

Manager Stats: Have more information entered at the start for your personal profile. I support Celtic and Liverpool. Favourite Players etc.

Isnt this already in? Apart from the favourite players bit?

Photography: Using background pictures to good effect. Changes look/feel to certain screens. ie. Boardroom picture when you are asking for a board request.

Nice request.

Chairman: Stop a chairman from a wealthy club selling your top players over your head when you have enough money in the bank.

Why? It happens in real life.

I was expecting something far better from your screenshots I have to say. But there are some nice ideas in there, such as the number next to the player. But I absolutely dislike the 'web' way of visualising the stats. It's absolute woeful and is only on consoles because you may not be able to read all the text on a TV. If a FM game ever solely went with that then I plainly wouldnt buy it. Absolutely awful way of visalising this.

One thing that has disappointed me with FM2008 has been the lack of decent skins. Is this because a lot of people are happy with the original skin? Or maybe people aint all that bothered. Have to say that I always go back to the excellent default skin.

[davhislop]

again, is there any chance we can dwnload this skin, it looks great

[Wayne\'o]

To cut along story short i agree with every thing you say stan.. SI makes changes to the game every year in terms of actions but graphics etc sound seem to get over looked. other games have better things about them than Fm but fm does have the best foundation for data base and so fourth.. with the power of graphics these days Fm lacks miles behind what could be achived for the current climate and its a shame.

[llama3]

yes good idea,

to appease people over the graphics thing then, there could be a plain style skin for slower computers and a skin which has a bit more to it

[LARulz]

Brilliant mock ups StanPetrov, agree with you on many points, You should really try and make a skin based on those mock ups

[Fallenone]

StanPetrov

ignore those naysayers

those who love to read thru ugly stats instead of great eye-pleasing details of game are just being too conservative

I always thought FM was not user-friendly due to the myriad of details in which you cannot tell which is more important than the other. Add to it that this would just make the game less tedious and more enjoyable

Props, SI should hire you!

[goodzorr_avfc]

These mock-ups are awesome.

[Schotsmannetje]

First of all, I really like this topic, especially the first post. You have done a lot of work and some improvements you suggested look awesome. I would like being able to right click on a player in the tactics screen to give him some individual instructions. Big thumbs up for that one.

Besides that, I really could not believe my eyes when I read posts saying: "Why should SI improve their graphics? That's not what FM is about."

Those people do not understand the concept of design, especially the design of a game like this. When having to read a lot of information (like you do in FM) it is of the up most importance that you can find the required information as soon and easy as possible. Little differences in letter type have a major impact on your ability to separate unimportant information from important information. Important information should be big and bold (like your team stats in the league table should be bold as stan pointed out) and unimportant information should be small. In FM, a lot of text and/or information has the exact same font and that is very tiring to your eyes and takes up a lot of unnecessary time.

As for including more pictures and graphics, I agree with this point up to a certain degree. Yes, having some information in a graphical way instead of just text gives our eyes a little rest once in a while and makes us more relaxed. Having to read text all the time actually creates stress. Be aware that this is only useful when graphics can actually replace text in an accurate way. This is clearly NOT the case with that idiotic graphical display of players attributes. I do not find that useful at all and I probably never will.

As for adding background pictures: I agree.

At this point I really feel the game lacks what I'd like to call graphical atmosphere. A Champions-League game looks just the same as a match in Holland's first division. I find that ridiculous.

I have a great digital imaging teacher at my school and I am sure he could give you some awesome advice haha. That man is a design-maniac. He designs business-cards and company logos in a matter of seconds.

[lewis999]

would like to say fantastic ideas and your quite right by saying when you finish your matches at the weekend i wouldnt say it makes you look forward to the screens but to an extent it makes you take notice and your are interested in seeing how other teams' players have performed if you have them next if that makes sense.

I also believe that if screens like this were implemented then football manager would be a brighter game and more detailed, i paticularly liked the tabs in the tactics screen to show all of the players or just def, mids or attackers nstead of going back to the filter.

Its also a nice change to see people actually spending time on ideas as another poster said than saying i would like to see different things.

finally so you dont have to read my waffle, just like to end by saying that you also have laid the graphics out very well and they look nice and in the right position and if SI can enhance these with your help too it would be great.

Thanks for reading

[CowRonaldo]

Great ideas there.

Just one thing that wouldn't work is the player pics for highest goalscorer, assist, and rating. Not every player has a picture and some of the downloadable pictures take up more space than the default ones.

[StanPetrov]

Originally posted by megafan2005:

some really good ideas but i think this should be included to

I had so many other ideas i never got round to do any of the other screens megafan.

I've tried to emulate what you've just suggested on the same screens as before.

Match Engine

[StanPetrov]

I'll try that one again...

Match Engine

[GillsMan]

Originally posted by !Steve1977:

I was expecting something far better from your screenshots I have to say. But there are some nice ideas in there, such as the number next to the player. But I absolutely dislike the 'web' way of visualising the stats. It's absolute woeful and is only on consoles because you may not be able to read all the text on a TV. If a FM game ever solely went with that then I plainly wouldnt buy it. Absolutely awful way of visalising this.

Couldn't disagree more with just about everything in your completely unconstructive post. That said, I guess all your voicing is an opinion and if improving the graphical interface means you no longer play the game, so be it.

The way the visuals are now is so dull. Stan's ideas are along the right lines to improve things. I love the idea of seeing stats all the time in different places, it's much more likely to enable you to totally emerse yourself in the game. Loads of times a player will score past me and unless I choose to click on him, I have no idea how well he's doing in the season. To have a pop-up tell me his stats is a nice idea.

As with everything, I'd have it optional though - after all, SI made the match experience optional, so I don't see why this sort of thing wouldn't be optional.

But this is definitely the way forward - Stan's clearly put a lot of work into those screenshots, so before you say that you were expecting something "far better", why don't you put some effort in and show us your ideas?

Cheers.

[StanPetrov]

Originally posted by !Steve1977:

Why? It happens in real life.

I was expecting something far better from your screenshots I have to say. But there are some nice ideas in there, such as the number next to the player. But I absolutely dislike the 'web' way of visualising the stats. It's absolute woeful and is only on consoles because you may not be able to read all the text on a TV. If a FM game ever solely went with that then I plainly wouldnt buy it. Absolutely awful way of visalising this.

One thing that has disappointed me with FM2008 has been the lack of decent skins. Is this because a lot of people are happy with the original skin? Or maybe people aint all that bothered. Have to say that I always go back to the excellent default skin.

I realise that it happens in real life, but not to the extent that it happens in FM. You could be playing as Everton in 2013 with £200m in the bank. Having bought Modric for £15m your board could sell him for £23m which is completely rediculous when you consider how much money you have.

again, is there any chance we can dwnload this skin, it looks great

I've never tried to design a skin as i don't really have the time to do so. I'd rather SI brought the game out with a choice of a dark and light skin this time round.

To cut along story short i agree with every thing you say stan.. SI makes changes to the game every year in terms of actions but graphics etc sound seem to get over looked. other games have better things about them than Fm but fm does have the best foundation for data base and so fourth.. with the power of graphics these days Fm lacks miles behind what could be achived for the current climate and its a shame.

Exactly the point i was trying to convey with my original post, thanks.

[Guest]

I'm not too keen on most of these suggested changes. Large text and graphics (pictures) just make the game seem more childish to me, like it's made out of those massive Duplo bricks instead of proper Lego.

I think everyone on this board would much rather that the in-game issues are resolved before any cosmetic changes are implemented.

[Stomalomalus]

I havnt come across any major in game issues, though. I mean, the only won I found was likely my bad luck

Cosmetics are a big thing as can be seen by the huge amounts of skins that get released for every new FM.

Also, graphics are the things that will help stop the game stagnating. For a game to advance, it needs to attract a new fan base - that is why PES has gone downhill recently, its fan base has stayed largely the same. Some new players to FM may be put off by the high amounts of text on screen at any given time, and may play games like FIFA manager instead.

One game that I have tried to play recently is Blizzards Warcraft 3. I have not been able to get into it, however, as current players scorn "noobs", and you cant get a game. In FM, people should be more willing to accept change as they have one major thing in common - football.

Graphics are important!!!

[Blight 00]

This is actually awesome.

[paulpaps]

Some of the OP's ideas are pretty good. I always miss the days when loads of random football related backgrounds were already with the game (CM 2 for example). For some reason I always have problems installing skins and background pics. It is true though, graphics aren't as important as how the game plays.

[StanPetrov]

Originally posted by tubbycrabs:

I'm not too keen on most of these suggested changes. Large text and graphics (pictures) just make the game seem more childish to me, like it's made out of those massive Duplo bricks instead of proper Lego.

I think everyone on this board would much rather that the in-game issues are resolved before any cosmetic changes are implemented.

It had already been suggested that the GUI Team would be doing this sort of thing and not the coders. With this in mind it probably wouldn't take anything away from the 'in-game issues' being fixed.

....it may mean, however, the GUI team have to work a little more on thier graphics.

[el sid]

They look fantastic i think.

StanPetrov

Mate, how long did it take for you to do all those mock-up s ?