Dr Naysay
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Posts posted by Dr Naysay
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4 minutes ago, bosque said:
Interesting point. What would be the difference between the cuts inside PPM and the cuts inside player instruction?
Completely anecdotal from my point of view but I think an actual out and out winger with the cuts inside PPM means he won't do it every-time. It tends to let the player, especially if he's got great mentals pick whether he's going inside or outside much like some of the more modern wingers.
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9 minutes ago, NineCloudNine said:
One thing often overlooked in specific tactical recreations like this is PPMs.
A FB with ‘gets forward whenever possible’ will play differently to one without, whatever role they are given.
Same with a W with ‘cuts inside’, who will play differently to one without.
I find PPMs really powerful in recreating particular styles, especially when the style in question is IRL very dependent on particular players, which I think is true of Arteta’s Arsenal (but perhaps less so of Guardiola’s Man City).
Not sure if you mean the Ben White role here but the IFB will still on occasion make that run anyway but if they have that PPM they really add a lot to a tactic when you have your foot on the neck of the opposition and want to give them something extra to think about.
Really good point tbh
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Most striker roles can work in a 433 within reason.
My current striker with Zaragoza is Ivan Azon and he is set up as a PFA. What you do around the striker and how you set the tactic up is massively important to how successful the role is, as is reading and reacting to what's happening in game. I will say that when it comes to 433 and playing as a primary goal scorer who doesnt drop deep I prefer a well rounded lone striker whose at least 6 foot, he can be 5ft 10 or higher if he excels in the air, I also will want to limit his weaknesses, for instance Ivan Azon can't dribble at a La Liga level so I will find a way to limit his chances to dribble which in this case was by changing his trait to running with the ball rarely. You need to take an overall approach to the set-up rather than just fixating on just the striker.
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10 minutes ago, lied90 said:
this was all I found by simply googling it
So it should be around 12 to 15 every 10 games as per the average PL crosses per game. Something you would hope gets improved in later versions.
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Not allowed to link it here but our very own @Rashididid a great video on his YouTube channel specifically on the HB in FM24 and how dynamic it can be in various systems.
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Genuine question as I dont know. How often do crosses from a player in the halfspace happen in real life? Is three in ten games not realistic?
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I mentioned going through the highlights pausing and re-watching in an earlier post. What are you sewing with the AF? I he isolated? Is he running with the ball in to blind alleys and turning it over?
I was reluctant to use AF on my save because I felt my Striker didn't have the technical attributes but after watching him play the role I was happily surprised at what he brought to the role. Other strikers simply aren't up to the task, more than likely because of their mental attributes so I would see how he plays the role and especially whose around him when ge gets the ball.
One thing is that with your rest defence, does your LCB have a "Stay Wider" setting? This would help with turnovers if your WB is caught higher up the pitch.
Honestly there is still tweaking to be had when I look at the set-up but I think it's more fun if you work it out through what you see. Good luck budm
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Central Midfielder Attack with stay wider and run wide with ball led to this.
He was often waiting wider than the winger for the ball.
On one of the highlights he received the ball wider than the Winger and then dribbled hugging the touchline.
There were quite a few times what you see above could have happened but the winger regardless of role always seems to want to step in front of the CM preventing the space for the CM to run in to causing the the CM to cut inside again or pass to the winger so I am not sure it will work with wingers.
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6 hours ago, Manunited_fan said:
Hi fmjeros, thanks for the recommendation.
Could you please provide the link to the article you read? It would be interesting to see the thought process behind the setup. I'm looking to learn and understand tactic development, so for now I'll stick with trying to build my own thing but can certainly take pointers from what Cleon was doing here.
I appreciate that my post was quite long so probably why there's been few responses. By going through this process, it has helped me to think more about what's going on in my team.
I'm still debating on the LW role. It has occurred to me that in the current set up I only have one person trying to score goals (the AF) as the winger, wing back, AM and IW are all more creative options. Therefore, I'm thinking that the LW (Joao Pedro currently) should may be an IF. I've seen people put things like Roam from position on the AM to try and create a bit more space as well.
I also saw another thread that if you have two solid DMs then you can put both FBs to Wing Back to add more ball carriers, so might try that (but maybe might need to upgrade on Mukiele in that case).
I appreciate this and your OP is logically thought out. The best thing to do now is analyse what you're seeing, pause and rewind a lot. See where your'e turning the ball over, make a note and see if there are repeating patterns. Analyse from the very point you turn the ball over to the point the opposition score or shoot and vice versa. This was the key thing Cleon taught me through one of his posts that was a light-bulb moment. Problems may be role related, TI related, PI related and player trait related. So once you see where the patterns are and discover what's causing those problems the better it will be for making tactical progression. Incremental changes rather than wholesale changes are best. I look forward to seeing how it does.
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On 16/04/2024 at 08:24, CJ_Randell said:
I found this to be useful to help build a platform, he also provides 2 example tactics.
Personally, I've found possession football to be too passive in recent FM's and have much more success with transitional tactics.
There;s a sweet spot to be had that doesn't mean possession overkill for the sake of it, but also in game management is a must imo these days particularly when using possession tactics.
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I think we are in serious danger of chasing off some of the best FM tactical minds from this forum, it happened with Cleon and it happened with a few other people and it really needs to stop because we can't afford to lose people on here who hand out great advice because a minority of people are too convinced of their own truth.
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2 hours ago, Fraser. said:
I use a set piece coach and leave it to him and haven't had any issues.
Yup, same here.
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1 hour ago, cappaj said:
That DLP was Pape Matar Sarr as that's his best role, when Bellingham plays it will be BBM for sure. AP(s) on Fernandes i think works best for him.
I have a question for defence, instead of Libero would BPD work beside a central defender with two IFB?
It doesn't matter what the game tells you his best role is, it matters what his attributes are to the role you want him to play. I know nothing about Sarr on FM24 but I could fully envison him being a really well rounded midfielder who could play most midfield roles really well.
You need to move away from finding roles to suit your players within a system you want to play and focus on finding roles too suit your tactic because you have some phenomenal talent that can not only play various roles withing a certain position but they can also play multiple positions.
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22 minutes ago, Rashidi said:
Cant really see the roles and duties in the tactic, those team instructions are just going to give the ball away against a 424. Even a system like mine could tear your 433 apart and this is my route one football tactic, it was modelled off what I thought was a tactic used by some of the AI teams in the game. All it does is wait for you to lose the ball. And if your system ever passes the ball back because it found one of its passing routes blocked then its vulnerable. So how does a 433 not concede, it doesn't lose the ball in transition. Strange that others are talking like you have provided roles and duties, yet I can't see them. Maybe I am blind.
They are on the right side of his team/formation pic. I was also confused at first.
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The match fitness is terrible, I wouldn't start one player that's not match fit never mind three and then of 10 subs you only have 2 match fit players on the bench, even the save you were top of the league a large portion of your players had zero to very low match fitness. To get to this stage of fitness you're not putting the effort in I am sorry to say, now add in a spiraling bad spell where i can only imagine you're putting as little effort in to to motivating your players and this is the result as has been said a few times. Player fitness and especially player morale are two layers on top of tactics that make your team a successful team. Either cut your squad(you don't need a 21 man squad for a 34 game season) or use your B team( if you have one) and create friendlies that get your whole squad match fit and ready to play, find ways to motivate your players to break out of this spell.
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If my B team is in a playable league I get rid of my U18 team via the editor and play all of the best U18 players in the B team. This allows you to focus on the very best players from your youth intake and have complete control of development from the age of 15 till they make their first team debut without having to loan them out as well as lowering the costs to your club. I essentially do what Brentford did with one difference that my B team are in a playable league.
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20 hours ago, crusadertsar said:
Couldn't have said it better myself. The claim that this year's ME is only geared towards Geggenpress attacking is a lazy response that doesn't take many factors into account. In fact that claim has been around since FM19 or FM20 at least or around the time when geggenpress changes (counterpress instruction, line of engagement, ect) to tactics creator have been around.
Sure you could download one of them "meta" Geggen tactics (you know which ones, especially those with maxed tactical intensity in the red zone and every single team instruction selected) and then win every trophy with Luton. Or you could actually take time and set up your defence so it actually makes sense and fits with your team. Or actually check which opposition you play or whether it's Away or Home game. Make little tweaks match to match, rest your key players. Give team talks and maintain good morale. That takes time and effort and is most definitely not lazy. And it shows via results, especially in defending stats.
If you go down the rabbit hole it's actually worse than that, apparently it's double mezzala 433's that completely nerf the match engine and it's the only way you can play and win. I don't mind if these people want to not see what's right in front of them and ignore all advice but I really wish it was left in the bugs/general forum. It is frustrating when someone comes on here to ask advice and people like yourself who try to help are often drowned out by the "don't bother the m.e is broken, the game is unplayable" crowd. If some of these people spent even a modicum of time to read the useful threads on here they might actually contribute more in future to others learning instead of heading down in to odd echo chambers.
Anyway, you are very right regarding resting players, making tweaks and maintaining good morale. I don't think people realise just how much of an effect a small change in squad morale can effect a tactic in one game and then snowball in to an all out bad patch. This years version is also imo one of the most tweak happy versions and if you aren't making adjustments to what you are seeing in game you will get a lot more frustrating results. For instance @Rashiditouched on this in one of his vids but if the opposition changes their static midfield role in to a RPM or any other more mobile role and you have them tight marked you are in for a bad time as your midfielder chases him all over the pitch leaving holes in your midfield, you really have to read and react.
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There's a video out on YouTube of a guy that created a defensive tactic and conceded 5 goals in 11 games whilst having played with Luton all whilst taking 5 points off of Man City, Arsenal, Liverpool and Newcastle.
This thing about only being able to succeed defensively by using Gegenpressing tactics is tiresome. If you believe the match engine is to blame for your woes it is best to take this to the General Discussion forum.
None of this is aimed at OP btw, if you are wanting to play a defensively solid game OP I really would recommend reading that defensive football thread that has been posted or actually searching YouTube to get some ideas on setting up a defensive tactic because I can see some issues with your tactical setup that I think would leave you flat during defensive transitions.
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It's interesting, it's not just that he's performing badly in comparison to Wilson but he's also not even trying to do as much as Wilson. A great example if you're on a budget why stats led recruitment works nicely in the game too when you consider Wilsons valuation.
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12 hours ago, whatsupdoc said:
Heya, are you willing to share a tactic / save file so I can test?
We agreed we were taking one of your saves with your players and your available current tactics. That's the only way to make this a like for like test, once I am finished with a season I will send it back to you in a DM with some thoughts. I don't even mind if it's the Fulham save btw, in fact that's even better because you had some very able bodied players to play out from the back in that one.
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16 hours ago, Bahnzo said:
Funny, you keep saying that to others posting here also. Maybe you need to just move on when you don't agree with someone and not go back and post stalk them?
That's a very good idea.
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- Popular Post
- Popular Post
This forum needs a thread like this right now.
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5 hours ago, Bahnzo said:
I see lots of what I call "lazy passes" which are these slow passes that the defense easily picks off. I chalk it up to the game deciding there's supposed to be a turnover and the match engine playing it out as that slow pass. It's maddening to watch because you know what's about to happen.
Kind of like those long replays where your team builds up with lots of possession and you are sure you are going to score....only to make one of those bad passes and then you know you are in trouble.1. This is not how the match engine works. there are issues that can lead to sloppy play that aren't tactically or attributes related, but the match engine doesn't work like that at all. Btw there are some issues with the match engine that need tweaking imo like 2nd phase chances after corners seem to be OTT.
2. I find your last comment to be really interesting, because this is how you should be analyzing your tactics and fixing problems. One of the best bits of advice I got on here years when I was blaming the match engine and using plug and play tactics was to analyse the tactics both in attacking and defensive transitions and especially at the points of turnover. When I am analyzing my tactic early on I will pause and analyze religiously at various points checking positioning of players, turnovers etc and I make notes noting why turnovers were made, is it a specific player, is it tactically related and so I tweak and adjust. You mentioned the bad pass and then knowing you're in trouble but what are you doing to resolve these issues?
Having read your recent posts I think this is starting to be a losing battle because you're taking yourself in to an echo chamber of like minded people who just want to blame the match engine or Gegenpress tactics, and yet there tons of threads and external resources where people are having success with a variety of tactics. You would do well to follow Rashidi on YouTube and learn from him.
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Ouch, and a lot of people would say it's unrealistic but in reality the board might for either nefarious or altruistic reasons do that irl. I hope you stick with the save though because I am enjoying it.
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Gian Piero Gasperini at Atalanta Case Study
in Tactics, Training & Strategies Discussion
Posted
Like in actual Angola? If so hello from south of the border.