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bazhsw last won the day on July 25

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96 "There's no crying in baseball"

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  1. I'd suggest that would be one of the last things they do because it's essentially the application of some data to the game and by it's nature is dynamic and I am sure it would be on the list but perhaps the priority is making the whole game hang together. I'm mindful also that this perhaps isn't that important right now, although I shudder to think of the future 'concerns' when the winner of the women's Champion's League has a higher reputation than an amateur side on a Pacific island. I think one should also consider that 99% of players have 'no chance' of getting a job at any club but it doesn't stop us playing and that for any new league to be added it will be researched with appropriate data / staff / salary etc. What I would expect is managers in game moving between the men's and women's teams so some of the high rep successful female managers would get good jobs in the men's game and the high rep women's teams would attract male managers in the game (right now a female manager in game has none of those concerns). There is clearly a level of dynamism and improving profile of women in football. I'd be mindful of saying 'no way would this happen' - the football world could look quite different in a year or two. Also want to address the 'what would Klopp do' comments. There are probably about 20 clubs in the world the very highest profile managers would consider working at. That doesn't stop us managing and enjoying FM at the 1000+ of other playable clubs in the game. Combined with the 'standard of football' comments I swear some would like FM to be a 'big club' game only
  2. I guess part of the appeal of LLM for me is the 'get what you are given' element of the first job when you are not well equipped for Football Manager. It can make those early seasons a real slog, especially if the only jobs are with sides who are almost certain to be relegation strugglers. Of course, I wouldn't want anyone to be playing and not having fun, but there is something about gradually improving your reputation and getting badges and how the players change in their actions towards you.
  3. Of course there is no historical precedent of a football product being flooded into overseas / new markets through a process of aggressive marketing, overpaying players disproportionately to projected income, in a marketing strategy to create new markets has there..... It's literally the story of modern football to the detriment of grassroots football in most of the world outside of a few countries in Europe and the Americas. That is the sad reality. Some facts - there are lots of women who play football. There are professional football leagues for women. In some countries women's football is MORE popular than the men's game. If we are going to have a game about football management it harms NO ONE to include women's football in the game and provides opportunities for new players, both male and female to manage a team they want to. Representation is REALLY important and good for overall health in the game. Some would argue things haven't changed to much but there was a time that women's toilets weren't even in grounds and racist abuse was openly laughed at. Calling this out was human decency and made the game better - grounds have more people of colour and more women and children than ever now. All SI are doing is reflecting that 'real life' aspiration for decency and placing it in a digital context. At the end of the day it's just a bunch of data and code that no one is forcing anyone to use. If this is the hill to die on I feel sad for you.
  4. And I won't post much more in this thread because minds can't be changed when one has a closed position, but if someone is this upset about 'politics' in Football Manager, then I hate to break the news about the influence of politics in football in the real world....
  5. There is a certain irony to your trolling comment when pretty much everything you have said in this thread is pretty much trolling the inclusion of the women's leagues into FM and by extension women's sport, and since you carry on referring to 'politics' I can safely assume women as well. So now that we have established that it IS the same game and we have established that subjective criteria you have invented for inclusion would exclude most of the current game and most football outside of the last ten years then you have moved onto 'who can beat who'. I don't want to be harsh, but using THAT criteria would have a very small (and boring) FM game because now you are using 'who would beat who' as a self-determined boundary for inclusion. You talk about boycotting and 'politics' but it is you who have made it 'political' when what 95% of the player base will see as 'brilliant - something else to do in the game'. I have not seen a SINGLE remotely justifiable criticism of this decision that can't be traced back to 'I don't like and I am scared of girls and women'.
  6. Essentially you are being sexist now. You cannot claim that women's football is a different sport when they play by exactly the same rules with the same pitch as men. In your head you say it is a different sport then call for changes to the women's game that simply are not necessary or desired. It's been covered before but if you took a blinkered view of what football should look like based on subjective criteria like 'tactics', 'intensity' or 'technicality' you would exclude most football played all over the world and exclude most of historical football. For instance, modern football has changed significantly from 30/40 years ago. I imagine some would say today's game is nowhere near as intense as in the old days. That doesn't invalidate modern football, and much of the football i grew up watching isn't invalidated because it was largely 'hoof it'. It's a silly comparison
  7. @gam945 why do you assume only women will want to manage a women's team in FM? I am male, it wouldn't stop me managing a women's team in much the same way the fact that I am British doesn't stop me managing a Mexican side. Lots of men will manage a women's side, and also gaming (and football) demographics are opening up more and more to women. This could open up a LOT of sales to SI.
  8. For those who say 'make a women's only game and let it face the market' rather than 'hide' it in the 'main' game, I ask you this. Would you buy 'Iceland Football Manager', because surely it's inclusion is 'hidden' amongst all those saves where most players pick a big Premier League club. Why not let 'Iceland Football Manager' face the market'? It is called 'Football Manager'. It doesn't say 'only men's football manager'. Women's football is of a suitable reach and status and professionalism that justifies it's presence. There are so many people tying themselves in knots and upset about this it would be laughable if not for the real life harm these attitudes have
  9. I think you would be surprised at the level of crossplaying. I know SI have their data one way or another but there are players who pick a big club or their favourite club and stay there, and other players who leap around jobs and countries all the time, often with mods of missing nations or ridiculous levels of depth in nations in game. I suspect a lot of those players are absolutely rubbing their hands at jumping back and forth between the men's and women's game - especially for long time players who have been 'everywhere' this is a great opportunity for a new experience. And not aimed at you Frederico specifically but there are a lot of dogwhistles in this thread with concern trolling about the game's development / data and use of phrases like 'agenda' and 'woke' and 'political'. It's transparent as anything. One could argue NOT including women's football is a bigger 'political' statement than its inclusion right now as it excludes a whole swathe of professional footballers from the world's most immersive football game based on their gender. I am reminded of two constant complaints about FM. 1) 'when are you going to add game changing new features rather than a glorified database update and... 2) 'when are you going to add more leagues' This announcement covers both of those criticisms but it appears not those features and not those leagues for some which I can only surmise is rooted in outdated opinions about women in sport
  10. I really like this post in response to 'women's football is boring'. I know we all get different things out of the game but I suspect a significant percentage of this board and football fans can't walk past two teams of under-9's playing football without stopping to watch. We can't walk past a Sunday league game on a park without watching for ten minutes. Lots of us may watch games on the biggest stages but many of us also watch non-league - or ANY football, because it is a universal language. Many of us spend a lot of money on season tickets and travelling away knowing full well the 'quality' and 'excitement' is likely to be boring - indeed, if you wanted excitement you would probably pick a different sport. And I'm good with that because we all go nuts when it's been 0-0 for 85 minutes and you scab a goal out of nothing, or you are there on that one day when magic truly happens because football is about narratives at almost every level, no matter how much is attempted to be sold back to us as 'elite level excitement'. Sorry to derail the thread, just think it's worth adding to Jef's brilliant point.
  11. I think this is brilliant news and will lead to a more immersive and inclusive experience for us players. I do think some of the, 'yes, but...' comments in this thread are really masking something else, but taking a broader approach I do think that the development of FM to support the women's game will lead to benefits experienced by every player (for instance graphics and match engine). I am one who supports additional leagues, but other leagues are well served by our brilliant modding community and we don't make a case for more inclusion by demanding a different underrepresented group are placed ahead of whatever else is going on. It's a really positive step, could increase the player base and for those of us who never stay in the same place for long gives us a whole host of other teams and leagues to play in. There really isn't a downside to this.
  12. The one hour thing came about from some players thinking 'realistically, who would uproot their family, leave their job for a part time contract of x per week', so in terms of expanding scouting range I have an informal rule of only doing that when the club is full time, not when it necessarily gets promoted. In terms of scouting nearby clubs and their youth teams I would say that is pretty accurate to how things work in real life anyway - scouting your neighbours and tapping up the nearby league club for some of their kids. I suppose my only pointer would be on 'realistic loans'. I don't have a hard and fast guideline but as an example a Premier League club with elite facilities isn't letting their teenage wonderkid out on loan to get hacked to pieces in non-league these days. Of course non-league is full of ex-professionals on their way down and kids who never quite made it in better teams youth teams so I think the approach is a good one
  13. It's an interesting post this and I definitely get the point of view. 'If only SI made the game harder' is a valid suggestion and I get the perspective that 'there is 30 years of AI and programming' advances to exploit. I have mentioned it before but there is a counterbalance to this... 30 years of fan development of tactics and how to play the game. There are over 100,000 posts in the tactics forums, for nigh on 30 years there have been hundreds, maybe thousands of players building on the knowledge of how 'best' to play the game. The 'knowledge' of how to 'beat' FM has grown exponentially at a far faster rate than SI's developers. Player advice on how to set up tactics, how to maintain morale, how to hire, train is ingrained in the community. The only way perhaps to make it 'hard' again would be a completely new game and engine from scratch. The fanbase's desire to share and help has created the position some players are in now. Playing 'realistically' won't solve all those problems of course and every player has to make that choice about what is right (not aimed at you, but 'but I like a tactic where I put a GK in AML on all out attack swapping with the DR' sometimes feels a little unconvincing). It's a shame of course but unless they start from scratch I don't see how it will change - for instance if there was a super hard AI in the next version two days after release someone would have looked under the hood at the hidden attributes, there would be a list of who they were in the game and a matrix of ten tactics to switch between depending on the behaviour of the AI. Of course not every player would use these but indirectly, unless the player actively avoided all discussion of the game they still would indirectly benefit from the increased knowledge the community has about 'how to play'.
  14. I don't think anyone should be seriously commenting on a game being 'too easy' when they have downloaded tactics that are specifically tested and designed to beat the match engine. What did you expect to happen?
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