Search the Community
Showing results for tags '4123'.
Found 4 results
442 and 3 at the back tactics have been very good to me, but for the life of me can't figure out a 4123 tactic that works consistently enough. I know you need the right players, but my team is a create a club and quite good. Here's the overview of the tactic, inspired by Klopp What am I doing wrong?
Hello Community, I have been playing FM19 for the past month and despite guides and tweaking, I just cant make my Team reliably getting results. The chances I get are usually headers or from a short distance, my Defence is solid and gets lots of draws. My Player strenght Looks good, but the T on the Right side seems isolated, despite being almost a 3* guy. Also please suggest some instructions, as it is not my strenght. PS: Sorry for having my FM in German, roles are CD+WB behind, CD(D)+Mezzala+Box2Box Mid and an AF in Front. Orders are Pass into Space, More Agressive Pressing and slightly lower Speed.
I want to preface this by saying that i've only been playing FM for about 6 months, and i'm at best a casual (definitely fairweather) football fan. I might be making bad assumptions about what is possible or how FM works. I have been reading some threads and trying to deepen my knowledge of the plug n play tactic i used on FM17 (The Reckonist's Scholes Can't Tackle), but a lot of the theory still seems like black magic to me. 433 (ish) Tactic goals: I want to develop a tactic that i could consistently use, starting in the lower leagues. In the game i would want to shape my team around the tactic, not the other way around - I'll gladly sell players that do not fit the system. I'm an Ajax fan, there's aspects of their play that i want to preserve in my FM playthrough, like a 433(ish) formation, and to play a passing game. I'd also like to preserve Peter Bosz' 5 second rule (If the opponent has the ball, we want to get it back in 5 seconds - regardless of the quality of the opposing team). Lately i've been reading Soccernomics, and from that i've learned that both crossing and shooting from distance are very inefficient modes of attack in real life, so i'd like to avoid them. I also feel that the Fullback is an underrated position in football, and i would like to leverage them into playing a key part of my teams. However i'd consider this idealism and i'm not married to having to preserve this in the game. It's hard to find great players that a natural to the position, especially in lower leagues. I'd want to play possession football, but i'm not married to the idea of it having to be a quick passing game. Long term i would like to transition a quick passing game, but that would be contingent on the quality of my players available to me. The base concept is a considered game where most risks are taken in front of the opposing teams goal. I've started out with a 4123DM Wide formation, as i feel 4213DM might not be positive enough. Passing/possession: Short to mid-range passing - no long balls/route one. This also goes for Goalkeeper distribution. Not (overly) rely on crossing, and when they are made, they have to be in a controlled fashion, so low/on the ground. Using possession as a defensive instrument (If the other team doesn't have the ball, they can't score) Attacking: Shots outside the box should be mostly avoided, but players who do well at shooting from distance should use good opportunities. Wingers/Inside Forwards cut inside to create overloads, supported by a fullback coming forward. Midfield: I'm having a lot of trouble understanding what roles to pick here.. What i'd like them to do and what would actually work in the game are two very different things, i assume. 1 player to aid the attackers, moving from a central position to attacking midfield/shadow striker like position (or go out wide maybe?) 1 player to bridge the gap between attack and defense. a DM to compensate for the absence of a Fullback when one of them bombs forward EDIT: Fullbacks: I'm not sure which role to choose here. Ultimately i've opted for Fullbacks with a support duty - i want them to come forward to support attacks, but the attack duty emphasises crossing, which i would like to minimise. Choosing the support duty here seems to be the best compromise, where they will provide width to compensate for the IF's cutting inside, and play through balls to the attackers, and cross when the opportunity arises. Defending: Upon losing possession, press the other team immediately, giving them little space/time to transition to an attacking shape. (Bosz' 5 second rule). I've chosen the CD/stopper and BPD/cover roles because apparently it is a 'classic' combination, but i can't say i fully understand it's function. I do understand the BPD would help in quickly transitioning from defending to attacking, but that's pretty much it. Goalkeeper: I'd love every keeper i have to be a Neuer-like Sweeper, just to have more help at the back, but i don't think that's a realistic expectation. Short distribution, long kicks are too much of a crap shoot in my opinion. Since Onana is a decent passer, he has the Take Short Kicks instruction. If he didn't, i'd probably ask him to roll it out. After reading some of the descriptions for GK roles, i opted going for the standard goalkeeper role in my most recent test. I'd love Onana to be more involved, but since the tactic has worked i'm unsure if i should make him a Sweeper,and if so, what duty to select. Team Shape: Since i want to keep hold of the ball even when it might be more difficult to do so, and want to quickly transition from defending to attack and vice versa, Going towards a more Fluid team shape seems to be the best course of action. However, in the lower leagues the players i have might not have enough quality to function decently outside their roles and duties, so i've decided to go with "Flexible". Mentality: I would like to use the Control mentality, because it seems to underline the general concept i'm going for, but in my most recent test i opted for Standard, and it's been quite successful. Obviously, Ajax is going to be the stronger team in most of their league games, but in Europe we'll meet more teams that are equally strong or stronger than us. The tactic and test results: After doing some reading and testing, this is the most successful tactic I've come up with (tests were done by going on holiday for the first 4 months of the season): I'd really love some feedback on this, and maybe a bit of guidance as to how i could identify weaknesses of my tactics. Obviously, by prioritising preserving the tactic over tailoring it to the team will require me to recruit players that excel at executing their chosen roles and duties. The way i currently test tactics is to go on Holiday and let the game sim 4 months of play, so we come up against a decent mix of teams... but when adjusting i'm just trying stuff out without really knowing what part of the tactic is or isn't working. Whatever generates the least amount of lost points, is the best, i guess. If i'm playing the game myself, often i'll just mess around with the team instructions until i find something that starts generating shots on goal. I honestly have no idea how to properly identify the consistent weaknesses of a tactic, or why my team might be failing to be successful. I understand that there's probably plenty of information out there that could help me, but i just haven't read enough yet, and i'm not exactly sure where to go from here. Any help or comment is greatly appreciated!
UPDATE: Finally got round to adding screen shots to make it easier for everyone to follow! Inspired by @Cleon and @Rashidi's guides and blog entries and more recently @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! series of fluid and very fluid tactical posts: 1) https://community.sigames.com/topic/352148-universality-in-football-manager-2015-very-fluid/ 2) https://community.sigames.com/topic/373859-arsene-wengers-invincibles/#comment-440604 3) https://community.sigames.com/topic/373361-arrigo-sacchis-4-4-2-very-fluid/ 4) https://community.sigames.com/topic/372887-johan-cruyffs-3-4-3-diamond-very-fluid/ and particularly this one: 5) https://community.sigames.com/topic/390163-playing-style-structure-a-modern-4-1-4-1-very-fluid/ (updated version of 1 above) I set out to convert my very structured/structured 4-1-2-3 Chelsea playing possession football based on Cleon's "Art of Possession Football" guide to a very fluid version of the same style of football. I've been trying to seriously take Cleon and Rashidi's advice in just watching the match and trying to figure out what's not working and what's working and how to create or attack space but haven't really come to any conclusions about where my tactic is working/not working. So after resisting for 2 weeks and watching half of my season's matches in full, I have come to these forums to seek enlightenment! I would like to show you how I set up initially based on Cleon's "Art of Possession". BEFORE: Shape: Structure/Very Structured Mentality: Control DLF(S)/F9 Costa/Embolo IF(A) AP (S) Hazard Willian AP(A)---BBM Tielemans---Lewis Cook DM(S/D) Matic/Mikel WB(S)--CD(D)x2--WB(A) Rahman--Terry/Zouma--Azpilicueta GK Courtois TIs: Lower tempo, Wider, Higher defensive line, Close down more, Tight Marking, Prevent Short GK distribution, Shorter passing, Play out of defence, Roam from position. NOW: Shape: Very Fluid Mentality: Standard FW: CF(S)/DLF(S)/F9 - Costa/Embolo/Luan AML: IF(S/A) - Hazard or Raum(A) - Pedro or W(S) - Malcom AMR: W(S) - Willian/Cuadrado or IF(A) - Kenedy MCL: AP(A) - Tielemans/Fabregas/Oscar MCR: BBM - Cook/Hojbjerg/Oscar DMC: DM(S/D) - Matic/Thiago Maia LB: WB(S/A) opposite duty of the AML - Rahman/Targett RB: WB(S/A) opposite duty of the AMR - Azpilicueta/Mayke DCx2: Ball playing defs x 2 TIs: Normal tempo, balanced with, slightly higher defensive line (lower to normal vs fast teams), Use Offside Trap, Max closing down, Tight Marking, Prevent Short GK distribution, Mixed passing, Play out of defence. PIs: FW: Move into channels, Close down much more. IFs: Sit Narrower, Close down much more. BBM: Get Further Forward WBs: Sit narrower, Run wide with ball based on Guido's defending vs crosses guide (https://strikerless.com/2015/12/23/dealing-with-crosses-in-the-fm16-me/) DCs: Close down less Comments and observations: - The style of football I am trying to play is total football/gegenpressing and possession football. - I was tempted to emulate @Ö-zil to the Arsenal!'s 4-1-4-1 but then I felt that Hazard suits the higher up AML positions as an Inside Fwd (and Kenedy on the AMR side) and to save me from having to retrain him into a wide left midfield position. - From watching matches, I felt that my final 3 attacking players were often isolated from the midfield duo of my AP and BBM hence why I have the 'Get Further Forward' PI on my BBM. - I've feel that when I play Cook/Hojbjerg as CMs instead of BBMs they tend to play better and get more on the ends of attacking moves and passes more. Why is this the case? But I've seen people play and post tactics on here with an AP-BBM-DLP/DM trio in the 433 midfield with success. I've read somewhere in one of Ozil's tactical guides that the BBM is just the same as CM but with roaming as a PI on. Is this a possible reason why? - Willian was my best player and played consistently better than Hazard as a right wide AP(S) in my structured control system before I made the switch. Hazard was often underperforming no matter whether I tried him as IF(A) or (S). - I got rid of Willian as an AP(S) in the new very fluid system as such fluid systems should have 0-1 specialist roles according to @wwfan (I know, I know... I have read the numerous debates on how the generalist/specialist debate is just a myth and @wwfan came up with it to help newer players understand the TC and how it works and he did disclaim that not every thing is hard and fast rule but it does make sense: more specialists in structured systems, more generalists roles in fluid systems as the efficacy of specialist roles in more fluid systems are lessened). I have switched him to a Winger on Support duty now but I feel that it makes no sense since my striker is a deep playing one (see below) and won't be in the box to receive his crosses. Am I wrong to play Willian as a Winger then? Inside Fwd doesnt suit him because he is right footed. - I'm not sure what to put my roles and duties for my midfield trio and final third attacking trio anymore as they no longer perform as consistently or in the way I would expect them to compared to my structured system. Could it be that my players dont have the right mentality to play a "Very Fluid" system and I should take it down a notch to "Fluid"? The reason I am adamant about it being able to work is because my team is the highest ranked team in the Premier League for "Decisions" and thus should be able to play intelligent and possession football. - My FW is usually a supporting striker role. F9 works beautifully with Luan but neither Costa or Embolo have performed consistently either with DLF or CF(S). I tend to play them as DLF(S) when AMR and AML are both Inside Fwds and as a CF(S) when at least one AMR or AML is playing as a winger. - As my FW is usually a supporting/creative striker role, I thought it would make sense to exploit the space he creates when dragging out the opposition's defenders with him by setting Hazard on IF with an attacking duty. However, I find that he is often not doing much to contribute to the match and hardly getting any touches in. - I am holding most of possession with many shots taken but less than half on target usually and I concede at least a goal a game on average due to being hit on the counter with my high defensive line and playing the offside trap. During half time of course, I select to work into box if I see that I have low shots on target and long shots making a fair share of my total shots. That's all I can think of right now in terms of comments and observations. Please let me know what other information you require in order to help you suggest where I could improve or tinker with and see if it makes a positive difference. Thank you! @Cleon, @Rashidi and @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! I am particularly looking forward to your responses!